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Author Topic: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review  (Read 27618 times)

DaveClark

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2015, 07:26:54 pm »

Thanks for the interesting collection of images.  It was very timely since I, along with many others, are in a transition to Sony mirrorless cameras.  The lenses you selected are on my list of possibilities.  I am currently using Canon and have a collection of L lenses.  I am trying to use my Canon lenses on the Sony A7Rii with the Metabones IV, although I am having some problems with the stability of that system.  Comparisons of some of the Sony/Zeiss lenses and Canon lenses with E mount adapters would be very helpful to those of us making this transition.  Although Canon is lagging the transition to high dynamic range sensors and mirrorless cameras, the Canon lenses are extensive and already in our inventories.  For example, I have the Canon 24-70 L series lens.  Based on your test images and data from other sites, I am assuming that it will give better images on the A7Rii than the Sony/Zeiss 24-70.  Some test images would be interesting.  Perhaps some of the participants in your forums have done tests that can be published on your site.  They have done an excellent job analyzing the images you published.
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Telecaster

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2015, 09:48:18 pm »

Most probably, and usually, the Cosina made lenses, although they are very good, are a different ballpark all together. But still, they are Zeiss branded.

I'd say in most respects the Cosina-made Zeiss lenses are the best of the current bunch. The ZM rangefinder lenses in particular…traditional optical designs, yes, but very well executed. Mine (21/28/35/50) are all of Leica-level quality. Regarding the other lens lines Zeiss is just dealing with the modern world. They need to partner with other firms to make lenses in quantity. And if Tamron, for instance, can come up with a quality iteration of the 85mm Sonnar design—as they've hopefully done, assuming LuLa's test sample is an outlier—why not take advantage of it. Presumably it was commissioned…by Zeiss.

-Dave-
« Last Edit: August 20, 2015, 11:14:39 pm by Telecaster »
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tetsuo77

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2015, 08:39:14 pm »

"I'd say in most respects the Cosina-made Zeiss lenses are the best of the current bunch"

Hye Telecaster.
Long time no see!
I do agree that the Cosina manufactured lenses are superb. My point being that simply, they are very different. I know that those lenses are manufactured and designed to fit a specific brief [as where the SL I line of Voightlander branded lenses, where the ApoLanthar was my fav.].
The only thing I wanted to stress is that, as I grow older [you know, that condition that happens to cure as time passes], I don´t have the time to dig around for too many options. I´m loosing the geeky side of having too much gear. Hence, I get lost with all the Canon and Nikon lens lines: too deep to dig about. I´d rather have a line [max. two lines] of affordable+the best optics. That way, I don´t have to get lost.
With these options [the Sony G lenses, which are very good lenses as well, Sony-Zeiss lenses, the Minolta legacy, the Zeiss branded lenses [the three lines of them so far], and the Cosina lenses], I surely am lost. Too many options to do the job, I´m afraid.

Answering what I would ask to Sony on those lenses, that would be:
-Size reduction: Take the lens to the gym, and have it lean. Not tiny, just lean. The KA 77 Ltd is 1.8, and it is considerably smaller. Taken that it has much less electronics embedded [no AF motor within, no readouts], it is physically just half a lens. With a small camera such as the A7 family, that should be a bonus.
-The built in shade.
-Krinkled finish: Funny, but all the Zeiss glass I have used has the tendency to be a bit slippery. Not bad per se, but not handy when on duty.
-Improve the color rendition of the lens: I don´t know why exactly, but colors do not look right on the samples I downloaded. They have the tendency to have the effect of a recovered HDR image.
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Telecaster

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2015, 10:48:48 pm »

The only thing I wanted to stress is that, as I grow older [you know, that condition that happens to cure as time passes], I don´t have the time to dig around for too many options.

Gotcha.  :)  Yes, there are a bunch of kinda overlapping, kinda complementary—yet cosmetically & functionally distinct—Zeiss lens lineups for the Sony A7x cameras: the Sony/Zeisses, the Loxias and now the Bati (Batises?). Bit of a mess! I've decided to stick with the AF options, including non-Zeiss Sonys when appropriate.

BTW the Pentax 31 & 77mm Ltds are terrific performers on the A7r(ii). The A series 50/1.2, 100/2.8 & S.M.C 135/2.5 (ne plus ultra variant) are killer too.

(Wow, just watched Mike Fiers of the Houston Astros finish off a no-hitter. On TV, of course. Baseball!)

-Dave-
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tetsuo77

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2015, 08:40:31 am »

 ;)
Yep, the 31+77 are superb lenses. Very, very recommendable no matter which system you work with.
Other stellar performers are the FA50 1.4 [which IMHO is better than the 1.2 or 1.8], and the DA 35 2.8 Macro [which, incidentally, is a full frame lens, but has high vignetting on the edges when used on FF].
Advantages of the A7 system are the versatility to attach lenses.


edit

Yep: Batus, Bati.
I would be tempted to write Batii, but that might be a bit too uptight.
Just sayin´

 ;)
« Last Edit: August 22, 2015, 05:04:15 pm by tetsuo77 »
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landsnapper

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #25 on: August 24, 2015, 08:35:05 pm »

No matter how many professional reviews with test shots on the web, many photographers are still waiting for their Batis lenses, ordered two months ago, promised  start July then mid July it's now nearing the end of August and Zeiss Batis no show. Zeiss UK say we are doing the best we can. I recall Nancy Regan prompting President Regan to utter these words many years ago. They mean as little now as they did then.

All of the Sony artisan photographers have cameras same for Zeiss, Fuji etc ad nauseam, but the mani n the street is who pays for the R&R of the cameras, manufacturers should keep that in mind when they attempt the fob off with "we're doing the best we can".

::DS
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Scottishlandscapes

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #26 on: August 24, 2015, 10:29:16 pm »

Personally I'd rather have 'em right than have 'em now. Assuming there's a legitimate reason they've been delayed (as opposed to distribution sluggishness or bureaucratic silliness). Reviewers often get pre-production or initial production samples, made before manufacturing fully ramps up.

-Dave-
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kjkahn

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #27 on: August 25, 2015, 05:20:48 pm »

Kevin,

I was hoping to use your train photos to compare the 85 Batis and 90 macro. Although the thumbnails appear quite similar and show three cars each, the downloaded Batis 85 photo (confirmed by the EXIF) shows four cars.

I cropped the Batis 85 photo to account for the 6% difference in focal length but that didn't come close to matching the change in field of view.

Am I missing something or did you shoot the photos from different locations at different angles to the train?

Ken

This is a reduced version of your 85 Batis shot:


« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 05:29:34 pm by kjkahn »
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ddubler

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2015, 01:06:14 am »

Kevin & Michael,

       I share your enthusiasm for the Batis lenses, particularly the 85mm f1.8. My experience with it has been excellent both in shooting and IQ. In fact I would say that it compares quite favorably with both the Otus 85mm f1.4, the 135 mm f2 APO and the 100mm f2 Macro using the Novoflex adapter on the A7II. I have yet to see any issues caused by the compressed raw file. Admittedly I don't push process 5 or 6 stops. But then I come from an analog background where my typical push on chrome film was +1/8 stop.
       When I walk out the door , I generally grab the 55mm f1.8 or 35mm f2 Zeiss Loxia. This little camera with it's fabulous choice of available lenses has had a big impact on the way I approach photography. I think more than any other camera in my 40+ years of photography.  It's not yet perfect but with the IBIS and focus peaking I am more than pleased with Sony's efforts.  In my opinion Nikon and Canon have a lot of catching up to do... Keep up your good reviews.

Douglas Dubler
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Hezu

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #29 on: September 02, 2015, 11:46:32 am »

In the article it says:
Quote
This is Zeiss’s first foray into the AutoFocus lens market for Sony.  Their previous lenses were manual focus.
Which is actually not true since the first series of Zeiss lenses for Sony E mount (and Fuji X system), Touit (2.8/12, 1.8/32, 2.8/50M) do provide autofocus. Of course, these might be slightly less useful on Sony FE cameras since these cover only APS-C sensor size as these were released already before Sony A7 series was launched.
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Heikki "Hezu" Kantola

alexcarnes

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2015, 04:33:21 am »

I certainly appreciate the file downloads.  The Batis 25mm appears excellent against the Sony Zooms.  But I am surprised by how very soft the Batis 85mm seemed in general and especially compared to the amzingly good Sony 90mm.  I couldn't help wondering if there was the possibility of some mix up or error in focus with the Batis 85mm, from the gravel it appears the focus might have been in front of the trucks not on them.  I suppose that is the downside of providing file downloads, your enthusiastic fan base starts second guessing the results LOL.
Quite a few of the telephoto shots in the download zip are very poorly focused, and the 85 Batis in particular. You don't need to pixel peep to see it either! If that was done using the camera's AF system, tripod mounted, then something's very very wrong. I used to shoot an A7R and the AF was usually very accurate...

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Kevin Raber

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2015, 10:11:55 am »

Since this review Zeiss has sent us a new 85mm Batis with the thought that the one used was not quite right.  We have completed our tests and returned to lens back to Zeiss.  We are working on a follow up and in the second attempt the Batis was very sharp.  We will publish the results but at this time we are very busy with numerous field reviews of cameras, printers, papers and more.  We'll get it finished and share the results as soon as we can.
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Kevin Raber
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AlterEgo

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2015, 10:37:16 am »

Since this review Zeiss has sent us a new 85mm Batis with the thought that the one used was not quite right. 

did they also suggest a comment about their own QA process then ?
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alexcarnes

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2015, 01:32:36 pm »

Since this review Zeiss has sent us a new 85mm Batis with the thought that the one used was not quite right.  We have completed our tests and returned to lens back to Zeiss.  We are working on a follow up and in the second attempt the Batis was very sharp.  We will publish the results but at this time we are very busy with numerous field reviews of cameras, printers, papers and more.  We'll get it finished and share the results as soon as we can.
Fair enough, thanks for the information.

That was quite worrying though - those photos were very clearly and obviously out of focus. There's always manual if AF lets you down...! ;-)
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Telecaster

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Re: Zeiss Batis 85mm and Batis 25mm Lens Review
« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2015, 02:55:57 pm »

My two Batis lenses finally arrived yesterday evening, nearly five months after being ordered.  :o  But it's a happy ending as both lenses AF properly and perform fine & dandy. Hopefully I'll get a chance this weekend to put some mileage on 'em!

-Dave-
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