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Author Topic: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?  (Read 39252 times)

JimGoshorn

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Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« on: June 16, 2015, 06:16:20 pm »

Hi,

Just thought I would inquire what kinds of experiences those of you with the 2013 Mac Pro are having and what config you got. My old 2009 Mac Pro is getting a bit long on the tooth and it's getting near time to consider upgrading...

Thanks!

Jim
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phila

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2015, 05:14:45 am »

Had mine for nearly 18 months now. It's all good! I bought the base model but BTO'd to the 6 core. That works out a bit cheaper than ordering the 6 core outright as I  figured the base model's GPUs would be more than good enough for non-video work. 512GB SSD. 32GB RAM.

Ellis Vener

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2015, 05:11:22 pm »

I did a lot of serious  research over month long period - Lloyd Chambers is an excellent resource -- before deciding that as I do not do a lot of video work, the 27"- Retina iMac with the 4GHZ processor and the higher capacity vGPU just made more sense for still photography.  I bought additional RAM from OWC to take it up to 32GB.

I really wanted to go with the Mac Pro but this machine just made more sense.
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JimGoshorn

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2015, 06:10:20 pm »

@Phila - I was thinking of going from my current 8 down to a 6 core to save $$. I thought maybe the D300's would become outdated too soon?

@Ellis - I read Lloyd's reviews and he returned his iMac because of concerns over overheating, profiling the screen and too few TB2 ports. Have you had any issues with those? I also seem to recall that the iMac didn't play well with LR (and Illustrator).

Thanks!

Jim
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kers

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2015, 06:56:46 pm »

@Ellis - I read Lloyd's reviews and he returned his iMac because of concerns over overheating, profiling the screen and too few TB2 ports. Have you had any issues with those? I also seem to recall that the iMac didn't play well with LR (and Illustrator).
Thanks!
Jim

I do not think Lloyd Chambers really wanted to buy the iMac... he has a very fast MacPro... he just wanted to test it...so he returned it within his legal return period.
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Christopher Sanderson

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2015, 09:15:50 pm »

I have had the MacPro for over a year and somewhat regret its purchase. I find that even now in the video world, not enough apps are sufficiently multi-processor and GPU aware. Even Apple's Compressor is considerably faster for a single video's compression on a MacBok Pro or iMac-R. Hello Apple??

IMO this seriously calls into question the economics of the MacPro vs either of those Macs mentioned above.

I would suggest doing very careful research before committing your dollars.

(Parenthetically, Capture One 8 is specifically engineered for the MacPro)
« Last Edit: June 17, 2015, 09:19:30 pm by Chris Sanderson »
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David S

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2015, 08:18:09 am »

I have had my Mac Pro for 5 months having replaced a dying Mac Pro 2009. It is OK and I think a lot of my issues have been Yosemite related and not hardware related. I stayed with the base graphics set-up and used OWC to push me to 64 G. I have been surprised that it isn't really all that subjectively faster than my old 2.9 G machine from 6 years ago. I wanted to wait but the machine (2009 Mac Pro) would have needed extensive repairs to continue working.

If you can, I would wait for the next Mac Pro iteration or go with the iMac 5k.

Dave S
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Ellis Vener

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2015, 10:34:04 am »

@Phila - I was thinking of going from my current 8 down to a 6 core to save $$. I thought maybe the D300's would become outdated too soon?

@Ellis - I read Lloyd's reviews and he returned his iMac because of concerns over overheating, profiling the screen and too few TB2 ports. Have you had any issues with those? I also seem to recall that the iMac didn't play well with LR (and Illustrator).

Thanks!

Jim

To be accurate: Lloyd's concern wasn't about profiling the Retina iMac, it was that he couldn't calibrate the display. Calibration and profiling are two separate processes. The Retina iMac profiles very well- I know because I have done it with an i1 Display Pro and i1 Profiler software.  To get a better display than the Retina iMac has - such as  the NEC's Lloyd and many other s like  likes  or a top of the line Eizo - you'll be spending as much as you will on the entire iMac Retina, and at best you'll have a 4K display.

Too few Thunderbolt ports: How many does the 2013 Mac Pro have? Six. How many Thunderbolt devices do you have? How many are you expecting to buy and use before Thunderbolt 3 comes out (which I've seen reported  will use a different connector)? AlsoI think the Mac Pro uses Thunderbolt 1 and not Thunderbolt 2 like the Retina iMac does.

My concern about the 2014 Retina iMac is not thunderbolt but the number of USB 3.0 ports. To help with that I bought an OWC Thunderbolt 2 dock https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/Dock/OWC/Thunderbolt2-Dock/  which also adds an additional Tbolt port and HDMI.

I am having zero problems using either Lightroom or Photoshop (both now at CC 2015). I don't use Illustrator.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2015, 08:00:43 am by Ellis Vener »
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Benny Profane

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2015, 10:50:20 am »

To be accurate: Lloyd's concern wasn't about profiling the Retina iMac, it was that he couldn't calibrate the display. Calibration and profiling are two separate processes. The Retina iMac profiles very well- I know because I have done it with an i1 Display Pro and i1 Profiler software.  To get a better display than the Retina iMac has - such as  the NEC's Lloyd and many other s like  likes  or a top of the line Eizo - you'll be spending as much as you will on the entire iMac Retina, and at best you'll have a 4K display.

 

But, what is your final output? Do you make prints, or have them made by another party? Or just show others your images on that screen? If it's the former, sorry, but, you need a different screen that can be calibrated seriously to a print output. Sorry, and I'd like to believe the IMac is appropriate for my needs, but I've concluded that I have to spend 5-6000 for a MacPro/Eizo setup, if I want accurate color on the screen represented for output.

I have seen older MacPros (previous generation) on Craig's and elsewhere going for pretty cheap, relative to a new one. Besides hard drive wear and tear, how exactly can an older machine get "long in the tooth" and necessitate a newer one, if relatively lightly used?
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kers

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2015, 01:01:07 pm »

I am still working on a 2008 MacPro 8core- i needed only one new GPU during that time. Paid way too much for that of course thanks to Apples closed ecosystem.
That said i upgraded it with 32g RAM an SSD for my system and a RAID0 for my data. Now i can do all with it reasonably fast but 4K video. I make very large panorama's with over 10GIG psb files.
Also i can still run 10.6 ( even 10.5) with some old software on it. Secondhand you can buy the fastest old Macpros for 1500€
A problem with the new MacPro trashcan is that you also have to buy a new ecosystem and that costs a lot too. cables, thunderbolt raids, dvd readers etc...
Probably a new version might appear within a year time with the latest Xeons in it.

just noticed jduncan has its own thought about it:
http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=100884.0


« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 01:03:58 pm by kers »
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JimGoshorn

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2015, 03:10:21 pm »

Thanks everyone for your input! It's not a clearcut decision so I thought I'd ask others.

As far as long on the tooth, I was thinking of a post that said that Apple doesn't consider computers supported (forget the exact wording) after 7 years. My computer (2009 dual 2.93) would need to have a new graphics card and more RAM (I'm only at 16gb) and possibly an SSD but I question how advisable that would be given the computer's age and it's technology.

An article I read on BareFeats which did a comparrison of a 2009 8 core and the 2013 8 core and said the 2013 is 21-43% faster but those results don't necessarily reflect what I would be doing so I figure about a 25% increase. As Chris said, it's a concern that a little more than 1 year after the computer has been available, there are few apps to take advantage of the GPU architecture (and how about OpenCL?). Kers made a good point that it's not just the cost of the computer but then TB device(s) to go with it.

As far as output goes, I make prints.

Jim
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Benny Profane

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2015, 07:09:55 pm »

Well, the way I'm looking at it, if I find a lightly used late (11-12) MacPro on Craigs or somewhere (Craig's allows  me to insist on running it through some paces before purchase), I'm confident of at least sub 2000 dollars, to maybe even a thousand. I'm lucky that I live in the NY Metro, a bit of a trek to Manhattan, but still able to travel into one of, if not the biggest graphics professional markets in the country. Throw in the geeky gamers and music "producers", and you get a lot of towers changing hands. Anyway, I'm pretty sure that computer will be functional with plenty of Ram installed for, at least, five years. The death knell would be an introduction of an OS that can't be run on that computer. So, fine. Buy the latest thing then, or do the same as the last time, and nail a used machine at a 50% discount.
I've worked with the best Macs of their time for about 25 years (at my employer's expense), and one thing I can say is that they don't break, and I have been on machines that are worked 2-3 shifts a workday. Rock solid. And now we have reached an interesting point in PC development for photography, when maybe where we are, is good enough, and the industry has moved on to cater to the video geeks. You know, how much faster can some things get? Sure, instantaneous, but we're pretty close.
My last employer switched from the old MacPro tower to the trashcan a year and a half ago, justifying the cost by moving into 3D. That went FUBAR, but, I wasn't impressed by the difference of speed in Photoshop functions. It was a lot smaller, and looked really cool, and totally quiet. But, 2-3000 dollars for a little cool and quiet? Eh.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 10:38:45 pm by Benny Profane »
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2015, 01:28:14 am »

Coming from a 2008 pro, I got the 8 core high end version shotly after release, now with 128GB Ram. I was a good target with not much need for internal storage.

It works well, is fast and reliable.

It does what I expect of a computer, which is to just work.

Now, has it made me a happier man?... ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

Josh-H

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2015, 05:00:53 am »

Ive been working on a 2010 Mac Pro Server with 64 Gig Ram - 8 core for the last few years. Its been rock solid. Runs 24/7.

I have an external promise Thunderbolt 2 RAID array sitting here on my desk doing nothing - which I purchased ready for the new Mac Pro 2013.

But.. due to travels I decided to wait as I am not around much to actually use the Mac Pro. Now.. Im ready to swap to a new Mac Pro, but frankly Im not paying Apple top dollar for 2 year old hardware. Apple won't drop the price of the current mac pro so I'll wait for the next mac pro speed bump - which I was hoping would be at WWDC. Now, I suspect it may not come this year.
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JimGoshorn

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2015, 03:22:04 pm »

I just checked Apple's refurb page and an 8 core 2013 with 32 gb, 1tb flash and dual D700's is still $6199. Compared a fully decked out 5k Retina iMac and a new 3.7 MacPro with 32gb, 1tb flash and dual D500's and the MacPro was only $500 more which if you have a good monitor and keyboard makes them basically even. Granted, the iMac will be a bit faster but the overall config will be better with the MacPro from my research so far.

Now if they come out with a MacPro with Broadwell, TB3 and improved graphics cards, that would be worth waiting for. TB3 will require the new USB C connectors tho or adapters for older TB devices. From what I have read some of the new graphics cards are rumored to generate even more heat so it will be interesting to see what Apple does to make them adhere to the heat requirements of the current design. Slowing them down so they run cooler has been discussed.

Jim
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jjj

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2015, 06:36:31 pm »

I have been wondering that maybe it's time to upgrade my MP, but can't find an Apple machine that seems worth buying.  I use multiple monitors which Apple don't seem to to like and why I'm still on Mountain Lion.
Have even wondered about getting a PC.   :-\
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Czornyj

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2015, 07:58:39 pm »

What monitors? I just got new rMBP15, connected it to 30"2560x1600, 27"UHD, 24"1920x1200 and all worked flawlessly (including Retina 15"2880x1800 display)
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2015, 09:27:05 pm »

I have been wondering that maybe it's time to upgrade my MP, but can't find an Apple machine that seems worth buying.  I use multiple monitors which Apple don't seem to to like and why I'm still on Mountain Lion.
Have even wondered about getting a PC.   :-\

My MP is connected to a 30 inch NEc 302something as main screen and to a 27 inch LG 4K screen.

The LG is defective (it shuts down after 1 hour of usage) and needs to be sent to repair, but the MP, now running 10.10.3, deals with those without issues.

Cheers,
Bernard

JimGoshorn

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #18 on: June 19, 2015, 10:07:50 pm »

I have been wondering that maybe it's time to upgrade my MP, but can't find an Apple machine that seems worth buying.  I use multiple monitors which Apple don't seem to to like and why I'm still on Mountain Lion.
Have even wondered about getting a PC.   :-\

I have stuck with Mavericks because of some of the issues I read about Yosemite on the Adobe forums. While I may not be happy about the current Mac/OS situation, I definitely would prefer to wait for things to straighten out than move to Windows. My significant other has a Windows 7 laptop and each time she asks for help with it, I end up a little balder ;D

Jim
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Schewe

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Re: Experiences with New 2013 Mac Pro?
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2015, 10:56:39 pm »

I have stuck with Mavericks because of some of the issues I read about Yosemite on the Adobe forums. While I may not be happy about the current Mac/OS situation, I definitely would prefer to wait for things to straighten out than move to Windows.

I've got an older 2009 MacPro and a new 2015 MabookPro running 10.10.3 with very little problems other than the fact I don't really like the aesthetics (I really hate the flat look of 10.10x & IOS 8.x).

I think the disconnect for users is that some users are loath to wean themselves of legacy software...when I went to Yosemite I was coming from 10.7.5 which had already killed off older apps. On the laptop I went to 10.9.x but jumped from 10.7.5 to 10.10.3. The only real problems I has was to learn 10.10.3 System & Finder options I needed (Google helped).

I have not pulled the trigger on the new Trashcan Mac Pro but will be soon. I need to finish my book (the update to The Digital Negative) before pulling the trigger.

At this point Adobe has been conservative in their GPU acceleration...LR CC/6 dipped their toe in while Photoshop keeps advancing. Newer powerful vid card really help (the current ACR 9.1 won't use my older vid card in my 2009 MacPro but will on the laptop).

In the future more GPU acceleration wiil come...Photoshop plans to use multiple GPU in the future and LR will get more advanced GPU use as well.

I think the iMacs (and certain Mac Minis) are really good deals but there's nothing like having 128GB of memory with a 1 TB flash drive and dual video cards with a 6 core MacPro.

My main hold up was waiting for enough 3rd part TB2 support to launch. USB 3 is established but TB2 (and soon TB3) have been slow to develop...

My philosophy is to buy the fasted, most loaded computer when I need to and use it (without regret for buying too soon) for years till it becomes time to upgrade. Between hardware & software advances, it all depends on your needs when determining when to pull that trigger.
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