Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Photographing art behind glass  (Read 8401 times)

kevs

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 932
Photographing art behind glass
« on: December 18, 2010, 08:27:13 pm »

What do you all recommend I buy for photographing art that is behind glass?

I have a Canon Camera and external Strobe unit. Thanks.
Logged
Canon 5DS4/ 5D2/ Canon 16-35, 24-105, fixed 85, Profoto D1s

tim wolcott

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 688
    • http://www.galleryoftheamericanlandscape.com
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2010, 02:23:57 am »

Having had to do sometimes because we had to at the Smithsonian.  Make the room all black.  If its between the images your shooting and everything towards the camera needs to be black.  Behind the camera all the way to the print.  But if you can get rid of the glass.  By doing this will eliminate all the reflections possible.  Tim
Logged

fredjeang

  • Guest
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2010, 10:36:36 am »

A polarizer ? You maybe want to polarized the light. (flash+lens) crossed polarization.
For example rolls 48 cm x 150 cm or 48 cm x 51 units.

Also the strobe impact shoud point just above the picture frame or a 45ยบ angle. (you would have a similar issue with a glossy warnish) and wolcott is right about the black arround the camera, you want to avoid reflected light and horrible color dominance and keep colors sat. Set the wb on custom. As much as you can, pasting wolcott's words: If its between the images your shooting and everything towards the camera needs to be black

What does that means? that first you need to switch-of the ambiant lights. Then you can get a big mate black fabrics where you have a hole for the lens. (the hole should be really just for the lens diameter).
I know, it's a DIY solution but it works.
If you can put the artwork on a mate black background also can help. (idealy all the room should be black so you don't need the fabric)

As you are on Canon, try to hire if you can a tilt.S lens.

You would want to use a very slow shutter speed but avoiding closing aperture to the extremes. In short, keeping the shutter speend low within the best aperture of your particular lens.

Ps: I'm not sure the strobes will be the best as you do want everything black and not having other source than your lightning. But that is more according to my taste.

Tether or live-viewed.

Avoid wide angles if the art size and the room allows you.

Good luck.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2011, 03:17:46 pm by fredjeang »
Logged

kevs

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 932
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2010, 02:03:16 pm »

Thanks guys.
I have already shot all my artwork unframed using all the appropriate tools.

But now I need to show, in a few shots, how the artwork looks framed (in suite), in the house.

A still life photographer friend says if you light it properly you dont need to do anything. I'm waiting back for that response.

To get a "black wall" between the art and the camera if a very big pain.

Do you have a link to those light polarizer filters. have you tried them?
Logged
Canon 5DS4/ 5D2/ Canon 16-35, 24-105, fixed 85, Profoto D1s

John Camp

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2171
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2010, 02:24:44 pm »

I used to shoot archaeological objects behind glass in museums, where flash wasn't allowed or you couldn't kill the reflections.

So try this. (I'm assuming a digital camera here.) Set your art up so that you can stand back and not see any reflections of light off the glass from your room lights, and that there are no cast shadows on the art itself. (Like, from a frame. The art needs to be evenly lit -- but not necessarily brightly lit -- which might involve moving some lamps around.) Then, if you get back far enough with your camera, you won't be able to see its reflection (or yours) in the glass. You'll need a tripod, or a way to brace the camera so it doesn't shake. Then using a long exposure instead of a flash, take the picture. If you're back a way -- several feet, a three or four meters) and have a simple prime lens, you may have a lot more wall than you want, but cropping will take care of that. If you need more resolution than cropping will allow, then you'll need a zoom lens. But remember that for a static object, like an art work, careful exposure will usually obviate the need for a flash.

Your bigger problem may be color correction. If you're standing back away, planning to crop, put a good white object in the bottom part of the frame, so you can color-balance with your post-processing software. Try to avoid mixing your lights...it's better to have all of one kind than to have several different kinds. If you're going to shoot art, some way of color-correcting the camera's output is an absolute necessity: you can't get along without it. Color correction is a whole art of its own.
Logged

framah

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1418
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2010, 02:40:47 pm »

Most of the suggestions so far are based on the pieces being able to be set up in a studio type setting.

 As you mentioned that you want to shoot them as they would look hanging in the house then here's a thought... open the frames up and remove the glass and then reassemble the frame and hang it without the glass. Problem solved.

Logged
"It took a  lifetime of suffering and personal sacrifice to develop my keen aesthetic sense."

kevs

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 932
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2010, 04:03:47 pm »

Thanks John, great post.
I'll experiment. Hope I can get a reflection-less situation.
I have very little flexibility in a lot of this. Limited wall space and even limited room for tripods.
For example sometimes a large bed will block any hope of placing a tripod.

But you think this is better than lighting with strobes? A friend just wrote that with grids it could work.

F -- I don't think you understand, I already shot all the art unframed. I now want to show it framed. I cannot remove the plexiglass now - it's fixed permanent.
Too much work anyway -- 15 pieces.
Logged
Canon 5DS4/ 5D2/ Canon 16-35, 24-105, fixed 85, Profoto D1s

John Camp

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2171
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2010, 06:03:29 pm »

I have very little flexibility in a lot of this. Limited wall space and even limited room for tripods.
For example sometimes a large bed will block any hope of placing a tripod.
But you think this is better than lighting with strobes? A friend just wrote that with grids it could work.
F -- I don't think you understand, I already shot all the art unframed. I now want to show it framed. I cannot remove the plexiglass now - it's fixed permanent.
Too much work anyway -- 15 pieces.

If you can't do a tripod, you can try a monopod. You can use that any place you can manage to stand. If you're inside a room, where you're warm and there's no wind, a monopod could be steady enough even for quite long exposures -- but if you do that, check the photo on your LCD to make sure it's sharp and the way you want it, and when you're sure the exposure is right, make about eight more. Small bits of blur are sometimes not visible, and by making redundant photos, you have an excellent chance of getting one that is sharp. You have to be hyper aware of shake, and when you're making the shot, try not to. Use the timer to make the shot, and concentrate on holding the monopod steady.

The point of my post was to suggest a way to eliminate lights. There are ways that you might be able to use lights, but you have to remember that lights are expensive. If you have a cheap source of lights, or you have your own, then you'd be okay. Even with an on-camera flash, if you aimed it at the ceiling or the wall behind you, over even a bedsheet tacked to a wall, (something matte, so you don't get a highlight that'll be reflected in the glass), you'll be able to jack up the light level and shoot with faster exposure times. If you think you need the light, remember that you can adjust white-balance in post processing, which means that you don't have to get really expensive strobes. You could, for example, go down to Home Depot and buy some of their super-bright work lights for $50 or so, and since they're continuous lights, you could move them around until there are no reflections coming off the glass. You'd get a color cast from the light (you'll get a color cast from all the lights unless you're shooting in a neutrally painted bedroom) but you can largely fix that in post.

The reason people use artificial lights for projects like this is to get fast exposure times which eliminates some of the problems involving shake. That is, they can expose close to the camera's native ISO, at a high enough f-stop to give enough depth of field (which you need when you're shooting a frame that stands out from the surface of the art work) and at a fast enough speed to eliminate shake. The problem, of course, is reflections, and they can be hell to get rid of with strobes (with strobes, you can't actually see the reflections in real time - you just have to keep moving them around and reshooting until the reflections are gone, and sometimes, they won't go.)

The reason people use tripods is so that they can expose close to the native ISO, at a high enough f-stop to get the needed depth of field, and at a slow enough speed to eliminate the need for lights, and hence, reflections. The amount of light entering the camera remains the same in either case -- you're just using different techniques to eliminate shake. As for setting up tripods, you can set one up in almost any place you can stand -- since you're inside, on a level floor and without wind, you don't need the full spread on the legs. You could use a narrow spread (supported maybe with duct tape) and then just be careful not to knock it over.

If you're shooting in rooms where you can't change arrangements, you may find yourself in a situation where there is a reflection coming off the picture or frame no matter what you do, because, say, of a window, or because of an overhead light. At this point, sheets of black construction paper, or drapes of matte-black cloth (which you can get at sewing stores), along with a few clamps from Home Depot (Home Depot is the photographer's friend) can help eliminate these sources.
 
Anyway, these are some ideas that I've used. Really, I'd suggest that you go down to a used clothing and household good store, like a Goodwill store, pick up a cheap picture frame with glass, put a piece of aluminum foil inside of it in place of a picture (something that'll give you an outstanding reflection) and then experiment in your house or apartment. Use different kinds of light-modifying stuff, most of which you can make on your own for a few dollars, and you'll quickly work out the best technique for shooting this stuff, with the equipment you've got. When I say quickly, I mean in a couple of hours.

I learned about the tripod/monopod technique when I was working as an archaeological photographer in the Middle East. There was a very narrow band of time between dawn and the actual sunrise, when photography was best (after the sun got over the horizon, the shadows became very harsh.) But you could shoot almost anything, and get decent color, if you just had a steady enough camera to enable long-enough exposures -- even when, to the eye, it seemed quite dim.

JC 
Logged

kevs

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 932
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2010, 07:06:16 pm »

thanks John, I'll be off to work.

I already have an elaborate studio set up with power packs etc, but this is good info.
Logged
Canon 5DS4/ 5D2/ Canon 16-35, 24-105, fixed 85, Profoto D1s

Martin Kristiansen

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1527
    • Martin Kristiansen
Re: Photographing art behind glass
« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2010, 12:31:39 pm »

If you already have images of the artwork shot without glass why not just shoot the interiors with the art work and allow the reflections to fall where they may. Drop the images of the studio shot artwork without the reflections into the frames in Photoshop.
Logged
Commercial photography is 10% inspiration and 90% moving furniture around.
Pages: [1]   Go Up