Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Landscape & Nature Photography => Topic started by: John Camp on January 02, 2006, 04:11:27 pm
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I have a 4x4 SUV which is coming to the end of its useful life, and which I have thoroughly beat around (including a trip to Dead Horse, on the Arctic Ocean in Alaska, from Minnesota), and I'm now starting to think of a new vehicle. One problem that I think most landscape people have is getting just a little bit higher than where you are, to see over local bushes and scrub, especially when the scene you're trying to shoot is flat, or falling away from you. What I'm getting to is this -- In my new vehicle, I'd like to be able to stand on the roof.
The problem with most vans and 4x4s is that you can't stand on the roof. I thought about mounting a sheet of 3/4 inch plywood with U-bolts to the roof rack, which I've been told will take 500 pounds. That would work, but it'd be ugly and, I'm afraid, noisy, and would get me even worse gas mileage. I'll probably do that, though, if a better solution doesn't present itself. I've tried carrying one of those short, multi-extendable ladders, but you can't use a tripod with a ladder.
Does anybody know of a vehicle that has a roof you can stand on? Has anybody else worked out a solution to this problem? I would also like to keep the solution, whatever it is, fairly low, so I can park in a standard home garage and in standard parking structures.
Right now, I'm thinking plywood platform with a sailing life belt to keep me from falling off and killing myself, with maybe some kind of simple apparatus that would keep the the tripod from falling off, as well...
JC
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Military hummers are built pretty tough. However, I'm shure the roof of a full size van could be beefed up at a customizing shop or at a home garage for that matter.
jj
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Outdoor Photographer magazine has been working with Nissan to create some sort of photographer's dream vehicle. Nissan told them that the Xterra wouldn't hold enough weight on the roof to do anything like you describe so they constructed a movable boom that fits in the trailer hitch and allows the camera (sans photographer) to be hoisted well above the vehicle. The camera (a DSLR) is tethered to a computer so they can see where it is pointed. It didn't sound like a great solution to me but they seem to like it.
Standing in the bed of pick-up gets you part of the way up and avoids making any kludgy modifications.
If I were building some sort of roof rack platform, I think I would look at steel grating rather than plywood. It would allow the platform to drain and wouldn't create an airfoil when driving. I'd also build about a 4 inch lip around it so I could carry gear and so I could position my feet and the tripod's feet right at the edge without slipping off.
My sense is that many vehicles are not rated for very heavy loads on the roof. My Jeep Grand Cherokee I think only allows 150 pounds on the roof rack-- not very much.
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Maybe the Land Rover Defender is worth taking a look at.
The model 90 has a short wheel base, and is excellent for off road.
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Actually, I can't find a customizing shop that will beef up a roof -- I went to a car show last year and checked the customizing people, and they all acted like I was goofy. I think there may be liability problems, too. One company does have a roof strong enough to stand on -- they're a van-customing company, but the vans they customize are only two-wheel drive. You can get four-wheel drive, but it costs A LOT -- $8,000 extra for the four-wheel drive alone. That's tempting, but the vans also get about 10 miles per gallon, and I do a lot of tripping.
Military hummers are pretty much out of it: they're tough, but they're crude and expensive, and not too pleasant if you're making a 5,000 mile loop out west. The other Hummer lines are basically Chevy Tahoes with extra weight.
Steel mesh isn't a bad idea, but it'd take a steel frame, and I'm wondering about weight. But that's something I'll definitely look into, because I've also thought about getting one of those permanent back-mounted ladders that would get me up to the roof, and a steel frame would give it something to hook into. Also, I'd rather have something that looks industrial, rather than exotic, because I think the truck would be less likely to get broken into.
I've thought about going with a pickup, and then just putting something like a folding scaffolding in it -- you could rig up something from Home Depot. Standing in the truck bed isn;t high enough -- I stand on the seats of my truck now, with my head stuck out the moon roof, and I'd kill for an extra four feet.
I don't know -- getting up on the roof seems like a simple concept, but getting it done has turned out to be pain in the posterior.
JC
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Good Day John,
There's another option also. It's called "UNI-STRUT". I've been using this stuff for years in the electrical trade. Very very versatile. I've built stand alone frames that supports 600 pound transformers. Also made A frames to hoist 500 pound genset rotors.
I'm suggesting that you purchase the tubes and you do the work yourself ei..lining the inside of your van with it. Since you cut to fit and bolt to assemble, you can remove or install or remove at your leasure....no welding required.
The channel tubes are available in galvanized steel or aluminum.
I've got a chin up bar in my pad made from it. Works like a charm.
http://www.unistrut.com/ (http://www.unistrut.com/)
Just another option for you to consider,
jj
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In Texas 4x4 pickups with raised seats in the bed are used for seeing over brush and scrub while deer hunting. The seats are taken apart when not in use.
Just a thought.
Jerry
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In Texas 4x4 pickups with raised seats in the bed are used for seeing over brush and scrub while deer hunting. The seats are taken apart when not in use.
Just a thought.
Jerry
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Well I'll be damned. Look at this thing!
(http://www.clineline.com/index_files/image565.jpg)
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I have a Toyota Landcruiser with an ARB steel roofrack. I have used it all over Australia for the past 10 years and it makes a great shooting platform. Rated to 200kg so no problems with weight.
There's no point in standing on the roof - just use a decent roofrack.
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Have you thought about doing something similar to your first idea, say a piece of plywood or whatnot, but constructing it where it would be detachable? You could keep in in the rear of you vehicle, but when you need it, pull it out and mount it.
I thought about something like this after one evening of sitting on top on my honda and feeling it buckle slightly under me. Oh well, I got the shot and there's no permanent dent....
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After following up on a couple of tips here, and doing some browsing on the web, I think I'm heading toward a Toyota Landcruiser with a full-length roof-rack. Some of the roof-racks shown online have floors made of bars that are tight enough to stand on without any further flooring, or that you could just throw a piece of carpet on. The bars could also be used to secure both myself and a tripod. I currently have a Lexus GX470, which is a version of the Toyota 4Runner, and it has been very reliable (though I have busted both a tire and a windshield, not the vehicle's fault.)
I did find, in browsing, a "photographers" vehicle here:
www.sportsmobile.com/3_photographers.html
That's a little more than I want. I also live in Minnesota, where the winters are tough, and I really want to be able to keep the truck in my own garage.
I did some browsing on Land Rovers, which somebody suggested, and though the LR has great after-market stuff, like roof-racks, there are two problems in the U.S. The first is that the Land Rovers have a bad record for reliability, and are expensive to fix when they do break down; and the second is that most states have only a single LR dealer. That means that if you break down in West Cooter, Arkansas, you might have to truck it a couple of hundred miles to get it fixed. The most recent Land Rovers have a high-performance Jaguar engine; they're supposed to be great for off-road, but I think that would be most practical in off-road L.A. Toyota dealerships,, on the other hand, are everywhere.
I thought about something removable that I could just put on, and take off, the roof. That was my first idea, in fact. But the problem is, most SUV roofs, including mine, are actually curved in several directions, and in differing degrees. If I just threw a few pieces of plywood on top (perhaps joined with hinges, with rubber on the bottom to protect the roof) I'm afraid that I'd still be denting the high spots under the flat plywood...and I think trying to match the curve of the roof with plywood would be impossible. The other thing is, anything removable would probably just get buried under all the other crap I drag around with me, and discourage impulse-shooting, which I don't want to do. I'd like something where I can yank the car off the road and be set up two minutes later.
I'm thinking that if I attach something like a bungee cord to the bottom of the tripod's center column, and then to one of the roof-rack's floor bars, it should be really steady. I plan to tie myself in with safety lines used in sailing; a two-point hitch, one on each side of the truck, would at least keep me from falling off and landing on my head.
If I actually pull this off (maybe this summer?) I'll post a picture.
JC
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I did some browsing on Land Rovers, which somebody suggested, and though the LR has great after-market stuff, like roof-racks, there are two problems in the U.S. The first is that the Land Rovers have a bad record for reliability, and are expensive to fix when they do break down;
I think this is the Range Rover series of cars, and not the Land Rover Defender, which is a real workhorse.
The Range Rover series had a few bad years earlier, I know, but I don't know anything about the reliability of the current versions (all are upgraded within the past years).
and the second is that most states have only a single LR dealer. That means that if you break down in West Cooter, Arkansas, you might have to truck it a couple of hundred miles to get it fixed.
Ouch.
The most recent Land Rovers have a high-performance Jaguar engine;
That would definitely be the Range Rover series, not the Defender.
The Defender uses a 2.5l diesel.
http://www.landrover.com/gb/en/Vehicles/De..._technology.htm (http://www.landrover.com/gb/en/Vehicles/Defender/Driving_technology.htm)
they're supposed to be great for off-road,
The Defender is right there at the top. The typical saying goes that if you get stuck with your 4x4, get someone with a Defender to pull you out. If the Defender gets stuck, get another Defender. If that doesn't work, get something with belts.
If you want to browse the Defenders, check out the UK web site, since the US web site seems to be missing all those models.
Given the general availability of the Toyota Landcruiser, I suspect that this may be a more convenient car to get, though.
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IMHO, most SUVs are useless for landscape shooting, they're far too small. Even if you could get up onto the roof, you're probably still not high enough. There are many other reasons for my dislike of SUV's, if you'll permit me...
Landscape shooting is "F8 and be there", right? It's the "be there" part that's hard. Anyone can dial up F8. To "be there", especially at sunset and dawn you need a ton of money for motels and a lot of dedication to get up hours before dawn and drive to the location. When it's all over, half an hour after sunset, you still have to drive all the way back to the motel. If you're really lucky, there's somewhere still open where you can get supper. Usually, you're not.
The solution is to camp in the vehicle. SUV's and their ilk fail this test totally. They're far too small to camp in, especially if you need to pack lots of gear. Like a simple aluminum stepladder. (What if the best camera location's not on top of the vehicle?)
The solution is a van, and by far the best van available nowadays (at least for landscape shooting is the Dodge Sprinter. In a Sprinter, you have stand-up head room in back for six-footers, enough room for stepladders and whatever else you need to take, photo-wise. Camping for two would be nothing short of luxury and, since it's manufactured by Mercedes Benz, it's well built and its turbo diesel gives you twice the mpg of North American domestic vans. Mine will have a scooter or dirt bike in back for places the van can't go.
American UPS and FedEx have bought thousands of them to replace their domestic fleet. The Sprinter turns on a dime, has ABS and traction control, tons of ground clearnance, parks in a standard stall, goes over 800 kms on a tank and costs about the same as a Stupid, Useless Vehicle.
www.dodge.com/sprinter
No, I don't work for Dodge. I'm retired. Until I get my Sprinter, I'll have to keep driving my 320,000 km GM van.
Peter
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The solution is a van,
No, the solution is the Defender 110 or 130!
since it's manufactured by Mercedes Benz, it's well built
*big cough*
Just because Chrysler and Daimler-Benz merged and formed Daimler-Chrysler doesn't mean that Chrysler/Dodge/Plymouth are manufactured by Mercedes-Benz.
And that a car is manufactured by Mercedes-Benz doesn't necessarily mean that it's well-built, q.v. the early A-series and the two-three year old Vito.
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The Sprinter would be ideal except for one thing: it's just a hair short of eight feet tall. That means that it won't park in standard residential garages, or in most parking garages. (You'll see that most parking garages have warnings that they'll only accept something up to about six-feet, four inches high; I know, because I've been looking at them. Except for that, The Sprinter would be great.)
The sleep-over thing was the reason I've been considering a van, though I haven't slept in the truck. Motels are fine with me, and since I've spent quite a bit of time camping, I've got a four-man tent and a self-inflating foam pad that works well enough.
Some of the vans on the conversion van sites would really be great for long distance trips with in-van sleeping, though, with microwaves, refrigerators, pop-tops, beds, storage bins, etc. I wouldn't be surprised, though, if they get less than ten miles a gallon. For that price, you could save enough in one-long distance day to stay in a motel...
JC
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Two options -
One go to an RV show, there are some vehicles now that would work for you. I saw one on the Outdoor network RV program that was built on a Ford super duty truck frame that had 4 wheel drive and you could sleep in it. Check the networks website, they might still have info on it.
The second is to start with a truck and use some of the same material that contractors use to build a frame that can hold quite a lot of weight. You could also use steel mesh for the flooring and attach one of those ladders to the back or side so that you could reach the "roof".
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I'd definitely get a Defender. They have plenty of aftermarket parts available for your needs.
Pics from the trip here. Article is in Finnish, sorry. (http://www.venajaseura.com/kulttuuri/siperianhalki.htm)
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Part of the problem with the LR Defender is that it is not imported into the US. I believe it once was, but not now. There maybe some used ones out there and importing a "gray market" model will prove very expensive to modify for both emissions and safety.
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Part of the problem with the LR Defender is that it is not imported into the US. I believe it once was, but not now. There maybe some used ones out there and importing a "gray market" model will prove very expensive to modify for both emissions and safety.
I'm not so sure that it will be so expensive to modify for emissions and safety, unless you import an old model.
The problem might be that it's somewhat expensive, at about 16 000 UKP minimum, which is about the same as USD 32 000.
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I came this close >< to buying a Defender 4 or 5 years back. I'm sure there are plenty in the used market, that could be brought up to spec inexpensively. look around Dallas or LA as there just show vehicles there. No significant offroading miles.
Hell of a vehicle, but noisy and crude, not at all like the GX470.
Bob
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I came this close >< to buying a Defender 4 or 5 years back. I'm sure there are plenty in the used market, that could be brought up to spec inexpensively. look around Dallas or LA as there just show vehicles there. No significant offroading miles.
Hell of a vehicle, but noisy and crude, not at all like the GX470.
Yes, but the GX470 is unusable off-road. With the Defender, you can get stuck in places you'd never get stuck before, simply because you couldn't get there.
Okay, I'll stop flogging the Defender now. I sincerely doubt that Land Rover will be paying me a commission.
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The main problem with the Defender is that they don't meet U.S. safety requirements, and haven't been sold here in 10 years. There's some possibilty that the next model will be, but that won't arrive until (perhaps) 2012.
Actually, the GX470 is a Toyota 4Runner with better seats and stereo; the 4Runner and the Toyota Land Cruiser are probably the two best stock off-road vehicles around, and are much more widely used in serious, non-tourist, off-road and outback situations in Africa and Australia than the Land Rovers, precisely because you can actually get them fixed when something goes wrong.
I'd kill for one of those Defender roof racks, to mount on top of the GX.
JC
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The Sprinter would be ideal except for one thing: it's just a hair short of eight feet tall. That means that it won't park in standard residential garages, or in most parking garages.
Absolutely true. If you have to park in there, the Sprinter's out. Seems like a small price to pay for an otherwise perfect camera vehicle.
I've been to Deadhorse, too. I'm sure you'd agree that the Sprinter'd make it no problem. (Spring thaw excepted)
Some of the vans on the conversion van sites would really be great for long distance trips with in-van sleeping, though, with microwaves, refrigerators, pop-tops, beds, storage bins, etc.
My Chev Astro has taken me across North America numerous times, always on photo missions. It cost me about half what a current Stupid Useless Vehicle sells for nowadays, has saved me a bundle on motels and accommodated me at some incredible locations. As I said, 320,000 kms on the clock with no significant repairs. All but a hundred kilometers or so with me at the wheel. 20 mpg US. 11 liters/100 kms, about 10 cents a kilometer at current fuel prices. Not bad for a house that moves. Darkroom, too, these days.
Most SUVs use more gas than the Astro and are invariably far too small inside for gearn and camping, even for single-handed use. 4WD is so infrequently necessary, I won't pay for it and don't go where I might need it. For that, I walk or take the dirt bike (stowed inside the Astro)
99% of photo trips consists of long stretches of paved highway. The short wheelbase of most SUVs, especially Land Rovers, (I used one for years as a land surveyor) delivers a choppy, uncomfortable ride. They are also invariably intolerably NOISY inside. Gimme a quiet ride any day.
I don't get this platform-on-the-roof thing. Very seldom can you put the vehicle where the camera needs to be, and the fuel penalty is bigger than you might think.
The Sprinter (made entirely by Mercedes) does everything the domestic vans do, but better. Not cheaper, but far better. The only thing "Dodge" about the Sprinter is the little sticker on the hood.
Peter
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Yes, but the GX470 is unusable off-road. With the Defender, you can get stuck in places you'd never get stuck before, simply because you couldn't get there.
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I don't know, My GX470 has been in all kinds of offroad situations. It's built on a truck chassis, not a car chassis like my previous X-5 (Beemer was great on Hwy and snow, but real offroad - NAH). It's the damaging of the cosmetics that keep it away from the more extreme terrain.
Best feature (470), passenger love that the rear seat reclines like the fronts. Makes watching Movies easier during long trips. I think you need to have a custom roof rack built for the GX, myself.
I'm surprised it's been so long since the defender has been for sale, doesn't seem correct but....I'm getting old and my memory is .........<snore>.......
Anyway, the USA models are out there and one can be put in pristeen shape for peanuts compared to buying anything new............<snore>........
AH, sorry, need a new battery for my pacemaker I guess
<kidding, I hope>
BTW, have you concidered getting a Gitzo 9900 XT (xtra tall) and a step ladder. Only $12,500 USD. I saw one of those Little Giant ladders on an infomercial and it looks usable for lots of stuff. Maybe they have an attachable ball head accessory from RRS. You "might" get it before the new Defender comes out!
bob
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I'm surprised it's been so long since the defender has been for sale, doesn't seem correct but....I'm getting old and my memory is .........<snore>.......
Anyway, the USA models are out there and one can be put in pristeen shape for peanuts compared to buying anything new............<snore>........
bob
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Did a web search on the Defender (90)for fun.
Whew was I wrong. There seems to be a cut off in 97 for USA models. And they are pricey. An 8 year old vehicle going for roughly 60% of new pricing. Guess someone likes them. Good ones look like $40-50K.
oh well.
bob
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Personally I would get a Safari Rack and mount it on whatever vehicle you want to drive and call it a day. Attach it for the photo excursions, remove it when just daily driving. With a plywood or expanded metal floor added to the bottom, it will be more than stout enough to stand on. Also LOTS of nifty accessories available for them -- you can find them at most well-stocked off-road stores: http://www.rocky-road.com/wildrack.html (http://www.rocky-road.com/wildrack.html)
But IMO the KargoMaster is probably the best -- and of course the most expensive: http://www.truckaddons.com/Catalog/subpage...ster_safari.htm (http://www.truckaddons.com/Catalog/subpages/kargomaster_safari.htm)
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All right, I'll bite. Instead of waiting for a new vehicle, I ordered the largest KargoMaster with a mounting kit (which they promise me will work on a GX470, though I have my doubts) from Truckaddons.com. I should have it in a week or so, and will try it out. If it works, and if I can figure out how to post a picture of the world's most expensive tripod, I'll do it.
Without a dedicated ladder mounted to the truck, I was thinking I'd have to continue to use my fold-up step ladder, and was thinking, oh sh*t, it takes up so much space in the back...and then I thought, well, duh, you're gonna have a cargo basket...
The Sprinter would eat up the road to Deadhorse, as long as you took it slow through the mountains. That gravel was a little slidey on the curves. Of course, we were up there equipped for anything, and found a guy commuting back and forth in what must have been a 20-year-old Chevy Nova, though with good tires...probably helps not to care what happens to the car. I agree with everything you're saying about vans, and when I do trade, they're still in the running. In addition to taking photo equipment along, I go on a few musky-fishing trips every year, and the rods -- 7 and 7 1/2 feet long, in one piece) barely fit in the GX in rod cases. With a van, you can just drop them on the floor, no problem. I do like the looks of some of the stuff they have on that van site...
http://www.sportsmobile.com/1_dyo.html (http://www.sportsmobile.com/1_dyo.html)
JC
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GM stopped making those passenger vans. They were assembled here in Baltimore and the plant was closed last year. I don't know where they build the commercial vans, but the Chevy & GMC (Astro and something else) were built here.
Have you considered the VW SUV. With the V8 or the diesel (should be back in 2006) a very comfortable vehicle both on and off road. Very capable. VW co-designed the vehicle with Porsche. Stay away from the V6, the thing weighs over 2 tons and the 6 just won't do it. If the diesel is available, get it, gets great mileage, better than the V8 and large amounts of torque over 500 ft/lbs!
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Don't fall off!
bob
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Oh yeah -- ARB makes really high quality racks too.
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I bought a Honda Element for this purpose. It will carry me and my gear to where I want to go-- mostly and while it is only rated for 150# on the roof, with the Thule track mount for the cross bars; it will take me and my Nikon + stuff. that puts my lensens about 11' off the ground. Surprising how many things you can only guess at being there are there to photograph without having to carry a chain saw.
I decided on one by driving into Washington states mountains on logging roads. I carried a 12' fruit picker three legged ladder and screwed a B-1 ball head on top.
12' doesn't always work, but often enough that I get many shots that I happen upon that I'd otherwise miss.
I am an electrician as is JJP above and he is dead on about build your own with strut [ Available at any electrical or Plunbing Wholesale house- yes thy will sell to you for cash}. What he didn't say is that you can easily make structures that are tear down. So you get where you want to go and put your prebuilt rack in place. How about your base not being 6' but 9?
Another thought, electricians mostly have racks built for their vans. Most look like the pix of the real Land Rover shown a few posts back only built out of galvanized expanded steel and angle iron. Believe me the electricians who worked for me had no idea of a weight limit on the roofs [ these roofs would collapse if a 200 pound man walked on them]. We used to set the aforementioned 12' ladders on the top to change light bulbs in parking lots lights- often at 24'.
A last different thought, notice that the racks on the LR pix above didn't mount to the roof but to the lower body, so who gives a rip what the roof rating is?
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Better late than never... (sorry, I just now signed on here)
Of course, you could drive whatever vehicle you pleased and... shoot from a boom mounted camera - wirelessly triggered, and wirelessly relaying images down to your laptop to confirm imaging. You'd have more flexibility of height (in addition to horizontal reach out over a precipice), greater mobility, and there's better personal safety since there's no perch for you to fall from. Never used one, no idea what they cost, just an idea - but it does significantly expand your vehicle options.
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This is a great thread and I guess we've all seen "that" picture and wanted a vehicle with a good useable shooting platform.
A couple of things that come to mind from all the previous posts.
Firstly, the best of best when it comes to 4x4's is landrover. Has been for about 60 years or something. There are only two real workhorse off road choices these days and the other is of course, the land cruiser.
The Merc Sprinter is a bloody good van and good to drive too.
The biggest point to raise though, is that no vehicle is going to be a stable platform unless it's properly jacked up to prevent any sway or movement. No point going to all the trouble to mount a tripod to the top of the vehicle by any of the means mentioned if it's going to move.
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I've had great luck with our VW Vanagon. You can stand forward of the poptop and there's ample room for a tripod. You do need to move slowly to avoid "rocking the boat." The best part is the combination of stove, refrigerator and sleeping space for 4. It's only a 4-cylinder and does a mere 40 MPH up steep grades. Also not adequate for going off-road except on well-graded dirt or gravel. It's about 6' 9" tall and just fits in our garage.
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This has been an interresting thread to read.
I have thought about ways to gain height when shooting in the field for some time. I remember seeing a picture of Ansel Adans shooting with a view camera on a plywood deck mounted on the top of his Buick ( I think) station wagon in Yosemite. I remember trying to get on top of a roof at a rest area in New Mexico for added height to see into the Rio Grande gorge.
I am currently driving a Honda Ridgeline, and thinking about carrying a collapsable ladder - It collapses to a 5 foot length, but extends to a full 10 feet as a leaning ladder - not a step ladder, but folds to makes a 5 foot folded ladder which could be used to shoot from.
One advantage of this is that the vehcile is not necessary - with removeable wheels added to the ladder, it could be wheeled to the shooting site.
Anyone else have any thoughts along this line?
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[attachment=431:attachment]I got this a few years ago to tow my boat and my daughter's horse box. It's the 50th Anniversary Defender with a 4.0 litre V8, it's had a tripod on the roof plenty of times without complaint.
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This has been an interresting thread to read.
I am currently driving a Honda Ridgeline, and thinking about carrying a collapsable ladder - It collapses to a 5 foot length, but extends to a full 10 feet as a leaning ladder - not a step ladder, but folds to makes a 5 foot folded ladder which could be used to shoot from.
Anyone else have any thoughts along this line?
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I bought a collapsible ladder to get on top of the truck. My solution to the problem (I started this thread) was to take the advice of buying a roof rack, which I did, and then to throw a couple of pieces of plywood in it to stand on. I can carry both the folding ladder and the plywood in the back of the truck with no problem, without even getting in the way of anything. Works okay, although I'm nervous about falling off, and have used a sailing safety belt like the kind single-handed sailors use. Anyway, this gets the camera ~12 feet off the ground. It really does get it over a lot of road-side brush, and opens up the world a bit. As far as just using the ladder goes, they don't get you up far enough. You can't stand on the top, so you wind up standing about two steps down, so you're only about three feet higher that you would be anyway. With my GX on the rack, I'm seven feet, and steadier -- and the extra four feet is pretty useful. If you could get a folding ladder that was about nine feet tall, so you could stand at the seven-foot level and maybe have some kind of bolt-on monopod at the top, both to hold on to and to steady yourself with, that would be good, too...I wouldn't want to carry it very far, but you could hump it a couple hundred feet without too much trouble...About the falling-off thing -- I think there's a real danger of getting involved in the photograph, and just edging backwards and catching the edge of the roofrack with your heel and going backwards over the edge. With your heel moving more slowly, I suspect you'd land on the back of your head...That's why you need some kind of safety belt.
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John, just be real careful not to inadvertently lynch yourself with a safety belt if you're out in the boonies on your own.
This is only somewhat related, but perhaps worth considering. I know of a couple who went out for dinner, leaving their dog tethered to a long leash on their large, upstairs balcony. When they returned home, the dog had somehow managed to get through the railing supports (possibly chasing a squirrel) and had - yep - inadvertently lynched itself.
So please be careful, even with a safety belt - and perhaps keep a knife handy should you need to extricate yourself.
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So please be careful, even with a safety belt - and perhaps keep a knife handy should you need to extricate yourself.
In any car, the following implement should be handy for both driver and passengers:
A combined belt cutter and window smasher.
It's a pity that this isn't a standard accessory in modern cars; these things are pretty cheap, too.
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Don't know who makes stuff like that in the states but thats something I'm considering at the moment:
(http://www.expedition-cabin.de/images/photo1gr.jpg)
Thats how you get the platform and something to sleep in. Watch here for their homepage http://www.expedition-cabin.de/engl/index.htm (http://www.expedition-cabin.de/engl/index.htm)
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if you can check out the may 2006 issue of Shutterbug. there is an article in there about a tricked out customizable off road van. Sportsmobile.com
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Glad I'm not the only that's been thinking about this sort of thing!
I'm sure the cheapest option is to just get a reasonable step-ladder (a-frame ladder), and then a clamp tripod attachment - probably more stable too, just as long as you aren't jumping around on the ladder ;)
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I have been using a 4x4 pickup with a glassfiber top for a number of years. I spread the load over the top to go directly down the sides and onto the frame using 12x2's, 2inch galzanised pipe and stuff from the local hardware store. The seat and tripod sit in 2inch and 6inch plastic drain pipe ends screweded to the 12x2's. The coffee cup holder is attached to the seat arm! Both the seat and the tripod can be locked to the 12x2's and as long as the branches are not to low and you trust the driver you could I supose click and drive. To get up I leave the tailgate down and the back window closed and use a two step ladder to get on the tailgate, then lift the ladder onto the tailgate and climb onto the 12x2's.
I alway make sure I have all my stuff including coffee with me when I get up. The dog stays down and normaly lays by a front wheel.
I do a lot of stuff in the New Jersey cranberry bogs and around sunset at certain times in the year the bugs are out in force. The extra hight helps keep them away and you can see them swaming below.
Although it is not a thing of great beauty, it works for me.
Bob
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John,
I had been wanting a roof-top platform for 30 yrs, ever since I first saw the picture of AA ("Camera and Lens," p. 63) on top of his International Harvester. About 10 years ago I built a removable one of sand-varnished 3/4" plywood attached to a Yakima rack on top of my Volvo V70. Looked weird as hell, cut the gase mileage, and was "removable" only with the help of friends -- but it worked great. After a few years, the ply started to separate, and I thought of replacing it with marine ply, but when I found how expensive it was, decided I might as well go with planks: easier to put on/take off. I thought I'd use thick cedar boards, but was convinced to go with Ipe, since it was rock-solid and I could extend the platform farther out beyond the supports. Well, 6-foot planks worked beautifully, looked great, and I got some nice photos ... but the wood was SO heavy (it doesn't even float) that its weight broke one of the support towers ... twice.
The wood's back in the basement, and if I do this again, it will probably be on a pickup truck with a VERY heavy-duty rack system. In that case, I'd extend the wood over the cab. In the interim, the Volvo now has >200K on it, so I just climb on top of the roof....
jim schaefer
(a displaced Minnesotan myself)
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the relatively inexpensive solution is a pickup with good sturdy rack that you can put a platform on - they transfer the weight to the bed/frame similar to the defender photos and widely used by contractors to haul big loads
you can choose any pickup with crew or regular cab, 2 or 4 wheel drive, etc. -- some of the racks may work with a shell on the back as well -- there are a huge number of choices
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I realize this thread is old, and the original question has been addressed, but the attached link shows just what can be attached to the roof of a Toyota 4Runner (here is SA we call them Twin- or Double- Cabs)
http://www.britz.co.za/safari.htm (http://www.britz.co.za/safari.htm)
This is not special equipment here, these add-ons are readily available.
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I too realize that this thread is old, but I just ran across the ultimate in off road photography. With all the amenities of an RV and the power of...well...a lot of power, easy access to the roof, perfectly stable in any condition anywhere....
Introducing the OSHKOSH Expedition Class AWD Motorhome:
http://www.steelwheels4x4.com/index.htm (http://www.steelwheels4x4.com/index.htm)
http://www.gizmag.com/go/3708/ (http://www.gizmag.com/go/3708/)
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I have a 4x4 SUV which is coming to the end of its useful life, and which I have thoroughly beat around (including a trip to Dead Horse, on the Arctic Ocean in Alaska, from Minnesota), and I'm now starting to think of a new vehicle. One problem that I think most landscape people have is getting just a little bit higher than where you are, to see over local bushes and scrub, especially when the scene you're trying to shoot is flat, or falling away from you. What I'm getting to is this -- In my new vehicle, I'd like to be able to stand on the roof.
The problem with most vans and 4x4s is that you can't stand on the roof. I thought about mounting a sheet of 3/4 inch plywood with U-bolts to the roof rack, which I've been told will take 500 pounds. That would work, but it'd be ugly and, I'm afraid, noisy, and would get me even worse gas mileage. I'll probably do that, though, if a better solution doesn't present itself. I've tried carrying one of those short, multi-extendable ladders, but you can't use a tripod with a ladder.
Does anybody know of a vehicle that has a roof you can stand on? Has anybody else worked out a solution to this problem? I would also like to keep the solution, whatever it is, fairly low, so I can park in a standard home garage and in standard parking structures.
Right now, I'm thinking plywood platform with a sailing life belt to keep me from falling off and killing myself, with maybe some kind of simple apparatus that would keep the the tripod from falling off, as well...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=55033\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I submit you'll get 10 times as many photo ops if you can bring yourself to actually leave the car a couple miles behind and hike.
Much better for your cardio-vascular system too!
And, after all those years, you'd finally get photos with a different perspective . . .
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I have a 4x4 SUV which is coming to the end of its useful life, and which I have thoroughly beat around (including a trip to Dead Horse, on the Arctic Ocean in Alaska, from Minnesota), and I'm now starting to think of a new vehicle. One problem that I think most landscape people have is getting just a little bit higher than where you are, to see over local bushes and scrub, especially when the scene you're trying to shoot is flat, or falling away from you. What I'm getting to is this -- In my new vehicle, I'd like to be able to stand on the roof.
The problem with most vans and 4x4s is that you can't stand on the roof. I thought about mounting a sheet of 3/4 inch plywood with U-bolts to the roof rack, which I've been told will take 500 pounds. That would work, but it'd be ugly and, I'm afraid, noisy, and would get me even worse gas mileage. I'll probably do that, though, if a better solution doesn't present itself. I've tried carrying one of those short, multi-extendable ladders, but you can't use a tripod with a ladder.
Does anybody know of a vehicle that has a roof you can stand on? Has anybody else worked out a solution to this problem? I would also like to keep the solution, whatever it is, fairly low, so I can park in a standard home garage and in standard parking structures.
Right now, I'm thinking plywood platform with a sailing life belt to keep me from falling off and killing myself, with maybe some kind of simple apparatus that would keep the the tripod from falling off, as well...
JC
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=55033\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Why not get out of the SUV and use those things called legs. You'll get far better pictures. Perhaps also think of the environment and drop the SUV altogether.
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I too realize that this thread is old, but I just ran across the ultimate in off road photography. With all the amenities of an RV and the power of...well...a lot of power, easy access to the roof, perfectly stable in any condition anywhere....
Introducing the OSHKOSH Expedition Class AWD Motorhome:
http://www.steelwheels4x4.com/index.htm (http://www.steelwheels4x4.com/index.htm)
http://www.gizmag.com/go/3708/ (http://www.gizmag.com/go/3708/)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=72081\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
That IS the world's most expensive tripod. Wonder if it gets four miles a gallon?
I submit you'll get 10 times as many photo ops if you can bring yourself to actually leave the car a couple miles behind and hike.
Much better for your cardio-vascular system too!
And, after all those years, you'd finally get photos with a different perspective . . .
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=73224\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Why not get out of the SUV and use those things called legs. You'll get far better pictures. Perhaps also think of the environment and drop the SUV altogether.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=76509\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Jeez, you mean it's that easy? Why didn't I think of that?
JC
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I too realize that this thread is old, but I just ran across the ultimate in off road photography. With all the amenities of an RV and the power of...well...a lot of power, easy access to the roof, perfectly stable in any condition anywhere....
Introducing the OSHKOSH Expedition Class AWD Motorhome:
http://www.steelwheels4x4.com/index.htm (http://www.steelwheels4x4.com/index.htm)
http://www.gizmag.com/go/3708/ (http://www.gizmag.com/go/3708/)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=72081\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I saw that thing on cable, the guy who build it started with a former fire engine used at airports to fight fires that occur when an airliner crashes. I guess he had a little too much spare time on his hands.
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I recently purchased a roof rack for my JEEP. The rack itself supports a payload of over 500lbs! It's stirdy, strong, and built "tough"! I added an overhead safari rack to it which would allow you to do the same. Then, on the bottom of the rack ,you could put your thin sheet of plywood or something grating for a floor. The rack itself has a lot of support rungs ... the flat panel would just be to give you a fully "solid" floor. But this will work!