Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: Gellman on November 28, 2014, 01:57:49 am
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I need to self publish a small run of a soft cover, 60 page, black and white photo book for a mid-December event. Getting the thing put together is no problem. Deciding who to use to print it is what I need help with. Between Blurb and Lulu, which one offers the highest quality reproduction? There is not enough time for me to get sample copies printed to evaluate. I've also heard about another printer called Artifact Uprising. Has anyone here used any of these printers? They offer different paper options. Which one has worked well for anyone? Thanks in advance to anyone who can share any insight.
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Have a look at Pikto (https://www.pikto.com/cad/photobooks-overview/) Very high quality.
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I've used Blurb for colour work here in the UK from their European presses and been very happy with the results.
However if you back read through the forum you'll find many other opinions.
Black and white seems a particular difficult output for these presses as the slightest colour shift is really noticeable. I'd strongly suggest taking some time to read through the support forums and FAQ pages to check what's recommended for the best output on the company you settle with.
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You might check with some photo dealers and stores who put together sales brochures and small booklets of photos they intend to display for sale. They could steer you to some printers.
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If you’re on a Mac and have Aperture, my experience printing now three books through it and Blurb, the Apple books have been significantly better color than Blurb. They can’t even get close to matching the cover and inside book if you use the same image (useful for testing color QC).
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Andrew - forgive me but I am unclear about what you are recommending. I am on a Mac in a color calibrated environment, but I use Lightroom and Photoshop, not Aperture. I am unsure what alternative you are suggesting. Do you mean some workflow other than the Blurb BookWright application, or some other publisher? Hopefully, color accuracy will not be a concern as all the photos are black and white.
Mark - I was unaware of Pitko. I'll add them to my bag of tricks. They do look to offer very high quality but would not be feasible within my client's budget.
Thanks to everyone for responding. Since more and more photographers are beginning to use print on demand self publishers such as Blurb and Lulu, it would be nice if there were some reviews of the various publishers and their software, articles that address color management for this purpose, and what might be the best workflows for black and white or color, paper options, etc. I know Blurb offers proprietary software as well as an Adobe InDesign plugin, and Lulu offers an online app, but have no idea which are the easiest to use or produce the best results. These publishers do offer tutorials but they are limited in scope.
John
www.jgphoto.com
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Andrew - forgive me but I am unclear about what you are recommending.
Build the book in Aperture, have it sent to Apple for printing. They do a much better job than Blurb. That’s the only functionality I actually use Aperture for, printing books and such.
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I seem to recall reading that Apple is discontinuing Aperture. I wonder what implications that will have for the future of their book publishing through legacy copies of Aperture.
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I seem to recall reading that Apple is discontinuing Aperture. I wonder what implications that will have for the future of their book publishing through legacy copies of Aperture.
Just had a book printed this month, the replacement for Aperture is still not here. So far, so good.
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Is it really Apple printing (I doubt) or they just outsource it? If the latter, then one can use a different program (i.e, Lightroom instead of the discontinued Aperture) and still get the "Apple" quality. That is, if we know which lab Apple uses.
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Is it really Apple printing (I doubt) or they just outsource it? If the latter, then one can use a different program (i.e, Lightroom instead of the discontinued Aperture) and still get the "Apple" quality. That is, if we know which lab Apple uses.
If I told you, they’d have to kill us both. But the facts are, Apple controls this process like everything else they touch and that’s one reason the quality of output is so good. And yes, I know quite well which ‘labs’ all over the world are used. It’s a major operation to do this kind of work worldwide. And no, you can’t use another program and get these ‘labs’ to do the same work, even if you were told where they were.
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Andrew, you are so dramatic! :-)
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Andrew, you are so dramatic! :-)
NDA’s from some companies are super scary. ;D
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Andrew, you are so dramatic! :-)
When you are a supplier of contract services to Apple, the NDAs are draconian and scary and Apple has a track record of suing for a breech. So, Andrew is not being dramatic, he's being very careful. He has to be...
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I’ll just add that I’ve had a number of books printed from both Aperture and Blurb using the identical images and files. The tests where such that I deliberately placed the same image on the cover as inside the book as differing print technologies are used. They should match ideally. I printed both color and “B&W” images. The differences in print quality between the two are dramatic and anyone in the Santa Fe area can come take a look. I will say I found LR’s/Blurb’s templates a bit more interesting in some cases than what’s available in Aperture. So it’s not possible to get a 100% identical looking book from both, but you can get close. I’m not very impressed with the print/color/quality from Blurb but only when comparing it directly to the Apple product hence my suggestion for Aperture. Unlike LR, Aperture does send Adobe RGB (1998) to the service site instead of sRGB, not that this is a major big deal considering the gamut of the presses used. If you are handling B&W work, which is rather difficult to print neutral, Aperture wins hands down.
It’s pretty easy to export your images in Adobe RGB out, import into Aperture just to build a book. Also, the books came back from Apple much faster than Blurb by nearly a week but that could be due to the locations of the various print providers and where I reside.
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Andrew, you are so dramatic! :-)
I agree Mark, but I am sure you were not referring to the NDA part of it, but to this drama:
"And no, you can’t use another program and get these ‘labs’ to do the same work, even if you were told where they were."
:)
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I agree Mark, but I am sure you were not referring to the NDA part of it, but to this drama:
"And no, you can’t use another program and get these ‘labs’ to do the same work, even if you were told where they were."
:)
You look a tad foolish being sure you know what Mark was referring to. Maybe he was, but you’re not inside his head (I hope for Mark’s sake).
Also, there’s no drama in the factual statement And no, you can’t use another program and get these ‘labs’ to do the same work, even if you were told where they were.
You would be lucky to get anywhere inside the facilities. And no, these are not ‘labs’ by a long shot!
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I've printed two photo books through MagCloud. A 100 pager and a 64 pager. I was very pleased with both, especially with the very low prices. The Covers are high gloss, the interior pages semi-gloss. I'd judge the color reproduction to be very good if your files good. Probably less quality than the much more costly publishers out there such as the Apple licensee. I'm in the midst of a 64+ page book featuring my Southwest USA images and have no qualms about using MagCloud again. Here's a screenshop of their current pricing:
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You look a tad foolish being sure you know what Mark was referring to. Maybe he was, but you’re not inside his head (I hope for Mark’s sake).
Also, there’s no drama in the factual statement And no, you can’t use another program and get these ‘labs’ to do the same work, even if you were told where they were.
You would be lucky to get anywhere inside the facilities. And no, these are not ‘labs’ by a long shot!
There you go! Still on the first page and already resorting to name calling. That was quick. I was about to say "you surely know what rhetorics and hyperbole as a rhetorical tool are" but now I am not so sure you do.
The "drama" is not in the facts about your "undisclosed locations," whether you call them facilities, labs, or "labs." The drama is in the underlying assumption in that statement that no other combination of software and publicly open labs can produce results as good as those in Apple's secret facilities. I've seen a number of comparative tests, across the world, and while Apple might come up high, they are by no means always the best in those tests.
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Jeff, Andrew and Slobodan: Cummon guys, lighten-up - just some fun! And yes, I know they mean business about the NDAs!
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There you go! Still on the first page and already resorting to name calling. That was quick. I was about to say "you surely know what rhetorics and hyperbole as a rhetorical tool are" but now I am not so sure you do.
What’s really telling (and quite typical of your posts) is you’ve come here, posted three times and have added absolutely nothing pertinent to the discussion, nada. Why don’t you read what’s been posted here thus far again (if you did in the first place), examine what I’ve written for the OP, then what you’ve written before you take this into uncharted, unnecessary and yes, foolish territory.
Is it really Apple printing (I doubt) or they just outsource it? If the latter, then one can use a different program (i.e, Lightroom instead of the discontinued Aperture) and still get the "Apple" quality. That is, if we know which lab Apple uses.
A question, which as someone who knows the facts, I answered. And you’re absolutely wrong again, one can not use a different program (i.e, Lightroom instead of the discontinued Aperture) and still get the "Apple" quality, not from what you incorrectly call ‘a lab’ using the processes Apple is using. You are excellent at making assumptions based on no understanding of the process.
agree Mark, but I am sure you were not referring to the NDA part of it, but to this drama:
A silly statement that is only useful to inflame and add’s nothing for the OP or lurkers.
And of course your last post which is an obvious attempt to start an argument.
Slobodan, do you have anything useful to say here? If so, say it or move on please. I have no plan to discuss anything else with respect to your writings at this point, it’s a huge waste of my time once again.
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Is it really Apple printing (I doubt) or they just outsource it?
You mean like their hardware? You think they don’t outsource nearly all of it? Or you assume there are some actual Apple employees in Cupertino building Mac’s and iPhone’s in some basement? Is Apple really printing books themselves? No more or less than anything else hardware wise they produce. Is Apple really making any hardware in total on their own, no. They outsource and more importantly control this process like few other companies on the planet.
That you assume you can walk into the faculty they use for printing their books, hand them a drive and get one printed indicates you don’t have a clue to how this process takes place. I on the other hand do. Intimately. And that’s the difference between the posts I’ve made in hoping to aid the OP and you, just mouthing off again.
Best thing for anyone who has an interest in this is to send the same images to two different providers and just examine the results as I’ve done many, many times over the years.
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Andrew, as usual, you've been silly and pompous. Silly in the sense of lacking basic logical analysis and reading comprehension skills.
You are stirring OP in one direction only: Aperture and Apple books. Rather impractical, given his time constraints, to acquire an obsolete program, learn how to use it, etc. in order to achieve a quality that is achievable otherwise. Unless, of course, you claim that nothing out there matches the supreme quality of Aperture/Apple combination. If that were true, and you were able to demonstrate it, I would be the first one to go that route. And I would apologize to you on top of that.
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Just when I was starting to learn something... ::)
Rand
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Well, it got snippy in here while I was away. Glad y'all aren't snipping at me. Slobodan, thanks for your input, however, my respect for Andrew is such that if he seriously leads me in the direction of Apple, that's where I will make every effort to go. I researched the Apple website and found that I can also order books printed directly by Apple's printer from within iPhoto. Don't know what printer Apple uses and don't care. Andrew's opinion is all the endorsement I need.
Andrew, do you suppose I could expect comparable quality from a book prepared in iPhoto as I would expect from Aperture, which I currently do not own? Apple's pricing seems fair, if not the lowest on the block. They quote very fast turn times and offer express shipping. My layout is exceptionally simple, and it appears the layout tools in iPhoto will suffice for this project. If this turns out well, I may have to purchase Aperture just to import finished images and assemble books. This is a choice of which I was unaware and never would have considered. Thank you so much for the advice.
John
www.jgphoto.com
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Glad y'all aren't snipping at me. Slobodan, thanks for your input, however, my respect for Andrew is such that if he seriously leads me in the direction of Apple, that's where I will make every effort to go.
John, my intent isn’t to steer you exclusively to Apple but rather Apple than Blurb. Those are two providers I’ve used for a number of side by side book tests. Slobodan would love to assume I’m claiming Apple is the best of any book provider, anywhere at any price and while that may be so, I have no idea if it is. What is true is that of the three book tests I’ve done using Apple vs. Blurb, with identical images, Apple‘s books were significantly visually superior every time.
Andrew, do you suppose I could expect comparable quality from a book prepared in iPhoto as I would expect from Aperture, which I currently do not own?
Other than options for book layout, the only other difference is that iPhoto sends out a color space that’s very similar to sRGB, Aperture sends Adobe RGB (1998) to the print provider. The presses, process, QC and I suspect turn around time are the same. I’d have to examine iPhoto’s book layout options compared to Aperture which I’ve never done. But otherwise, the process aside from the RGB working space is the same.
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If my memory serves me right, the last time I was looking at iPhoto vs. Aperture for books, the latter had several advanced features in addition to those available in iPhoto (and in addition to what Andrew has mentioned, color space). Mostly in advanced layouts and ease of manipulating images around.
This is what Apple itself says about the difference:
With iPhoto, you can create fun photo books to share with family and friends. With Aperture, you can get even more creative with fully customizable book layouts. Add, move, resize, rotate, or delete photo and text boxes. Place titles exactly where you want them — on any page or even over a photo — and use any font, size, and color you like. Tell a story with multicolumn text. Create two-page, full-bleed spreads. Design wraparound covers. Include travel maps showing where your photos were taken. And add photo borders the width and color you choose. Aperture makes it easy to create photo books as unique as your photos.
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Hopefully, color accuracy will not be a concern as all the photos are black and white.
Black and white is going to be the hardest output assuming you are expecting dead nuts neutral images over the entire image and page.
One big issue is how the Indigo screening deals with neutrals. One fun test I did with one book was to send an entire page of neutral gray to both Apple and Blurb. The screening is such that it’s impossible to get a clean, neutral image across the entire page. You’ll see minor and regular pattern’s going from neutral to non neutral over the page. It kind of looks like someone sat on the page and their repeating butt checks altered neutrality. Seriously that’s about the best way to describe this pattern. If you ‘tone’ the prints a bit, that might help. But nothing can be done to make a page neutral evenly as you’d see in say a good quality inkjet print (Canon, Epson etc). Now while this pattern can’t be dealt with, a shop with a really good printer profile and superb process control will make all this less an issue and again, this is where Apple’s product shines. But don’t expect a B&W from these presses to look akin to say a good inkjet with a good profile but with a halftone dot.
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If my memory serves me right, the last time I was looking at iPhoto vs. Aperture for books, the latter had several advanced features in addition to those available in iPhoto (and in addition to what Andrew has mentioned, color space).
For B&W work, anything that fits inside of sRGB, the difference in what is sent to the print provider is moot.
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Well, there you go. Never question the ultimate authority from Santa Fe, book printing capital of the world.
Aperture? Really?
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Andrew, despite how others may interpret your statements, I never thought you were trying to steer me exclusively towards Apple. Rather you simply addressed exactly the subject of my post - Lulu, Blurb, or who? I have seen photo books produced by Blurb and I think they are nice, but I found the reproduction quality to be underwhelming. Perhaps that is due to standard entry level rather than higher level choice of paper. I just don't know, and I don't have time to order some test copies from various sources and do my own comparison. I have never seen a Lulu produced photo book, so I am clueless. Whether one worships Apple or not, it is hard to argue with the quality of almost everything they do. So, considering your involvement (whatever it may be) with Apple's printing operation, the fact that you are one of the world's foremost color management experts, and that you are apparently a made man in the Pixel Mafia, who am I to ignore such helpful advice on a tight deadline? Thank you.
I will add a slight sepia/warm tone to the images. They were all shot in the mid-1970s and should look good that way. Hopefully that will minimize the printing challenge of producing "dead nuts neutral images." Maybe toned like acorns is the way to go in the dead nuts color space.
It is unfortunate that I have not taken it upon myself to research print on demand publishers of photo books before I had an urgent need to know. I guess there is no substitute for staying abreast of new technologies in a field that changes so rapidly. My bad. At this point, my goal is to have twenty-five copies of a book printed in time for my client's event, staying near my client's modest budget, that at best I will be proud of, and at worst won't embarrass me.
Considering the lack of useful comparative information available online, all I can say is thank goodness for the Luminous Landscape forums.
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Hopefully, color accuracy will not be a concern as all the photos are black and white.
I've mentioned this before; Colour accuracy is absolutely critical for Black and White. All PoD photo books are printed on colour presses, getting complete neutrality is very difficult and the slightest colour cast can be very obvious and unacceptable.
I've read a couple of comments over the years that go as far as suggesting that attempting proper monochrome is futile and that you'll get greater satisfaction from applying toning to any images used , sepia, cyanotype, selenium etc
I have seen acceptable B&W from the European Blurb presses, but it's still not up to the standards of neutrality that you would expect from a well set up inkjet or gelatin silver prints.
The Apple books I've seen here in Europe have been no better than ones from Blurb, Lulu, My Publisher etc. It was often reported a few years back that the iPhoto books were printed by My Publisher. (I'm not subject to any Apple NDAs).
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Black and white is going to be the hardest output assuming you are expecting dead nuts neutral images over the entire image and page.
One big issue is how the Indigo screening deals with neutrals. ... But don’t expect a B&W from these presses to look akin to say a good inkjet with a good profile but with a halftone dot.
So, thought I'd look up the latest in HP Indigos..worth a read, if we think that many book printing operations are using equipment along llines of that outlined in the linked PDF. The Indigos seems to now go up to 7 colors. Options for light magenta, light cyan, AND light black (for 2-color B&W printing) can add fidelity. Additionally, perhaps for usage in accent type in one's book, spot PMS colors could be used. Now, whether any book printers allow these options, I don't know.
http://h20195.www2.hp.com/v2/getpdf.aspx/4aa3-6495enw.pdf (http://h20195.www2.hp.com/v2/getpdf.aspx/4aa3-6495enw.pdf)
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More toner (colors) are intended mostly for larger color gamut. Harder to profile (one must re-profile) and produce better neutrals. Don’t expect to necessarily find them in the operations under discussion just yet. And of course, more toner, substitutionally higher cost for print providers. Less toner colors, bigger issues with screening.
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It is not the limitation of the Indigo models but the standarisation of Blurb I'm told. We have a local supplier to Blurb that has the W7200 with 7 ink ability.
See:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/conversations/topics/106930
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
November 2014 update, 680+ inkjet media white spectral plots
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More toner (colors) are intended mostly for larger color gamut. Harder to profile (one must re-profile) and produce better neutrals. Don’t expect to necessarily find them in the operations under discussion just yet. And of course, more toner, substitutionally higher cost for print providers. Less toner colors, bigger issues with screening.
Don't most of these printers only have only a few paper choices anyway..? For a business, coming up with 3-4 profiles for Hi-fi or maybe even hexachromatic printing, shouldn't be that much of a problem. Better neutrals, with less ink usage would be obtained using a 2-color B&W inkset rather than 4cp I would think.
More toner usage would potentially be a cost factor, but I don't think a large one (or at least that couldn't be passed of to the consumer at say a few dollars/unit increase). This might get offset by a degree as well to the percentage of rejected work being reduced.
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Don't most of these printers only have only a few paper choices anyway..?
More toner usage would potentially be a cost factor, but I don't think a large one (or at least that couldn't be passed of to the consumer at say a few dollars/unit increase).
First off, papers have to be OK’d (certified) by HP for use. 2nd, the HP model for toner is akin to what Epson does with their inks (make a very nice profit on that expendable). So yes, Toner costs are on the owner/operators minds at all times. Lastly, they take a good deal of maintenance and have a number of other expendable parts that have to be regularly replaced.
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First off, papers have to be OK’d (certified) by HP for use. 2nd, the HP model for toner is akin to what Epson does with their inks (make a very nice profit on that expendable). So yes, Toner costs are on the owner/operators minds at all times. Lastly, they take a good deal of maintenance and have a number of other expendable parts that have to be regularly replaced.
I realize all of the above, but we're talking about the relative cost difference between running one of these machines with just 4-colors turned on vs. eg. 5-colors (to enable 2C B&W), or 6-colors (to add LM and LC). FYI, Pikto (who Mark referenced earlier in this thread) seems to market themselves with their 6C default print quality.
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Black and white is going to be the hardest output assuming you are expecting dead nuts neutral images over the entire image and page.
........................ But don’t expect a B&W from these presses to look akin to say a good inkjet with a good profile but with a halftone dot.
Andrew, I think this all depends, as usual, on the quality of the work and process that goes into it. You get what you pay for in terms of time and money. As I write, I have at hand here a book we made several years ago to celebrate my late Mother's 90th birthday. A good number of the photos in that book are from my archives of black and white 35mm negatives shot as far back as the 1950s. I digitized the negatives in my Nikon 5000 scanner using SilverFast, neutralized them in SilverFast (the film always has a bit of a cast), output them to Pikto's specifications, selected their highest quality book paper offering and they then made the books. I don't know what process and machinery they used (they don't say), but the quality of the B&W rendition is outstanding in every respect. Contrast, clarity and sharpness are well-maintained and the photos are as neutral as I can judge them, uniformly across the page. I have to assume you weren't trying to suggest there is some kind of huge generic challenge to get this right in any absolute sense.
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Back to basics, guys. One last workflow question about the Apple book printing service - what about sharpening? Assuming I generate images at the size they will be printed, how should I set PhotoKit Sharpener II for output sharpening? All images are 35 mm Tri-x scanned on Nikon LS-5000. Btw, would this be the same for Blurb and other printers?
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In PKS use halftone.
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Thanks Andrew. What effect? (Specifically for Apple.) There are twenty effects from which to choose under halftone.
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Should be only one for output. Not near a computer but just look for output not creative sharpening.
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Nope. There are 20 effects for halftone output. I just double-checked. From 85lpi Coated 127.5 ppi to 175lpi Uncoated 350 ppi. (Every option is listed in Coated and Uncoated.)
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Nope. There are 20 effects for halftone output. I just double-checked. From 85lpi Coated 127.5 ppi to 175lpi Uncoated 350 ppi. (Every option is listed in Coated and Uncoated.)
My bad, yes LPI. If memory serves me, for Apples Indigos get as close to 160 LPI.
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didn’t know apple books switched from NexPress to Indigo’s. The Indigo’s originally couldn’t deliver the quality Apple liked but I heard they also didn’t like some of the aspects of the toner based printing Blurb certainly doesn’t seem to get much out of their indigo’s. The tight integration between Apple, their software, and their providers certainly seems to work, I haven’t seen many poor quality Apple books.
I know a few who have published books who have used Apple to do short run prototypes, which looked pretty good.
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didn’t know apple books switched from NexPress to Indigo’s.
They didn’t. Various on demand press technologies are used depending on the part of the book (cover, interior) is under discussion and this is true for all book publishers. That’s why my Blurb book covers and interior shots of the same image don’t match as well as I’d like. That’s real, real hard to do.
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Unfortunately, Aperture and iPhoto are the only two entry points to the Apple book printing service. It appears that iPhoto doesn't have the design flexibility I need, and the only version of Aperture Apple will currently sell only runs on Yosemite, and will not run on Mavericks, which is my current OS. So I'm back to square one. Does anyone besides Apple have better quality than Blurb? Lulu? PhotoBook Press? Or... is there anyone with enough pull at Apple to get them to sell me the last version of Aperture that will run on Mavericks? Gotta ask. Ya never know. I would gladly send one of my Duane Allman prints to anyone that can get me an older version of Aperture.
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Do you have a second drive on which you could install Yosemite and use it for this purpose? For example, I have one legacy product that needs Snow Leopard, but other applications that need at least Mavericks, so I keep both operating systems, but on separate drives. The MacPro/OSX architecture makes it very easy to work between the two systems as you need them. All document files/pictures etc. are reachable wherever they are stored from whichever the two OS you operate.
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Or if you don't have a spare hard drive, you could split your OS hard drive into 2 (or more) partitions. I've now got Snow Leopard, Mavericks and Yosemite partitions on a single drive.
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Or buy an older version of Aperture on ebay:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l2632.R2.TR12.TRC2.A0.H0.Xaperture&_nkw=aperture&_sacat=18793
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Other than options for book layout, the only other difference is that iPhoto sends out a color space that’s very similar to sRGB, Aperture sends Adobe RGB (1998) to the print provider. The presses, process, QC and I suspect turn around time are the same. I’d have to examine iPhoto’s book layout options compared to Aperture which I’ve never done. But otherwise, the process aside from the RGB working space is the same.
Andrew, is the color gamut of the printing process significantly wider than sRGB? If not, what is the benefit of being able to send the files in Adobe RGB (1998) for printing? Or is it simply some sort of convenience feature?
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Digitaldog, Slobodan Blagojevic, please just SHUT UP!
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Digitaldog, Slobodan Blagojevic, please just SHUT UP!
I think Andrew has been making very useful contributions to the this thread, and it is important to think twice before telling other members to "shut-up", including to ask yourself whether it is your prerogative to do so in the first place. Yes, a few barbs were traded, but let's be tolerant - happens from time to time; I wish it didn't, but that's life and let's not obssess.
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I think Andrew has been making very useful contributions to the this thread, and it is important to think twice before telling other members to "shut-up", including to ask yourself whether it is your prerogative to do so in the first place. Yes, a few barbs were traded, but let's be tolerant - happens from time to time; I wish it didn't, but that's life and let's not obssess.
Both make very useful comments to this and many other threads; we all know that, but they both also get into what can only be described as childish ego contests which add nothing and detract much, and I think it is perfectly fair to tell them to stop it.
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Both make very useful comments to this and many other threads; we all know that, but they both also get into what can only be described as childish ego contests which add nothing and detract much, and I think it is perfectly fair to tell them to stop it.
OK, for the record, this debate between them ended November 28th 8:30 PM LULA time. It was gone, buried. You come in on December 5th and create an issue, in unflattering language. I'm not going to prolong this. I agree with you such incidents are distracting, but truly, there is such a thing as the appropriate time and manners for handling it, if the situation really cries out. I'll leave it at that, and no hard feelings meant - just a suggestion about tolerance and civility a number of us need to remind ourselves of periodically. :-)
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Andrew, is the color gamut of the printing process significantly wider than sRGB?
Not significantly but sRGB is smaller in cyan’s and blues a bit and depending on paper, yellows. Adobe RGB fully contains the entire output gamut so that’s moot.