I am looking around at products that I can use to improve color accuracy and especially white balance, particularly for situations like night shots, night shots with street lighting..or even worse night shots with snow. I am considering ColorChecker Passport, SpyderCheckr + that nifty SyperCube and even ExpoDisk. Being able to take the solution out into the field is an important consideration.
Any thoughts? Recommendations?
I am looking around at products that I can use to improve color accuracy and especially white balance, particularly for situations like night shots, night shots with street lighting..or even worse night shots with snow. I am considering ColorChecker Passport, SpyderCheckr + that nifty SyperCube and even ExpoDisk. Being able to take the solution out into the field is an important consideration.
Any thoughts? Recommendations?
Thanks
What's wrong with using a daylight (or dual illuminant) calibrated profile, and using that at night? As a neutral reference for the local color balance you can then use something as physically rugged as a WhiBal (http://michaeltapesdesign.com/whibal.html).
Thanks all. I think my particular issue is WB, though creating a calibrated profile can't hurt.how do you intend to create a "calibrated" profile in a uncalibrated profile creation workflow ( when tools used for dcp profiles do not allow you to enter measurements of your particular target ;D , that is if you have tools /calibrated ?/ to measure it in the first place ) ... do you really think you are getting a "better" profile for a daylight ? no - you just getting a different profile (by removing some part of what Adobe thinks your colors shall be)... you can argue about taste, but not about "precision".
Thanks I will look into the WhiBal. Any comments on the ExpoDisk? This seems so easy to use, especially for the field, that I wonder if I am missing something.
http://rmimaging.com has some tests of WB targets (in terms how neutral they are, with a usual fine print about variations between items) - for example http://www.rmimaging.com/information/ColorChecker_Passport_Technical_Report.pdf has info about a dedicated WB target in xrite passport.
and of a BabelColor White referencewhich unfortunately ceased to be sold because of some patent dispute (???)
which unfortunately ceased to be sold because of some patent dispute (???)According to Danny, it was simply too expensive to produce and sell at that cost.
According to Danny, it was simply too expensive to produce and sell at that cost.he could simply cut Teflon sheets into smaller chips with a hole in a corner... done.
how do you intend to create a "calibrated" profile in a uncalibrated profile creation workflow ( when tools used for dcp profiles do not allow you to enter measurements of your particular target ;D , that is if you have tools /calibrated ?/ to measure it in the first place ) ... do you really think you are getting a "better" profile for a daylight ? no - you just getting a different profile (by removing some part of what Adobe thinks your colors shall be)... you can argue about taste, but not about "precision".
However I still need something that allows be to easily set custom wb in the field. I am not sure gray cards are the most convenient thing to do this.
Ummm.... I read this several times and still cannot figure out what you are suggesting...CCP has a lightgrey card incorporated as well. So that can be used to eyedrop the color balance.
What I am suggesting is that I could use ColorChecker to create a dng profile. However I still need something that allows be to easily set custom wb in the field. I am not sure gray cards are the most convenient thing to do this.
he could simply cut Teflon sheets into smaller chips with a hole in a corner... done.So what he specifically wrote about the cost and price for consumers isn’t accurate or you have something solid about some patent dispute?
What I am suggesting is that I could use ColorChecker to create a dng profile. However I still need something that allows be to easily set custom wb in the field.Use the same Passport target.
Use the same Passport target.
Yea, I got that. But is there anything wrong with the ExpoDisk as a WB target? Other than the additional cost?
But is there anything wrong with the ExpoDisk as a WB target?It’s unnecessary. Use the Passport target for WB too!
Yea, I got that. But is there anything wrong with the ExpoDisk as a WB target? Other than the additional cost?
The ExpoDisk is supposed to be aimed at the light source, so if there is more than one light source the ExpoDisk will probably not be as accurate as a white balance card, assuming you can position the card in a way that it is reflecting those multiple sources (which may be really tricky often times).
However, you can probably find some other way to do what the ExpoDisk is doing. For example, I found a cap to a bottle of salad dressing that was very similar to what you might find on a light meter for incident readings. I placed that over my lens and set the camera white balance using it. It was very, very good.
I learned at that time, like has been pointed out, "perfect" white balance can kill the atmosphere. "Perfect" white balance is supposed to show you true color, while the colors we are seeing in everyday life are only "true" in a certain, ever-changing, context. Sometimes we need the "hard" truth, and sometimes the contextualized truth.
Actually, if white balance is the only thing you need, a SpyderCube can be enough.He needs a DNG camera profile!
So it will correct the color input of your camera to match the colors in real life.
The goal of a White balance tool is to get an impression of ... ambient reflections, that will determine how the subject color reflections will look....
...Also remember that the scene illumination mostly comes from illumination sources that are behind the camera and to it's sides. Measuring (averaging color reflection) of what's in front of the camera only makes sense if it is of a subject with known spectrally neutral reflection (of that illumination behind the camera), or the same color as the illumination.
I would think that if the goal is to get an `approximate` calibration of white balance for later post production that pointing the ExpoDisk at the scene would give reasonable, average results. The disk will be lit up from the reflected light from the various objects in the scene, much as a grey card may be lit up by reflections from the many objects.
He needs a DNG camera profile!
Ah, no, not really.
Why?
What else?
And if you are the lucky owner of a Sony a7(r), it's even easier and better: This camera allows you to set the WB in real time in live view - no need to make test shots; and you can adjust BOTH the yellow-blue AND the magenta-green balance!
I would think that if the goal is to get an `approximate` calibration of white balance for later post production that pointing the ExpoDisk at the scene would give reasonable, average results. The disk will be lit up from the reflected light from the various objects in the scene, much as a grey card may be lit up by reflections from the many objects.
Hey, either way I guess I will give it a shot. Its not that expensive. Or maybe I`ll just look for a suitable bottle of salad dressing :)
Well, so much for that idea. Tried it and it really sucks. Brought it back. What I saw on the camera display screen (yes I know its only an approximation) using AWB or Tungsten preset (they were virtually the same) was much closer to the scene than what I got with a preset based on the ExpoDisk, which gave completely garish results.
Guess I get that grey card, though it would be cooler to do an in-camera correction.
brighter than an exposure card (lower noise).if you make a specific shot w/ WB target you can just expose it properly (spot meter and adjust), now if you want it to be in your regular shot along with the object it is another story - but then if it is somewhere along the border you might have other issues with colorshift for example.
if you make a specific shot w/ WB target you can just expose it properly (spot meter and adjust), now if you want it to be in your regular shot along with the object it is another story ...
- but then if it is somewhere along the border you might have other issues with colorshift for example.
Guess I get that grey card, though it would be cooler to do an in-camera correction.
One thing I do not understand is LR recommends correction on a neutral gray object rather than a white object.if they key word is neutral then it is obvious, if the key word is is gray may be to avoid the situation when you either clip "white object" /assuming that you might expose WB target along with something else and... might happen/ or (allegedly, with some cameras) expose it to the area near sensel(s) saturation where the situation with the sensel charge might get non linear (hence even a neutral object will be non neutral).