Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Cameras, Lenses and Shooting gear => Topic started by: ErikKaffehr on February 15, 2014, 04:11:57 am
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Hi,
The new Sony Alphas are potentially very attractive cameras. Still I decided to skip the EF mount for this time. Here are the reasons:
- I am pretty sure this is just the first generation. Hopefully there will be a '9' version.
- I just invested in a P45+ with a Hasselblad, that puts some strains on my spending and fulfils my lust for pixels.
- I have an Alpha 99 that I am happy with
- I am pretty unenthusiastic about lack of OLP filter on the A7r
- I have a Sony Alpha 77 with 3.9 micron pixels, and I feel that pixel size is preferable. Corresponds to 54 MP on full frame
- I may feel the A7r might have been a rush work. The A7 has a later generation sensor with electronic first curtain leading to short response time.
- The A7 also has on sensor phase detecting AF, the A7r has not
- Size doesn't really matter to me, I will always carry a 70-400 zoom and they are big, anyway.
- I was not impressed by the optical quality of the NEX lenses. Much interested in the new lenses, and it seems that the Zeiss primes have some promise, the 1.8/55 actually being an excellent lens
So I actually stand by, and see where Sony is going and looking forward to 54 MP variant with a larger battery. It also strikes me that buying the Alpha 7r, some decent adapters and all Canon T&S lenses would have been smarter than buying the P45+ and the Hassy ;-)
Regarding the issues with shutter caused vibration, I think it is there. With regard to the discussion on raw compression I strongly feel it is a non issue, mostly. Diglloyd has found real atifacts on star tracks, which I presume are coming from delta compression. That may be fixed in a firmware upgrade.
An EF-mount camera may be on the shopping list for 2015.
As a side comment about the MF camera, I like working with it. I don't know if it helps me taking better pictures or if it just a hindrance. The advantage I see with MF is resolution and nothing else, DR advantage and 16 bit is pure myth. Regarding colour rendition I am pretty sure the Sonys I have are more accurate. For that the P45+ may yield better colour. Accurate and good is not necessarily the same.
Best regards
Erik
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Erik, I have both the a7 and the a7R. I'm still trying to figure out where they fit in my collection of photographic capture devices.
I bought the a7R with the idea of using it for a specific macro-ish series in the field. The shutter shock put an end to that idea, at least with available light. Using trailing-curtain synch, I could make it work with strobes if I am willing to carry all that lighting gear around (it's not so much the lights, but the light stands and the diffusers and the reflectors and the softboxes...) So I'm either going to use the D800E for that, or stitch with the a7. The electronic first curtain on the a7 is a real revelation to this Nikon shooter, although I guess Canon people have had it for a while. A long shot is dragging a H2D-39 out of storage, but it currently is on the fritz. I'm not sure repairing it is worthwhile considering its depreciated value and its about-to-be-obsolete Firewire interface. If you're interested, I could go on for days about the Imacon SCSI to Firewire conversion and what a disaster that was.
The weight of the alpha 7s is not important to me, but the tilting LCD panel is a godsend. I can get low angles that my aging back made me give up on years ago. I can use less tripod extension and get more stability. Another great thing about the cameras is the crisp EVF focusing; it makes me want to slap my D800E every time I use live view on it.
I think the a7 is a better walking-around camera than its sibling. The AF is definitely better. But if weight's not important, the D4 is impossible to beat, IMHO. It's the first camera I reach for when someone says go somewhere and document an event. Fast, big buffer, fast AF, low noise, what's not to like?
For travel, I don't take the D4 unless I need to. The RX-1, and now the a7, seem to make excellent travel cameras. I'd put them clearly above the M240 in that regard if it weren't for the small number of Zony FE lenses and the user interface. The Zony lenses -- I only have the 55 now -- are light and, in the case of the 55, are, as you say, excellent. I consider my copy of the Zony 55 to be as good as a 50mm ASPH 'lux.
I wish Sony would employ the Canon/Nikon push-a-button-and-twirl one or two wheels UI. It seems like they're halfway there. The OK button in the middle of the four-way wheel is awful. Either you push it by accident or you push some part of the wheel while you're trying to push it. Nikon had this problem early on, and they still have the arrangement, but they made the switch detents stiffer, and they have an OK button well away from the wheel that you can use instead (unless you're changing the file name).
But I'm rambling. One group of people who might be candidates for the a7R are Canon users who've been waiting a long time for a dim light, high res body, but there's that shutter vibration thing.
Is is nice to have choices while we wait for the D4x and the $10K CMOS MF back. I've got a few Hassy lenses that I'd love to use on something modern, but MF prices scare me off, and at high res, you really need live view.
Jim
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The OK button in the middle of the four-way wheel is awful. Either you push it by accident or you push some part of the wheel while you're trying to push it.
You can disable it.
On the A7r you have 3 custom buttons, 12 'Fn' settings, 4 controller tabs plus the centre button if you 'need' it - a total of 20 possible customisations, although I strongly recommend disabling the centre wheel for the reasons you've just stated.
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Erik,
I read your reasons and thought these, in and of themselves, a sufficiently good reason for your decision ..
quote
- I just invested in a P45+ with a Hasselblad, that puts some strains on my spending and fulfils my lust for pixels.
- I have a Sony Alpha 77 with 3.9 micron pixels, and I feel that pixel size is preferable. Corresponds to 54 MP on full frame
- I have an Alpha 99 that I am happy with
unquote
I have had several exchanges with other members about the A7r, probably no need to repeat them but 3 points that you and Jim Kasson (above) have not mentioned are
(1) The huge advantage of the Sony is the interoperability now afforded by virtue of being able to use a variety of lenses.
(2) The live view/focus peaking implementation is the best yet - bar none.
(3) You can tether.
The shutter issue may be a problem for some. It was the same for me when I first picked up a D800e - it needed a distinctly modified technique to be able to hand hold. This is different for sure, but I'm convinced that by adding mass to the body (and possibly a different L-bracket) the negatives may not be eliminated but, hopefully, will be minimised.
Regarding the lenses, particularly Jim's assertion in comparison to the Leica 50 Lux - I haven't tested them both yet - but as we well know resolution charts don't tell the whole story. How different lenses 'draw' are also important depending on the subject and usage. Someone described some of the older variants as being more 'organic', not as clinical as some modern ASPH designs. I think they have a point, certainly for some forms of portraiture. In the link below, you can see a comparison of various lens on the Sony. I'll let you be the judge of the Otus v Summilux comparison.
Regards
M
http://www.3d-kraft.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=151&catid=40&Itemid=2
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I had high hopes for the A7r but after trying it a couple of times I decided to pass. More of my reasons can be found here:
http://paulcaldwellphotography.com/021414-why-i-didnt-purchase-a-sony-a7r-thoughts-from-a-nikon-shooter/
Shooting with a tech camera makes me wish for AF whenever I can get it. If a Nikon adapter does come out later on with AF support I would give the A7r a 2nd look. Plus by then Sony may have a solution for the shutter issues many photographers seem to notice.
Paul C
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I went for the A7 and I'm happy with it. I sold my 5D and all my Canon/Sigma lenses.
I chose the A7 rather than the r basically because I don't need the additional resolution and the massive files and 24mp is much more than I've ever had before and I was pretty happy with my 20D and 5D.
I've used my A7 quite a bit now and I can honestly say that I've never pressed the centre button my mistake :D
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I must say that the introduction of the A7/r certainly aroused my curiosity. But after owning an NEX7 and reading of others experiences with the new camera body I keep getting the feeling that Sony, while wowing with the technical advances, continues to introduce half-baked products.
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For a lens hoarder like me the A7r is kid in the candy store fun. In terms of usability my first impression was Hmmm..., but the longer I spend with it the more I like it. My favorite lens set thus far has unexpectedly turned out to come from Pentax: 31/77/150mm, with the first two being part of the excellent Limited series and the third being a very compact tele I bought used years ago for under US $100. The 150, an f/3.5, punches way above its weight. The two Ltds are first class in build and performance. I also like that all three lenses are kinda odd focal lengths and thus don't duplicate lenses I own from other makers (or native FE lenses likely to turn up at some point). For wider coverage so far I've prefered using a Nikon 28/3.5 PC lens and making composites over using an ultra-wide. The Nikon, at f/11, performs fine & dandy as a straight-up 28mm and also when shifted. I have little interest in longer lenses with this camera.
-Dave-
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For travel, I don't take the D4 unless I need to. The RX-1, and now the a7, seem to make excellent travel cameras. I'd put them clearly above the M240 in that regard if it weren't for the small number of Zony FE lenses and the user interface. The Zony lenses -- I only have the 55 now -- are light and, in the case of the 55, are, as you say, excellent. I consider my copy of the Zony 55 to be as good as a 50mm ASPH 'lux.
But I'm rambling. One group of people who might be candidates for the a7R are Canon users who've been waiting a long time for a dim light, high res body, but there's that shutter vibration thing.
Jim
Agree, the D4 is the "go get that picture" camera.
But in low light, the 6D is much quieter than the Sony, check dp's comparison. But as always the 7r has more pixels if that's what you need.
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EVF only, is a very good reason for someone to reject an all purpose camera… :-[
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Yes just like there are always drivers who like playing with their gears and not using auto !
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You can disable it [the center "OK" button].
I went looking for how to do that. Before I tried to figure out how to disable the button, I thought I should reassign the function to something else; otherwise, how could I say "OK"? I thought C3 would be a good candidate, since it's close to the wheel. I found the menu item to reassign C3, and scrolled through the long list of possibilities, but couldn't find anything like "OK" or "Enter" or "Select".
Can you give me some guidance here?
Thanks,
Jim
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Can you give me some guidance here?
I have sent you a PM.
All best
M
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EVF only, is a very good reason for someone to reject an all purpose camera… :-[
or select one...