Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Computers & Peripherals => Topic started by: David Eichler on May 17, 2013, 08:22:30 pm
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I am seeking suggestions for a moderately priced monitor to be used primarily for photo editing. Most of my photos get used for web viewing or cmyk printing, which does not require wide-gamut viewing. I occasionally do some printing on an Epson 3800, but I don't think it is enough to warrant spending the money on a really wide-gamut monitor when I am on a budget and could make better use of my resources for other hardware. The price range I am thinking of is about $400 to $600 for the monitor.
I currently use a 2009 model iMac and would be getting current model Mac Mini to use with the new monitor.
One monitor I am considering is the Asus PA246Q. Any other suggestions in the $400 to $600 range?
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sufficiently decent review sites for LCD monitors :
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/
http://www.prad.de/en/index.html
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I paid about $650 for my Dell U2711 monitor, caught it on sale/refurb from the Dell store. Wide gamut, 27" size, capable of 10 bit display with the right card, IPS panel. Really a great value for the price. I think they're listed at $750 right now for a refurb, but you could keep your eyes peeled for a coupon code or a sale.
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I paid about $650 for my Dell U2711 monitor, caught it on sale/refurb from the Dell store. Wide gamut, 27" size, capable of 10 bit display with the right card, IPS panel. Really a great value for the price. I think they're listed at $750 right now for a refurb, but you could keep your eyes peeled for a coupon code or a sale.
you need to monitor sites like slickdeals... just couple of day ago it was (new) USD $599 ( http://slickdeals.net/permadeal/95182/dell-small-business-27-dell-ultrasharp-u2711-sips-2560x1440-lcd-monitor-w-premiercolor )
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you need to monitor sites like slickdeals... just couple of day ago it was (new) USD $599 ( http://slickdeals.net/permadeal/95182/dell-small-business-27-dell-ultrasharp-u2711-sips-2560x1440-lcd-monitor-w-premiercolor )
I think a 24" monitor is adequate for my needs at this point. And, if spending more money, I would rather put that into the quality of the monitor. At +$750 to $1,000, wouldn't an NEC monitor be a better choice for a 24" monitor than a Dell of whatever size?
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I think a 24" monitor is adequate for my needs at this point. And, if spending more money, I would rather put that into the quality of the monitor. At +$750 to $1,000, wouldn't an NEC monitor be a better choice for a 24" monitor than a Dell of whatever size?
2711 is a good monitor ( http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/dell_u2711.htm )
sure, there were (and will be) deals for 24" Dell monitors there as well
http://slickdeals.net/f/6028328-24-Dell-U2412M-UltraSharp-IPS-1920x1200-LED-Monitor-275-Free-Shipping = http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/dell_u2412m.htm
PS: and you are not spending more money - you posted " The price range I am thinking of is about $400 to $600 for the monitor.", deal was $599
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...http://www.imagescience.com.au/kb/questions/120/Monitors+For+High+Quality+Imaging+Work#BestOfTheBest
before you buy any foto-processing monitor. I had no idea inexpensive monitors performed so poorly.
I bought a 27" NEC PA271W...
http://www.colorhq.com/NEC-MultiSync-PA271W-Monitor-p/pa271w-bk.htm
...and NEC's calibration/profiling system...
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/613707-REG/NEC_SVII_PRO_KIT_Color_Sensor_and_SpectraView.html
Getting the colors right, too, is important. :)
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David, I would second the suggestion from Jeffrey Behr to check out the info on the Image Science website.
Absolutely top-notch.
Interestingly I bought my NEC through them and I was determined to give them my business because of the stellar calibre of their customer service.
Price-wise they are very competitive too but the information and advice they offer cannot be beat.
Obviously, living in California, you won't be dealing with them when you buy but do yourself a favour and peruse their site.
Tony Jay
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The Dell 2412 is routinely on sale for $260 shipped and is superb for the price.
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I am not in disagreement with the fact that NEC and Ezio make excellent tools. However I do question any website being presented as an authoritative source of information that is also sells the products they promote as the best. Clearly there is a conflict of interest. If you don't recognize a thinly veiled sales pitch then I have some real estate you might be interested in, act now and I will throw in a car that an elderly women drove only to church on Sundays.
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Also looking to replace 2008 vintage ACD 23" which is a bit awkward to use with a PC and has imperfections appearing in the display. The Dell Ultrasharp 27" looks best bet and is about as much as I'm prepared to pay (primarily for print output to Epson 3800 - 3880 in future).
I'm assuming the Dell will have a wider gamut and be appreciably more acurate than the ACD? Can the Dell be successfully profiled with Color Munki? Any other suggestions at similiar price band?
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Also looking to replace 2008 vintage ACD 23" which is a bit awkward to use with a PC and has imperfections appearing in the display. The Dell Ultrasharp 27" looks best bet and is about as much as I'm prepared to pay (primarily for print output to Epson 3800 - 3880 in future).
I'm assuming the Dell will have a wider gamut and be appreciably more acurate than the ACD? Can the Dell be successfully profiled with Color Munki? Any other suggestions at similiar price band?
Oh, I see U2711 already replaced by U2713H (not HM)
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Oh, I see U2711 already replaced by U2713H (not HM)
And one might note, the Dell U2713H uses the same panel as the NEC PA271W
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And one might note, the Dell U2713H uses the same panel as the NEC PA271W
And significantly cheaper although the panel I would imagine is not the only indicator of merit
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And significantly cheaper although the panel I would imagine is not the only indicator of merit
Indeed! First off, there are only three manufactures of panels and everyone who sells one has to get it from one of these sources. Next, not all panels coming off the line are of the same quality and companies like NEC get pick of the litter. But aside from that, there's a huge difference in creating a reference display system aka PressView, Artisan, SpectraView etc. They are designed from the ground up for calibration processes that are unique in terms of how and where the calibration takes place, communication with the software and instrument etc.
I always wonder what some are thinking when the ask for a moderate priced display and their needs. If soft proofing, consistently in calibration, control over calibration is important, one might wish to adjust the budget accordingly. IOW, a used SpectraView system (note the system here) is IMHO a better approach than a new lesser quality display brand new.
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I always wonder what some are thinking when the ask for a moderate priced display and their needs.
probably the same as xrite passport for camera calibration ;)
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probably the same as xrite passport for camera calibration ;)
Not even an appropriate analogy. The Passport does exactly what it was designed to do and very well.
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Not even an appropriate analogy. The Passport does exactly what it was designed to do and very well.
and those monitors do the same... fine print " what it was designed to do" ;D
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and those monitors do the same... fine print " what it was designed to do" ;D
Do they? You can conduct the calibration in the panel? Without touching a single control on the unit? These displays can adjust the contrast ratio? They can build a suite of calibration targets, switch on they fly and have the display load the correct ICC profile? They can emulate sRGB, Full gamut or additional or other color spaces? They have PIP? Their Colorimeters are tuned to the panel? They all have 5 year warranties? They are all the best panels off the line?
As I said, your analogy is weak at best. Your understanding of what a reference display system is seems lacking.
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The 2711 was just on sale for $599 shipped again and I couldn't resist, got another one :) I prefer it over the 2713 for it's wide gamut. When LED backlights improve I'll switch over but I'll take the better colors in exchange for the thicker panel any day.
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The 2711 was just on sale for $599 shipped again and I couldn't resist, got another one :) I prefer it over the 2713 for it's wide gamut. When LED backlights improve I'll switch over but I'll take the better colors in exchange for the thicker panel any day.
The U2713h IS a wide-gamut display, covering 99% aRGB, 100% sRGB, and 120% CIE. You may be confusing it with the standard-gamut U2713hm.
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No, it's not, compared to the 2711.
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No, it's not, compared to the 2711.
Sorry, but the U2713H is actually a slightly wider gamut than the older 2711. The specs for the 2711 state "100% sRGB, 96% Adobe RGB, 110% NTSC (110% on CIE1976, 102% CIE1931)". The U2713H is slightly wider than that at 100% sRGB, 99% Adobe RGB, and 120% CIE1976, 103% CIE1931. The U2713HM is only 82% CIE1976. Gotta remember there are TWO different models carrying the 2713 number currently in the Dell lineup, though for some weird reason you have to actually search on the specific model number to find the U2713H in the online listings.
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Now that you edited - yes, you are absolutely correct. The h, is the best of both worlds. Unfortunately it's never yet been on sale lol!
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New NEC EA244WMi is quite an interesting low-budget solution.
It has a decent AH-IPS 8-bit panel controlled by 10bit 1DLUT. It doesn't have DUE (Digital Uniformity Compensation), but it's quite uniform:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/19059944/uniformity_2013-06-01_02-01.html
It can be hardware calibrated with free NEC GammaComp MD QA, and most of popular sensors:
http://www.necdisplay.com/support-and-services/gamma-comp/downloads
After hardware calibration it's quite linear, here's 100 patch TRC validation:
White point error = 0.686204 deltaE
Maximum neutral error (@ 0.975117) = 1.681167 deltaE
Average neutral error = 0.838355 deltaE
Number of measurements taken = 100
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/19059944/verify_2013-06-01_02-32.html
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Now that you edited - yes, you are absolutely correct. The h, is the best of both worlds. Unfortunately it's never yet been on sale lol!
I think it's on sale on the US site this week. The Canadian site had it on special the last week of May for CDN$899 so I grabbed one.
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FWIW, I ended up stretching the budget and getting a NEC PA241W and I really like it so far. Economized a bit by getting a Mac Mini as my new computer. Really prefer the NEC to the Apple displays, which are certainly not bad, as far as I can tell.
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Good call, the PA241is a good entry level reference display system.
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The Dell U2723H looks like the best bet for me but I can't get a definitive idea of whether it is compatible with the Color Munki - that was a signinficant investment so I'm not going to change that.
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The Dell U2723H looks like the best bet for me but I can't get a definitive idea of whether it is compatible with the Color Munki - that was a signinficant investment so I'm not going to change that.
There should be no problem using the Munki and their (X-rite) software on that unit.
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The Dell U2723H looks like the best bet for me but I can't get a definitive idea of whether it is compatible with the Color Munki - that was a signinficant investment so I'm not going to change that.
The only supported colorimeter for hardware calibration is the x-Rite i1Display 2 and it is the only one the Dell calibration software will recognize. For software calibration any unit that is suitable for a wide-gamut monitor should work.
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A 24" Dell with and IPS screen should be in the dollar range the OP indicated. OP, you should go with a wide gamut (IPS) monitor, you might as well be able to see as much of what's in the file your working with as possible. You can always turn on soft-proofing (assuming your editing software supports it) to see what you will get in print or in sRGB web output.
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I'm happy :)
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How about Dell U2713HM-IPS-LED? The price is $599, and my brother bought this one in last week.
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See this page, http://thedigitalcamera.net/best-monitor-for-photo-editing-and-photography/ it's helpful to you choose a monitor for photo editing.
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Asus PA246Q is a good buy for the purpose of photo editing.You might also want to check these (http://www.monitorsforphotoediting.com) other top performing monitors for photo editing in the price range you mentioned.There are more of them available for all budgets.See this page (http://www.monitorsforphotoediting.com) for more about top monitor products for photo editing.
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See this page (http://www.monitorsforphotoediting.com) for more about top monitor products for photo editing.
Not to quibble over brands and models, but I still have a couple of reservations. For instance:
- The higher the contrast ratio, the better for our purpose here because a higher contrast ratio produces better display qualities such as clear and vivid images. The ideal value we recommend for photo editing is a constant contrast ratio of 1000:1.
What you want is a good screen to output match. No papers reach even close to 1000:1 - even the very best glossy photo papers rarely exceed 300:1, and matte papers 150:1 or less. Offset print is even lower. So with a display at 1000:1 you're guaranteed an unpleasant surprise.
High-end integrated hardware calibrators such as Spectraview or Colornavigator let you fine-tune the black point/contrast ratio for different types of output. This is such an important aspect of critical calibration that it should be mentioned in any discussion about monitors for photo editing.
And further:
- Generally speaking, the bigger the screen, the wider and better the view.
Well, yes, but few people realize just how much prices skyrocket with an increase in panel size. Size is the single biggest cost factor, and most people have budgets. So instead of encouraging people to go bigger, a much sounder advice is to go down in size to get substantially better quality for the same price.
There's more, but this'll do for now...
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Not to quibble over brands and models, but I still have a couple of reservations. For instance:
- The higher the contrast ratio, the better for our purpose here because a higher contrast ratio produces better display qualities such as clear and vivid images. The ideal value we recommend for photo editing is a constant contrast ratio of 1000:1.
What you want is a good screen to output match. No papers reach even close to 1000:1 - even the very best glossy photo papers rarely exceed 300:1, and matte papers 150:1 or less. Offset print is even lower. So with a display at 1000:1 you're guaranteed an unpleasant surprise.
High-end integrated hardware calibrators such as Spectraview or Colornavigator let you fine-tune the black point/contrast ratio for different types of output. This is such an important aspect of critical calibration that it should be mentioned in any discussion about monitors for photo editing.
And further:
- Generally speaking, the bigger the screen, the wider and better the view.
Well, yes, but few people realize just how much prices skyrocket with an increase in panel size. Size is the single biggest cost factor, and most people have budgets. So instead of encouraging people to go bigger, a much sounder advice is to go down in size to get substantially better quality for the same price.
There's more, but this'll do for now...
Noted. And thanks @D Fosse for shedding more light on some very important aspects discussed on that page.