Luminous Landscape Forum

Site & Board Matters => Luminous Landscape Video => Topic started by: Christopher Sanderson on April 16, 2013, 06:08:03 pm

Title: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on April 16, 2013, 06:08:03 pm
The Lu-La shopping cart and download system needs updating. Our ZenCart system is clunky and not very intuitive for new users. I believe it costs us sales.

I believe we should also offer a streaming version of our videos in addition to the stand-alone download files. Give customers the choice.

I have been searching around for an off-the-shelf solution and have not found very much.

So far the best solution is the most expensive: build it yourself as Lynda.com or Larry Jordan have done. Alas, the cost is very high - too high!

The other outfit we are considering is Leaping Brain. They offer most of what we want for a healthy slice off the price a user pays for the videos - fair enough!

I would be interested in comments about the Leaping Brain (http://leapingbrain.com/) system and their approach - especially if you have been a customer.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on May 05, 2013, 11:49:43 am
Still looking at alternatives...

Vimeo now has a streaming/queueing/download option (http://vimeo.com/ondemand) for paid subscribers which looks like it may work. Any user comments?  The comments on Leaping Brain were not overwhelmingly numerous  ;D
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on May 05, 2013, 04:58:11 pm
YouTube has had Rental options for a long time
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on May 05, 2013, 05:52:28 pm
Let me know if you see International paid distribution & Download. I don't see it.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on May 05, 2013, 06:12:09 pm
Aw crap on a stick - it's US only.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Jeff Magidson on June 18, 2013, 12:15:19 pm

I would be interested in comments about the Leaping Brain (http://leapingbrain.com/) system and their approach - especially if you have been a customer.

Chris;

I purchased a few guitar lessons through "Leaping Brain". I like the LuLa system much better! With LB, you have to view the videos in the LB viewer. The actual video files are hidden on my computer (to prevent me from copying them?), which I find annoying. When ever I go to view my LB videos, It has to do an online authentication.

~ Jeff

http://artslidesboston.com
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on June 18, 2013, 01:38:58 pm
Thanks for this Jeff. I queried LB and here was their partial answer:

"Once you've registered on a computer and have the product listed under My Stuff with all the media, you can be offline to view the content."

They seem keen to help and would like you to contact them if the problem persists.

We are still looking seriously at the LB system. One disadvantage is the workaround needed to view on a TV - basically the TV has to be a computer monitor - easy on a TV hooked into the HDMI of a Mac but more problematic in other situations.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Jeff Magidson on June 18, 2013, 03:09:14 pm
Thanks for this Jeff. I queried LB and here was their partial answer:

"Once you've registered on a computer and have the product listed under My Stuff with all the media, you can be offline to view the content."

They seem keen to help and would like you to contact them if the problem persists.

That may be, but on my Mac, the video files are definitely hidden. The whole LB system is very proprietary and locked down by design. Your current system is much more transparent and flexible for the user. For example, I put all my purchased LuLa videos in a iTunes playlist, much to my liking.

~ Jeff

Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Nigel Johnson on June 22, 2013, 01:07:11 pm
Chris,

Having bought most of the LL videos I would be very unhappy if the downloaded videos were only usable in a proprietary viewer. It sounds as though this is the case for Leaping Brain and such a move would make me think very hard about buying future videos from LL.

Regards,
Nigel

PS I am currently in the middle of viewing the LR5 tutorial and looking forwards to the next instalment of the LLVJ.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on June 22, 2013, 06:09:36 pm
The LB 'Propritary Player' is simply a Lu-La branded version of VLC player I believe - so full QuickTime functionality. The advantage of it from a users point-of-view, is the availability of everything you have purchased in one place across multiple machines - and access to all the other Lu-La videos in one place (IOW, in-app purchase) plus live streaming if required.

Since we are in the testing stage, I would be very keen to hear all and any objections.


Chris
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Robert-Peter Westphal on June 23, 2013, 02:21:42 am
Hi Chris,

I'm verry sorry sorry, but I also dislike it. I've bought many LLVJs as well as many Lightroom and print to screen to... videos.

The pros of the existing way of publishing is that you can copy the videos to any device and play it on a big TV set.

Is forbidden copying and theft such a big issue for your and your very specialized video that it is worth putting 'mantraps' on every customer ?

Robert
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: davidgp on June 23, 2013, 07:48:20 am
Hi Chris,

While you keep the option of downloading the videos as you do right now (maybe using other kind of shopping cart since you want to improve it), I will not care too much about which streaming system are you going to use. I will simple not use it and not really eager for you to change to that...

I usually download everything, put it on my iTunes, and them syncing on my iPad (wifi version, not 3g/4g one). Usually I watch the videos when I got a bit of free time and not got many other things to do, such as when I'm traveling by plane (due to my work, quite frequently) no internet connection there, but my iPad has the videos in its memory...

And to say the truth, I always hate when watching a video on-line it starts buffering all the time, I just stop watching the video and get annoyed...

Regards,

David
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Dave (Isle of Skye) on June 23, 2013, 05:59:24 pm

Since we are in the testing stage, I would be very keen to hear all and any objections.

Chris

I agree with what is being said here. I have also purchased and downloaded all the LLVJ's and a some other Lula videos as well, which I then copy to a USB stick and watch on my TV, which has a USB socket. This means I can watch the videos sat comfortably in my armchair while 'leaning back' as opposed to 'leaning forward' to watch them through a smaller and less comfortable to view monitor.

Back in my university days, the net and computer games etc, were described as a 'lean forward' technology, whereas watching TV was described as a 'lean back' technology and even though I know there is a bit of crossover in some of the content being made available via Lula, the LLVJ's for me at least, are definitely of the latter ‘lean back’ type, so I would always like to have the option to download them and watch them on the TV from the comfort of my armchair and without having to be connected to the Internet. So while I can see the merit of offering streaming for things such as the LR5 videos, where the user may wish to be at the screen and working along with each section, the LLVJ's (for me at least) are more for entertainment than instruction, even though I know there is general photography instruction contained in there, they are mainly something to watch and enjoy, rather than trying to 'lean into' to study and work along with. So it is definitely the download option for me please.

I also think that the people here on Lula, are very loyal to Lula and is the reason that (as far as I am aware), the LLVJ's have never appeared on any pirate sites (I may wrong of course, but I have never heard any reports or rumours of this happening).

However, if piracy was part of the consideration for streaming rather than download, perhaps some sort of high level encryption and password protection being added to the download files would help?

Either way, I would still like the option to download the files in full if at all possible and the option to pay the full price up front as a ‘one off’ perpetual use fee, rather than smaller but repeated streaming fees.

Perhaps you could offer smaller repeat fee streaming to the world to expand your customer market, but the full download option only to members, who are registered and have supplied sufficient details to validate this process?

Dave
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on June 23, 2013, 08:15:09 pm
I agree with what is being said here. I have also purchased and downloaded all the LLVJ's and a some other Lula videos as well, which I then copy to a USB stick and watch on my TV, which has a USB socket. This means I can watch the videos sat comfortably in my armchair while 'leaning back' as opposed to 'leaning forward' to watch them through a smaller and less comfortable to view monitor.

Back in my university days, the net and computer games etc, were described as a 'lean forward' technology, whereas watching TV was described as a 'lean back' technology and even though I know there is a bit of crossover in some of the content being made available via Lula, the LLVJ's for me at least, are definitely of the latter ‘lean back’ type, so I would always like to have the option to download them and watch them on the TV from the comfort of my armchair and without having to be connected to the Internet. So while I can see the merit of offering streaming for things such as the LR5 videos, where the user may wish to be at the screen and working along with each section, the LLVJ's (for me at least) are more for entertainment than instruction, even though I know there is general photography instruction contained in there, they are mainly something to watch and enjoy, rather than trying to learn into to study and work along with. So it is definitely the download option for me please.

I also think that the people here on Lula, are very loyal to Lula and is the reason that (as far as I am aware), the LLVJ's have never appeared on any pirate sites (I may wrong of course, but I have never heard any reports or rumours of this happening).

However, if piracy was part of the consideration for streaming rather than download, perhaps some sort of high level encryption and password protection being added to the download files would help?

Either way, I would still like the option to download the files in full if at all possible and the option to pay the full price up front as a ‘one off’ perpetual use fee, rather than smaller but repeated streaming fees.

Perhaps you could offer smaller repeat fee streaming to the world to expand your customer market, but the full download option only to members, who are registered and have supplied sufficient details to validate this process?

Dave

I am in complete agreement with Dave (my emphasis added). I have no use for streaming anything. I always download so that I can watch on my own time, not having to worry about whether my ISP will have a stroke in the middle. I have bought most of the LuLa videos, and I often go back to sections of them to refresh my memory.

Dave's "full download option only to members, who are registered and have supplied sufficient details to validate this process" is a great idea.

Eric M.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: AFairley on September 06, 2013, 08:20:56 pm
I also agree with Dave.  I like being able to watch the tutorials I've purchased on any of my multiple platforms without having to worry about streaming or DRM limitations.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: degrub on September 06, 2013, 09:42:32 pm
Chris,

I have been with LLVJ for a while and have purchased a copy of many of the tutorials.
If this is change for the sake of a refresh, it would not motivate me. I have no need of the services of LB or similar.
If the site takes a jump to LB, please provide a ftp server that we can get to for downloading.
Otherwise, just like with Adobe, i will decline to participate.

Frank
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on November 07, 2013, 09:53:29 pm
Having seen reasonable answers to most of the early objections to the new system, I just tried it out with the purchase of the new video on Norway. I downloaded the Purple player OK, and then set up my new account in the new LuLa store and bought the new video. I then had to download the Purple player a second time, because there was no link on the site to restart it or even to tell me what name the player has (hint: it isn't called Purple.)

But that was minor annoyances, easily straightened out.

I the chose to download the video and then play it. Which worked fine except for one BIG annoyance. I like to watch LuLa videos full screen on my PC's monitor, and the Vimeo video does have a button labeled "full screen," but there was no way I could get the video to play in full screen mode, nor was there any thing available on the player's "option" menu that would have enabled it.

The result is that there is a player which operates only as a fraction of my monitor's screen, and it runs the video in a tiny window that won't enlarge.

I have no interest whatever in watching videos on an I-thingy or any other tiny screened device. I want to watch them using at least 90% of my monitor's screen.

If this is going to be the standard for all future LuLa videos, then I will not be able to make use of them. I hope this can be corrected, and soon.
Title: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Robert-Peter Westphal on November 08, 2013, 12:28:31 am
It is a Bit off-topic, but where did you find a video on Norway on Lula ?

Best wishes

Robert
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on November 08, 2013, 01:59:47 am
It's an old 2005 vid/clip.  And Eric I would bet $20 you are simply missing the button to go fullscreen.  No way others wouldn't have already complained about such a thing.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: michael on November 08, 2013, 06:50:33 am
The new Norway video will be officially announced later today.

Michael

The Full Screen button (a four way arrow) is the same place as it is on Youtube and Vimeo; lower left of the play bar.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on November 08, 2013, 08:05:49 am
Yes, I know where the full-screen button is, and I clicked it at least seven different times before re-downloading the video and clicking it again. Nothing happens except that the words "full screen" pop up briefly to tell me it knows what it is supposed to be doing.

The Purple player occupies a little more than one quarter of my screen, and the Windows "full screen "ikon in the upper right corner is grayed out and doesn't work. The video itself displays in about a quarter of the Purple Player's window, so it is really small. This is no way to look at the beautiful scenery of Norway.

I'm running Win 7 64, and I have not had this problem with Youtube or Vimeo directly.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on November 08, 2013, 08:59:28 am
Well, guess what?

I just tried one more time. This time I first opened the "properties" for the desktop icon for the player and changed it from "open in normal window" to "open maximized" to see if that would make a difference. Then I opened the player and it again came up occupying only about a quarter of my screen. But this time, when I selected to play the video, an entirely different viewer came up, which did indeed have a different tool bar along the bottom, with a WORKING "full-screen" button!

The new player didn't show the standard "Vimeo" type of screen, and had its own window rather than being a small hole in the Purple player that I was getting before.

I can't imagine how they switched the player without my doing anything, but it seems to work now. I hope it will continue to work.

Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: gfioravanti on November 08, 2013, 02:52:17 pm
Sorry for the initial issue you experienced!

It's possible that the first time you tried, the preferred player had not yet installed completely so you saw the "inset" player.  But, it sounds like you're now using the better player.  Please let us know if you encounter any other issues.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on November 08, 2013, 06:14:39 pm
Sorry for the initial issue you experienced!

It's possible that the first time you tried, the preferred player had not yet installed completely so you saw the "inset" player.  But, it sounds like you're now using the better player.  Please let us know if you encounter any other issues.
Thanks for checking. Everything seems fine, now, so I'm moving from Grumpy Old Man (or Purple People Eater?) to Happy Camper now.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 10, 2013, 12:05:15 pm
Not impressed with the new system.  Here are some observations after a few minutes use.

- from a users perspective the old system was not broken.

- the new player is not intuitive to use.  It took me a while to figure out how to download a file.  Downloading is very slow - currently 176 kbps.  I tested my system and downloads are 2.4 Mbps.  Something is seriously broken.

- the player is loaded to the C drive.  I did not want it there.  In fact I didn't want yet another proprietary piece of software.  There is no uninstall for the player.  That's pretty lame guys.

- the whole process is more complex than I need.  Streaming is not working very well as I keep running into buffering.  I just bought the Bjørn Rorslett video and after an hour I still have not been able to watch it.  Not a very good customer experience.

Much as I love you guys I just don't need this kind of clunky, proprietary stuff on my computers.  Can you work out a process where your customers can opt for the old process if they want?

Rory
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 10, 2013, 12:23:25 pm
Okay, it gets even worse.  I finally downloaded the video after 2.5 hours and tried to play it.  The player window opened and the video started to play.  The audio that is, on a very black window.  If I move the window the video appears while the window is moving.  Maximizing does not help.

Windows 7, dell 30" monitor.

I just want to watch a video, not be a beta tester.

Rory
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 10, 2013, 12:27:12 pm
Believe it or not, it is getting worse  :'(  Running the video player changes the windows desktop colour scheme back to default.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 10, 2013, 12:31:01 pm
Sorry you are having such problems.

Try the help system (http://platformpurple.com/help/) and or live chat help. They are normally pretty good at solving this sort of issue.

Chris
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Philip Weber on November 10, 2013, 12:41:10 pm
Chris - I haven't had any issues but agree with other posters, it could be more intuitive and the download was slow, although that may be from demand for the video.

In any event, is there or will there be a way to uninstall? I'm ok with it now but there may be a point when I don't want it on my hard drive any more.

I'm sure there are many reasons why this was good for LuLa but as the old way of downloading and playing worked so well for me, I'd have rather not had to work through the new process. That said, I enjoyed the video and thanks for all of your efforts.

Phil
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 10, 2013, 12:47:56 pm
Sorry you are having such problems.

Try the help system (http://platformpurple.com/help/) and or live chat help. They are normally pretty good at solving this sort of issue.

Chris


Hi Chris

I tried the live chat.  Got to fill out a form.  I would not call that live chat.

Rory
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 10, 2013, 01:21:05 pm
Here is my Leaping Brain 365 24/7 customer response experience so far...

(http://roryhill.zenfolio.com/img/s9/v93/p991141105.jpg)

I've got better things to do.  I'll check back later.

Rory
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 10, 2013, 06:52:41 pm
My guess is that the problem is solvable but as always, you can get a refund if dissatisfied. Please just send me an email or PM and I will arrange a refund.

Chris
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 10, 2013, 07:04:15 pm
My guess is that the problem is solvable but as always, you can get a refund if dissatisfied. Please just send me an email or PM and I will arrange a refund.

Chris

I watched the episode through the link you provided Chris.  Even though the interview was 8 years ago, which was a bit of a surprise, I enjoyed your editing.  No need for a refund, but I don't think this is ready for prime time yet.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 11, 2013, 10:06:04 am
I would encorage you to get the solution for your playback problems. Of no comfort to you, but these types of problems, while certainly not unheard of, are relatively rare.

Usually there is a setting somewhere in your system that can solve the problem. FWIW, on the old system the problem you describe was common enough to warrant a special section in our  old FAQ (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/videos/Dwnld_Video-faq.shtml). Check the DirectX settings and re-install QuickTime.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 11, 2013, 10:35:32 am
I hear you Chris.  I have not had great luck with the folks at support@platformpurple.com.  I think I will sit on the sidelines for a while until you have the kinks out of your new system or change to something else.  While I have great respect for the work and integrity of LL, I am not much of a fan of how you are tweaking the video part of your business model.  What I do not like is that you are making it more difficult for me to watch your videos on multiple devices at my leisure, using a clunky, not ready for prime time software.  Some problems with the new process:


I think you guys have a lot of work and maybe a little soul searching ahead of you.  I wish you the very best and hope to be back on board when the dust settles.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: gfioravanti on November 11, 2013, 01:12:42 pm
Hi Rory,

We are the technology company that manages these digital downloads, and we apologize for the trouble you encountered!

We try to work out any kinks within the system, but of course issues will always come up that we try to resolve right away.  I'm sorry that you were having trouble getting on live chat with someone.  Unfortunately, we are not yet 24/7 with our live chat.  From your support thread in our system, it seems that Mabel replied to you regarding getting on live chat.  If you can let us know what happened when you tried this and when you tried this, this will certainly help us fix this for the future. 

Regarding your comments:

1) We rarely receive requests from users with a need to uninstall the program, so we have focused resources on other updates and features that can further improve the platform. 
2) The program should install in the default hard drive on your computer.  Is your C drive not your default?
3) We do design the program with the user in mind, so we're sorry that you do not feel this way.  As one example, by having the videos download through the program, you can be assured that you can always regain access to your content.  If your hard drive crashes or you get a new computer, just reinstall the program and you can re-download at any time.  Also, our players help manage the videos themselves so you don't have to worry about loose video files and chapter lists.  The videos themselves are also programmed through the player to play continuously, so your viewing experience is not interrupted by having to launch the next video.
4) If you'd prefer not to install software, you can stream through our cloud player - http://player.platformpurple.com.  You mentioned that you were having trouble with the streaming player.  What browser are you using when you just see it buffering?
5) That is very strange as we have not encountered this before.  Can you provide us more details on this?
6) We try our best to make the program simple, but still intuitive.  Can you tell us what you would have liked to see?
7) I'm sure we can get you up and running with your videos.  Usually the most expedient way is to do a screen share where we could actually see what's happening and be able to fix it right away.
8) What download speed were you seeing reported?  The download speed will depend on your internet connection and it's connection to our CDN.
9) Again I apologize that you were not happy with support.  We do try our best to offer support during all hours, but have not quite reached 24/7 yet.  However, opening a ticket via our form or email will always get you a response and almost always lead to a fix to your problem.
10) We will leave that to the folks at Luminous who control the product information.

Thanks for your time, and hope we get the opportunity to help you with our system.
Grace
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 11, 2013, 01:55:32 pm
Thanks for the response.  I'll try again to get a real time dialog with you on your support site.  I do have some thoughts about your response - see inline below.  BTW your program crashed when I ran it to reproduce some of the problems for my answers below.

Hi Rory,

We are the technology company that manages these digital downloads, and we apologize for the trouble you encountered!

We try to work out any kinks within the system, but of course issues will always come up that we try to resolve right away.  I'm sorry that you were having trouble getting on live chat with someone.  Unfortunately, we are not yet 24/7 with our live chat.  From your support thread in our system, it seems that Mabel replied to you regarding getting on live chat.  If you can let us know what happened when you tried this and when you tried this, this will certainly help us fix this for the future. 

Regarding your comments:

1) We rarely receive requests from users with a need to uninstall the program, so we have focused resources on other updates and features that can further improve the platform.  This simply amplifies my point that you do not think this is important to your users.
2) The program should install in the default hard drive on your computer.  Is your C drive not your default?  You're kidding, right?  Changing the default drive in windows requires a hack to the registry.  Well behaved programs ask where you would like to install the program.
3) We do design the program with the user in mind, so we're sorry that you do not feel this way.  As one example, by having the videos download through the program, you can be assured that you can always regain access to your content.  If your hard drive crashes or you get a new computer, just reinstall the program and you can re-download at any time.  Also, our players help manage the videos themselves so you don't have to worry about loose video files and chapter lists.  The videos themselves are also programmed through the player to play continuously, so your viewing experience is not interrupted by having to launch the next video.  Sounds good.  I just like to manage my own files.  
4) If you'd prefer not to install software, you can stream through our cloud player - http://player.platformpurple.com.  You mentioned that you were having trouble with the streaming player.  What browser are you using when you just see it buffering?  Chrome, Safari and Firefox.  I measured the download speeds while trying to stream the content using http://www.speedtest.net/ and got 3.4Mbps while your app reported 176 kbps.  It took 2.5 hours to download Bjørn Rørslett video.  Either you have a software problem with the app, or you were swamped with download requests which suggests you have insufficient bandwidth.
5) That is very strange as we have not encountered this before.  Can you provide us more details on this?  When I select the video to play in your app and then select "PLAY ALL" my monitors are momentarily blanked and then this message appears in my task bar, which changes color from my custom setting of gray to blue.  (http://roryhill.zenfolio.com/img/s4/v62/p23979953.jpg)
6) We try our best to make the program simple, but still intuitive.  Can you tell us what you would have liked to see? 
7) I'm sure we can get you up and running with your videos.  Usually the most expedient way is to do a screen share where we could actually see what's happening and be able to fix it right away.  Hope so.
8) What download speed were you seeing reported?  The download speed will depend on your internet connection and it's connection to our CDN.
9) Again I apologize that you were not happy with support.  We do try our best to offer support during all hours, but have not quite reached 24/7 yet.  I guess that is what you mean by 20/7 365 on your site.  I misread this as 24/7 the first time.  However, opening a ticket via our form or email will always get you a response and almost always lead to a fix to your problem.
10) We will leave that to the folks at Luminous who control the product information.

Thanks for your time, and hope we get the opportunity to help you with our system.
Grace
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Philip Weber on November 11, 2013, 07:39:20 pm
Hi Grace - I asked this question of Chris who did not respond so I'll ask it of you, even though, as you said to Rory, that customers seldom ask this.

In the event one does want to uninstall it (all of it) then how does one go about doing so? If one cannot, when do you anticipate this feature (a basic feature that all software seems to come with) will become available?

Thank you,
Phil Weber
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Rory on November 11, 2013, 08:38:21 pm
Final follow-up on this topic.  I worked with Grace to resolve my issues but we failed to find a solution.  I believe Grace would have kept on trying but I only have so much time to deal with these things.  I could get the program to work when I rebooted in safe mode, so there is some incompatibility with some other software I am running.  I tend to believe this conflict is the fault of the LeapingBrain software, which does not appear to follow proper windows protocols, as evidenced by the lack of uninstall and the interference with the windows desktop display in my case, and the fact that all other video playing software seems to be working on my computer.

Both Chris and Grace offered to refund my money, which shows they both stand behind their products and are classy people.  I cannot accept a refund in good conscience since I did watch the video through an alternative stream that Chris provided, and face it, we are only talking $10 that I would be happy to donate to LL in any case.  Unfortunately the new delivery of the videos will not work for me.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 11, 2013, 10:02:22 pm
Hi Grace - I asked this question of Chris who did not respond so I'll ask it of you, even though, as you said to Rory, that customers seldom ask this.
On a Mac it is pretty simple - delete all instances of 'leapingbrain', 'luminous landcsape', MODplayer - or just use a helper app like CleanMyMac: trash the app and it follows up with the tricky bits.

On Windows, I do not know and will need to let the Purple help folk step you through it with their help system (http://platformpurple.com/help/).Just open a HelpTicket
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on November 12, 2013, 12:42:23 am
On Windows I am sure ccleaner can uninstall it for you. It is well-respected, and often succeeds when a program's built-in uninstaller doesn't.

But the purple player is working fine on my win 7 64 machine now, so I'm keeping it.

Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: ianr on November 13, 2013, 09:06:59 am
I didn't like the new video content experience at all. I have in the past, just logged in and downloaded my content to my ipad to watch offline. I live in an area where the internet is too slow for streaming video. When I purchased the capture one tutorial, I was presented with a lot of (quite confusing) information about this purple thing that I have zero interest in. I installed the ios player but can't watch my content because the internet is too slow. I see no way to download overnight, which was my previous method.

Purple player's help shows no information on how to do the simplest thing you can do on the internet - download a file.

I understand your reasons for wanting to update the shop and download methods, but I fear that you have assumed (as everyone does) that everyone has a fast broadband connection.

I don't think I'll be buying any further content.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 13, 2013, 09:38:57 am
Purchasers ALWAYS have a choice between downloading a file for viewing later offline or streaming a file.

To download a video in the Luminous Landscape app, click on the icon of the video you wish to download and select 'Add to Download Queue'.

If however you select Play - it will stream the video
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: ianr on November 13, 2013, 11:52:12 am
Hi Chris.

Thanks for the quick reply. I'm glad there's still an option to download - especially as I raised my feedback with Platform Purple on Twitter and they managed to turn me from someone who wanted to provide feedback into someone who now hates them with a passion.

One question though: What's the LL app? I've obviously been gone too long and missed something fundamental.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 13, 2013, 12:27:35 pm
Check the receipt that you were sent.

As mentioned there are two ways to view a video. My guess is that you clicked on the 'Watch Instantly' of the first screen grab from your receipt.

The emailed receipt goes on to suggest that you download the player app - see the second screen grab
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: ianr on November 13, 2013, 12:34:12 pm
Yes you're right I did click "watch instantly", but that's because I didn't want to have to install any software. I think that's fine for those that want it, but I wish there were just an ftp type option that didn't require any third party software. Platform Purple started ranting at me about broken downloads and how would I stream to other devices, what if my hard drive crashed. I found it rather infantile to be honest. We are all photographers here, we're used to managing files and don't get flummoxed with such things.

Thanks for your help, but let mw know when there's a simple download option that doesn't require any software. I'm not installing anything by platform purple.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 13, 2013, 01:01:19 pm
Yes, if you do not want to install any software to play the videos, you are a bit stuck. The app is a plain vanilla media player (with our branding) and some file access/management ability.

For anyone who is loath to install anything, the streaming is simply available through your browser (https://player.platformpurple.com).
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on November 13, 2013, 05:01:31 pm
For anyone looking for the app, accessing your videos or more information on what may have been missed in an email

Go here (http://platformpurple.com/help/accessing-your-content/?sku=tll)
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: mrcmrc on November 21, 2013, 07:33:43 am
Still looking at alternatives...

Vimeo now has a streaming/queueing/download option (http://vimeo.com/ondemand) for paid subscribers which looks like it may work. Any user comments?  The comments on Leaping Brain were not overwhelmingly numerous  ;D

Some day ago I've purchased the nice "Everybody Street (https://vimeo.com/ondemand/everybodystreet)" on Vimeo the process was fast & smooth and I downloaded all movs on my computer.

- Marco.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: AlexG on December 02, 2013, 04:21:17 pm
Hello Chris,

I have been away from Lula for a while...

I purchased last night the LR5 guide only to find out you guys changed everything! I simply don't like it. While finally waiting overnight for the downloads to complete, I can only see them through your dedicated player. I managed to transfer the files to my external HD (my method of choice) using your help guide, but I was not able to open any of the (MOV) files in any of my laptops using either WMP or Quick time, or any other standard player for that matter - just "error windows". Does this new method requires to have your dedicated player in every computer?

Can you guys please make it a little easier and allow files to be viewed with standard players...I go back to LLVJ-1 and since then I never had a problem until now (quite a few years)!!

All the best.

Alex
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: James Orr on December 02, 2013, 08:02:53 pm
Quote
Can you guys please make it a little easier and allow files to be viewed with standard players...

+1.  I've really enjoyed the content and your impeccable customer service over the past 10+ years, but I like to keep my files organized.  My 15+ (not quite all 20 :) ) VJ's and tutorials all live in iTunes, along with 100+ other digital videos and tutorials, so that I can use the Apple TV to watch them without using AirPlay.  I love AirPlay, but it's still buggy for me and I only get audio half the time, unfortunately. 

If have one or two videos here and there that require a misc. player, those are the ones I'll probably never see again.  That's the case with a video I bought from Fine Woodworking on using handplanes.  Paid my $5, watched it once, haven't seen it since.  I forget about it because it isn't on any playlists.    

I know it's a new rollout and hopefully time will tell which way you go.  
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: John McDermott on December 04, 2013, 09:39:57 pm
I just purchased the Ctein video and it works fine in the purple reader. However, I have in the past purchased many of the training videos and have downloaded them to my hard drive. Is there any way that I can view them in the purple reader?
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 05, 2013, 02:13:29 pm
No, not really since the files are not transferable between the LuLa app and QuickTime Player/iTunes.

You can see everything if you have a subsc but I am sure you won't want to re-purchase stuff you already have. Send me a PM and let's see if we can work something out.

Chris
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Jeff Magidson on December 19, 2013, 01:17:34 pm
Over the years I have purchased many LuLa videos. I purchase them mainly for the content but a secondary motivating factor is that I want to support LuLa because of the highly valuable forums and other content the site so graciously provides.  

The new streaming/download system is really a step backwards in frictionless video purchasing and viewing. If you look at my attached screen capture, you will see that the "purple player" requires three separate windows to be open at all times, If you close any one of those windows the player just quits. The "Purple Player" has no uninstall option, no preferences (unlike ALL good Macintosh applications) and does not have the ability to remember where you left off so when you go back to watching a one hour video (al la Ctein interview) you have to search around for for where you left off. It has other functional problems too. If you want to buy a LuLa video, you are now locked in to the "purple player". iTunes was a much better system for storing and viewing my LuLa videos!

I'm sorry, but the purple player system is really for people who don't know any better. Will I buy any LuLa videos in the future? Maybe, but this new system is adding a LOT of resistance to my purchasing decision.

~ Jeff

FYI: Mac 10.8.5


Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Kevin Horsefield on December 20, 2013, 11:07:29 pm
I agree with all that Jeff has said above.

I have spent a totally frustrating evening trying to transfer my downloaded files to my i-pad.  I am ready to pitch it through my wall.

Lula  has excellent content, but this platform is rediculously difficult to use.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on December 21, 2013, 02:35:36 am
I just bought my first purple vid...I can say that yes, for non tech people this sucks.  For tech people, no big deal.  So I can understand why the Lula people are a bit confused why there is so much backlash - but trust me this blows for the avg consumer.  I'll be converting the vid to a regular mp4 straight away so I never have to use the player and can view the vid on my other devices.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Josh-H on December 21, 2013, 04:02:53 am
Also just purchased my first purple vid. I'm pretty technically savvy and I admit I found the process cumbersome at best. If you compare it to simply downloading a QT file its outright horrid. Will also convert to .mp4 and bin the purple player....
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 21, 2013, 10:51:51 am
We hear you. I cannot say that I disagree with many of the criticisms we have received.

I am starting to actively consider alternatives. Suggestions always welcome as before.

Chris
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on December 21, 2013, 12:44:16 pm
I strongly urge you to simply go back to distributing a normal video file.  I understand your attempt at preventing piracy with the Purple system, but removing the purple:safe DRM was easy.  Anyone that wants to do so for distribution is not hampered.  Those of us that do so because we have using proprietary players or being limited to playback devices will still do so.  You are doing the equivalent of right-click prevention for images on websites at the expense of of the avg viewer.  My suggestion is go with what is easiest for the customer, that's always the best solution for sales.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 21, 2013, 12:50:20 pm
I strongly urge you to simply go back to distributing a normal video file.  I understand your attempt at preventing piracy with the Purple system, but removing the purple:safe DRM was easy.  Anyone that wants to do so for distribution is not hampered.  Those of us that do so because we have using proprietary players or being limited to playback devices will still do so.  You are doing the equivalent of right-click prevention for images on websites at the expense of of the avg viewer.  My suggestion is go with what is easiest for the customer, that's always the best solution for sales.

The move was never motivated by DRM. The move is to allow streaming as well as download. Only solutions that provide both options were/are considered.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on December 21, 2013, 12:59:29 pm
Gotcha.

I would look to the big guys - do what they do.  I would seriously reconsider the need for streaming.  Creative Live does it perfectly http://www.creativelive.com/courses/creative-expression-photography-joel-grimes
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on December 21, 2013, 01:05:30 pm
Oh this is nice - NO UNINSTALL!?  And the damn thing has no settings for where to store files!  I certainly don't want them stored on my SSD which it does by default!  TERRIBLE app!
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on December 21, 2013, 01:09:41 pm
For those on Windows at least the two directories you need to manually delete to remove this POS is the LeapingBrain folder in program files x86, and the Leaping brain folder in Users/(yourname)/appdata/local/roaming/leapingbrain - note you must have show hidden folders enabled to see this path.  This is where it sticks all the video files you download.  The Ctein was over 700MB alone as a .mov, taking up space.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 21, 2013, 01:56:02 pm
All the information on storing the media on a different drive or directory is available in the help section (http://platformpurple.com/help/category/media-storage/)
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 21, 2013, 01:58:30 pm
Looks like there is a partial solution to the Purple woes that some are having.

We will strip out the DRM tags of all the videos - I was not aware this was possible.

I will post again when the DRM is gone.

This will allow the files to be played on most any media player. The challenge for some will be finding them...
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Dr. Egon Milas on December 24, 2013, 02:55:40 am
Looks like there is a partial solution to the Purple woes that some are having.

We will strip out the DRM tags of all the videos - I was not aware this was possible.

I will post again when the DRM is gone.

This will allow the files to be played on most any media player. The challenge for some will be finding them...


Hello Chris,

this is the best Christmas present this year.

And for the finding challenge there's a solution in the LuLa shop: "Where the #% *! Are My Videos?" or was it Picture?  ;)

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year

Egon
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on December 24, 2013, 05:19:36 am
Thank you for the help link - although it's of little value - it tells you what I just did - and it's a VERY techy thing to find the files, no way the avg user will get through it.

BIG Cudos for at least doing all you can to make it easy on the user and removing the DRM.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Bob Nicholson on December 24, 2013, 05:45:14 am

1) We rarely receive requests from users with a need to uninstall the program, so we have focused resources on other updates and features that can further improve the platform. 
Grace

To design a program (for ANY OS) without an uninstall routine just leaves me speechless!
Bob
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: GeraldB on December 25, 2013, 04:01:14 pm
Thanks for the info Kaelaria. I've deleted the folders. Sorry, a program that has no uninstall, and puts massive video files on my C: SSD is not for me. I'll wait for a better solution from LuLa. Kaelaria, do you see a need to to do a register clean after removing the folders? I did not find any significant entries in the registry.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 25, 2013, 04:18:40 pm
In case you missed it (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=77494.0).
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: kaelaria on December 25, 2013, 05:06:53 pm
Thanks for the info Kaelaria. I've deleted the folders. Sorry, a program that has no uninstall, and puts massive video files on my C: SSD is not for me. I'll wait for a better solution from LuLa. Kaelaria, do you see a need to to do a register clean after removing the folders? I did not find any significant entries in the registry.

No compelling reason to for me, no.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Jeff Zanin on December 27, 2013, 09:48:49 am
Looks like there is a partial solution to the Purple woes that some are having.

We will strip out the DRM tags of all the videos - I was not aware this was possible.

I will post again when the DRM is gone.

This will allow the files to be played on most any media player. The challenge for some will be finding them...

Another non-fan of the whole purple / leaping brain evolution.  These are goofy names that add nothing to the LuLa brand, and the download / player model seems very clunky compared to what I was expecting, having purchased numerous LuLa products over the years.

I downloaded the LR5 videos this past Wednesday 25 (yes on Christmas).  The first file will play in QuickTime, the rest will not.

This makes it quite awkward to purchase & download the videos on computer A, then transfer the files to my NAS for playback on computer B or C, which has worked well for all my other videos, LuLa and others.  Instead I ended up downloading all of them again on computer B, not a very good work-around.

With all due respect to the issues you were addressing I think the outcome here with regard to video distribution / licensing / etc. is quite poor and certainly not worthy of the quality of the video content and production and definitely not of the LuLa brand.

Hoping for something better, and at this point your idea to remove the DRM would be a step in the right direction.

Jeff
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 27, 2013, 10:06:17 am
...I downloaded the LR5 videos this past Wednesday 25 (yes on Christmas).  The first file will play in QuickTime, the rest will not.

This makes it quite awkward to purchase & download the videos on computer A, then transfer the files to my NAS for playback on computer B or C, which has worked well for all my other videos, LuLa and others.  Instead I ended up downloading all of them again on computer B, not a very good work-around...

The change-over to non DRM videos is on-going - I don't think all the kinks are quite worked out yet - but if the files open in any media player other than the Luminous Landscape app, they are non-DRM.

Try double clicking on the media files, If they open in another media player, you can freely copy them. If you are bounced back to the Luminous Landscape app, you will need to go to this page to find the instructions for moving DRM encoded videos.

<http://platformpurple.com/help/how-do-i-move-my-downloaded-media-to-another-location-like-an-external-drive/>

Chris
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Jeff Zanin on December 27, 2013, 10:24:08 am
The change-over to non DRM videos is on-going - I don't think all the kinks are quite worked out yet - but if the files open in any media player other than the Luminous Landscape app, they are non-DRM.

Try double clicking on the media files, If they open in another media player, you can freely copy them. If you are bounced back to the Luminous Landscape app, you will need to go to this page to find the instructions for moving DRM encoded videos.

<http://platformpurple.com/help/how-do-i-move-my-downloaded-media-to-another-location-like-an-external-drive/>

Chris

Thanks.  In the videos that I assume still contain DRM when I double-click on the file in Explorer I get an error dialog that reads "Error: -2048: Couldn't open the file tll_lr5guide_11.mov because it is not a file that QuickTime understands.".

I'm re-downloading all the LR5 files now, because it was my understanding from your post (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=85446.msg692348#msg692348) in the DRM thread that this has been fixed, but your post above indicates that "... the change-over to nonDRM videos is on-going - I don't think all the kinks are quite worked out yet ...".

So other than re-downloading how do we determine when the fix is complete?

Jeff
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 27, 2013, 10:46:55 am
... So other than re-downloading how do we determine when the fix is complete?

I guess I will know when the volume of complaints recedes!  ???

We are trying...
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: gfioravanti on December 27, 2013, 02:27:46 pm
You can also find the files by clicking the gear icon and selecting "copy to mobile device".  Then click "open folder".
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: gfioravanti on December 27, 2013, 02:28:27 pm
You can select a new storage location by clicking the gear icon and selecting "choose preferred storage location".
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: gfioravanti on December 27, 2013, 02:33:49 pm
Sorry that we do not include an uninstall feature.  We haven't found that uninstalling has been a necessary feature since it hasn't been really requested by customers.  But we will add it to our feature list.

Also, if you'd prefer not to download and store the large video files, then the streaming player might be best for you.  http://player.platformpurple.com

But if you do want to view the videos offline, then you will need to download and store them somewhere on your computer or external drive.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: gfioravanti on December 27, 2013, 02:35:14 pm
If you are having trouble downloading the non-DRM version, please contact me at grace@platformpurple.com, and I'll get you fixed up.  Thanks!

Thanks.  In the videos that I assume still contain DRM when I double-click on the file in Explorer I get an error dialog that reads "Error: -2048: Couldn't open the file tll_lr5guide_11.mov because it is not a file that QuickTime understands.".

I'm re-downloading all the LR5 files now, because it was my understanding from your post (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=85446.msg692348#msg692348) in the DRM thread that this has been fixed, but your post above indicates that "... the change-over to nonDRM videos is on-going - I don't think all the kinks are quite worked out yet ...".

So other than re-downloading how do we determine when the fix is complete?

Jeff
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Jeff Zanin on December 27, 2013, 03:20:29 pm
I guess I will know when the volume of complaints recedes!  ???

We are trying...

That is one way... and I get that you are trying.  However consider that for every one of us that complains, asks questions, and perseveres long enough to get what we want there could be several who just move on and are never heard from again.  Or even worse they tell their friends, often with various embellishments about the difficulties they encountered.

For myself I can report that having re-downloaded the LR5 series today Friday 27 December 2013 all the files now open and at least start play with QuickTime, and I am no longer getting the "Error -2048" dialog that I believe was associated with the DRM.

Thanks to the LuLa and Purple/LB people who are working to clean up this issue.

Jeff
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 28, 2013, 04:23:01 pm
... I can report that having re-downloaded the LR5 series today Friday 27 December 2013 all the files now open and at least start play with QuickTime, and I am no longer getting the "Error -2048" dialog that I believe was associated with the DRM. ...

Glad you got it sorted out. I firmly believe that 99% of the reported problems can actually be sorted out fairly easily - if the customer chooses.

The frustration for customers (and also for me) is that the system does not operate exactly the same way that it used to.

As someone in the software industry has said, "Everyone wants their software to improve; no one wants it to change!"

That is easily understood but often hard to execute when adding features.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Alto on December 31, 2013, 08:34:41 am
Hi All

Just to say Purple Player horrible experience the old system was better just download to a folder then watch 20 mins so far and nothing it won't download at anything faster than 245 Kbps just awful I want to download why can't i get into my account and check files

Jon
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 31, 2013, 09:39:52 am
It sounds as if you have a problem. Please contact the Purple help folk (http://platformpurple.com/help/contact-us/) and they will sort it for you.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Alto on December 31, 2013, 11:22:11 am
Hi Chris

Why can't we download the chapters as before purple now make you download the DRM free as one huge file the Palose that I have just purchased will take over 6 hours to download.
With say camera to print at least you could view one chapter while downloading the next.

Jon

{EDIT}The download from purple has now gone to 8 hours 42 mins please bring back chapter downloading .

I trashed the purple player folder from the apps folder are there any other files i should look for???
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on December 31, 2013, 11:54:42 am
The Palouse videos are produced as before by subject - that has not changed.

There are separate video files for The Palouse, WheatMan with Bill Atkinson & a Slideshow

It sounds as if there are serious network problems if the files are taking that long. I would suggest you contact Purple help (http://platformpurple.com/help/contact-us/) and ask them to help.
Title: Re: New Streaming & Dwnld Videos?
Post by: Alto on December 31, 2013, 12:06:51 pm
Hi Chris

Are the files downloads as "chapters" as it seems the people at purple want you to download it all in one go .

You can't restart a download in safari once you stop it .

and the purple customer support is sluggish .

EXELENT content let down by poor third party support .

regards

Jon