Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Cameras, Lenses and Shooting gear => Topic started by: Colorado David on September 24, 2012, 11:12:30 pm
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Years and years ago, a Brooks Institute educated colleague of mine told me never to buy a third party lens. By now I think I pretty well know that doesn't apply to Schneider/Leica/Zeiss, but what about some of the lower priced third party offerings. I have my eye on a Zeiss wide prime for use on my D800. Are there less expensive lenses that are usable?
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The manual focus Samyangs are looking interesting but I haven't tried one. Yet.
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Here is some practical advice/experience from a photographic dilettante on just such an issue
I'm getting into macro and since I'm brainless it was decided that the ticket could be filled by a Schneider MAKRO Super Angulon TS 90mm. So I ordered one from B&H and spent nearly two full days fooling around with tilt and shift and focus. Wasn't completely happy but figured I'd eventually get the hang of it. Then happened into a store where a minty Nikkor 105 Macro was just waiting for a Noob to swipe it.
So on a whim it came home. Immediately the photos were much better. Don't get it wrong, when the MAKRO was "on" the images were slightly/somewhat sharper and color rendition was slightly more pleasing. However, the keeper/trash ratio was MUCH lower with the lens that effectively cost 4X the Nikkor. It is likely that over time the outcomes would improve with the "Super Lens". However, the integration of the "System" was much better with the Nikkor.
I do appreciate that learning and conquest are part of skill acquisition and satisfaction that comes with photography whether a hobby or profession. But some times you just want a great picture. IQ is just part of that process. No doubt many here could have produced wowser images right off the mark with the Schneider, but the whole equation is what matters. Being a designed part of the System can be an advantage regardless of the positive traits.
Maybe one day, when I am better, the Super Angulon will be "better". A photographer has to know their limitations too. It ain't just the equipment...
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Years and years ago, a Brooks Institute educated colleague of mine told me never to buy a third party lens. By now I think I pretty well know that doesn't apply to Schneider/Leica/Zeiss, but what about some of the lower priced third party offerings. I have my eye on a Zeiss wide prime for use on my D800. Are there less expensive lenses that are usable?
I have no first hand experience, but I hear some of Sigma glass is excellent, notably the macro lenses.
Cheers,
Bernard
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Sigma 70mm f2.8 is an excellent lens. It is extremely sharp starting wide open - corner to center to corner. Curved 9 blade aperture allows for very creamy bokeh.
The only drawback of this lens - AF is noisy, but it is AF (vs Zeiss:) )
I did not see any exceptional reviews of Sigma's wide angle full frame primes (except a spectacular lens on DP2)
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One thing that have always kept me from buying third party is that so far I have not found a single one that is weather sealed, and has the gasket around the mount. I don't know what type of shooting you do, but for me that is a requirement.
However, many of the third party macros are stellar.
Best,
Mattias
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Roger has just posted lates camera and lens reliability/repair data on lensrentals.com. interesting reading for both camera manufacturers and 3rd party - reliability, cost, repair time/responsiveness. a couple changes from a year ago
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Sigma 70mm f2.8 is an excellent lens.
Hi Michael, thank you for this info. But this is a Macro lens. Do you use it for infinity landscape work?
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I can't see the downside of using a third-party manual focus lens, if you don't need the AF capacity.
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Hi Michael, thank you for this info. But this is a Macro lens. Do you use it for infinity landscape work?
Hi Hening, yes, it works great at any distance.
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allegretto, don't bet too much on the Schneider. I had one for a week and after trying every combination I could think of I ended up not being very impressed. If you want to try one of the exotic ts lenses, try the Hartblei. My advice is to send the Schneider back from whence it came.
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Not ready yet for third party non-german designed glass. But who knows what's going to happen soon. Some Sigma lenses are quite good now, especially for the savings involved. In their beginnings they were much less than acceptable.
Eduardo
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I have not used any of the really new Sigma lenses, but my past experience with them I was not all that happy with them, the centers were generally ok but the corners were lacking. I have heard the macros are good. I really like the Zeiss lenses. However the Samyang's are worth looking at, they have some excellent optics. Here is a comparison I ran across comparing ultra wides, the Zeiss 15, Samyang 14mm, and the Nikon 14-24mm, some rather interesting results....
http://www.3d-kraft.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=127:uwa-comparison&catid=40:camerasandlenses&Itemid=2
You could also try renting them from Lensrentals.com, they have some interesting equipment and worthwhile to give it a try and see what you like or dislike. For me manual focus is not a problem.
Alan
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Personally I have no real brand loyalty and I'm willing to buy whatever product I feel is best for me at the price I'm willing to pay.
I have two main cameras systems at the moment, a Canon 5D and a Panasonic G1. I've bought different brand lenses for each notably (and as mentioned by another poster) I've bought several Sigma lenses for my 5D including 12-24mm, 150mm f2.8 macro and 50mm and 85mm f1.4's. In each case I felt that each was the best for me at the price I was willing to pay, the 12-24mm has no real competition within the Canon line up, the 150mm is a good lens and the 50 and 85mm f1.4's are both arguably the best Canon AF compatible lenses at their respective focal lengths. I also have a Voigtlander 25mm f0.95 for my G1 and it seems to be a very good lens.
So, my experience of third party lenses has been very good and I'd advise anyone to buy the best lens at the price they're willing to pay regardless of the badge on it.
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I have not used any of the really new Sigma lenses, but my past experience with them I was not all that happy with them, the centers were generally ok but the corners were lacking. I have heard the macros are good. I really like the Zeiss lenses. However the Samyang's are worth looking at, they have some excellent optics. Here is a comparison I ran across comparing ultra wides, the Zeiss 15, Samyang 14mm, and the Nikon 14-24mm, some rather interesting results....
http://www.3d-kraft.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=127:uwa-comparison&catid=40:camerasandlenses&Itemid=2
You could also try renting them from Lensrentals.com, they have some interesting equipment and worthwhile to give it a try and see what you like or dislike. For me manual focus is not a problem.
Alan
Very interesting to see this comparison. Now I feel happy about my Nikon 14-24. Mostly because I work f/5.6 and f/8 all the time. CA not an issue since ARC corrects them very well.
ACH
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Thanks for the input
It's already RMA-ing its way back to B&H
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I for one am anxiously awaiting news on the Samyang 24mm TS lens, announced at photokina.
I have been pleased with my APS-C-only lens Sigma 8-16mm f/variable. I am usually shooting at f/8, though.
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Hi Hening, yes, it works great at any distance.
Thank you.
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The manual focus Samyangs are looking interesting but I haven't tried one. Yet.
Ellis, do you plan to review the Samyang 14mm 2.8? I'm curious about your evaluation, especially on a Nikon D800. The attached article comparing it to the Nikon and the Zeiss has piqued my interest.
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I've had the Samyang 14mm for a few months and been using it on a Canon 5Dii and am very happy with it indeed.
There are a lot of reviews and pages about this lens on the web dealing with it on both Canon and Nikon lens mounts. My experience suggests the reviews are all pretty accurate, although my example didn't suffer the focusing scale errors some others have found.
You have to live with manual focus, manual iris and correcting any unacceptable distortion in software, but for this particular lens type it's really not a deal killer. The end results really are directly comparable to Canon's own 14mm at nearly eight times the price.
Overall I thinks it's outstanding value for money.
Given it's low cost and depreciation, you really can't go far wrong buying one to try out if you're looking for a super wide.
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The likes of Rick Sammon would say stay away from 3rd party glass. Use whatever brand lens as it will be better..
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I use or have used both Zeiss and Samyang lenses. I should point out that I like manual focus lenses to begin with, so your mileage can and will vary.
The Samyang, IMO, are great value for the money. Extremely sharp glass for the most part, but the wide angles do show more distortion, I think, than some of the better brand name lenses. Still for the money, and especially for the smaller sensor SLRs, it is hard to beat them.
I like my one zeiss so much I just ordered a second one. I would normally agree that brand name lenses work best than third party lenses, but the single exception, to me, is Zeiss. Excellent optics, sharp image, low distortion, built like a tank, and totally seamless integration with my Nikon.
I would recommend the Samnyang on any smaller sensor camera - Rebel, D5100, etc. But on your full frame D800, look at the Zeiss. Maybe rent one first to see if you like it.
Good luck
Joe
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The likes of Rick Sammon would say stay away from 3rd party glass. Use whatever brand lens as it will be better..
What's a "brand"? Canon? Nikon? ;D
IMVHO there really is no place for brand snobbery. To beleive that any one manufacturer, let alone Canon, makes the best lens at every focal, aperture and price point is quite foolish. To pick and choose what is best for each of us is the best way, IMVHO.
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Ellis, do you plan to review the Samyang 14mm 2.8? I'm curious about your evaluation, especially on a Nikon D800. The attached article comparing it to the Nikon and the Zeiss has piqued my interest.
If I can. Time is tight and lens reviews are a lot of work. See if imaging-resource.com has anything to say about them.