Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Adobe Lightroom Q&A => Topic started by: Scott O. on March 07, 2012, 04:50:26 pm
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Question for Jeff or anyone else who might know...What is the effect on an image which has been previously processed with an earlier process version and edited? Does upgrading that edited image to Process 2012 mean the image needs to be reprocessed from scratch? Thanks...
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I have found that there is no need to reprocess the image at all when converting previously worked-on images from LR3 to LR4. Everything seems fine.
Gerry
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My experience is that you'll need to check each image after conversion. Some are fine (those without much change), others (that might have had more changes) change a lot and need re-evaluation.
I'd second Adobe's Ms Kost's recommendation (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0ZHtNGrhIA&feature=youtu.be) not to bulk change to the new process.
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I've converted a couple. They were both quite close, but I readjusted both. The before/after view option is very convenient for this.
Alan
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Question for Jeff or anyone else who might know...What is the effect on an image which has been previously processed with an earlier process version and edited?
It all depends...the biggest differences between LR3 and LR4 PV 2012 is really the Fill Light which doesn't translate exactly because the adjustments are very different. For certain images, you may not be able to get the exact match. Highlight Recover is also very different...at this point there seems to be an issue with updated LR3 catalogs loosing the point curve edits. That's something Adobe is working on.
So, I guess it comes down to how extreme your PV 2010 adjustments are. Normal images tend to convert very well. Edge case images may not. You'll get a feel for the types that will or won't. Personally, there are some images whose settings are optimal in PV 2010 and I'm going to keep them that way. For all new images, PV 2012 is default. One thing I wouldn't do is a mass PV 2010 > PV 2012 update...that may be very frustrating. Also remember if you do update, in LR4 you can always use History to get back to the previous settings in PV 2010. Converting from PV 2010 to PV 2012 and then back to PV 2010 won't get you back exactly...you'll have to use History to step back.
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If you do a "mass" conversion of all of your files to PV 2012 when you first open up LR4 and you want to reverse it(having read up today about the potential issues with converting images from PV 10 to PV 12), how do you go about that? Trash the new LR 4 catalogue where it was created and import the LR3 catalogue again? The old LR 3 catalogue does appear to be intact in its old location.
Thanks.
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If you do a "mass" conversion of all of your files to PV 2012 when you first open up LR4 and you want to reverse it(having read up today about the potential issues with converting images from PV 10 to PV 12), how do you go about that?
Well to redo it en-mass, the only way I know of is to start again with a LR3 catalog update...otherwise you'll need to go down into the image history to negate the PV 2012 changes...
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Well to redo it en-mass, the only way I know of is to start again with a LR3 catalog update...otherwise you'll need to go down into the image history to negate the PV 2012 changes...
To do that, you would have to do it image by image, right?
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To do that, you would have to do it image by image, right?
Yep...there's now way to do it en-mass...
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Yep...there's now way to do it en-mass...
I believe that's incorrect.
You should be able to copy the process version develop setting and paste across a whole catalogue.
Might not be a quick process.......
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Based on what Jeff has said on this forum as well as the new LL Lightroom 4 tutorial, I will not convert already processed images to the 2012 process in mass. I will do them on an individual as needed basis. But I would like to go back to previous folders and update all the images which have not yet been processed. Everything that I have processed has been tagged with a color code. Is there a way to select just those files WITHOUT a color code? If so I could then update only the unprocessed files, all at once. Thanks!
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Go to "Library", activate Library Filters (library menu) and click on "Metadata". Take a look at the frame "Label". Check if there are only colours listed and of course "No Label". If so (no other labels involved) just click on "No Label" and Bob is your uncle.
You have to select the whole catalog of course.
Ciao, Walter
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Until one becomes very familiar with PV 2012, I very strongly recommend not batch-converting images with existing adjustments from older process versions (e.g., 2003, 2010) to 2012. Since the underlying algorithms for the Basic tone controls have changed, and in some cases there are no direct equivalents, this means that image appearance may change significantly in some cases. Any issues that arise will be obvious if you update an individual image. But if you batch-update a group of 100 images, potential problems won't be obvious until you individually review the images.
Now, if you were planning to rework some older images anyways, it's fine to update them to PV 2012.
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Until one becomes very familiar with PV 2012, I very strongly recommend not batch-converting images with existing adjustments from older process versions (e.g., 2003, 2010) to 2012.
And, if ERIC is advising restraint (which I agree with) you would be foolish to to a mass conversion...take it image by image and learn how to take control over the PV 2012 controls and learn how to expect the conversion will be handled...the major changes in PV 2012 relate to Fill Light, Highlight Recovery and Clarity...Highlights and Shadows are "different" than the PV 2010 controls and Clarity is now about 2x as strong (without the halos) that PV 2010 tended to suffer from...
Not only does it take time to learn the new controls, it takes time to understand how the PV conversion will impact images. Take baby steps...
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Now sorry if missed it above ^^^ ???
But when installing LR4 as an upgrade to LR3.4 (in my case ~ never did do the incremental to 3.6) what is the advised method (step by step please ;) ) to use my LR3 catalogue but not to mass convert to PV2012 so that as advised I can look at each PV2010 process(ed) image and decide using a VC whether I like the new 'PV2012 processing' before I commit to the change.....................but or course as I understand VC I can commit to it without losing my PV2010 version :)
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Hopefully someone will tell me if I am totally wrong! Installing LR4 WILL NOT automatically update your catalog to PV 2012. That is a separate step after LR is installed. After LR4 is installed, when you look at an image in the Develop Module, there will be a (!) in the lower right corner which signifies the image has yet to be updated. Click on it. You will be given the option of updating the single image you are on OR all images in the filmstrip. So, you can update either one or a bunch. A previous post tells how to select just the unedited images should you want to update those only, which is what I am going to do. They I will update previously edited images later only if I see the need to do so.
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"Installing LR4 WILL NOT automatically update [any images in] your catalog to PV 2012."
You seem to have got it right though. Just convert individual images as and when you want to do so. There's no point converting all your pictures unless you want to review and fine tune each one individually.
John
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Hopefully someone will tell me if I am totally wrong! Installing LR4 WILL NOT automatically update your catalog to PV 2012.
I also noticed that converting a catalogue after installing LR4 creates a new catalogue without destroying the old one (at least if the original has a custom name as all mine do - haven't checked with defaults), and that installing LR4 leaves 3.6 in place, so that you can always go back to where you were before LR4.
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I also noticed that converting a catalogue after installing LR4 creates a new catalogue without destroying the old one (at least if the original has a custom name as all mine do - haven't checked with defaults), and that installing LR4 leaves 3.6 in place, so that you can always go back to where you were before LR4.
Ah! now this is the first comment I think I have seen stating that LR3 is left intact after installing LR4.............................if that is correct it comes back to my question as to how to 'copy' the LR3 catalogue and leave the original catalogue intact in case it is required for any reason by LR3. Or is that simply (?) one of the options offered when choosing the catalgue that LR4 will use???
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When you first open a LR3 catalog in LR4, you are asked to update the old catalog...it gives you the option of renaming-but I would NOT name it the same and overwrite your old catalog, that would not be a good thing to do. By default I think it takes the name of the old catalog and adds a -2 at the end. So as long as YOU preserve the old LR3 catalog, you can still open that in LR3.
Note, any changes you make in the upgraded catalog can not really be put back into the LR3 catalog. So once you start working, you form a new branch...also, with regards to the LR 4 updated catalog, you'll want to make sure your preferences for that catalog are properly set...I'm not sure an updated catalog inherits the LR3 catalog prefs...and be sure to do a backup!
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LR4 certainly does not pick up the LR3 backup preferences.
Alan
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When you first open a LR3 catalog in LR4, you are asked to update the old catalog...it gives you the option of renaming-but I would NOT name it the same and overwrite your old catalog, that would not be a good thing to do. By default I think it takes the name of the old catalog and adds a -2 at the end. So as long as YOU preserve the old LR3 catalog, you can still open that in LR3.
Note, any changes you make in the upgraded catalog can not really be put back into the LR3 catalog. So once you start working, you form a new branch...also, with regards to the LR 4 updated catalog, you'll want to make sure your preferences for that catalog are properly set...I'm not sure an updated catalog inherits the LR3 catalog prefs...and be sure to do a backup!
Jeff, many thanks for insight :)
So as this is the first I will have updated LR (LR3 was my first) I will have read each dialogue very carefully. If I read your guidance right ~ LR4 gives the choice of updating the old LR3 catalogue the answer should be no but to rename it and by doing so LR4 takes a copy of the catalogue with an LR4 unique name for it. And as such n'er the twain will meet for the two catalogues!
As for the preferences such as its store location these will need to be set as required like in LR3 if you wish to over-ride the default preferences.
Lastly, I did see an online uTube about using virtual copies of PV2010 images being opened in LR4 and when you make changes to use the "Before & After" side by side view in Develop module to see the PV2010 to PV2012 differences ~ made a lot of sense to me as it keeps the original PV2010 version intact and shows readily any changes the PV2012 is making to the PV2010 original.
Just need to order up my upgrade but use the trial period of the download in the meantime...................though that will have to wait as I have a week away on business :(
Oh, not forgeting to make sure LR4 does not over-write the LR3 installation by default.................but it does sound like it installs naturally into its own root folder???
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If I read your guidance right ~ LR4 gives the choice of updating the old LR3 catalogue the answer should be no but to rename it and by doing so LR4 takes a copy of the catalogue with an LR4 unique name for it.
No...wrong, you _DO_ want to update the LR3 catalog...you just want to give it a unique name so it won't over write you original LR3 catalog. The original LR3 catalog will remain untouched.
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No...wrong, you _DO_ want to update the LR3 catalog...you just want to give it a unique name so it won't over write you original LR3 catalog. The original LR3 catalog will remain untouched.
My experience was that Lightroom 4 provided the unique name on its own, by adding -2 to the original (custom) name - but no harm making sure by naming it yourself.
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I believe that's incorrect.
You should be able to copy the process version develop setting and paste across a whole catalogue.
Might not be a quick process.......
If I understand the question correctly, the poster was asking if he converted all of his images from PV2010 to PV2012 whether or not it would be possible to convert them en masse back to PV2010. I think we've all agreed doing so would be a really bad idea, but it IS possible. To test it I took a rejected image (which was in PV2010) and set the sliders in the basic panel all to 50. I then updated the image to PV2012, and in the conversion the final result was quite different (as expected). However, I backed up a step and created a new Develop preset (called Test), unselecting all of the boxes EXCEPT Process Version. Actually, when you click Uncheck All, Process Version remains checked by default. Anyway, I re-converted the image to PV2012, then applied the 'Test' preset and it changed it back to PV2010 with the sliders as I had set them. One could select all images, apply the 'Test' preset and it would convert them all to PV 2010. Why you would want to do this I have no idea, but it is possible. Certainly better to choose images that you'd like to update and work on them individually.
Mike.
Mike.
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No...wrong, you _DO_ want to update the LR3 catalog...you just want to give it a unique name so it won't over write you original LR3 catalog. The original LR3 catalog will remain untouched.
Jeff, thanks for making that more pointed for me. I would hate to muck it up :o So 'updating' the LR3 gives the option to rename (either the default rename or one chosen by me) and this action creates the LR4 working copy of the LR3 catalogue :)