Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: markrichardross on January 29, 2012, 11:39:35 am
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I have a relatively new (September 2011) 4900, that I had not used in about two months. When I tried to make a print, I discovered that 5 of the nozzles are completely clogged -- not even a speck showing up on the print nozzle check. I think I have tried everything to clear them, but... I have tried the manual (powerful cleaning) on the missing channels, powerful cleaning on all channels, auto cleaning, letting the unit rest overnight (as advised in the manual) and trying it all again, all to no avail. Is this unit dead or is there anything I can or should try (short of calling Epson tomorrow) in order to get this puppy to work? I am supposed to deliver a print on Monday (which is now going to be late, sigh). Any help or advise is much appreciated. Thanks.
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Not so sure about the 4900, but in those situations on the 9880 out come to the lint-free paper towels and Windex bottles, long before we have exhausted the manual's suggestions. I'd better let those who know the 4900 better than I continue this thought, but it's a variation on "get a bigger hammer."
I'm thinking the Epson Wide Format Forum (http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/EpsonWideFormat/) will have a lot to say about this.
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It's under warranty - your best option if you've tried a couple of cleans (and let it sit for a while after doing them), is to contact Epson. I know that's not really useful when you have a print to get out, but it's the best option. To reiterate - when you do a clean or two - let the printer sit for a while and do a nozzle check - not lots and lots of continuous cleans.
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I just called Epson. I'll let you know how well it goes. Thanks. One question while they have me on endless hold... does anyone think that it is (or is not) worthwhile to get the 1 or 2 year extended warranty?
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I just got off the phone with Epson, and as the printer is still covered under warranty, they are simply replacing the unit. The tech suggested that since I do not print every day (I do fine art prints in limited volume, alas!), that I run a nozzle check every day (or so). He stated that it would use "very little ink" and keep the nozzles fresh with ink moving through them. If this happens again, I will certainly entertain getting the extended warranty (replacement).
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I've owned a 4880 for a few years (read: not an expert), and have been following this topic here in the forums. My experience agrees with what I've read as the three most commonly accepted reasons for "clogs" in Epson wide format printers:
1) New printers and sometimes new ink cartridges make bubbles in the lines that, when they reach the head, cause the whole channel to go out. When my printer was new, I could actually see the bubbles in the line. I don't know if the 4900 is built differently to avoid this, but if not your replacement printer will experience it too. I don't know a way around this.
2) Humidity. Winter in most places means dry air. These epson printers seem to fair much better in moderate humidity (not too low and not too high). After going away for Christmas, and leaving my printer unused for over a month (oh, and I live in the desert that is Utah) I was experiencing what you describe - most channels almost entirely clogged. After struggling with it for two days and getting very worried, I remembered that I should have had my humidifier on. After turning that on for a day, I came back to it and the nozzles all cleared up by the second cleaning! (not power cleans)!
3) Cleanliness. Avoiding dust always seems like a good idea for these touchy devices.
When I cut the previous print from the roll, the newly created edge on the roll should be wiped to remove any tiny paper bits. It seems to make a difference for me - or maybe it's just a superstition that I've built up.
Hope this was helpful.
Good luck with your new printer!
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Thanks. Someone else just told me about the humidifier solution (which makes sense to me) and suggested that in place of a humidifier, I could place a can of water (for evaporation purposes) in the printer, obviously making sure to remember to remove it every time, prior to printing. I am not sure how wise (or not) this solution may be, (it would be harsh to forget to remove the can), but short of keeping a humidifier running in my studio all winter long, it may be a viable solution. Any comments?
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Humidity is diffusive and will quickly disperse in the room it is confined to in order to reach equilibrium. I have high-end guitars in one small room in my house. The target humidity in this room is 45-55 RH. I use a Venta humidifier in this room and it is simple to keep it in that range. Generally, I have to put about a gallon of water in the reservoir each day and the room is only 12' by 12'. I think this is a better method than a can of water in the printer for three reasons. 1. I would NEVER put a water reservoir inside my printer - NEVER. 2. It won't increase the humidity in the room, which is the goal. 3. There is no mechanism - like the humidifier - to get the water dispersed to the air as fast as it needs to in order to do the job. I've heard the 'can-in-the-printer' suggestion a few times on this forum and I cringe every time I read it. Just sayin...
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I guess a humidifier does make the most sense. Knowing me, I would forget that I have the can in the printer and totally screw the pooch. Which model of the Venta (or others) do you recommend?
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I use the LW14, which was ~$200. Here is the link
http://www.ventahumidifiers.com/
The main reason I like this unit is that it has a finned drum that spins in the water bath and when it spins free of the bath the fan blows on the fins and evaporates the water and blows the vapor into the room. They call the unit an airwasher as it claims to take dust and particulate matter out of the air and into the water. Other humidifiers that I tried put a white dust on everything in the room, which I later found out were the minerals from my hard water that was still trapped in the water droplets. This was an unacceptable situation so I dug and found the Venta that totally eliminates this problem due to the water evaporating and leaving any solids behind.
BTW, I have no affiliation with Venta; just a happy user. :)
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Thanks. I will order one today.
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From reading these and other forums, it seemed the open container of water is a common approach that works well. If the container is in the printer itself, the humidity can rise locally without affecting the room as a whole. However there was one post about mold growing in the printer (and I've never heard of anyone else experiencing it at all) but that scared me out of ever trying it. Also, the open container is for when the printer is off, but when I use the humidifier it is only before and when the printer is in use.
I'm just relating my approach. If you are willing to spend the time, it would be worth searching and reading through the old threads.
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Before I can accept that a can of water can raise the humidity in the immediate area of the printer, I'd want to put a Radio Shack humidity gauge in the printer AND in the room it is in to prove that the humidity will be different in two places in the same room. I have doubts that you'll find two different humidity levels in the same room.
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I'm with Randy on this. Temperature (and rate of variation), air movement and existing relative humidity will have such a significant effect that a "can of water" solution (no pun intended) seems dubious at best without some hard measurement.
I also agree with the comment that sometimes a new printer just needs time to settle. A good thing is to get a few decent sized prints done as soon as possible and then continue to make some regular use of it for a couple of weeks. Nozzle checks are an ideal way to keep an eye on things, too.
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I have now ordered the Venta humidifier (it will arrive before the replacement printer) and trust that the humidifier, along with regular "nozzle test prints," will nip the problem in the bud (so to speak). The water in the can solution (again, no pun intended) seems interesting as the low tech way to deal with it. I may just have to get a Radio Shack humidity gauge (or something else relatively inexpensive), just to check to see if indeed two humidity levels can be present in the same basic micro climate. Stay tuned..
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I just got off the phone with Epson, and as the printer is still covered under warranty, they are simply replacing the unit. .... If this happens again, I will certainly entertain getting the extended warranty (replacement).
Mark, they may replace your unit with a refurb. If so, make sure it's in as good a condition as yours and check the ink cartridges.
As for the extended warranty, keep in mind that clogs are a real possibility. The problem here is that the cost of the Epson warranty is very high. If I buy another printer I'd be inclined to buy from B&H where you can get a two-year warranty at a fraction of the price for the Epson two-year extended warranty. Plus, they also offer a four-year extended warranty (after the one-year expires) which Epson doesn't offer. What I don't know is the track record of the service provider.
Jim
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Yes, I am worried that they may replace it with a refub unit. What should I look for as my unit is really pristine except for the damned clogs...
I did check on the price of the extended warranty and my oh my, but it is pricey - $349 for one year and $549 for two; certainly not worth it is they are going to replace with a refurbished unit. The replacement is due to be delivered tomorrow. I will let you know....
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Yes, I am worried that they may replace it with a refurb unit. What should I look for as my unit is really pristine except for the damned clogs...
I did check on the price of the extended warranty and my oh my, but it is pricey - $349 for one year and $549 for two; certainly not worth it is they are going to replace with a refurbished unit. The replacement is due to be delivered tomorrow. I will let you know....
If it were me and I didn't like its looks I'd reject it and tell Epson it is unacceptable. See if Epson will repaired on-site. If not, I believe you also have the option of bringing it to an authorized repair shop. Depending on where you live that may be a good option.
Jim
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Yes, I am worried that they may replace it with a refub unit.
Mark,
Unless Epson has drastically changed the way they treat their Pro Imaging customers, your "refurb" should be indistinguishable from your original printer. It should be pristine.
I went through this when I bought my 4000. It had an issue (vertical banding which usually mean a drive belt issue), I was told I'd have a replacement ASAP. The tech assured me the replacement would be "better than new" because (at that time) they were hand check and tested. Hope that is still their policy.
I used my first set of carts to prime my new printer and then had a full set of ink for my troubles. I hope your 4900 will receive the same treatment!
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Mark,
Other than one replacement 4900 I received (the ink ribbon holders caused friction on the ink lines producing a grinding noise), all have looked and operated like my last. Epson sends new starter ink and has told me to keep everything from within my old printer when replacing. The only items that come new are the power cable and roll paper mechanism. I have a love-hate relationship with my 4900--love the output but it does cause me aggravation with clogs. The best thing I've done for it is to ensure all head cleanings are activated--on startup, before each print job and random checks--and I don't send more than 5 sheets through per print job so that I'm assured of a head cleaning. I've only had positive experiences with Epson customer support.
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Thanks for the encouragement. I also love the output of the 4900. And I also do not print often, so the regular nozzle checks recommended by Epson tech support makes sense . I have also ordered a humidifier (see the reply by Randy Carone) for my studio, which together with the nozzle checks, should (I hope) eliminate this problem.
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I received the "new" (refurbished) 4900 printer from Epson yesterday. It came in perfect cosmetic condition. After letting the printer acclimate to my environment, I ran a nozzle print test and discovered a few clogged nozzles. I ran the nozzle clean routine, which did not help and then ran the powerful clean routine. Three of the nozzles still showed significant drop out. An individual power clean to the affected nozzles did not alter the print out (or clogged nozzles). A call to Epson and they are sending me another printer, a replacement for my replacement. At this point Epson is very responsive (and apologetic), though this is all getting a bit long in the tooth (as am I). Stay tuned.
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Many times I have found that just letting the printer sit for a few hours up to a full day (left on) will get the ink flowing better than multiple cleaning cycles. This might not help if the printer has a serious problem, but since this printer was just sent to you... I would give it a try.
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I will try that. Thanks.
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I wish you and myself well Mark. I have discovered a similar problem with my 4900: blocks in the VLM and LC that will not clear. I had a 4800 for 5 years and never had to do a power clean. Two did nothing for this clog. Epson is sending another printer, but given how much trouble it was to get the printer to the second floor, it is not the solution I was hoping for.
Tom
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Well, I am hopeful that the third time's the charm for me. The Epson rep I spoke with said they they are thoroughly testing this third printer before they send it to out me (Should not they ALL be thoroughly tested?). I was very disappointed to find the same problem on the replacement unit as my original. Like you I never had a single problem with my 4800. This replacement is due to be shipped Monday, so I will let you know how well it works. Best of luck to you with your replacement unit (and the stairs).
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Refurb units will be QAed at the time they're refurbed - they generally won't fire them up before sending them to you. In this case, it sounds like that's exactly what they're going to do, which is excellent service (and appropriate in the circumstances).
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Epson's support has been excellent. They have been working their best to get me a replacement (and solve my nozzle problem). The machines have let me down, not them. Indeed, they are going to to have the good folks in Indiana (where the 4900's are refurbed, tested and warehoused) fire it up and do another set of diagnostics before shipping it out. Can't ask for more, other than sending me a new unit ;).
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I hope your replacement's replacement works out for you. I'm currently on my fifth replacement--my third was DOA like yours. Epson offered to "test" my latest machine prior to sending it to me and I had a similar response as you. However, it was a bit of a waste, it least for me. I had hoped testing would involve setting the machine up and if clogs easily appeared, it would not be sent. Instead, it seems quite a bit of ink was run through the machine (the maintenance tank was 3/4 filled and most of the initial cartridges were close to empty when I received the machine) and it needed cleanings when I initially set it up.
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Shane,
Your experience is one of my concerns (that they won't really test it, that it arrives as yours did, and i need to go through additional pack/unpack/test/clean/retest/call/repack and wait for a replacement cycles). There is nothing at this point I can do other than to wait. My question to you is whether, in spite of the fact that the maintenance tank arrived 3/4 full, and that most of the ink ink had been run through it, necessitating "another" cleaning, did it works as is was supposed to (without clogs), or are you now waiting for your 6th machine?
I am beginning to rue the day that I sold my trusty 4800.
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No, I'm not waiting for my 6th and my current, to me, clogs more than my 7880. That's why I say I have a love-hate relationship with it and have reached détente with it. I let it perform all its auto nozzle checks and I try not to get aggravated as I print a 72 page fine art project for a client in 5 page increments as it may clean nozzles every five pages (it gets worse after the first half). I've just decided that's how it's going to operate for me. The only reason I have this one is because I became particularly aggravated after my previous printer was performing a cleaning after almost every 5 pages, I paused it after 1 page printed following a cleaning and nozzles were again clogged. I called Epson just to find out if it l was normal behavior. I was told no and I acquiesced to them replacing it. I don't live in either a particularly dry or humid environment but I may try the humidifier route.
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For what it is worth, I have owned a 4900 for about 6 months and print intermittently (2x/wk is usual). I also have guitars and mandolins so we keep the house at a pretty steady 40+ per cent humidify and I have had only one clog which cleared easily during this period of time. I also bought a dust cover for the printer and use it pretty religiously whenever it is not in actual use. I live in the northeast US so the heating can make the air pretty dry, and it seems like the bonus is that the extra moisture in the air is better for you health.
Jeff
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A report on my replacement 4900. Epson's service very responsive and fast as reported by others. I recruited a now former friend :D to help me carry the clogged 4900 down, and the replacement up, a narrow flight of stairs.
The printer came with inks installed and a perfect, signed and dated nozzle check taped to the tray. After installation, I tried a print nozzle check - nothing on the paper. I tried a print from the console, again nothing on the paper. Auto nozzle check gave the following:
A power clean solved the problem. The printer had traveled by air freight, so the low humidity and reduced pressure of a cargo hold may explain the clogging of every nozzle. Seems ok now, best of luck to all with a problem.
Tom
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Just how common is the clogging problem with the 4900? After all, in their promotional literature, Epson expressly claims that the printer has a new "ink repelling coating for dramatically reduced nozzle clogging." Is this just BS, or are those few who have experienced repeated clogging posting on this forum?
Rob
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Just how common is the clogging problem with the 4900? After all, in their promotional literature, Epson expressly claims that the printer has a new "ink repelling coating for dramatically reduced nozzle clogging." Is this just BS, or are those few who have experienced repeated clogging posting on this forum?
Rob
Rob:
In my limited experience, I have not seen many reports of clogging compared to previous Epson printers. I can tell you that the Epson rep responded quickly when I told him that a clean did not clear the nozzles with "that is not normal". He then suggested a replacement printer, which so far, is fine.
Tom
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As a coda to my 5 clogged nozzle story, I purchased the Venta humidifier as recommended by a number of people in this post. While I was waiting for the third replacement to arrive from Epson (all the previous replacements had the same clogged nozzle problem and no manner of cleaning/power cleaning would solve the issue), I had to leave my studio for three days. I left the humidifier running. Upon return I ran a nozzle check on replacement Unit #3, and lo and behold, most of the nozzles had "miraculously" cleared. A regular nozzle clean cycle cleared up the (very) few remaining clogs. I now had the printer running properly and everything was as it should be. Once again, I was a happy camper. The output was just what I had wanted/expected.
I contacted Epson Pro Services again and told them that indeed, the humidifier "trick" had done the job and I no longer needed the replacement. I related that the info I'd gotten had all come from this blog/community and suggested that LL would be a good place for them to learn what was really going on with their printers and glean some info on possible real-world solutions. The rep took down all my info regarding the fix, including how long I let the unit sit in the now humid atmosphere of my studio (about 60 hours) and relative humidity (40%) prior to its being able to clear a clogged nozzle and work properly. I must say that Epson was great through this whole process.
This solution may (or may not) work for others with this problem, but it certainly did for me. (For the record, I had also tried the can of water solution, which did NOT work). I appreciate everyone's ideas and help with this. Thanks again. :)
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please forgive the next naive remark/question but it is on the level of 'putting a can of water near the printer'.
the printer (3800) came in a big plastic bag. I have the printer sitting on some green foam bricks that i put in the bag (the kind you buy at a craft store for sticking flowers into. whenever i am done with a printing run, i tape up the bag. when i am not going to do any printing for a month or more, I throw a sopping wet towel into the bottom of the bag and tape it up around the printer. does this sound really stupid or just mildly demented? i cannot see the harm except the possibility of mildew growth-
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If it were me and I didn't like its looks I'd reject it and tell Epson it is unacceptable. See if Epson will repaired on-site. If not, I believe you also have the option of bringing it to an authorized repair shop. Depending on where you live that may be a good option.
Jim
Epson does not repair 4900's on site.
On a 4900 they may or may not ship a refurb printer, prob. depending on availability. It also could be with the 4900 just shipping new is easier than replacing parts. A refurb unit is pretty much factory new. All key components are new (head, cap assembly etc.) I would be surprised if you could tell it was ever used. I also had a 7900 replaced, and no problems with the replacement printer.
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Three weeks with the replacement 4900 and not a clog. I don't even bother printing noozle checks anymore, well maybe, but not as often.
Tom