Luminous Landscape Forum
The Art of Photography => The Coffee Corner => Topic started by: fredjeang on December 29, 2011, 02:46:48 pm
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Hi guys, this is I think the appropriate forum for this topic.
I'd like to have, if there are some here in Lu-La, former heavy smokers testimonials.
The short story is this:
I've been a heavy smoker (2 - 3 packs a day) for more than 20 years and a serious coffee drinker too.
I've never visited a doctor since my childwood, not ill one time. Not kidding.
Recently I've decided to stop coffees and passed from at least 60 cigaretes a day to 5 - 6, not because I was ill but, you know, because
I was thinking that this crazy consumming would end to kill me although I was perfectly fine.
And then problems started to araise just coinciding with the period I stopped. Instead of feeling better, the body's reaction has suddenly turned crazy:
low pressure, cardiac rythm suddenly unstable, low, then high, headaches (never happened to me in the past), sensation of breathing worse, lack of concentration, and I'm starting to catch colds easily...
I also had sort of dizziness sensations that come and go from time to time, and a form of anguish.
I'm really having bad time those days, and my social life is affected; it's not my style to complain or feeling physically bad, but the sensation in fact is that it seems that when I decided to take care of my healph, the worse I'm feeling !
If you've been a serious smoker in the past, I'd like to hear from your experience.
Thanks.
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I've never visited a doctor since my childwood
Just do it now. He will probably tell you this is just withdrawal syndrome symptoms.
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It gets better ... I promise. Give it some time ... Probably a few months. Stick with it ... Quitting smoking is VERY hard. It took me a long time and many attempts. Mark Twain said it well ... Paraphrasing ... "quitting smoking is one of the easiest things I have ever done - I've done it thousands of times!"
When I used to smoke I used to drink a coffee or espresso with almost every cigarette ... There is a cross tolerance between caffeine and nicotine. Now that I no longer smoke at all, I find I consume FAR less coffee - but I still drink it.
Your body is used to processing poison. It is a bit of a shock to stop pushing so many toxins around and your body will react in funny ways ... Your brain will also try and trick you into smoking again.
Find a healthier distraction ... I used lolipops ...
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Many thanks guys.
Yeah Jeremy, I'm with you on your description. I've noticed that the brain tries to fool me and let me think that if I smoke back like before, the bad symptoms will disapear.
But in fact it seems that the cure is starting first with not very funny moment.
I'm sticking with it.
Best regards.
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Can't help with the smoking part Fred seeing that I smoke and only once tried to give up and gave up on giving up since then. I had a simmilar experience when I gave up drinking Coca-Cola during the day though. Used consume about four litres of the stuff daily and always wondered why I had no energy in the evenings. An athlete described to me one day why I had the problem with Coke and started drinking bottled water and fruit juice- had a serious reaction to it for a few weeks ( headaches and the like as you describe) but lost 15kg's.
I still drink Coke though, but only because rum isn't drinkable with anything else. Thank heavens I don't drink coffee, it's an addiction all by itself.
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I used to smoke quite a lot, as did my father-in-law. He owned an office building and I had a top apartment as my first studio, and his own offices were ground floor. He used to come on up and see me now and again, just to see how business was going - save his daughter's neck, more like it - and he thought he'd like to stop smoking. I thought about that, about the way I used to light one just before starting a long run of prints that I couldn't stop working with with wet hands... so those cigs would burn right down to my lips, fill my eyes with tears of both smoke and pain, and then I'd finally poison myself with developer/fixer fingers when I couldn't take any more. Then the long time spent spotting ash marks on those bloody prints from the same messy cloud at the enlarger...
At the same time, my wife's uncle died of throat cancer.
I noticed that I used to get regular sore throats; I'd stop for two weeks or so and feel fine. Then I'd start the entire cycle all over again.
My father-in-law's wish to stop seemed a good idea. We made a bet for more money than I wanted to lose about who'd give up first. We both kicked it!
Drinking. I hardly drank at all in Scotland - it was too risky because as a one-man-band, I was as vulnerable as a taxi driver to the result of losing a driving licence. But, once we came to live in Spain, it all changed. That was totally inevitable because of the social life out here. G&Ts became very pleasant to have at around 11am with something nice to chew; invitations to pre-lunch cocktails would wipe one out until late afternoon. And I was supposed still to be working. We eventually gave up the social whirl but still killed a minimum of a bottle of chilled white every lunchtime and the best part of another at night. As one would, when one could... could, because along came a heart attack and I was told that a single glass of red, which neither of us liked much, was my limit because of the effect of alcohol on the heart. Apparently, the red contains anti-oxidants that help cleanse the blood, but more than one glass goes the other way and causes more direct problems than it solves.
Coffee. That, too, was limited to a single cup a day. Until my next attack, I obeyed it all religiously. Then, after that, I lost my wife, and now, though I still stay within the restrictions regarding wine, coffee – decaffed – has become maybe four cups a day minimum. And I’m not giving it up, either. Why? Because I feel precious little wish to knock myself stupid with alcohol and lose even more of the day than I do now to housework, but as far as the coffee goes, it takes me out into local café/bars and life. I see and chat with folks on a superficial level and as best I can in Spanitaliano and we get along just fine. If I take that away from the total act, then I may as well save everybody a lot of time and let the kids inherit tomorrow.
But Fred, the body is always changing. My wife seldom ever had even a cold – but that didn’t save her. I was always sniffing in winter, but the worst flu’ I ever had was after I was shamed into having an anti-flu’ jag one year! Never again! Light heads?… join the club; fainting in restaurants? - I have a record now. Hard to hold focus when using a viewfinder? Talk to me.
And you know what - losing my wife stopped me having any fear of death. I still fear pain and possibly being incapacitated, of course, but when your life’s already pretty well effed’ why would you care anymore?
In the end, the older I get, the more I believe that it’s all mapped out for you before you pop out into this world. I look around at some of the useless people that I know who have become so successful, and I see no other explanation.
Rob C
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Well, I've been a semi heavy smoker (1 and a half packs a day) for 15 years, there was a period, about 2 years ago, that I tried to quit smoking, and have to tell you, I felt horrible, besides the anxiety, I started to have head aches and also caught the flu two times in that period, when before that I've only have like 1 cold a year at the most. The final of the story was me going back to smoking and ever since then everything is ok. I know I should quit, that at some point I'm going to end up with lung or some type of cancer, but the truth is, that's the last thing on my mind.
The same happened when tried to reduce the coffee, I usually get around 7 or 8 cups a day on a regular basis, sometimes even more.
This you are experiencing may be your body adapting to the new scenario, and only that, if you want to keep it this way just give it some time for your body to settle.
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A friend in the 1960s smoked like a chimney. Next thing you know, he was in the hospital, diagnosed with Type 1 diabetes. Smoking wasn't the cause, but he decided one strike was enough and took in smoking money and bought a nice camera which he shot until recently. In the mean time, his wife at the time continued to smoke for the next 25 years. First, she lost half her jaw, then part of the esophagus, then her life...
In the mean time, my friend is doing well and is fairly healthy now in his 80s. All the money he saved not smoking bought the camera, film, traveling and a lot of enjoyment and so far, a long life.
However if you are in California, please keep smoking. It helps save the children through the tax revenue and "big brother" programs (let Uncle taxpayer raise your children;-) and keeps the tax man out of my pocket, LOL!
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I smoked up to 3 packs of cigs a day (Camel filters, and also liked to roll my own with Three Castles, Drum and some other more exotic stuff) and also drank pots of coffee daily. I quit smoking “cold turkey,” as they say back in the summer of 1992, and never looked back.
The consequence was that I suffered from chronic fatigue for the longest time and had some of the problems you mentioned. I started walking daily (still do) and greatly reduced my caffeine intake by about 75% initially and it has gone mostly down since then. Currently I have about a cup or two o’joe week. It *really* wires you if you don’t drink it daily.
If I had it to do again, I would have quit smoking as I did but used something like a nicotine patch to help re-acclimate myself to lower levels of stimulants. That would have made it easier. There are a wide variety of options for aiding this process.
Your body has acclimated to the stimulants and so it’s used to getting is fix. It is complaining and maybe malfunctioning a little because it’s not getting what it wants.
I encourage you to contact a health care provider. It can be a doc (MD), nurse practitioner (ARNP), physician’s assistant (PA). These are titles known in the US; other places probably have different titles. Any of them can give you guidance and may suggest some goodies to help safely detox yourself.
Doctors really are excellent resources to be taken advantage of. Many people dislike going to them and some fear them. It is important to get over any objections you have. Docs can be a great aid during this process and everyone can benefit from an occasional blood test to make sure that everything is working okay.
Congratulations on putting a handicap behind you and in doing so you have gifted yourself the single best thing you can do to insure greater health and longevity!!!
Quitting is very difficult and you owe it to yourself to give yourself the best opportunity at success. It gets easier but probably not noticeably easier for a couple of weeks or so. Walking really, really helps. I started with 15 minutes a day and worked up from there.
Hang I there!
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Thank you all so much for your testimonials.
It's been really informative and helpfull.
After reading you, it gives me root for keeping my decision and accept the body symptoms as part of the process.
I'm very thankfull you took the time to share your experiences.
Best regards.
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Thank you all so much for your testimonials.
It's been really informative and helpfull.
After reading you, it gives me root for keeping my decision and accept the body symptoms as part of the process.
I'm very thankfull you took the time to share your experiences.
Best regards.
Still see a medico first, Fred; don't diagnose yourself or from websites.
Rob C
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Fred, smoking cigarettes is an unmitigated1 evil, for you and for those around you. I applaud your attempt to give up and I wish you well. I'm sure you'll feel much better in the long run.
A quick trip to a doctor for confirmation that all is as to be expected wouldn't hurt, though. I agree entirely with Rob that getting medical help from web sites (particularly photography web sites!) is a sub-optimal idea.
I'd be much more relaxed about coffee-drinking, though.
Jeremy
1unless you have one particular nasty bowel condition, which there is, or used to be, some evidence it assisted
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Of course, I didn't pretend getting a medical diagnostic from a website. But simply that people who have been through the process could share their experiences.
Best regards.
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Fred, I smoked for 38 years, starting when I was sixteen. Toward the end I decided to stop by switching to snuff. Went around with a wad of the stuff stuffed under my lip until my dentist told me my mouth was becoming pre-cancerous. Actually, I think my wife conned him into saying that, though he was heavily disposed in that direction before she said anything to him. Then I had to face the music and quit. I think I was getting an even bigger nicotine jolt from the snuff than I ever got from a cigarette or a pipe or a cigar, all of which I inhaled. Quitting was agony. Three years later I was still dreaming about smoking. But having that monkey off my back, finally, was worth the agony.
Get with an MD and find a way to struggle through the withdrawal. Believe me, my friend, it's worth it.
But enjoy your coffee. That's one thing I never backed away from, though I'll never go back to the kind of coffee I used to get near dawn on midnight shift at a radar site.
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I would characterize myself as a "recovering smoker." I still sometimes feel the urge for a cigarette, especially with coffee, even more than 15 years after quitting a 1 1/2 to 2 pack a day habit. I haven't slipped once, despite a nasty divorce after 21 years of marriage (this was after quitting, no connection!), two years later the collapse of a long term relationship - begun AFTER the divorce, no connection - coincidental with job loss.
A chest x-ray a few years ago was clear. I think I've dodged the bullet.
Please see a doctor. While you've never felt the need for one, as we grow older things change. Some of the symptoms you mention may be related to lowered nicotine intake, but perhaps not, and they should be evalutated.
I had good success using nicotine patches. As you probably know they feed a decreasing dosage of nicotine so that one can concentrate on finding some safer form of oral gratification. I found munching carrots and other crisp veggies useful, YMMV. A friend would fondle a rolled up piece of paper, about the size of a cig. No one expects you to handle this without a crutch, why should you expect it of yourself? There are groups analogous to Alcoholics Anonymous; while I didn't use them I imagine they could be really valuable. http://www.nicotine-anonymous.org/
Give yourself a break! Work on one habit at a time. While caffeine is habit forming, it is no where as addictive as nicotine, which I've heard is more habit-forming than any other drug. Give yourself a reward! Here in Georgia cigs are close to $4.00 per pack! At your stated 3 - 4 packs a day that's what, $84.00 per week? Buy some film, donate to the American Cancer Society! :)
I lost a dear friend and professional colleague to lung cancer a couple years ago. She died about 2 weeks after her 60th birthday. While she was lucid to the last, the chemo courses had reduced her to a wraith, her hair was gone, as were her strength and vitality. She accepted her responsibilty for 40 years of smoking and died at peace, but she should have had many more years. We all miss her.
Don't end up a fond memory. Keep at it.
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Russ, yes, I've kept one or 2 real coffees per day.
Like the one you described. I remember being in a radar air force station for a few days, in the countryside (the Landes forest). It was magic at night. I can picture your feelings perfectly.
In fact I've also been under heavy stress-pressure with motion to catch-up in small time and spent too much hours-day in front of the screens those lastest months. I just bought now glasses for that purpose and headhaches have disappeared as soon as they came. Too much excess of everything (except sex!!) in a short time.
Then, I didn't have any cough at all before quiting, nor previous breathe problems. I called a doctor and talked to my natural food supplier who also quitted and those are fortunatly very common symptoms.
Some people have had them for about 6 months.
It seems that the mistake I'm making is not quiting totally directly. Doctor explained me that when you decide to reduce drastically to a few, but not quit totally, the symptoms are way worsed and last longuer.
If you quit totally, it's in fact easier. I didn't know it.
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I conducted quit smoking classes for the Am. Cancer Soc. for a number or years. The symptoms you described are almost universal, starting within a day or two of quitting. The hacking cough is mostly due to the throat and lung tissues trying to break up the tar and other chemical coating the breathing system. The brain, being the devious organ it is, uses those symtoms and many others to convince you that all would be better by replenishing its daily doses. There are thousands of rationalizations to smoking. Any bodily affliction you suffer for months after quitting will be blamed by your nicotine-starved brain on quitting its supply. You've already discovered many such attempts to get you back using. As your abstinence continues many more will pop up. Just recognize them for what they are.
One of my close friends quit smoking about 20 years ago. Several times a year, usually after dinner, I ask him why his fingers are fishing around in his shirt pocket. I ask him about it several minutes after the action and he swears he didn't reach into that pocket. Since our wives are usually watching this behavior unfold he can't deny the habitual behavior even after 20 years time.
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Nicotine triggers release of endorphins...
Nicotine triggers dopamine release. It also disables the body's ability to create dopamine, so that lacking the nicotine responsible for the dopamine boost,,,we get very little of this feel good chemical.
I speak as a fifty year smoker who's not in the mood to quit just now.
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Well, I can only assume, then, that quitting ciggies is different for different folks!
Once I discovered fear, it was the easiest thing, and I hate the very smell of a smokey room. Fortunately, Spain has finally banned smoking in bars - there was, for a brief while, the pathetic spectacle of people rushing outside mid-meal for a quick drag at their habit... now, even that seems largely to have drifted away. I think that many who did it were reacting to something they imagined they would feel driven to do, rather than their actually having to do it. Or simply doing/enjoying some street theatre of their own making ;-)
As has been said, the mind plays funny games with the body. I have actually had dreams where I was smoking again, could taste the horrid taste of tobacco on my tongue, and I was asking myself why the hell I was doing it again. The relief of waking up to a clean reality was enormous!
As for sex... what's that, Fred?
Rob C
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I was a 2-pack a day menthol smoker for 15+ years, quit cold turkey - and yeah it sucked, took weeks to really even the body out. Hang in there!!
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Fred
The symptoms that you describe are in fact completely normal. I would advise that you get some nicotine patches, start using them and quit actual smoking altogether. Every time in the past that I tried to quit smoking the withdrawal symptoms would wear me down and in the end I would start again. About 7 months ago, after fifty years of smoking, I stopped again. This time I had quite a good incentive.
Just as I was coming up towards retirement, in late April, I coughed up some phlegm and spat it into the kitchen sink (by pure chance). There was just a trace of blood in it. The next day there was a little more, so I got concerned enough to book an appointment with my doctor. The day after that there was just a trace again, and the next day it was clear – I felt perfectly fit and well so I nearly didn’t bother to go to the appointment. It was just as well that I did. The doctor sent me for a chest X-ray, which didn’t really show anything much, but he still wasn’t happy and sent me to the specialist at Treliske Hospital, a nice chap called Simon Iles. A week later, after a CT scan, I was diagnosed with lung cancer. After another two weeks and a PET scan in Plymouth, it was active lung cancer. This, as I am sure you know, is very bad news indeed.
Fortunately, the scans showed that I had just the one tumour, low down in the RH lung, so it could be tackled with surgery. However, until they had me opened up nobody could say with any certainty whether the cancer had spread into the rest of my body or not. I was booked in to Derriford hospital for the op at the end of June. While all this was going on I was in the middle of my retirement leaving presentation etc and not really able to talk to anyone about it. Very stressful. So I was retired for a month, which I spent manically gardening because I knew I would not be able to for quite some time after the op, and then into Derriford Thoracic Unit. The surgery went very well (I have a huge scar) and I came home after only 10 days but then had quite a rough time trying to cope as best I could (I was not allowed to drive for 8 weeks which made life difficult). After five months, I am returning more or less to normal. So now (after thoracotomy and lobectomy in technical speak) I have one-and-a-half lungs instead of two.
At first I was not allowed to lift any weights at all or do any kind of heavy activity. Now I can lift up to 5 kg and do gentle gardening and light activities. After January I should be more or less OK if I am sensible about working it up gently. I have been doing a lot of walking which is good for the healing process, but at first any sort of hill was pretty scary. I am getting better at the hills now, with persistence, but of course I will never be as fit as I was. The good news is that both my follow-up appointments so far have given me the all-clear, but I have to go back at intervals for five years. The bad news is that of course the cancer can recur or pop-up somewhere else, but the post-op biopsy showed that the tumour had remained localised and had not spread into the surrounding tissues, so thank heaven for that.
So, as you can imagine, I have not had much of a chance to think about retirement or how I might spend it, or what I might be doing or who it might be nice to do it with. I have just been coping with events, really. The moral of this tale is that smoking is not too great an idea – but I guess we always knew that, didn’t we? Fred, I wish you all the very best in quitting smoking. Never imagine that it will be easy, it will probably be one of the hardest tasks you have ever set yourself, even with the support of family and friends. Even with the excellent incentive of death staring me in the face, I still found it terrifyingly hard to quit. And I am still very shaky about staying clear of tobacco in the long-term.
John
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there was, for a brief while, the pathetic spectacle of people rushing outside mid-meal for a quick drag at their habit... now, even that seems largely to have drifted away.
That's still happening. In this year's Christmas lunch at work, when the whole department share a table in a restaurant for one day and after meal conversation lasts a bit longer than usual, I recall seeing two of my mates (both girls aged 26-29) rushing outside for their dose.
I have spoken several times to one of them about quitting smoking (I understand some people smoke; after all the drug has been offered to us for years, legally, at affordable prices and even socially accepted. But I have problems to understand smokers not trying to quit such a disgusting habit once they are grown up), and I was surprised at her answer: 'it is not yet the time now'.
I answered: 'you are 29, young, you have a boyfriend and live happy with him. Even in the middle of this crisis both of you have well paid and stable jobs, no children to feed yet, a good mortgage totally under control [his bf works in a bank and gets very low interest rates], your only worry is to play the videoconsole at weekends and properly match your summer holidays, and you claim it is not yet the time. So I wonder: when will it be the time?'
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Thank you so much again for all your testimonials and particularly the lovely human side that's been expressed all along this thread.
I've been learning a lot.
John, yes I remember you mentionned at one point that you had to have a surgery, I ignored it was relationated with this topic. I join my wishes with Keith's on your recovery.
It seems that it's very important to avoid stress, bad thinkings and worries in the recovery process.
Today I've also learned, or re-learned, something really key about mind power. I was in a terrasse this mid-day next to my home and I was feeling terrible, like my head was about to explode because of pressure and my heart was beating very strong. I got-up, walked immediatly very pissed-off to the healph care center. They checked me and took my pressure and cardiac pulse, everything was...just perfect. In fact, it has never been as good. I felt confunded because I was so sure that it was horribly bad. I felt it...but what I was feeling was in fact stress and worries into the process, in other words, an ilusion. (those ilusions mind can create, if repeted and beleived could by the way become more real, so it's important to distinguish)
I went back home, immediatly after receiving the news that it was all right, I was feeling good and symptoms disappeared just like that. Mind is really, I mean really, key. Well directed, it should be of an incredible power.
I'm convinced that if the mind is capable to fool ourselves and drive us to wrong or dangerous paths, it's also on the other way, possible to take posession of it and directing it to do the exactly opposite.
The little today's anecdote reminded me this known fact in a clear and straingforward form.
Thanks for all the kind words and again, best luck to John and to all Lu-La members who are facing serious issues in their lifes at the moment.
Best regards.
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At first I was not allowed to lift any weights at all or do any kind of heavy activity. Now I can lift up to 5 kg and do gentle gardening and light activities. After January I should be more or less OK if I am sensible about working it up gently. I have been doing a lot of walking which is good for the healing process, but at first any sort of hill was pretty scary. I am getting better at the hills now, with persistence, but of course I will never be as fit as I was. John
Hey, you kept that very private; I don't know if to praise you for it, or to admonish you for not having out with it and giving your fellow LuLanders a chance to give you some moral support. Guess we all react differently in these moments - but regardless, I wish you the very best of luck, my man.
The exercise thing is a bit strange. My own problems have been heart, which is obviously something else, and the advice there was to take as much exercise as I could - a minimum of about an hour's walking a day.
When I first came out of hospital I could hardly make fifteen to twenty minute walks. Then, over time, I got back to pretty normal. However, at my last visit to the cardio six months ago, I mentioned that I was able to walk up steep hills with few problems; I expected a sweet, but got a metaphorical kick up the ass instead! He was horrified: gently is the way to go, apparently, with tickers, gently but for as long as you can do it. Now I know. If he’s right.
Again - best of luck and stick with the photography; it’s a great calmer – far better than noxious weeds! It has certainly helped make my life more bearable these past few years.
Ciao –
Rob C
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John, I know our federal government might object, but I'll pray for you. Hang in there, walk a lot slowly, and get back up to speed.
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all of your words have made me rethink about my bad habits, I'll give it another try on quit smoking, start with less cigarettes a day and so on, coffee, well I can't promise about that, :)
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As I recall the stop smoking statistics, for most smokers it took three to four serious attempts to quit before success. "Serious" didn't mean trying to cut down gradually or just attending a stop-smoking class with intent to quit at some later time. It took the realization that the person was fully determined to break the habit and the related days, weeks, or months of cold turkey abstinence. Some have been successful with patches, hypnosis, or the rapid tapering off of tobacco use. But, by far, the most successful quitters are those that got off the nicotine for long chunks of time. And if they relapsed, they immediately quit again--even after only one cigarette. That's the kind of determination that's need in most cases. If anyone is interested, I'll list lots of pitfalls to quitting and some positive ideas.
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When I quit, my wife and the sixteen people who were working for me all had decided to quit at the same time. It was quite an experiment. Many of us were permanent quitters, a few gave up.
Personally, I still, after 40 years, occasionally dream about smoking, but, come morning, realize that it is all for the better.
We are quite thankful that most European countries have started anti-smoking campaigns. It make traveling there much more comfortable and enjoyable.
Alan
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Fred
The symptoms that you describe are in fact completely normal. I would advise that you get some nicotine patches, start using them and quit actual smoking altogether. Every time in the past that I tried to quit smoking the withdrawal symptoms would wear me down and in the end I would start again. About 7 months ago, after fifty years of smoking, I stopped again. This time I had quite a good incentive.
Just as I was coming up towards retirement, in late April, I coughed up some phlegm and spat it into the kitchen sink (by pure chance). There was just a trace of blood in it. The next day there was a little more, so I got concerned enough to book an appointment with my doctor. The day after that there was just a trace again, and the next day it was clear – I felt perfectly fit and well so I nearly didn’t bother to go to the appointment. It was just as well that I did. The doctor sent me for a chest X-ray, which didn’t really show anything much, but he still wasn’t happy and sent me to the specialist at Treliske Hospital, a nice chap called Simon Iles. A week later, after a CT scan, I was diagnosed with lung cancer. After another two weeks and a PET scan in Plymouth, it was active lung cancer. This, as I am sure you know, is very bad news indeed.
Fortunately, the scans showed that I had just the one tumour, low down in the RH lung, so it could be tackled with surgery. However, until they had me opened up nobody could say with any certainty whether the cancer had spread into the rest of my body or not. I was booked in to Derriford hospital for the op at the end of June. While all this was going on I was in the middle of my retirement leaving presentation etc and not really able to talk to anyone about it. Very stressful. So I was retired for a month, which I spent manically gardening because I knew I would not be able to for quite some time after the op, and then into Derriford Thoracic Unit. The surgery went very well (I have a huge scar) and I came home after only 10 days but then had quite a rough time trying to cope as best I could (I was not allowed to drive for 8 weeks which made life difficult). After five months, I am returning more or less to normal. So now (after thoracotomy and lobectomy in technical speak) I have one-and-a-half lungs instead of two.
At first I was not allowed to lift any weights at all or do any kind of heavy activity. Now I can lift up to 5 kg and do gentle gardening and light activities. After January I should be more or less OK if I am sensible about working it up gently. I have been doing a lot of walking which is good for the healing process, but at first any sort of hill was pretty scary. I am getting better at the hills now, with persistence, but of course I will never be as fit as I was. The good news is that both my follow-up appointments so far have given me the all-clear, but I have to go back at intervals for five years. The bad news is that of course the cancer can recur or pop-up somewhere else, but the post-op biopsy showed that the tumour had remained localised and had not spread into the surrounding tissues, so thank heaven for that.
So, as you can imagine, I have not had much of a chance to think about retirement or how I might spend it, or what I might be doing or who it might be nice to do it with. I have just been coping with events, really. The moral of this tale is that smoking is not too great an idea – but I guess we always knew that, didn’t we? Fred, I wish you all the very best in quitting smoking. Never imagine that it will be easy, it will probably be one of the hardest tasks you have ever set yourself, even with the support of family and friends. Even with the excellent incentive of death staring me in the face, I still found it terrifyingly hard to quit. And I am still very shaky about staying clear of tobacco in the long-term.
John
This looks much like my father's history.
An avid smoker (1 or 2 packs per day) for most of his life, until some phlegm with traces of blood frightened him, and he abruptly stopped smoking, finally; that was about five or ten years ago. Then, he was x-rayed last November, because of a cough that was taking too long to recover; it was indeed just a cough, it went away as it it came in, and he feels perfect now... but there was that little spot on the x-ray, that worried the doctor, and turned to be lung cancer. Luckily, it seems to be very localized, he will have half his lung removed by he end of this month, and doctors have hight hopes to put and end to it with that.
Thanks for sharing.
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Well, I can only speak for myself, of course, but the only way to quit is totally, the act based on the very real fear of needless death. It also helps to realise that the start of the addiction came from nothing more pathetic than wanting to appear older and tougher than the fifteen years of age that I was. Sad. And expensive.
I see patches and all that shit as just that: more commercial exploitation based on the wish for a pretend, easy way out. Man, just DO IT!
Rob C
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Well, I can only speak for myself, of course, but the only way to quit is totally, the act based on the very real fear of needless death. It also helps to realise that the start of the addiction came from nothing more pathetic than wanting to appear older and tougher than the fifteen years of age that I was. Sad. And expensive.
I see patches and all that shit as just that: more commercial exploitation based on the wish for a pretend, easy way out. Man, just DO IT!
Rob C
+1
I finally quit cold turkey after way too many years of smoking 8 years ago. I just hope I keep it that way. I relapsed many years ago after being smoke free for 5 years. Cigs are the devils drug.
Cold turkey and sheer will power...you must REALLY want to quit to succeed.
What worked for me, a small whiteboard that I updated every day....x days without a smoke. It was really helpful for me to see the progress and a good deterrent to staying smoke free. I would have hated to see that number of days go back to 1
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As several have stated will power is needed to quit smoking. As a "recovering smoker" I don't see anything wrong with using the nicotine patch, gum, whatever! to make a difficult task just a little bit easier. In this struggle there is no place for macho machochism. There is no "right" way to quit! Pragmatism rules in this contest. Whatever gets you though it successfully is the right avenue for you.
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Don't see it as any form of macho masochism at all; see it as realisation that Death is standing, key in hand, outside the door. Some think there's mileage in toys and self-deception. I think not - I think you get your chance and you have to take it. Live or die; it's your funeral.
Rob C
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Smoked a lot between the age of 16 and 25. One day, during my internship (am a MD but don't practice) in ER, I was called for a woman with acute respiratory distress. It turned out it was my mother. Don't remember if I smoked that night, but I quit the next day. The first 36 hours were horrible, abdominal cramps, the sensation I was about to implode, etc... Then it was over as suddenly as it came. Unfortunately, I started again 20 years later, by accident. I know I should stop, I hope I still can, but I can't push myself hard enough.
BTW, between the age of 40 and 45, I became a health maniac: I rode bicycles for thousands of miles every year, at the decent average speed of 20 miles per hour. I monitored my performance, heart rate, watts produced, and pedaling rythm for years and compiled so much data that I could recognize the course I was cycling simply by looking at the charts of my heart rate on the PC. As soon as I started smoking, a single cigarette per day at first, then three, my stats collapsed. After 3 months, I had lost what I had gained in two years by training. Today, I am back to square one.
My very lame advice (it worked once, but as I said I can't push myself to do it right now) is to plan a few days where you will not be confronted to your normal life's issues, keep yourself busy with a new demanding task that's not associated in any way with smoking. Drink a lot of water and keep a liquorice stick in your mouth.
Good luck! (et courage!)
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Hi guys, this is I think the appropriate forum for this topic.
I'd like to have, if there are some here in Lu-La, former heavy smokers testimonials.
The short story is this:
I've been a heavy smoker (2 - 3 packs a day) for more than 20 years and a serious coffee drinker too.
I've never visited a doctor since my childwood, not ill one time. Not kidding.
Recently I've decided to stop coffees and passed from at least 60 cigaretes a day to 5 - 6, not because I was ill but, you know, because
I was thinking that this crazy consumming would end to kill me although I was perfectly fine.
And then problems started to araise just coinciding with the period I stopped. Instead of feeling better, the body's reaction has suddenly turned crazy:
low pressure, cardiac rythm suddenly unstable, low, then high, headaches (never happened to me in the past), sensation of breathing worse, lack of concentration, and I'm starting to catch colds easily...
I also had sort of dizziness sensations that come and go from time to time, and a form of anguish.
I'm really having bad time those days, and my social life is affected; it's not my style to complain or feeling physically bad, but the sensation in fact is that it seems that when I decided to take care of my healph, the worse I'm feeling !
If you've been a serious smoker in the past, I'd like to hear from your experience.
Thanks.
My father had the same symptoms 15 years ago when he wanted to quit. Finally he concluded that he couldn't give up smoking. He died last year (lung cancer) 4 weeks after I photographed his and my sister's father-daughter dance at her wedding. I remember that I was crying behind the camera. He had prayed to be able to be at her wedding. Sorry to be brutal! Quit today!!!
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My father had the same symptoms 15 years ago when he wanted to quit. Finally he concluded that he couldn't give up smoking. He died last year (lung cancer) 4 weeks after I photographed his and my sister's father-daughter dance at her wedding. I remember that I was crying behind the camera. He had prayed to be able to be at her wedding. Sorry to be brutal! Quit today!!!
I hope I wasn't too harsh. I just miss my father.
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As a recovering smoker who used the perscription patch some 13 years ago to quit - so far, so good -
I was reminded of this thread by a New York Times story: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/10/health/study-finds-nicotine-gum-and-patches-dont-help-smokers-quit.html?ref=health
My interpretation of the story is that the OTC patches aren't effective in the long run, with or without counselling. Patient non-compliance is cited as a possible reason. I wonder if the study includes the earlier perscription patches, which at least in theory were tailored to the patient. Those patches also weren't covered by insurance (at least not my insurance) and they weren't cheap, so the patient had more skin in the game. Since a doctor's visit and a drugstore purchase were needed, perhaps we felt that others were watching, thus there was some peer pressure.
Anyone out there with other thoughts?
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As a recovering smoker who used the perscription patch some 13 years ago to quit - so far, so good -
I was reminded of this thread by a New York Times story: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/10/health/study-finds-nicotine-gum-and-patches-dont-help-smokers-quit.html?ref=health
My interpretation of the story is that the OTC patches aren't effective in the long run, with or without counselling. Patient non-compliance is cited as a possible reason. I wonder if the study includes the earlier perscription patches, which at least in theory were tailored to the patient. Those patches also weren't covered by insurance (at least not my insurance) and they weren't cheap, so the patient had more skin in the game. Since a doctor's visit and a drugstore purchase were needed, perhaps we felt that others were watching, thus there was some peer pressure.
Anyone out there with other thoughts?
Yes, Nike. Just do it.
Rob C
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I think that all the discussions about the most/least effective means to quit often is a nicotine-brain excuse to put off the actual quitting. Remember, the brain is addicted to the stimulation nicotine delivers and will do nearly anything to defeat your efforts. Just don't put it off. Quit now for two hours. Then quit again for three hours. Then for a day. Two days. Etc. Learn to laugh at what your brain concocts as excuses to go back. It can be amazingly creative. Once you know its tricks for what they actually are you won't be as easily fooled.
A few tips to help you quit:
1. Quit drinking. Brains love quitters to drink. So much easier for it to get its way.
2. Replace the 1st cig of the day with a decent breakfast. That's to replace the stimulation of nicotine your brain craves with a slower, but effective supply of energy.
3. Don't socialize with smokers for awhile. Their brains also have a vested interest in seeing you fail.
4. Replace "I'm trying to quit" with "I don't smoke" or "I don't smoke anymore". See #3 above.
5. Realize that virtually no tobacco executives smoke and their marketing efforts are the best ever devised.
6. Calculate the actual yearly (non-health) costs to you of smoking. Cost of tobacco plus additional health/life insurance premiums. Then pick out a nice gift to yourself or your family you can now afford after six months or a year.
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I think that all the discussions about the most/least effective means to quit often is a nicotine-brain excuse to put off the actual quitting. Remember, the brain is addicted to the stimulation nicotine delivers and will do nearly anything to defeat your efforts. Just don't put it off. Quit now for two hours. Then quit again for three hours. Then for a day. Two days. Etc. Learn to laugh at what your brain concocts as excuses to go back. It can be amazingly creative. Once you know its tricks for what they actually are you won't be as easily fooled.
A few tips to help you quit:
1. Quit drinking. Brains love quitters to drink. So much easier for it to get its way.
2. Replace the 1st cig of the day with a decent breakfast. That's to replace the stimulation of nicotine your brain craves with a slower, but effective supply of energy.
3. Don't socialize with smokers for awhile. Their brains also have a vested interest in seeing you fail.
4. Replace "I'm trying to quit" with "I don't smoke" or "I don't smoke anymore". See #3 above.
5. Realize that virtually no tobacco executives smoke and their marketing efforts are the best ever devised.
6. Calculate the actual yearly (non-health) costs to you of smoking. Cost of tobacco plus additional health/life insurance premiums. Then pick out a nice gift to yourself or your family you can now afford after six months or a year.
You could add point no.7: bad breath. It repels people.
Rob C
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I still drink Coke though, but only because rum isn't drinkable with anything else. Thank heavens I don't drink coffee, it's an addiction all by itself.
I drink Mt Gay with water, raw or brown sugar, and a squeeze of lime (no, lemon does not work); you can even stick in a sprig of mint if you are trying to impress somebody! Buy one or two bottles a year. Don’t try this with low-grade rum. $2.50 Orstralian chardonnay is however my particular bête noir!
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I still drink Coke though, but only because rum isn't drinkable with anything else. Thank heavens I don't drink coffee, it's an addiction all by itself.
Hmmm... according to the guy in the bar at the Bacardi factory some years ago (unless I remember wrongly), cola is an insult to Bacardi; at the very most (he said), use tonic. (I had better write cola for obvious marketing reasons and just in case my memory of the incident was indeed flawed.)
I learned from experiment that a BeeGee is very nice, too, especially with Bacardi Gold. That's a Bacardi-and-ginger. Damn, wish I hadn't found Medium's post - reminds me of what I miss! I also learned from experience that if Gold is unobtainable at a handy supplier near you, you can manufacture it yourself in the average man's kitchen: simply mix in some brown sugar or treacle. I suppose that the brown sugar will be the more readily available option for that average man.
Rob C (in forced abstinence)
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You could add point no.7: bad breath. It repels people.
Rob C
I was on a bus last week when a chap in his 20s got on and sat behind me. The tobacco reek was enough for me to change my seat.
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I was on a bus last week when a chap in his 20s got on and sat behind me. The tobacco reek was enough for me to change my seat.
I believe you. I almost gave up my favourite bar where I dined most lunchtimes because of that. Trouble was, before they banned it in bars totally, there was no practical choice: it was the same everywhere. I even began to sit by open windows where the draught was chilling the food. Now, that bar has changed hands and the new broom has swept not so much clean as poor, I never go there now. Amazing how someone can take over a popular place and, because they want to up their market a bit, they lose the clients that already existed. In this particular case, the problem was that the new owner was a younger, business girl and not a real cook. The prices remained much the same, but the quality dived even though everything looks prettier. You can`t eat through your eyes alone...
On the bright side, such experiences have made me learn to cook a lot better than I could before.
No, I don't want to run a bar! I promise!
Rob C
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(snip)
The prices remained much the same, but the quality dived even though everything looks prettier. You can`t eat through your eyes alone...
On the bright side, such experiences have made me learn to cook a lot better than I could before.
No, I don't want to run a bar! I promise!
Rob C
I remember a restaurant in the small West Virginia town where my father was professor of chemical engineering. The place had been in operation for many years and had a good clientele. The food was uniformly good; the pies were phenomonal, the best I've ever had in any restaurant. The proprietor decided to sell. The new owners closed the restaurant for "remodelling." When it reopened in three months the cook and most of the other staff had either left or been "let go."
The result was yet another "chi-chi" place with ferns everwhere, and barely adequate food. Former clientele gave it a try, but...there were other choices. The "new look" lasted maybe six months.
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On the bright side, such experiences have made me learn to cook a lot better than I could before.
I learned to cook early, as Ms Right never appeared. There were a few Ms Near Enough/Perhaps Nots.
No, I don't want to run a bar! I promise!
Let me know if you change your mind, and I’ll be over there in a flash to have a couple with you! Costa Del Plenty? ;D
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I learned to cook early, as Ms Right never appeared. There were a few Ms Near Enough/Perhaps Nots.
Let me know if you change your mind, and I’ll be over there in a flash to have a couple with you! Costa Del Plenty? ;D
Running bars in Spain has been a short, sharp, expensive lesson for many expats here; it takes a hell of a lot of determination, capital, charm and willingness to work into the wee wee hours for it to succeed. Many thought it a quick route to becoming millionaires: to them, I recommend Euromilliones, which I still try...
Transfer of ownership is an ongoing business here: one guy takes on the lease and when he fails he tries to pass it on to the next chap in the queue; sometimes, they just do an undignified runner, hours before the heavy squad calls to say hello...
It seem to me to be a paradox: folks (foreigners) come here to enjoy the difference; why would they want to feel 'at home' when they go out for a drink? Rather negates all that travel, I'd have thought. Yet, scores of them do: always at least one bar where all the voices are a variation on English; how effing sad is that?
Rob C
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It seem to me to be a paradox: folks (foreigners) come here to enjoy the difference; why would they want to feel 'at home' when they go out for a drink? Rather negates all that travel, I'd have thought. Yet, scores of them do: always at least one bar where all the voices are a variation on English; how effing sad is that?
Rob C
So long as it’s not full of Ocker expats drinking VB (yuck). Apparently parts of Asia (particularly Philippines) are full of Aussies gone native, enjoying both the exchange rate and local ladies. A new colonialism.
Give me a Singha (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singha) over almost any Australian lager. James Squire (http://www.maltshovel.com.au/#/ageVerify/) is good though, and a few boutique breweries.
But the *home away from home* syndrome is an ancient one: imagine a Roman lady wanting to check out quaint local handicrafts in Britannia, while her husband tries to find somewhere to have a decent red wine or three, and not have to deal with primitives! Of course, this was never possible in Caledonia! :D
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I think that all the discussions about the most/least effective means to quit often is a nicotine-brain excuse to put off the actual quitting. Remember, the brain is addicted to the stimulation nicotine delivers and will do nearly anything to defeat your efforts. Just don't put it off. Quit now for two hours. Then quit again for three hours. Then for a day. Two days. Etc. Learn to laugh at what your brain concocts as excuses to go back. It can be amazingly creative. Once you know its tricks for what they actually are you won't be as easily fooled.
A few tips to help you quit:
1. Quit drinking. Brains love quitters to drink. So much easier for it to get its way.
2. Replace the 1st cig of the day with a decent breakfast. That's to replace the stimulation of nicotine your brain craves with a slower, but effective supply of energy.
3. Don't socialize with smokers for awhile. Their brains also have a vested interest in seeing you fail.
4. Replace "I'm trying to quit" with "I don't smoke" or "I don't smoke anymore". See #3 above.
5. Realize that virtually no tobacco executives smoke and their marketing efforts are the best ever devised.
6. Calculate the actual yearly (non-health) costs to you of smoking. Cost of tobacco plus additional health/life insurance premiums. Then pick out a nice gift to yourself or your family you can now afford after six months or a year.
Thanks for the usefull tips.
But, hey, Here, and it was the same in France too, many doctors used to smoke, and not just a few/day but a lot. I knew many doctors who where-are heavy smokers. Why is so?
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Doctors can be just as stupid as the rest of us.
“Do as I say, not as I do” has been around for a very long time.
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“Do as I say, not as I do” has been around for a very long time.
I believe it was first coined by a Jesuit, many many moons ago.
During my two heart-attack sojourns in hospital, I used to lie in my room trying to cope with the stink of smoke coming into it from the room across the passage that was used by the nursing staff as a recreation centre... Almost all of them, mainly female, smoked. Today, many males have abandoned the habit here, but the incidence of young girls taking it up seems very high. Who'd have thought they would be so daft - I always credited girls with more advanced brains than males have. For a start, they are less obsessed with balls, a useful early indicator. But obviously not an infallible one.
Rob C
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Who needed nicotine to have a 'problem'? When the hell's my PS computer coming home!
Rob C
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I drink Mt Gay with water, raw or brown sugar, and a squeeze of lime (no, lemon does not work); you can even stick in a sprig of mint if you are trying to impress somebody! Buy one or two bottles a year. Don’t try this with low-grade rum. $2.50 Orstralian chardonnay is however my particular bête noir!
Reminds me of the low grade rum found in Mozambique, mixed with raspberry cooldrink and plenty ice. Vile and cheap stuff (it's sold in plastic bottles with a dodgy label) but damn it tastes good.
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Reminds me of the low grade rum found in Mozambique, mixed with raspberry cooldrink and plenty ice. Vile and cheap stuff (it's sold in plastic bottles with a dodgy label) but damn it tastes good.
Sounds like Australia’s Bundaberg Rum (sugar cane country in Queensland).
All you have to do is love the one one you’re with (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5IVuN1N6-Y)!
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Hmmm... according to the guy in the bar at the Bacardi factory some years ago (unless I remember wrongly), cola is an insult to Bacardi; at the very most (he said), use tonic. Rob C (in forced abstinence)
You often hear that said about whiskey too Rob. I attended an interesting whiskey tasting evening once ( actually three times for work) where the presenters noted the popularity in Europe of a cooldrink called "Iron Brew" as a mix for whiskey.
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You often hear that said about whiskey too Rob. I attended an interesting whiskey tasting evening once ( actually three times for work) where the presenters noted the popularity in Europe of a cooldrink called "Iron Brew" as a mix for whiskey.
Aye, it’s Scottish, so that’s OK.
An old friend, who I haven’t had a drink with for years, used to drink Scotch with lemonade (and he was born a Scot). I shuddered, and offered ice, water or even dry ginger, but he was adamant. Irn-Bru seems to be an orange-coloured bevvie, containing industrial colours that would keep wee kiddies up for weeks! But it ain’t Sassenach!
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I quit smoking 16 years ago. I had smoked for 10 years prior to this. I had "quit" smoking to previous times, each time lasted a couple of months or so. What made me successful the third time? Well, I technically did not quit smoking, I simply stopped buying cigarettes. I would smoke one only when I could bum one. All of my smoker friends started avoiding me like the plague. A lot of the time, the smoker who would give me a cigarette would smoke something vile, such as a Picayune, a Camel No Filter etc. Or, it would be a menthol, and I was a non-menthol smoker. This, combined with the embarrassment of begging, eventually weaned me from "needing" a smoke. But, 16 years later, when someone lights a cigarette and I smell it, my mouth almost waters. I can remember how wonderful that first drag of a fresh cigarette was. I know that I will never smoke again. I know that if I smoke one, I will have to fight that battle again to keep a plant product from reigning over my life. I am too smart for that.
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I quit smoking 16 years ago. I had smoked for 10 years prior to this. I had "quit" smoking to previous times, each time lasted a couple of months or so. What made me successful the third time? Well, I technically did not quit smoking, I simply stopped buying cigarettes. I would smoke one only when I could bum one. All of my smoker friends started avoiding me like the plague. A lot of the time, the smoker who would give me a cigarette would smoke something vile, such as a Picayune, a Camel No Filter etc. Or, it would be a menthol, and I was a non-menthol smoker. This, combined with the embarrassment of begging, eventually weaned me from "needing" a smoke. But, 16 years later, when someone lights a cigarette and I smell it, my mouth almost waters. I can remember how wonderful that first drag of a fresh cigarette was. I know that I will never smoke again. I know that if I smoke one, I will have to fight that battle again to keep a plant product from reigning over my life. I am too smart for that.
I used to be so superior to smokers—I had taken up and abandoned the habit on the same day, when I was about 5! But as I watched a TV documentary about addiction on Australia’s ABC network (similar to the BBC) c20 years ago, I realised how tough it could be to try to stop. Understanding further enhanced by talking to a woman who had given up up 20 years earlier: “Do you miss them?” “Every day” was the reply.
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How odd to miss tobacco!
I have no desire to start smoking ever again; I detest being in the same room as anyone smoking, and lighting up in a non-smoker's home or car must rank amongst the worst insults one can offer.
The idea struck me that one could carry a small bunch of dry leaves in a side-pocket, along with a box of matches or a Zippo, and return the compliment in the offender's home by taking out the aforementioned props and setting ablaze the one with the other, preferrably upon the host's best table. I doubt they'd see the joke.
My PS computer is still AWOL, but a man came yesterday and fitted wifi and additional tv channels. I can now watch tv with the added distraction of flickering lights on yet another piece of technical equipment I don't really want to look at at all. Meanwhile, back in the office, my monitor boasts a modified row of flickering "ADSL" and "Modify message -..." boxes at the bottom, where once they remained steady and non-distracting. Why? Because during a conversation with the girl in the telephone shop (Telefonica) I mentioned my angst at paying an unlimited use rate for ADSL at home, and also seperately for its use on the cellphone, and tried to explain that I was unlikely to be using them both at the same time... she looked at my bills and then told me that she could send a chap around to give me more for less. So, here I am: more flickers and, possibly, lower telephone bills in the future. As I have noted in the past, things often improve without getting any better.
Oh well, time to exit the house and face the world.
Ciao
Rob C