Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Colour Management => Topic started by: schiminiello on June 26, 2011, 05:49:15 pm
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Hi
Has anyone tested the new I1 Display Pro calibration device on the market? http://xritephoto.com/ph_product_overview.aspx?id=1454
It says it's the "Next generation i1Profiler software for calibrating and profiling all modern display and projector technologies including LED & Wide Gamut LCDs"-- I'm looking to calibrate my macbook pro and haven't had good luck with the I1 Display 2 because of the luminescence factor...
Any thoughts or comments?
Thanks,
Shannon
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I have an overview here.
http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/reviews/profiling/i1_display_pro.html (http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/reviews/profiling/i1_display_pro.html)
Still waiting for some more detailed specs, but it works fine :-)
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Hi
I've had trouble calibrating my macbook pro laptop - would you recommend the new xrite I1 Display Pro Calibration device for a macbook pro monitor?
Just wanted to get a credible non-biased recommendation before purchasing it.
Thanks,
SC
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The i1Display Pro worked well with my own Macbook Pro - albeit a non reflective screen version.
I should note that this particular laptop was also fine using a Spyder3 Elite.
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The hardware is quite good, impressive and has some very interesting and useful technology. The software, not so much. As such, until and if NEC supplies a update for SpectraView to support the new hardware, it will sit in a drawer.
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The hardware is quite good, impressive and has some very interesting and useful technology. The software, not so much. As such, until and if NEC supplies a update for SpectraView to support the new hardware, it will sit in a drawer.
I find myself in the strange situation where I agree with Andrew.
Edmund
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Would you or Andrew be so kind as to explain your reply? Does it mean that the monitor calibration works well but you don't like the software? What about the software don't you like? What do you use the software for after you have calibrated your monitor?
Would it be good enough to calibrate my macbook pro laptop? I've had trouble calibrating it with the xrite I1Display2 device I have due to the luminescence factor. I just need to calibrate my macbook pro laptop... do you have any thoughts? This is the only calibration device I have seen that says it works on new generation monitors...
Any advice or explanation would be greatly appreciated. Don't know what NEC is or what it has to do with calibrating a macbook pro...
Thanks in advance!
SC
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The hardware is quite good, impressive and has some very interesting and useful technology. The software, not so much. As such, until and if NEC supplies a update for SpectraView to support the new hardware, it will sit in a drawer.
Andrew, even if they do update it, it will sit in a drawer. I asked Integrated Color if they planned on supporting the i1Display Pro. The short answer is no (not unless they change their policy regarding compatibility with 3rd party software). The policy is... i1Display Pro colorimeters bought as an X-Rite package (with the i1Profiler software for monitor profiling) will not work with 3rd party devices. They are happy to sell 3rd parties an i1Display Pro that will work with 3rd party software but you can't have one i1Display Pro that will work with X-Rite's own software, and 3rd party software. So this means that if you want to use an i1Display Pro with Spectraview, you're going to have to buy one directly from NEC and that NEC branded i1Display Pro won't work with any X-Rite software (which at the moment is not a big deal but still... WTF???).
Here's my original question and Integrated Color's response:
http://www.integrated-color.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1693
It's unfortunate. Until X-Rite changes their policy or until they fix their software (which has a lot of potential) and getting functioning to a point where it's equal to or better than other options my recommendation to my clients will continue to be...
NEC Monitors - Spectraview II package with an NEC branded i1Display 2
Everything Else - Color Eyes Display Pro or BasICColor Display with a Spyder 3.
Cheers, Joe
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As such, until and if NEC supplies a update for SpectraView to support the new hardware, it will sit in a drawer.
>Andrew, even if they do update it, it will sit in a drawer
Not for me, not if NEC supports it. I have no need for Integrated Color support but I’d love to use the instrument in SpectraView (even exclusively).
I don’t disagree that the policy of X-Rite is silly.
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Not for me, not if NEC supports it. I have no need for Integrated Color support but I’d love to use the instrument in SpectraView (even exclusively).
I don’t disagree that the policy of X-Rite is silly.
Andrew, what I'm saying is that under their current policy (at least as I understand it, I don't think this policy is specific to just Integrated Color but to ALL 3rd parties including NEC), your i1Display Pro would not work with Spectraview even if NEC supports it. You'll have to buy an i1Display Pro that works with 3rd party applications (hence the one you have will continue to sit in the drawer as I'm assuming it's tagged for use with X-Rite's software only... unless the beta pucks are able to work with 3rd party apps in which case you will have something unique). Perhaps NEC can cut a deal with X-Rite but it seems as if the X-Rite bean counters have set out a mandate to bite of their nose to spite their face... I mean find new sources of revenue. I understand the reasoning but I sincerely doubt this is going to bring them in any additional revenue. With the software in its current state I certainly wouldn't recommend buying the i1Display Pro. If someone does buy an i1Display Pro, discovers the shortfalls of the application and later buys 3rd party software that "supports" the i1Display Pro only to find out that their X-Rite branded model won't work... that will make for some unhappy people and a bit of animosity towards X-Rite I'm unsure.
Cheers, Joe
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You'll have to buy an i1Display Pro that works with 3rd party applications (hence the one you have will continue to sit in the drawer as I'm assuming it's tagged for use with X-Rite's software only...
Understood, agreed. Yes, assuming the X-Rite software can't provide the same functionality as SpectraView II OR I can use it with SpectraView II, you are indeed correct. It will sit in the drawer.
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The policy is... i1Display Pro colorimeters bought as an X-Rite package (with the i1Profiler software for monitor profiling) will not work with 3rd party devices. They are happy to sell 3rd parties an i1Display Pro that will work with 3rd party software but you can't have one i1Display Pro that will work with X-Rite's own software, and 3rd party software.
That really sucks - thanks a lot for the information, since now I won't recommend that useless junk to anyone. I don't belive X-Rite will ever improve i1profiler, it's designed to create as few problems with user support as possible, so I doubt they'll gonna change the way it works.
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I got my new Xrite i1 Display Pro yesterday and had lots of time to test it today.
The report is an A. I finally have a dual display that matches. The White Point Match feature is special.
I have a sRGB monitor and a wide gamut very, very close. Of course thats on easy and more narrow DR images. Skin tones are so close as to call them a match - which is my point of interest.
Overall, the new device (and software) is much, much better than my i1 Display 2 or my Colormunki.
The software updated to version 1.1.1. The software options are stunning and it will take a while to check everything out fully. Overall, thrilled.
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Hi Raw Shooter-
By any chance is one of your monitors a Macbook Pro? As I mentioned in my original post I have had trouble calibrating my MacBook laptop due to the bright screen.
As for the other comments, although interesting, I do not have any idea what Spectracolor or Spectraview, NEC, etc. is. I am mainly interested in knowing if the new XRITE I1Display Pro Calibration device is good for a macbook pro monitor and if the reviews are really true that it can calibrate new generation monitors. I am trying to do some research before I purchase it.
Thanks in advance to anyone who can offer relevant information to my questions.
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Sorry Schiminiello, didn't work on the Macbook Pro. My laptop is a Dell XPS 17, and like the Macbook Pro it's an IPS screen - and yes, it worked great. Once again, in my eyes, better than previous devices.
Some of the Mac guys on here aren't too high on the i1Pro, so maybe there is a problem with the Mac side of the software. On the Windows 7 side, all is very good so far. 2 days isn't long enough to know yet.
The prior posts on this device and software had me wondering too. My experience surprised me, based on their reviews.
It should work on a Macbook Pro, nothing lost by trying. On the other hand, I personally don't do much post processing on a laptop anyway. Both of my desktop monitors are where the real work is done and the new Xrite product was a big upgrade. Good luck.
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Hi RawShooter
Thanks for your response. I don't do my editing on a my macbook pro as I have a desktop monitor for that but I do visit my clients homes and it would be nice if I could get my laptop screen to match my desktop monitor. That is what I'm looking for.
Glad to hear that the device worked for you. I think I might try it.
Thanks again, and if anyone else has any comments about how the new XRite I1 Display Pro Calibration device works on their Macbook Pro and external monitor I'd love to hear your comments.
Best,
Shannon
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The hardware is quite good, impressive and has some very interesting and useful technology. The software, not so much. As such, until and if NEC supplies a update for SpectraView to support the new hardware, it will sit in a drawer.
hi Andrew,
I'm considering to buy one. Why do you think that the sw is not so great?
Will i be able to perform a good calibration? Or is there any feature missing that will make a good calibration not possible?
thx
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If you have no such solution, then yes, go for the new product. The software needs work and has a few odd bugs (forget about creating your own patch sets). Otherwise it can produces good calibration if your needs are not severe.
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Im also in the market for a new colorimeter - but for me it has to be supported by SpectraView or its not going to work for my needs. Would greatly appreciate if anyone hears if this support is forthcoming that they post it here. thanks.
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Im also in the market for a new colorimeter - but for me it has to be supported by SpectraView or its not going to work for my needs. Would greatly appreciate if anyone hears if this support is forthcoming that they post it here. thanks.
Until we hear from NEC, there’s nothing to report. I’ve got my fingers crossed.
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If you have no such solution, then yes, go for the new product. The software needs work and has a few odd bugs (forget about creating your own patch sets). Otherwise it can produces good calibration if your needs are not severe.
I expect to end up with a high quality calibration and profile. So I guess it is severe.
Can you describe what you mean with severe? Which tweaks / modifications / procedures do you consider as severe and will not be available / working?
Thx!
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What is the better calibration device...the i1 Display Pro or the Colormunki Photo ?
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I expect to end up with a high quality calibration and profile. So I guess it is severe.
Then get an NEC SpectraView with their instrument and software and calibrate using a integrated solution.
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Sorry Schiminiello, didn't work on the Macbook Pro. My laptop is a Dell XPS 17, and like the Macbook Pro it's an IPS screen
The MacBook Pro does not use an IPS panel, they all use TN Panels. The Dell XPS 17 (L701x) does not use an IPS panel either, it uses an LG LP173WD1-TLA1 TN film panel. I looked on Dell's website and there is no option for an IPS panel on this model. The only Dell laptop I'm aware of that offers an IPS panel is the M4600 and it's a $500 option. If there is an IPS panel option, it will explicitly say IPS panel in the description. "HD" or "3D" does not = IPS.
Cheers, Joe
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Then get an NEC SpectraView with their instrument and software and calibrate using a integrated solution.
Ditto that. If you already have a monitor I would not recommend the i1 Display Pro at this time. I'm pointing people towards the Spyder 3 with Color Eyes Display Pro.
Cheers, Joe
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Hi
I am the original poster to this thread. Can anyone give me an answer to my questions? I have macbook pro and haven't had good luck with the I1 Display 2 calibration system. Has anyone tested the new I1 Display Pro calibration device on the market? http://xritephoto.com/ph_product_overview.aspx?id=1454 FOR A MACBOOK PRO? It says it's the "Next generation i1Profiler software for calibrating and profiling all modern display and projector technologies including LED & Wide Gamut LCDs"
Should this work well on my macbook pro? I don't edit on my macbook pro (I edit on a separate monitor) but often need to take my laptop to clients homes and need the color to be correct... so having the calibration on both computer screens match would be key.
CAN ANYONE ADDRESS MY SPECIFIC ISSUE AND QUESTION?
Thanks,
Shannon
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I have macbook pro and haven't had good luck with the I1 Display 2 calibration system.
I was disappointed with the i1Display system as well but love the new pro device and software (now that it's at 1.1.1 and has lots of new display calibration features). Works great on MacBookPros.
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I took the plunge (its not really a plunge, more like small dip) for the i1 Display Pro to calibrate my field macbook pro. It does a fine job with the included software.
What I really want though is NEC to pull their finger out and issue an update to the SpectraView software to make the i1 Display Pro compatible so I can properly calibrate my NEC 2690 WUXI spectra view monitor. The sooner they do this the better. I am keen to see how the i1 display pro performs on a wide gamut monitor compared to my previous Eye One Display 2 (which is ok - but not great on wide gamut).
I know Will from NEC who was instrumental in these monitors engineering reads and posts here occasionally. Will can you shed any light on if/when?
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What I really want though is NEC to pull their finger out and issue an update to the SpectraView software to make the i1 Display Pro compatible so I can properly calibrate my NEC 2690 WUXI spectra view monitor.
Patience grasshopper, patience.
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I'm totally confused. I have an NEC monitor, but in my country the NEC puck is not available. Can I use Spectraview with another calibrating device?
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Can I use Spectraview with another calibrating device?
Yes, it supports a number of instruments.
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I'm totally confused. I have an NEC monitor, but in my country the NEC puck is not available. Can I use Spectraview with another calibrating device?
Do you have NEC Spectraview, or PA version? There's basICColor display SQUID WG, which - I believe - is equivalent of NEC SVII sensor.
On the other hand new basICColor display 5 aka Spectraview Profiler 5 will also support X-Rite i1display pro, that seems to be much better solution.
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Yes, it supports a number of instruments.
found it. but which is the best?
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I have an PA221 which I want to be hardware calibrated.
I don't trust the basiccolor stuff. why? a friend of mine uses the software with the same monitor i got and his monitor is so off from what it should look like. tested it again and again. same result.
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a friend of mine uses the software with the same monitor i got and his monitor is so off from what it should look like. tested it again and again. same result.
I've successfully calibrated a couple of P221s using basICColor display software and the DISCUS sensor. If something goes wrong it's usually a matter of sensor or target settings rather than software - there's a lot of crappy sensors out there, and - contrary to common expectations - the calibration doesn't have causative power, so the target settings should be matched to specific environmental conditions of our workspace.
found it. but which is the best?
basICColor DISCUS, but I expect i1display pro to be the most reasonable alternative. It will be supported by basICColor display 5 and next release of NEC Spectraview II software that will be available soon.
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I have an PA221 which I want to be hardware calibrated.
Might want to forgo spending any money on hardware until you see how well MultiProfiler works.
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Might want to forgo spending any money on hardware until you see how well MultiProfiler works.
Sounds interesting, but unfortunately I have an P221 not an PA, so not for me.
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@ Czornyj : Thank you. One question left, will basicolor 5 create a profile or do an hardware calibration with my p221
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Sounds interesting, but unfortunately I have an P221 not an PA, so not for me.
Ops, sorry. In that case, if you only want a Colorimeter, the new i1D-3 (i1DisplayPro) should be shortly supported and that’s the instrument to get unless you also want to make printer profiles. Then ColorMunki or i1Pro, depending on budget would be next in line.
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@ Czornyj : Thank you. One question left, will basicolor 5 create a profile or do an hardware calibration with my p221
Yes, there will be hardware calibration support for P221W
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thank you both for the quick answers, so I will sit and wait.
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What I really want though is NEC to pull their finger out and issue an update to the SpectraView software to make the i1 Display Pro compatible so I can properly calibrate my NEC 2690 WUXI spectra view monitor. The sooner they do this the better. I am keen to see how the i1 display pro performs on a wide gamut monitor compared to my previous Eye One Display 2 (which is ok - but not great on wide gamut).
You may want to try the "check for updates" feature.
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Mr. Hollingworth,
This is great news. Thanks for the update tip. Is there anywhere we can read about the "NEC SpectraSensor Pro calibration sensors" mentioned in the release notes?
Tom
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Is there anywhere we can read about the "NEC SpectraSensor Pro calibration sensors" mentioned in the release notes?
Tom
No. Pretend for now you didn't see that. : :)
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Is there anywhere we can read about the "NEC SpectraSensor Pro calibration sensors" mentioned in the release notes?
The name says it all. It must be rebadged i1D3 (vel i1Dispaly Pro/ColorMunki Display), as each device is spectrally characterized - a "SpectraSensor" indeed.
Can anyone tell where's the above mentioned update? I can't find it, did it disappear?
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I updated my Spectraview II from within the program. The release notes downloaded along with the new version.
Now, I am anxiously awaiting to hear if Mr. Rodney and others see an appreciable difference with Spectraview II with the NEC-mated sensor versus Spectraview II and the new i1 Display Pro.
Tom
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Seems there's no OSX version yet, so I've played with Windows version instead.
New sensor works really nice, as expected. I've cross-validated it with my DISCUS:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19059944/LCD3090WQXi%209Z300649ZB-001.png)
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You may want to try the "check for updates" feature.
No new update for OSX yet :-[
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It seems there's no display-specific calibration spectral set either. There are only X-Rite generic .edr files in Spectraview II folder.
The X-Rite generic Wide gamut CCFL calibration spectral set was taken from PA241 and PA271, and the standard gamut CCFL one from HP's and EIZO's with eIPS, so generally it should work well with PA series displays, but I'm curious how it's gonna work with WGCCFL S-PVA of P221's...
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No new update for OSX yet :-[
http://www.xrite.com/custom_page.aspx?PageID=284
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http://www.xrite.com/custom_page.aspx?PageID=284
Huh? I meant the SpectraView II update to take advantage of the new colorimeter (not X-Rite Software) ;D
Jeremy over at Image Science seems to have scored a preview copy - so it must be almost here: :P
http://www.imagescience.com.au/blog/2011-10-05/spectraview-ii-now-supports-the-fantastic-i1display-pro/ (http://www.imagescience.com.au/blog/2011-10-05/spectraview-ii-now-supports-the-fantastic-i1display-pro/)
As of this post though - there is no update on NEC's website (http://www.necdisplay.com/support-and-services/spectra-view-II/Downloads) and the built in update feature isn't showing an update either.
I know.. I know.. patience grasshopper... ;D
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The folks at Chromix said that there would be a public beta being released next week for BasICColor Display v5. Amongst some of the new features are added support for the i1D3. The new version will also have longer integration times for the Eye One Pro which should improve shadows if you're using that spectro.
Cheers, Joe
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Huh? I meant the SpectraView II update to take advantage of the new colorimeter (not X-Rite Software) ;D
See post #41.
Jeremy isn’t the only one who scored a copy. And so if the update isn’t happening, just a bit more patience.
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One more question, if I want to use the device primarly with the Spectraview software, would the Color Munki Display be enough? It is the same sensor to begin with.
Regards
Heinrich
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One more question, if I want to use the device primarly with the Spectraview software, would the Color Munki Display be enough? It is the same sensor to begin with.
Regards
Heinrich
There's no support for ColorMunki Display in Spectraview II (at least not yet).
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I have been successfully using the i1 Display 2 and Eye One Match software for the last couple of years.
I decided to "upgrade" to the i1Display Pro. I used the advanced mode, went carefully through the steps, and ended up with a profile that has a nasty green cast.
I stayed with default recommendations for the most part, used the large patch set, adjusted brightness manually.
I must be missing something. With my i1 Display 2 & software, in advanced mode I manually adjust the RGB values. I don't see any part of the process w/ the i1Display Pro that allows me to do that.
Can anyone out there who has used both enlighten me? I looked for video tutorials and only found a couple of very basic ones on YouTube.
I uninstalled the new system and reinstalled the Eye One Match and re-profiled with good results using my i1 Display 2.
At this point, I feel as though I wasted some money.
I know it must be user error of some sort, so would appreciate any insight.
Thanks . . .
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No new update for OSX yet :-[
Update should now be available via "check for updates" in the software and on the http://necdisplay.com/spectraview (http://http:/http://www.necdisplay.com/support-and-services/spectra-view-II/Downloads) web page.
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Update should now be available via "check for updates" in the software and on the http://necdisplay.com/spectraview (http://http:/http://www.necdisplay.com/support-and-services/spectra-view-II/Downloads) web page.
;D
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I must be missing something. With my i1 Display 2 & software, in advanced mode I manually adjust the RGB values. I don't see any part of the process w/ the i1Display Pro that allows me to do that.
Can anyone out there who has used both enlighten me? I looked for video tutorials and only found a
At this point, I feel as though I wasted some money.
My i1Display2 'died', so I am considering i1Display Pro too. There seem to be no answers here, but have you found out it otherwise?
/fox
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My i1Display2 'died', so I am considering i1Display Pro too. There seem to be no answers here, but have you found out it otherwise?
/fox
Here's my workaround:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=58826.msg475023#msg475023
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I'm a little confused about the NEC Hardware/Software options. I have Spectraview II already for my LCD2690wuxi. As far as adding new calibration hardware it looks like I have two options which have the same end result but at different prices....
A. The XRITE I1 Display Pro for $250.00 and use that with the Spectraview software or the I1 software.
B. The NEC SpectraSensor Pro for $200.00 and use that with Spectraview software or the I1 software.
Are these devices the same, or is the NEC specially filtered like the old colorimeter? Why would I or anyone buy the XRITE version for $50 more? In the press release for the NEC SpectraSensor Pro it looks like I get to use the I1 software for that device in addition to the Spectraview software.
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Since you already have the SpectraView II software, you just need a color sensor if you feel you need to upgrade.
You could either go with the the full X-Rite iOne Display Pro package (sensor+software), or the alternate is to get the NEC SpectraSensor Pro sensor for $200.
So the extra $50 would get you essentially the same device, but with the addition of the X-Rite software (which you wouldn't use with the LCD2690WUXi anyway).
Note that the NEC SpectraSensor Pro is not supported in the X-Rite software. However the NEC SpectraView II software supports both the NEC SpectraSensor Pro and the X-Rite iOne Display Pro sensors.
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Since you already have the SpectraView II software, you just need a color sensor if you feel you need to upgrade.
You could either go with the the full X-Rite iOne Display Pro package (sensor+software), or the alternate is to get the NEC SpectraSensor Pro sensor for $200.
So the extra $50 would get you essentially the same device, but with the addition of the X-Rite software (which you wouldn't use with the LCD2690WUXi anyway).
Note that the NEC SpectraSensor Pro is not supported in the X-Rite software. However the NEC SpectraView II software supports both the NEC SpectraSensor Pro and the X-Rite iOne Display Pro sensors.
Thanks for the clarification Will. Seems the extra $50 for the XRITE version may be worth it in my case since I don't currently have a software solution for my laptop or iMac screens.
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Note that the NEC SpectraSensor Pro is not supported in the X-Rite software. However the NEC SpectraView II software supports both the NEC SpectraSensor Pro and the X-Rite iOne Display Pro sensors.
A very timely post, thanks for the info Will. One more question... since SVII will only calibrate and profile NEC monitors, will the SpectraSensor Pro work with other 3rd party software such as Color Eyes Display Pro, and BasICColor Display when they release versions that support the i1 Display Pro? I would think BasICColor would since Spectraview Profiler is BasICColor Display. I think that functionality is more important than working with i1 Profiler. Phenomenal software for making printer profiles. Not so much when it comes to monitors though. That it's not compatible with i1 Profiler isn't something that would concern me at all.
Cheers, Joe
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i1Profiler is not that bad - what more, it can be installed on unlimited number of computers and activated simply by plugging the device.
On the other hand - you can save 50$ getting NEC SpectraSensor Pro and use it with (as free as mighty) ArgyllCMS to calibrate&profile other displays as well.
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will the SpectraSensor Pro work with other 3rd party software such as Color Eyes Display Pro, and BasICColor Display when they release versions that support the i1 Display Pro?
Due to the device "locking" mechanism implemented on the new sensors, each software application must be given the keys to access each different device. We will work with other software vendors on this issue as necessary, however our immediate priority is supporting the NEC device in the NEC software.
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Due to the device "locking" mechanism implemented on the new sensors, each software application must be given the keys to access each different device. We will work with other software vendors on this issue as necessary, however our immediate priority is supporting the NEC device in the NEC software.
Thanks Will. So it sounds like it will just take a little time to see how things pan out.
Cheers, Joe
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Hi Will, I have a brand new PA271W's which I purchases with spectraview II and the NEC branded i1 display 2.
I also have the i1 display pro 3 (i1D3) retail version which came with the i1 profiler software.
Would you recommend that I use the i1D3 device rather that the NEC i1d2 device?
When I try it I get a very very slightly higher delta e from the calibration, but overall the device may be more accurate compared a reference device?
Which device do you recommend that I use?
Thanks!
-Nat Jencks
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Would you recommend that I use the i1D3 device rather that the NEC i1d2 device?
When I try it I get a very very slightly higher delta e from the calibration, but overall the device may be more accurate compared a reference device?
You should get very similar results from both devices since they are both optimized for the wide gamut of the PA series displays.
The delta-e results are more to do with how the display settles after adjustment, rather than the absolute accuracy of the measurement device (since you are calibrating and measuring with the same device).
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The new I1 Display Pro is supposedly more accurate than the EyeOne Pro at low luminance levels.
I would like to know if anyone is getting more accurate measurements with the I1 Display Pro using Spectraview II? Is there a visible difference on displays like a MultiSync PA241W?
Does Spectraview II run on any I1 Display Pro or only those sold by X-Rite and NEC?
Thanks.
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The new I1 Display Pro is supposedly more accurate than the EyeOne Pro at low luminance levels.
I would like to know if anyone is getting more accurate measurements with the I1 Display Pro using Spectraview II? Is there a visible difference on displays like a MultiSync PA241W?
Does Spectraview II run on any I1 Display Pro or only those sold by X-Rite and NEC?
Since the PA series does a lot of the corrections and calculations internally based on it's self monitoring, the low luminance performance of the sensor doesn't have much influence on the calibration. Only the final results shown may have some differences in the contrast ratio and gray tracking due to the sensor performance.
Other models however do rely on the sensor for the full accuracy of the calibration, so there may be some visible differences.
SpectraView II only supports the NEC SpectraSensor Pro, X-Rite iOne Display Pro, and what X-Rite calls "low volume generic OEM" versions.
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Ok, so just to make absolutely sure I'm not missing something here:
- The X-Rite branded i1Display Pro will work with Spectraview II.
- The NEC "MDSVSENSOR3" won't work with X-Rite i1Profiler even though it's the same hardware. (Can you even buy i1Profiler by itself?)
Correct? So I should be safe buying the X-Rite branded i1 Display Pro for use with SV II?
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Ok, so just to make absolutely sure I'm not missing something here:
- The X-Rite branded i1Display Pro will work with Spectraview II.
- The NEC "MDSVSENSOR3" won't work with X-Rite i1Profiler even though it's the same hardware. (Can you even buy i1Profiler by itself?)
Correct? So I should be safe buying the X-Rite branded i1 Display Pro for use with SV II?
Correct. I have one (an X-Rite branded i1D3) and am using it with SVII.
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I just bought the i1/Display Pro and will be using it with my MBP's and Apple displays. I've calibrated two displays so far but am not sure about some of the settings. Perhaps someone can steer me in the right direction. The software gives me a choice of LED rgb or LED white (plus a few others) for my 27 and 24" displays, which should I choose. Also, the tutorial suggests that photographers should use a whitepoint of 6500 while prepress users should pick 5000, is this correct? My older 30 and 23" displays I believe are LCD's is that correct? What settings would they use? I would appreciate any info on this subject. Thanks, Jim
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It's hard to say whether or not you want RGB or white LEDs without the model numbers of the displays. If I understand this distinction properly, some "white" LEDs consist of a R, G, and B LED that, in combination, produce white light. The regular white ones are something like blue LEDs that use a phosphor to convert the blue light into a wider spectral distribution that's closer to white.
From the viewing perspective I'm not sure how much 6500K matters, but it matches the default white points of sRGB (for example) so should in theory, I guess, lose less information during color management. Also, I think most typical sRGB monitors tend to be optimized for 6500K as their "native" white point. 5000K is recommended for prepress because that's the 50D standard that's used for viewing booths and everything else. Of course if you're doing prepress or otherwise need D50 for some reason then you'll already know that and so probably don't need to be told.
Thing is though that the white point of ProPhotoRGB is D50 (5000K) which might mean that 5000K is better if you're using Lightroom, but I don't remember if MelissaRGB (Lightroom's internal version of ProPhoto) differs from D50 or not..... If anyone knows please tell me, and let me know how much it matters to use 5000K with lightroom if so.
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All modern Apple displays have W-LED backlight. Use D65 rather than D50, as paradoxically it usually gives better visual match, even with the standarized D50 viewing booth.
Don't worry about the difference between the wtpt of your editing space and calibration target, AFAIK the CMM of PS/LR uses color adaptation transform to correct the difference.
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There are very, very, very few RGB LED's out there (and none from Apple). So White.
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Thanks for the info and clarifications, I'm calibrating away! Jim
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Is there a NEC monitor with Spectra-View that you like better than its siblings? I'm not fussy about it being 24", 22 or 23 is fine.
Bill
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PA301W is a real king of the hill - not only the biggest, but also the only one with true 10 bit P-IPS matrix (rest has 8+2FRC).
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Considering those, what would you guys recommend if I'm using a MacBook Pro 17" (non-glossy) along with a LED Cinema Display 24".
I tried RGB LED and white gamut with the D65 settings and my screen is way too much warm (yellow-ish). I'll have to try with the White LED display to see if it changes something.
But I'm using Lightroom A LOT, so would I be better using D50?
Let me know your thoughs...!:)
It's hard to say whether or not you want RGB or white LEDs without the model numbers of the displays. If I understand this distinction properly, some "white" LEDs consist of a R, G, and B LED that, in combination, produce white light. The regular white ones are something like blue LEDs that use a phosphor to convert the blue light into a wider spectral distribution that's closer to white.
From the viewing perspective I'm not sure how much 6500K matters, but it matches the default white points of sRGB (for example) so should in theory, I guess, lose less information during color management. Also, I think most typical sRGB monitors tend to be optimized for 6500K as their "native" white point. 5000K is recommended for prepress because that's the 50D standard that's used for viewing booths and everything else. Of course if you're doing prepress or otherwise need D50 for some reason then you'll already know that and so probably don't need to be told.
Thing is though that the white point of ProPhotoRGB is D50 (5000K) which might mean that 5000K is better if you're using Lightroom, but I don't remember if MelissaRGB (Lightroom's internal version of ProPhoto) differs from D50 or not..... If anyone knows please tell me, and let me know how much it matters to use 5000K with lightroom if so.
All modern Apple displays have W-LED backlight. Use D65 rather than D50, as paradoxically it usually gives better visual match, even with the standarized D50 viewing booth.
Don't worry about the difference between the wtpt of your editing space and calibration target, AFAIK the CMM of PS/LR uses color adaptation transform to correct the difference.
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I tried RGB LED and white gamut with the D65 settings and my screen is way too much warm (yellow-ish). I'll have to try with the White LED display to see if it changes something.
But I'm using Lightroom A LOT, so would I be better using D50?
Let me know your thoughs...!:)
Like I said - White LED for all modern Apple displays. If your Macbook is older - A1151/A1212/A1229/A1261 it may have CCFL backlight, in such case choose "CCFL" as your display technology typ.
You'd better stay away from D50, unless you want your display to be even more yellow-ish ;)
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Andrew said:
There are very, very, very few RGB LED's out there
Why are there so few RGB LEDs?
thanks,
Paz
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Why are there so few RGB LEDs?
Because Red, Green and Blue LEDs blended together to get white light is both difficult and very expensive. White light LEDs are are a lot cheaper now but LEDs with R, G & B emissions are still very expensive. NEC had an RGB LED display...it was about $6K if I remember correctly. Great display but very few people bought them. So, until the cost of R, G, & B LEDs come down, you won't find many displays using them.
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Thanks for the explanation, Jeff.
I have one. Yes, it was expensive, and it hasn't been easy to calibrate successfully either, but I'm getting closer.
I keep reading, often confused here, but I'm learning more and more of the language you guys use! ;D
thanks again,
Paz
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Because Red, Green and Blue LEDs blended together to get white light is both difficult and very expensive. White light LEDs are are a lot cheaper now but LEDs with R, G & B emissions are still very expensive. NEC had an RGB LED display...it was about $6K if I remember correctly. Great display but very few people bought them. So, until the cost of R, G, & B LEDs come down, you won't find many displays using them.
Not only that but I'd say there's a rather small demand for them as well as very few folks seem to have demand for a display that is capable of a gamut that extends beyond AdobeRGB. If there's no demand, that will also affect the price.
I have a feeling that we'll see affordable OLED monitors before we see affordable RGB LED monitors.
Cheers, Joe
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Hi
I am the original poster to this thread. Can anyone give me an answer to my questions? I have macbook pro and haven't had good luck with the I1 Display 2 calibration system. Has anyone tested the new I1 Display Pro calibration device on the market? http://xritephoto.com/ph_product_overview.aspx?id=1454 FOR A MACBOOK PRO? It says it's the "Next generation i1Profiler software for calibrating and profiling all modern display and projector technologies including LED & Wide Gamut LCDs"
Should this work well on my macbook pro? I don't edit on my macbook pro (I edit on a separate monitor) but often need to take my laptop to clients homes and need the color to be correct... so having the calibration on both computer screens match would be key.
CAN ANYONE ADDRESS MY SPECIFIC ISSUE AND QUESTION?
Thanks,
Shannon
So, I'm wondering why it is that your I1 Display 2 isn't working for you?
Are you using Advanced mode? I use the I1D2 on my MacBook Pro, and it works fine. What is it about Your results that you don't like?
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So, I'm wondering why it is that your I1 Display 2 isn't working for you?
Are you using Advanced mode? I use the I1D2 on my MacBook Pro, and it works fine. What is it about Your results that you don't like?
The i1D2 will work fine for old MacBook Pros which used CCFL backlighting, but for newer MacBook Pros which use LED backlighting, it doesn't work very well at all. The profiles it generates tend to be inconsistent which usually manifest in a color cast. I've observed this with the i1 Display 2, and the DTP-94. The Spyder 3 does okay with LED backlighting, the Eye One Pro (aside from the issues and limitations inherent in using a Spectrophotometer for profiling a monitor) does quite well, as does the i1Display Pro (and without the noise floor issues that the Eye One Pro has when measuring "shadows").
Cheers, Joe
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The new I1 Display Pro is supposedly more accurate than the EyeOne Pro at low luminance levels.
I would like to know if anyone is getting more accurate measurements with the I1 Display Pro using Spectraview II? Is there a visible difference on displays like a MultiSync PA241W?
Does Spectraview II run on any I1 Display Pro or only those sold by X-Rite and NEC?
Thanks.
It doesn't matter for PA series they let the color engine do almost everything (for the US version, in Europe they handle the PA series very differently). As far as I can tell the color engine receives input for the three primaries and for the white point and some info on what tone response and it does everything itself. So the calibration isn't actually every measuring any dark values, ever, that are actually used to build the calibration nor are they stored in the profile since the profile is a simple matrix gamut change of basis type with also information on the white point and selected TRC. The only place it would show is on the profile sanity check stuff it shows you at the end.
At least that is what I think is happening from everything I've seen it do. I'm 95% sure on this despite what many have posted in various forums.
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Since the PA series does a lot of the corrections and calculations internally based on it's self monitoring, the low luminance performance of the sensor doesn't have much influence on the calibration. Only the final results shown may have some differences in the contrast ratio and gray tracking due to the sensor performance.
Other models however do rely on the sensor for the full accuracy of the calibration, so there may be some visible differences.
SpectraView II only supports the NEC SpectraSensor Pro, X-Rite iOne Display Pro, and what X-Rite calls "low volume generic OEM" versions.
Ah and I see I have been correct as NEC themselves have now said as much that it works as I thought.
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Some quick early test do hint that this new unit may be most impressive indeed. I think there is a chance that it might even outdo the 4x the price i1 Pro even on a wide gamut monitor (although it is said they tuned the i1 Display Pro to my particular wide gamut monitor, so perhaps on alternate wide gamuts or other display types the i1 pro might slide ahead again???)
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I have a NEC PA24 and the i1 Display Pro. I'd like to ask a question about the SpectraView II Preferences window: Do people suggest keeping them at the defaults, or are there reasons to switch settings? Thanks for any help. I have a great match with monitor and prints, but I'm always open to new info. and tips.
For example: I believe Andrew once suggested to check "Extended luminance stabilization time", and I think I remember Jeff saying in their most excellent "Camera to Print and Screen," that he sets Preferences/ICC Profiles to use "Factory measurements."
Tom
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I’d always have the Extended option on (takes longer, presumably does a more through job measuring). As for the factory setting that entirely depends on the insturment being used and if you are dealing with a wide gamut display or not. See page 22 of the manual.
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I’d always have the Extended option on (takes longer, presumably does a more through job measuring).
As far as I know it's not any more "thorough" with it on, than it is with it turned off (there aren't any more patches introduced). All it does is allow more time for the CCFL backlights to stabilize after a change has been made to the luminance which is especially important when making more extreme changes.
Cheers, Joe
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I just bought the i1d pro packaged with ColorChecker passport.
I have the Dell u2711 and an older Dell 20" lcd side-by-side ("1st" and "2nd" screen respectively in Lightroom). I also have a Spyder 3 Express, and have been using Argyll CMS.
Earlier, I have not been satisfied with calibrations on my 2711. I know that I probably should not expect visual matching between those two monitors, but was expecting them to be "sort of close".
Using the i1d pro with its software I still have this problem that certain saturated reds looks very different - the 2711 shows them with a purple cast, while the old 20" is more orange. The annoying thing is that the 20" looks more realistic when I bring the physical reference into the room. A 10 years old sRGB lcd should not be more perceptually accurate than a brand-new wide-gamut photo-oriented display when both are calibrated with the nicest colorimeter out there?
Then again, perhaps it is the Adobe-supplied camera profiles for my camera that are weird, and the 2711 is just showing me accurately the color that camera/lightroom is telling it to?
-h
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I just bought the i1d pro packaged with ColorChecker passport.
I have the Dell u2711 and an older Dell 20" lcd side-by-side ("1st" and "2nd" screen respectively in Lightroom). I also have a Spyder 3 Express, and have been using Argyll CMS.
Earlier, I have not been satisfied with calibrations on my 2711. I know that I probably should not expect visual matching between those two monitors, but was expecting them to be "sort of close".
Using the i1d pro with its software I still have this problem that certain saturated reds looks very different - the 2711 shows them with a purple cast, while the old 20" is more orange. The annoying thing is that the 20" looks more realistic when I bring the physical reference into the room. A 10 years old sRGB lcd should not be more perceptually accurate than a brand-new wide-gamut photo-oriented display when both are calibrated with the nicest colorimeter out there?
Then again, perhaps it is the Adobe-supplied camera profiles for my camera that are weird, and the 2711 is just showing me accurately the color that camera/lightroom is telling it to?
-h
It is pretty dangerous to judge monitor profiling accuracy based upon Adobe profiles for camera shots!
You should get a Prophoto RGB color checker image and then compare it to a real life color checker chart under as close to D65 lighting as you can get on it.
I calibrated a standard gamut HDTV with i1 Display Pro and sadly none of my probes agreed on it hah. Although the two DTP94b had the closest take. For white balance when i1D Pro said R,G,B were balanced:
1. i1 pro said it had too much R,G and too little B
2. i1D2 said it had too much G and too little B
3. DTP94b1 said it had a lot too much R and a lot too little B
4. DTP94b2 said it had too much R and too little B
hah
the probes all disagreed about whether R or G were correct or too much hah
all did agree that the i1D Pro said it had too little B
I used the i1pro to sample white point grayscale in spectral cal on NEC PA241W and it said (when i1DPro said it was balance) it had a good deal too much R, a trace too little G and too little B. hah. In photoshop I tried taking out 3 parts red and adding 1 green and 2 blue to dark, mid and high tones with the oclor balance chance tool and compared to color checker and it then matched less well than before hand. who knows maybe i1d pro is the best.
adding more B seemed to make a worse match, so maybe the odd many out i1d pro was actually correct on B??
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It is pretty dangerous to judge monitor profiling accuracy based upon Adobe profiles for camera shots!
Yes I just discovered that. The "Adobe standard" profile seems to look very different from e.g. the "Camera standard" on my wide-gamut display, but much less so on my standard-gamut display. Further, this difference seems to only be visible in develop mode(!). For other colors, this manifests itself as "more saturation", but for deep reds it look like (to me) a shift in hue from orange-ish to purple-ish.
I tried making a profile of my camera using flash and the Colorshecker passport, using that instead of the built-in profiles. But I guess its small array of colors is not really enough to do a full camera characterisation?
-h
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I tried making a profile of my camera using flash and the Colorshecker passport, using that instead of the built-in profiles. But I guess its small array of colors is not really enough to do a full camera characterisation?
-h
it certainly helps, but still not perfect
for testing display calibration quality you still really need to give it an exact target, the exact colors the CC chart should have and show that on the screen and compare to the CC PP
it probably still won't ever look quite the same since the eye response to the spiky monitor primary colors varies a bit person to person
and the charts on an srgb monitor usually looks a bit different than on sRGB monitor even when a probe says they look the same due
metamerism