Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: Josh-H on April 29, 2011, 11:16:59 am
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I have just about burned through another set of 130ml ink cartridges for the Canon IPF6350 and need to order some replacements.
Anyone seen a better price than B&H? ($812.95)
I dont mind buying from B&H - its just their shipping options to Australia are really expensive (Like $100 for a set of inks :o )
Cheers,
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Adorama.com has the same deal, but I think that's the best you can do on straight across sets.
The problem with buying those sets is you wind up with a lot of surplus low-use colors after the second or third buy.
FWIW it might be better to buy a full set, then include extras on the high use colors to avoid having to pay another full shipping charge on a second piecemeal order. On my 8300 Yellow, Matte Black, Photo Magenta, Blue, Gray, and Photo Cyan are all way out in front of the other colors in volume, in about that order.
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If it costs that much to ship it, why not buy locally and support someone who can give you local support and warranty?
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If it costs that much to ship it, why not buy locally and support someone who can give you local support and warranty?
Thats easy - in Australia the inks sell for best price $145 each.
Australian $ currently equal $1.09 USA and in the US the inks are around $75 each.
Do the math.
Ed - I'd love to support a local dealer BTW: but it has to make economic sense.
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At least here in the US, I've been buying printer cartridges (Epson 3880) through Amazon. Don't know if that is an option for you.
Paul
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The major paper/printer suppliers are all good sources. www.shadesofpaper.com (but call them for the best pricing), www.itsupplies.com, www.lexjet.com, www.colorhq.com. They should all be +/- a few dollars of each other.
I too order from Amazon when I need it fast, thanks to Amazon Prime.
Neil
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Josh, I'm in Sydney, so I understand the pricing issues. But, when you say it makes no economic sense, then you're not looking at the full economic picture potentially.
If you're selling your work, then ink should be one of the smaller components of the cost. Unless you're actually going backwards, you need to decide on the value of having local support, local distribution and so forth. How long does it take to get ink from the US compared to a local dealer? I know a lot of the US dealers ship very promptly, but they'll never beat going into the local and buying immediately. If you have a fault, you've got no local warranty and if the local dealer decides to shut up shop you've got even less options. Are all of the dealers able to guarantee to ship to Australia? For shipments over $1000- you're liable for GST, so add 10% (avoiding it just risks the ATO stinging you with a fine if you get caught). Etc etc - I'm sure you've done all those numebrs.
The cost of doing business in Australia is higher than the US and the currently flagging USD and strident AUD is making it even more apparent.
Of course you don't want to pay any more for something than you have to, and competition is good, but if you're a professional then you're buying more than just the consumables. It may still be worth it, but again that 40% saving in ink is not a 40% reduction in your total costs - it's likely less than 5%, which is not really a big margin to pay for local support and distribution (which again is not to say some pressure on local prices is a bad thing - I love competition and cheaper prices as much as anyone :-)
Ultimately you're the only one who can decide what's right for you, so I'll never say you're wrong, but just consider the wider picture.
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Of course the fundamental problem faced by all artists is that production costs are 100% up-front and cash out of pocket. Profits come MUCH later, if they come at all. Too often it's a choice between penny pinching or simply not being able to continue working.
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AliExpress is your friend. Quite a few vendors at $US75 each for genuine Canon with free delivery to Australia. Many have multi-cart buys that are also well priced. That means you get them for $AU68.81 each, delivered, (approx. of course)
As to not bothering with small savings on costs - it's the additive effect of cost control that makes the difference in all businesses.
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Ordered online this morning a set form B&H - paid my B&H shipping tax ;D Still way cheaper than buying locally. Went with B&H as have used them before and always had very speedy shipping (even though their shipping costs are a little *cough* hard to swallow - I guess thats the trade off for fast and speedy shipping). I needed a Black Magic HDMI to SDI adapter a week ago and received it from B&H within 3 days of ordering with UPS.
As to the cost savings - If I have purchased these locally it would have cost me $1,740 Australian.
Landed from B&H these inks are costing me under $800 and I will have them in 3-5 days. Thats a massive relative saving in costs. Sure, the saving per print is small - but the overall saving is not small. In fact, I could buy two sets for the price of local purchase.
I always love to support my local dealer. Indeed I purchased my printer locally and camera gear locally (I even paid a premium on one of my camera bodies to buy locally). But even my local dealer is now telling their clients to buy online for ink. After all, provided ink is not past its expiry there really is not much that can go wrong with it.
Of course the fundamental problem faced by all artists is that production costs are 100% up-front and cash out of pocket. Profits come MUCH later
And that is exactly the point of a cost saving exercise and a very valid point to raise. My recent exhibition of my Iceland work finished here in Melbourne last week. I sold 50% of my work on display (was very happy with that result). Print prices started at $850 for 13 x 19 and went north from there. My trip to Iceland was almost a year ago so its taken me nearly a year to get a return on my investment - yet all my costs were up front (all the travel, time, etc. not to even mention cost of print production). The additional holding costs of that investment alone over this period of time needs to be offset against items such as print prices and my own costs of production. Therefore (for me), any savings in the cost of production are well worth while. Thats my thoughts on it anyway.
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As an aside, not to derail this thread, Wired Magazine has a monthly column wherein they deconstruct various consumer products like mouthwash, drain cleaner, shampoo, etc. This month, they chose to investigate one of the most expensive liquids on the planet, our own favourite: ink jet ink.
Their conclusion? 95% water. Nicely filtered water, mind you, and fairly pure.
Ninety-five percent. :o
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I seem to remember that humans are 95% water too. It's the active ingredients that are the important part. And the packaging! :)
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For what it is worth, probably only applicable to the US, I have fount that the best source of ink is to contact Marie Summers at Provantage. 800.336.4466 ext. 120. One of the reasons I suggest this is that for several years I have found the service to be unmatched. I also buy all my hard drives there as I can not find anywhere that beats them.
Alan
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I've experienced excellent prices (better than B&H and Amazon) and service from Atlex.com. If they would just do free shipping they would be the king.
http://www.atlex.com/
Good luck,
Stan
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Here in Oz we find even more ludicrous price differences. For that reason a lot of us use US based companies that will act as a US customer on your behalf. They then send the goods to you where-ever you are. There's a fee of course, but big savings can be made.
In my case I have a US relative who acts as my agent, takes delivery and posts stuff to us: anyone here have such a contact they can use? You are right about NAFTA, we have a similar free trade agreement with the US, and whole point of these agreements was to facilitate, you guessed it, free trade. We eliminated all duties apart from a soon to go 5% on cars, just to help all this free trade to happen.
I have heard of some Canadians who rent the smallest possible space across the border, perhaps with costs shared by several, just for the purpose of buying at US prices.
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Have you tried www.atlex.com? I have had good luck with them in the US.
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I've been buying Epson ink and paper from Atlex for several years and have found them to be best on price; shipping cost is reasonable and delivery has always been quick. Unfortunately their web site says that they do not ship Epson, HP or Canon professional goods out of the US.
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I have just about burned through another set of 130ml ink cartridges for the Canon IPF6350 and need to order some replacements.
Anyone seen a better price than B&H? ($812.95)
I dont mind buying from B&H - its just their shipping options to Australia are really expensive (Like $100 for a set of inks :o )
Cheers,
The only way I can see is that you guys have got to stop digging big holes all over your beautiful country and shipping what you find there off to China. It drives up the demand for your currency and makes you feel rich, then they turn it into something useful and sell it back to your for big price!
But the only thing worse than free trade and capitalism is the alternative!
But getting back OT, are there any Ebay traders sellng OEM ink over there? Here in the UK I am picking up 220ml Epson 7880 carts for £45 incl postage. Worth a look maybe.
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It seems B&H and altex seem to have the best prices on the CANON wide format inks.
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As an aside, not to derail this thread, Wired Magazine has a monthly column wherein they deconstruct various consumer products like mouthwash, drain cleaner, shampoo, etc. This month, they chose to investigate one of the most expensive liquids on the planet, our own favourite: ink jet ink.
Their conclusion? 95% water. Nicely filtered water, mind you, and fairly pure.
Ninety-five percent. :o
I don't know what type of ink they were testing but that is not true for Epson pigment inks. Several months ago when there was a debate about outgassing I looked at all the 3880 MSDS that list all the compounds in the inksets. Water is the major constituent but in most cases not even 1/2 the weight of the mixture. I think I posted the compositions of all 9 inksets and you can do a search on it to find it. I don't know about other companies or even other Epson inks.
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Alistair,
Many of us agree with you about digging up everything and then buying it back as finished goods, not clever. The companies doing this are enriching their owners and shareholders, many of whom are international in origin.
We locals see no real benefits in the situation, we have one of the world's highest mortgage interest rates, our manufacturing industry is seriously dying as we speak because of the high Aussie dollar, and I know no-one in middle or working income households who's gaining any benefit at all. The reverse in fact, and our income distribution is already one of the widest spreads in the OECD and getting worse.
But, while the dollar is high our canvas costs are down and ink as well, all neatly balancing out the poor consumer sentiment, high savings ratio and business uncertainty, leaving us about where we were when our dollar was worth much less.
Moan, groan ....
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It's a bit OT, but the Australian economy is out performing most. To understand the current issue with interest rates requires more than just the popular headlines. A good example of one of the factors can be read in this piece:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/05/09/3211033.htm
Manufacturing in Australia has been in decline even when it was USD0.48 to AUD1. Tourism and some exports are suffering, but other exports (raw materials) are benefiting, which is why we currently have a two-speed economy.
Relatively high interest rates are a sign of a growing economy, low unemployment and are creating a shift that is adjusting the housing market without crashing it as well as encouraging savings (which have historically been much lower here than other OECD economies).
We're currently paying back the debt incurred in avoiding a recession during the GFC - it was always going to happen, but it's part of a flattening of the boom-bust cycle and it's a lot less painful than riding the highs followed by the lows (just ask most of our friends here in the US and Europe).
Our banking system has come through the GFC as probably the most robust in the OECD.
Overall, we're doing reasonably well. Employment is good, inflation is in check, interest rates are historically pretty much normal, we're seeing economic growth despite local natural disasters and others in the region and with our trading partners. Business and consumer confidence would best be described as circumspect, but that's appropriate given the last few years.
Also, bear in mind that the AUD's appreciation against the USD and the JPY is more about the devaluation of the others than the appreciation of the AUD (although the AUD is now gaining its own momentum and additional value, as noted in the article linked above).
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Interesting how different people's circumstances result in very different views.