Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: Mark F on August 11, 2009, 09:48:08 pm
-
As a practical matter, how many different papers do you use? Not different sizes but different papers?
In my chemical darkroom I had settled on one paper and used it most of the time until I switched to something else I liked better. I suspect I'd wind up doing the same with these printers but would like to know what you guys are doing. For the record, I shoot mostly landscape with occasional wildlife. No commercial/product work and rarely do portraits.
I am about to buy my first printer and have decided on a 17" model, which means either the Epson 3800 or the Canon 5100. I've been following (what seems like) the hundreds ☺ of posts here comparing these two models and have concluded that I wouldn't go wrong with either printer and the quality of my prints will have much more to do with my skill rather than the printer. Size and weight are important but not the deciding factor and one feature that the smaller and lighter 3800 lacks is the ability to use rolls of paper that are less costly than pre-cut sheets.
Thanks.
Mark
-
At least around 5 papers for me, namely :
- Enhanced Matte or Matte Heavyweight, low-profile matte for first proofs,
- Glossy for RC glossy prints (mostly for family snapshots these days), and for panos too (see below),
- Semigloss RC for panos, too bad there are too many papers available in 13" rolls
- Hahnemuhle German Etching (lovely) and Epson WatercolorBW (cheaper, A3+ only) for textured matte prints,
- Gold Fibre Silk for non-textured and high-gamut prints.
I'm thinking about using canvas for panos, but haven't found an cheap enough solution yet.
-
After trying all sorts of paper, I've pretty much settled on a basic Lustre finish r/c coated. I like the house paper from Ink Jet Art. It's half the price of Epson, prints well, and is available in 17x25 inch cut sheets (as well as a variety of other sizes.)
-
As a practical matter, how many different papers do you use? Not different sizes but different papers?
After a fair bit of testing I've settled on the following for my Epson 3800:
1) Epson Exhibition Fiber
2) Hahnemuhle Fine Art Baryta
3) Ilford Gold Fibre Silk
Most everything gets tried on the EEF paper first; however, at times an image just works a tiny bit better on the Ilford, and sometimes I like the more pronounced texture of the Hahnemuhle, so while EEF is the paper I use the most (by far), I always keep stock of the other 2 around in a few sizes just in case.
Disappointments amongst the other papers have been numerous - more times than not, I try some recommended paper and find it totally unsuitable. Personal testing for what you like is critical here - luckily there are lots of choices out there, so I'm sure you'll find something. I've got to say that I've not yet found a "cheaper" paper that is as good as what I've listed; in my experience, you get what you pay for when it comes to paper.
-m
-
For archival papers in my iPF5000 (modified to use the four 5100 grayscale inks) I use Ilford GFS and Innova Photo Smooth Cotton 315. For proofing papers, Red River UltraPro 2.0 Satin and Polar Matte - both available in 100' rolls and and 17x25 cut sheets at very reasonable prices. I print these using the same profiles as their archival mates, with driver tweaks for a very close, predictable match.
Another feature of the Canon X100 printers is their vacuum paper hold-down system similar to that in the larger Epsons (and 4880) rather than the mechanical "pizza wheels" used by the 3800. Bullet-proof, mar-free paper transport in the Canons has been the norm.
Pete
-
I use 2 papers, both Epson (I have an Epson 4880 printer). Most serious prints go on Premium Luster, a wonderful and reasonably priced paper that is available is sheets and rolls. Perhaps 25% of serious prints go on Exhibition Fiber, when I want its astounding whites. It is very expensive and not available in rolls, however.
Matte papers, feh.
Peter
-
I have been printing on one paper after trying a dozen samples initially. I use Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Satin - in the roll form - on my Z3100.
I like the delicate surface sheen in particular. Alas! it is one of the most expensive papers. (I am not a high volume printer, however.)
Howard
-
Running a printing studio as I do gives me a lot of opportunity to try different papers and we currently stock 15 choices. I'm actually testing and profiling 6 more today (My name is R___R___ and I'm a paper addict.)
Personally for my landscape work on our Canon 8100, I prefer, in no particular order, Harman FB AL and the warm tone version, Moab Entrada Natural and Bright White, Hahnemühle Photo Rag Satin and sometimes Ilford Galerie Gold Fibre Silk, although it has a wee bit of gloss differential.
Sure beats the old darkroom days of "Ya' want it on glossy or matte?"
-
Running a printing studio as I do gives me a lot of opportunity to try different papers and we currently stock 15 choices. I'm actually testing and profiling 6 more today (My name is R___R___ and I'm a paper addict.)
I don't run a printing studio but would agree with Rob that it is really easy to become a paper addict!! I've tested a fair number of papers and tried to keep things very simple:
Ilford Gold Fibre Silk for most "glossy" prints and occasionally Epson Exhibition Fiber (though I don't find it outperforms the Ilford paper and this is maybe why we've seen the recent price cut by Epson as maybe their sales are low). For matte papers (which I do like for certain images), it is mainly Hahnemuhle Ultra Smooth, Bamboo and William Turner. About a month ago I did some profile prints from my R2880 for Museo and they sent me 25 count boxes as compensation for the ink and time to print (ended up with 23 fresh sheets after doing the requisite 3 prints for Museo). I'm seriously comparing the Museo papers to see if they are better than what I'm using but as of now haven't made a decision. I do like the Museo Silver Rag and Portfolio Rag papers.
-
Great information guys, thanks. And you're right, Rob. I never had this great a choice of papers when printing b&w.
-
Ilford Gold Fibre Silk for most "glossy" prints and occasionally Epson Exhibition Fiber (though I don't find it outperforms the Ilford paper and this is maybe why we've seen the recent price cut by Epson as maybe their sales are low).
Regarding these two papers - initially I thought them to be "competitors" but the more I print with both, I tend to see these as complimentary. I hope what I type next might make sense as it's late and the gin and tonic sitting next to me is pretty tasty!
Anyway, for my tastes, in B&W images, I find the Epson Exhibition Fiber to have a slight bit more dynamic range than the Ilford. It's a subtle difference, but I find I get a slightly better black and a slightly better white out of the Epson paper, although at times this seems to make the paper a bit "hot" in the whites for some subjects. The biggest difference for me is that I've not yet found a paper from anyone that does as good a job at delineating the 3/4 tones as the Epson paper - in that range it just has this magic that makes it my favorite paper. I haven't noticed this difference on every image though - at times I've printed an image on both papers (on an Epson 3800) and the differences are barely perceptible, and other times it's more apparent.
So I'm finding as of late that if a print just seems to be a bit too hot on the Epson paper that running it on Gold Fibre Silk is the answer and it turns out dialed just right. Hence, I'm going to go forward and stock both papers since they both have their place, and also keep some Hahnemuhle Fine Art Baryta around for when it does the job, although I tend to experience more curl issues with their papers than everyone elses.
Great to have these choices, we live in exciting times!
-m
-
I can't help but wonder if obsessing about paper choices could fall into the :what do you do to avoid photographing" thread !
Peter
-
I can't help but wonder if obsessing about paper choices could fall into the :what do you do to avoid photographing" thread !
Peter
Because of the remark above after some trials (including some of the baryta papers mentioned before) I settled for 1 paper: Ilford Galerie Smooth Pearl.
I frame my prints behind glass so tactile properties, surface etc is only limited value to me. I only print for myself. The glass makes them also "glossy" anyway (which i like).
For occasional print on mat paper I keep a roll of Innova FibaPrint White Matte 285gsm IFA39
[attachment=16000:You_Are_Framed.jpg]
-
which ever ones I happen to get for free lol
any heavy weight gloss will do for snaps, kirkland gloss or harman crystaljet normally
for anything else I'm using up my free stocks of fibre based paper from harman, ilford, epson, innova and hahnemuhle.
don't bother with matt/cotton papers cause they don't have the Dmax or the colour gamut for my type of images.
R2400 with fotospeed CIS and my own profiling.
-
After testing many papers from Canson, Epson & Hahnemühle, for my type of photography (Water), I will stay with:
Epson EF and Ilford GFS, eventually when Canson send out its samples for their new Baryta paper, I would have to test it.
On certain images that have a subtle look, I would use:
- Canson Infinity Arches Aquarelle
- Hahnemühle Torchon
- Canson Infinity Edition Etching Rag
- Hahnemühle William Turner
Gonzalo
-
There is a camera store I’ve been to a few times that has a loose leaf binder with the same 4 prints on dozens of different kinds of paper. One people portrait, one architectural photo, one nature photo, and one B&W photo. It was interesting to see the same photos on all the different papers. Papers I saw rave comments about in the forums did not appeal to me at all. I tried Epson Premium Luster and Epson Premium Semi-gloss, and stuck with the Epson Premium Semi-gloss. I’ve had a custom profile built for it.
I have also used some Red River papers, but they have a kind of cold blue tint to them, but if not placed side by side with the Epson Premium Semi-gloss, Red River papers look good, and worth looking at.
To answer the original question, I only use one paper. Epson Premium Semi-gloss.
-
I have also used some Red River papers, but they have a kind of cold blue tint to them, but if not placed side by side with the Epson Premium Semi-gloss, Red River papers look good, and worth looking at.
This only applies to RR papers with "Arctic" in their name. Their Polar Satin/Gloss and UltraPro 2.0 Satin/Gloss are very much like Ilford Galerie Smooth Pearl/Gloss with a slightly warm tone, and are papers that perform well above their pricing in my experience.
Pete
-
After a fair bit of testing I've settled on the following for my Epson 3800:
1) Epson Exhibition Fiber
2) Hahnemuhle Fine Art Baryta
3) Ilford Gold Fibre Silk
Pretty much where I'm at ... anything under 24x30 goes on EEF, anything larger on roll Hahnemuhle FAB. I liked Ilford GFS at first, but lately it seems a little "boring" looking to me ... not really a gloss but not a matt either. Nice paper, but I just feel like the other two have a little more character. I may try the Ilford with a couple of Black and whites I'm working on ... it seems a little bit warmer which I tend to prefer on B&W most of the time.
-
I'm still printing some sizes of Harman FB AL, but as I run out I've pretty much replaced it with Ilford Gold Fiber Silk. For matte I use Ilford Smooth Fine Art and sometimes Hahnemuhle William Turner. I will try the new Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta sometime in the next week or so.
-
I would add here to any paper companies that are reading this - please change your sizing to 17x25!!!
Yes, Yes, Yes. Ilford, Epson, are you listening?
-
I use the Epson Heavyweight Matte as a cheap solution when making simple courtesy prints for others when I don't want to spend much on materials. For my own work I now use the Innova Soft Textured Natural White for just about everything. I still have some Hahnemuhle Photo Rag here which is beautiful but rather expensive.