Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: marcmccalmont on July 19, 2007, 05:08:48 pm
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I am new to medium format and am planning on assembling a used Mamiya 645 AFD II outfit over the next few months (I have the 645 AFD II).
1) Lenses, I am planning on the following:
AF 35mm F3.5
AF 55-110 F4.5
AF 105-210 F4.5 ULD
AF APO 300 F4.5 if
Are these as sharp as the primes? Any suggestions?
2) Digital Back,
Beer budget and Champaign tastes so probably the Mamiya zd back unless for under $10K there is a used alternative that would be a better choice?
3) I will use this mostly for landcape photography here in Hawaii.
Thanks
Marc
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I have the 35mm. Not for long and from the first contact sheet I have it looks pretty sharp. As it was not done on glossy paper I checked the neg and I don't see anything wrong, still better than my 24mm Nikon. Though tomorrow I will have more to look at.
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The 35 is a decent lens, but not quite as sharp as the new 28mm or the 55-110 for instance.
Regards,
Bernard
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This is pretty much my plan as well. I've run right off the resolution limits of my DSLR even with my own sharpening and demosaicing software. I need more bits in all dimensions. Better lenses wouldn't hurt, either. The ZD+AFD combination looks very good from a price and capability standpoint, and has an excellent upgrade path for the future unlike integrated cameras. I really do need to drop by Joe's shop and do a hands-on, but it's a pain to get downtown during the week (basically I have to kiss off the entire day).
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This is pretty much my plan as well. I've run right off the resolution limits of my DSLR even with my own sharpening and demosaicing software. I need more bits in all dimensions. Better lenses wouldn't hurt, either. The ZD+AFD combination looks very good from a price and capability standpoint, and has an excellent upgrade path for the future unlike integrated cameras. I really do need to drop by Joe's shop and do a hands-on, but it's a pain to get downtown during the week (basically I have to kiss off the entire day).
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=129128\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Who or what is "Joes" shop?
Thanks,
Don
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Vistek in Toronto
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Ditto. Seems to be a few of us in the same boat!
I have some MF lenses already; others to decide on . .
Pentax FA 35mm or Mamiya 35mm?
The Pentax is doubtless a much better lens, but I'm still awaiting my Pentax -> Mamiya adaptor to test the pair together.
Hartblei 45mm Super Rotator or Mamiya 45mm f2.8 or Distagon 50mm or Mamiya 50 Shift?
I'd love the SR to be as good as the others because of its versatility. I have the first two, but not the last two. Will test them all and let you know how I get on!
Late 4-digit Biometar 80mm f2.8 in adapted Pentacon 6 mount.
Beautiful, beautiful lens. You can keep your 'kit' offering.
Mamiya 120 Macro
Obviously.
Mamiya 55-110mm AF
Also seems like a no-brainer
Mamiya 200mm f2.8 Apo
En route . . . not yet tried.
I still have an Arsat 30 knocking around from an earlier experiment: it will be interesting to see how that compares to the Mamiya 24mm and the 28mm f4.5 when budget permits.
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Mark:
I shoot with the Mamiya 35mm quite a bit and would love to get a better lens - what Pentax > Mamiya adapter is available?
Tim Ernst in Arkansas
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Ditto. Seems to be a few of us in the same boat!
I have some MF lenses already; others to decide on . .
I'm in that boat as well
FYI Frank Doorhof has posted some nice photos at DPReview
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp...essage=24087319 (http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1014&message=24087319)
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp...essage=23973274 (http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1025&message=23973274)
Enjoy!
Jon
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Frank has a stunning eye for lighting but that doesn't change the fact that the ZD back seems to be producing extremely rich and subtle skin/gradient toning with very little mottling or hue variation. This, and the availability of superior lenses, are the main reasons for my interest in the device.
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Sean have you been in Toronto to play with the ZD yet?
I' like to go but I am in Mtl and I have no time so far to make such a ride
I would like to see RAW files of it.
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Sean have you been in Toronto to play with the ZD yet?
I' like to go but I am in Mtl and I have no time so far to make such a ride
I would like to see RAW files of it.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=129397\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
David,
The previous week was full of post processing, and the coming week my transport is otherwise spoken for. So, it will be another week before I can contemplate going down to TO to exercise the ZD back. Which is, on reflection, entirely convenient because I need to go by DryTac in Vaughn and pick up laminating film. So, in a week more or less I should have my own feedback and a sample file or two.
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Mark:
I shoot with the Mamiya 35mm quite a bit and would love to get a better lens - what Pentax > Mamiya adapter is available?
Tim Ernst in Arkansas
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=129195\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I'm working on one myself now: hope to have a functional prototype in a week or so. An unnamed manufacturer in the Far East is also looking into the feasibility of producing the adaptor on a larger scale. Watch this space . . .
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Frank has a stunning eye for lighting but that doesn't change the fact that the ZD back seems to be producing extremely rich and subtle skin/gradient toning with very little mottling or hue variation. This, and the availability of superior lenses, are the main reasons for my interest in the device.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=129388\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Sean,
Frank has produced prevous good work, the the latest images posted I would have to disagree on. The color seems to be way too blue in the images with the mid tone gray background, and the skin tones are starting to approach a smooth plastic like texture of some of the 35mm DSLR's. When Frank shoots on a white or black background, the skin tone rendering seems to improve a lot. I would like to see other photographer's posting some high lighting ratio photos of people from the Mamiya ZD back or camera please!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks,
db
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it reminds me the vinyl time when you could listen to all of them to make sure that what you bought was what you could like... now with CD the only one you can listen are the one you hear thousand times a day on radio...
almost the same with DB...
(it is a little bit exaggerate but you catch what I mean)
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I'm working on one myself now: hope to have a functional prototype in a week or so. An unnamed manufacturer in the Far East is also looking into the feasibility of producing the adaptor on a larger scale. Watch this space . . .
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=129430\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I´ve got lots of Pentax 645 lenses. An adapter to use them on a Mamiya 645 AFD would be very attractive for me. Will your home-made have an automatic aperture or will you have to stop down manually?
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My prototype (providing it works: the parts are still en route) will be stop down only. However, the manufacturer I mentioned earlier is investigating an auto aperture version. However, I've used lots and lots of adapted lenses on the Canon, and don't know of a single AE conversion short of Conurus full mount surgery for the Contax N range which also retains autofocus.
It seems quite possible to develop a similar auto-everything conversion for Pentax lenses, but it won't be a project I'll be undertaking any time soon. Stop down, like the MF Mamiya lenses, will be good enough for me: I just want to pair up my FA35 and ZD back!
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My prototype (providing it works: the parts are still en route) will be stop down only. However, the manufacturer I mentioned earlier is investigating an auto aperture version. However, I've used lots and lots of adapted lenses on the Canon, and don't know of a single AE conversion short of Conurus full mount surgery for the Contax N range which also retains autofocus.
It seems quite possible to develop a similar auto-everything conversion for Pentax lenses, but it won't be a project I'll be undertaking any time soon. Stop down, like the MF Mamiya lenses, will be good enough for me: I just want to pair up my FA35 and ZD back!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=129688\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
WHO is this manufacturer? Does he have a website?
Such an adapter would enable me to enter the Mamiya 645AF-Sytem at very low cost, as I have already all the pentax lenses.
So this information is pretty HOT for me.
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Mark:
Yup, your adapter might start another rush for the Pentax 35mm like the Zeiss 21mm to Canon party of a couple years ago. Stop down would be fine for me too, and I hope you are developing this with an eye towards a bit of distribution...
Tim Ernst in Arkansas
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I've been asked not to say who the manufacturer is: Frank Doorhof referred this guy to me who quite independently of my efforts was trying to get a FA35 and other Pentax glass adapted for his ZD. He bumped into the MD of a certain far eastern manufacturer of after-market photographic goods in his local Mamiya dealer and struck up a conversation about his adaptor project.
Said MD took a genuine interest, and it appears that they are looking into official development of an adaptor. Needless to say, this is all – quite literally – Chinese whispers at present, and my 'contact' has asked me not to divulge any specifics at this stage of the process.
I am somewhat skeptical that an auto adaptor can be made at all, but he doesn't share my pessimism on this point! In a few days – postman willing – I should have the bits to put together a prototype. If it works, I would be prepared to put together another one for board members. If there was sufficient demand, I'd be quite happy to look into subcontracting small scale production to a specialist, or publishing instructions on my site ( http://www.16-9.net/fa35.html (http://www.16-9.net/fa35.html) is interesting!) to enable others to make their own.
All I want – all I really, really want – is to get my ZD together with my FA35! I have always considered this lens to be the exact MF equivalent of the Zeiss 21mm. Remember about four years ago when it too was undervalued and underappreciated, but worked like nothing else on the 1Ds Mark I?
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A little remark from my side about the too blueish tones.
Could you please post a picture, some of my work is filtered with blue or tabacco for a certain look, that's not a problem with my colorbalance
I think you mean this series:
(http://www.doorhof.nl/models/albums/userpics/10001/Stephanie_21_juli_2007_-4.jpg)
A blue layer was used indeed for this.
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Are those highlights just fried or did you muck them up in Post?
Frank I think it would better to post regular shots.. Not something you destroyed in Photoshop...
Just some friendly advice.
There are all kinds of Problems with that picture, Color being the main one.
Not sure Mmaiya would like that..:+]
Snook
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Are those highlights just fried or did you muck them up in Post?
Frank I think it would better to post regular shots.. Not something you destroyed in Photoshop...
Just some friendly advice.
There are all kinds of Problems with that picture, Color being the main one.
Not sure Mmaiya would like that..:+]
Snook
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This is very rude; not "friendly advice" at all. It is not what I expect to read on a forum where the forum owner urges, and most regulars maintain, a tone of mutual respect and consideration. You may certainly disagree with Frank's style, but I urge you to pursue other ways to express it.
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Let's keep it civil! This isn't DPReview . . .
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@Snook,
That's your opinion.
Mamiya LOVES my shots, so that is ok I think.
The way I approach my photography will differ from those you will use, but I believe we had that discussion earlier, when you mailed me to stop copying your style (up untill than I never heard of you), and that mail was not very nice to say the least, even when I tried to answer you very politly, so maybe you are a bit frustated with something ?
Don't be, the world is big enough for alot of styles and personallities, but PLEASE stop chasing me with this sort of campaigns, I'm a very nice person but this is really beginning to bug me.
I never destroy pictures, but I have my own style, and that style is differse as far as I know, and WHEN a highlight is blown, trust me that is intended, and when a picture has a blue cast, trust me that is intended.
With modelphotography I make my art the way I see fit, and that is more than just pressing the shutter and getting everything nice and balanced in the rules someone makes. I love to experiment with color and with blending modes, for me Photoshop is a gift to the photographer of the modern day.
Accentlights are often 1/3 stop above my mainlight, meaning accents WILL blow out but that is again totally intentional.
But I guess you like the safe work more, and that's ok, here something to ease your mind, or wait, never shoot into the sun ?? (just kidding of course).
Oh and I blew the highlights in the water..... (again pun intended)
See www.frankdoorhof.com for the rest of my work.
Maybe good to visit that before you again make ridicilous claims about my work.
For the mods, very sorry to be so blunt, normally I'm a very civil person but as mentioned before, this person and I have a history which from his side is let's say not so nice and civil
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What side do you have with me Frank?
I think your mistaken on that.
Maybe on another forum I ask you not to post everyrthing so rosy as you have been accused of being Promoter of Mamiya equipment, So your answers are biased ofcourse.
I asked you (In another foorum) to please post anything negative like buffering and such and you never did.
I have nothing against you at all..? Contrary. I appreciated a lot of your Information you posted about the ZD. Biased or not...
Which thanks again.
But when people start talking about blue cast etc... How can anybody make an opinion on something that IMHO opinion has been destroyed in Photoshop.
If the truth hurts, Sorry.
But I do not think it is fair representation of the ZD after so much post.. actually I think it hurts it.
That picture sure looks pretty blown on the skin and has the orangy Digital phenom on the skin tones as well.
I did not say the picture was horrible... Just that you pretty much destroyed any information that was representative of the ZD, and for that reason Mamiya probably would not like it..
SO take it how you want.
It is My Opinion Only..:+}
PS...
I destroy some of my pictures from time to time to get that "destroyed" highlight look as well.
Snook
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Maybe it's the power of the written word than that took the words come out rather negative to me.
I'm no longer posting pics for the review of the Mamiya anymore, but I'm doing my work and with my work also working with colorlayers is a part of the look I sometimes want.
The thing I was remarking to is the unpleasent mail conversation (well I don't even call it a conversation) we had a while ago in which you claimed I was copying your style and you wanted me to stop immediatly, I mailed you back that I did not know you and I did not know what this was about, when you got really aggressive, I did a search and found some shots you did on a cargraveyard and I did some on a cargraveyard, I did not found however any similarities execpt they both used old cars and beautiful girls
It's the same as photographing in a hotel room and mailing everyone that shoots in a hotelroom, I'm 100% honest when I say I never (activly) heard from you before that, let alone was copying something you did, when looking at the shots it was also clear that it was not even similair, except the girls and the cars.
When something like that happens, and you read this I hope you understand I'm jumping into defence mode
Again, I'm not a difficult person and I answer everyone that mails me and I love to share, HOWEVER I do have a own style of photography and PS work.
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A little remark from my side about the too blueish tones.
Could you please post a picture, some of my work is filtered with blue or tabacco for a certain look, that's not a problem with my colorbalance
I think you mean this series:
thanks,
db
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Well should I also mention that they were shot on the brand paper I use, add a little video showing what I did, and attach the original RAW files ???
Sorry to maybe come over wrong but this is ridicilous, I think it's clearly seen that the tint is done on purpose and is not some noob who doesn't know how to balance a picture on the camera side.....
I post my pictures and if ANYONE has ANY questions about it I will explain what I did (always have and always will).
However there are some people looking for a stick and there can always one be found.
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Well should I also mention that they were shot on the brand paper I use, add a little video showing what I did, and attach the original RAW files ???
Sorry to maybe come over wrong but this is ridicilous, I think it's clearly seen that the tint is done on purpose and is not some noob who doesn't know how to balance a picture on the camera side.....
I post my pictures and if ANYONE has ANY questions about it I will explain what I did (always have and always will).
However there are some people looking for a stick and there can always one be found.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=130644\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Frank,
I sorry if I hurt your feelings, I am interested in the Mamiya AFDII back and was wondering if it had any blue tinge issues that is all. I am not a very good wordsmith like a lot of folks on this forum.
Best,
db
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I started this topic just to get some feedback on mamiya lenses and digital backs
wow! BTW I really like Franks style (for advertisements) I wish I was that good. (I would love a tutorial) I also like Michael Reichmann's realistic style (for landscapes) I wish I was that good too.
Marc
PS I did find out the 35mm is a bit soft so the thread wasn't a total loss
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Hi Frank
Please continue to post your images. I would ignore some of these comments. We need more photographers like you that go to the time of posting their work. And this is very important for the ZD back right now. Keep up the good work,
Denis
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Thanks, by the way don't know if I ever commented you about it but your site is in my favorites for the STUNNING work.
About the 35mm, don't know who finds it a bit soft but maybe it's copy dependend, I own the 35mm and it's a very very nice lens, I find it very sharp, even wide open it's very usable.
about the blue tint, when a back has a problem it's often due to bad operation from the AWB or the photographer, when you work in a calibrated workflow (which I urge everyone in my workshops to do) it should be no problem.
The simplest way is to shoot with a graycard and RAW of course, and use the graycard later on to balance your shots.
If you should have a blue tone in for example your shadows (but I never heard of this in the high-end backs, but correct me if I'm wrong) you can always make a selection and set a blackpoint with the settings 1,1,1.
Greetings,
Frank
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Great work, Frank, I can see why Mamiya loves your work. Don't let some DPreview exile with a chip on his shoulder get you down.
Quentin