Luminous Landscape Forum
Site & Board Matters => About This Site => Topic started by: Rob C on March 01, 2007, 04:21:14 pm
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Never mind accidental penguins - THIS is a damn great shot!
Ciao - Rob C
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Never mind accidental penguins - THIS is a damn great shot!
Ciao - Rob C
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I agree - I prefer it to the penguin shot.
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Ditto - very nice picture.
Regarding Michael's question about the difference in color temperature of the berg versus that of the snow on the glacier --
This is not scientific and I've done no research, but could it be that the snow on the glacier has a slightly different composition since it fell as precepitation from the sky whereas the berg has been dipped in the chemically rich ocean water?
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Ice is ice and snow is snow. I don't think it's any more complicated than that. Ice is a lot denser than snow and has different reflective qualities.
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Ditto - very nice picture.
Regarding Michael's question about the difference in color temperature of the berg versus that of the snow on the glacier --
This is not scientific and I've done no research, but could it be that the snow on the glacier has a slightly different composition since it fell as precepitation from the sky whereas the berg has been dipped in the chemically rich ocean water?
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Bergs are bluer than snow, by far. Be aware that many icebergs have been in glaciers where they were covered by hundreds of feet of snow for thousands of years. This compresses all the oxygen and air out of the ice and gives them a distinctly blue cast. Some of them are VERY blue. And as Icebergs float around, the bottom has the snow melt off and what you get left is BLUE ice. The 'bergs eventually flop over so you get these weird blue jaggies all over the place.
For example:
(http://blloyd.smugmug.com/photos/132044999-L.jpg)
(http://blloyd.smugmug.com/photos/132043900-L.jpg)
Look at all the blue ice surrounding the center iceberg. The color on that is pretty accurate.
In fact, we saw some weird colors on the 'bergs, some that the staff didn't even know what was going on. For example:
(http://blloyd.smugmug.com/photos/132042652-L.jpg)
What's that green stuff? It was actually green ice on the side of the iceberg. Nobody knew WHY.
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Fasinating! CatOne, thanks for the explanation and beautiful pictures.
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Interesting theory; so how do you get the oxygen out of ice, which is simply frozen water, which is just hydrogen and oxygen in the first place? If there was no oxygen there would be zilch in that berg except frozen hydrogen... I think not.
Ciao - Rob C
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Interesting theory; so how do you get the oxygen out of ice, which is simply frozen water, which is just hydrogen and oxygen in the first place? If there was no oxygen there would be zilch in that berg except frozen hydrogen... I think not.
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CatOne is quite right, he means the oxygen that it trapped between the ice not the oxygen within the water. As the snow/ice is compacted further less and less oxygen exists between the water particles, which turns the ice bluer and bluer. This is the same explanation I was given by several geologists last time I visited Iceland for the deep blue colour of some of the glaciers there.
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A few pointers:
wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_ice_%28glacial%29)
Cause of Colors (http://webexhibits.org/causesofcolor/5C.html), that also states that glacier ice lasts longer in drinks...
Illustrated Guide to a Glacier (http://www.carleton.edu/departments/GEOL/Links/AlumContributions/blueice/blue.html)
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Glacial ice lasts longer in drinks because of it consists of larger crystals than the ice in your freezer - ice melts from the outside inward and larger crystals expose a smaller percentage of their volume as surface area - the difference is small, but it does exist. Glacial ice is also loaded with impurities, which further hinder light absorption. Anyone who's seen a glacial lake or river can attest to that. Pressure on a glacier compresses air bubbles, it does not remove them. That's why scientists can study ice core samples from places like Greenland and determine the composition of the atmosphere when the ice was formed.
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Glacial ice lasts longer in drinks because of it consists of larger crystals than the ice in your freezer - ice melts from the outside inward and larger crystals expose a smaller percentage of their volume as surface area - the difference is small, but it does exist. Glacial ice is also loaded with impurities, which further hinder light absorption. Anyone who's seen a glacial lake or river can attest to that. Pressure on a glacier compresses air bubbles, it does not remove them. That's why scientists can study ice core samples from places like Greenland and determine the composition of the atmosphere when the ice was formed.
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Thanks for that - I had suspected all along that those quoted Icelandic geologists were really those guys from up Rushmore.
Ciao - Rob C
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Glacial ice lasts longer in drinks because of it consists of larger crystals than the ice in your freezer - ice melts from the outside inward and larger crystals expose a smaller percentage of their volume as surface area - the difference is small, but it does exist. Glacial ice is also loaded with impurities, which further hinder light absorption. Anyone who's seen a glacial lake or river can attest to that. Pressure on a glacier compresses air bubbles, it does not remove them. That's why scientists can study ice core samples from places like Greenland and determine the composition of the atmosphere when the ice was formed.
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Today, bottled spring water. Tomorrow, bags of glacier ice.
But if glacier ice lasts longer, will it get your drink as cold?
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Isn't photography educational!
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LOL Howie - same temperature, but it's a godsend for folks who love grit in their scotch.
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LOL Howie - same temperature, but it's a godsend for folks who love grit in their scotch.
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But if it transfers heat slower (same amount of ice lasts longer), the loss to the bar room may keep the scotch warmer. Scotch and grit. New tooth paste?
A kilogram of ice will absorb 335 kj of heat to melt. If it requires more time to do this (melts slower) the drink will not get as cold. If the ice didn't melt at all, the drink wouldn't care if it were with ice or neat.
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We chipped some "black ice" off one of the icebergs, It was described as being 30,000 years old by one of the expedition leaders, a glaciologist. During the last week of the trip we used it in our Scotch in the bar.
Eat your heart out Glenfidich.
Michael
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We chipped some "black ice" off one of the icebergs, It was described as being 30,000 years old by one of the expedition leaders, a glaciologist. During the last week of the trip we used it in our Scotch in the bar.
Eat your heart out Glenfidich.
Michael
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LOL!!! Now as a serious scotch drinker that is something one can appreciate!
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Said glaciologist with said "black ice" fwiw:
(http://blloyd.smugmug.com/photos/134816138-L.jpg)
Bob was hilarious. He had some pretty damned funny stories.