Luminous Landscape Forum

Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: fishbain on February 07, 2007, 03:00:15 pm

Title: aptus 17
Post by: fishbain on February 07, 2007, 03:00:15 pm

Hi all,
I’ve been reading this forum for some time but this is my first post here.
And my question is…
Where can I get a Refurbished Aptus 17, and for how much?

Thanks,

Moti.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: yaya on February 07, 2007, 03:30:20 pm

Welcome Moti,

Please let me know which part of the world you are in and I will point you to the right people you should be talking to, or better even I'll get somebody to contact you.

Refurbished backs are available from the factory although some dealers may be holding limited stock of these.

It would also help to know which camera you are looking to use it on.

Best regards

Yair

[span style=\'font-size:7pt;line-height:100%\']Yair Shahar | Regional Manager | Leaf EMEA |
mob: +44 77 8992 8199 | yair.shahar@kodak.com | www.leaf-photography.com
Leaf, part of Kodak's Graphic Communications Group
[/span]

Quote

Hi all,
I’ve been reading this forum for some time but this is my first post here.
And my question is…
Where can I get a Refurbished Aptus 17, and for how much?

Thanks,

Moti.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=99694\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Title: aptus 17
Post by: fishbain on February 07, 2007, 04:04:19 pm

Hi Yair,
Actually I’m from Israel, and I did get a price from Jugend, but it seams to high for me (13500$).
I know from this forum that the price for a refurbished one in the USA is around 9500$ and I’m trying to confirm this and find out why there’s such a big deference.
I can get a P20 for 8000$ new, so it’s a big dilemma for me.

The camera will be Mamiya AFD

Thanks,
Moti.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: rueyloon on February 07, 2007, 08:37:35 pm

same situation here,  I can only get a refurbished p20 back for around 8k USD, and a new one would be about 11k USD.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: yaya on February 08, 2007, 03:38:25 am

::Sent you an E-mail::

Quote

Hi Yair,
Actually I’m from Israel, and I did get a price from Jugend, but it seams to high for me (13500$).
I know from this forum that the price for a refurbished one in the USA is around 9500$ and I’m trying to confirm this and find out why there’s such a big deference.
I can get a P20 for 8000$ new, so it’s a big dilemma for me.

The camera will be Mamiya AFD

Thanks,
Moti.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=99706\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Title: aptus 17
Post by: John_Black on February 08, 2007, 04:29:02 pm

I think $8k is retail for a P20 Mamiya back with the standard 1 year warranty (the 3 year warranty with 24 replacement adds $3k) - Calumet (http://www.calumetphoto.com/item/PE71255C.html).  I spoke with Digital Transitions earlier this week regarding their offer for a Mamiya AFD II + P20 for $8990.  According to them Phase One has a $1000 rebate on Mamiya backs.  The "+" backs are expected to ship in March or April, so they may have used P20, P21, P25, etc. when people swap for the "+"'s or simply trade-in.

$8900 is an attractive price for AFD-II Kit w/ P20, but I'm not crazy about the square sensor nor the crop factor.  I'd rather work a deal on a used P25, but I suspect that would still more expensive than I could handle.  Just in case anybody missed it, here's the Digital Transitions deal - Mamiya 645 AFD II with P20 Back - $8990 (https://digitaltransitions.com/promo/q4_promo.htm).  I have a 1Ds2 now, so I'll probably wait to see what Canon announces at PMA.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: jimgolden on February 09, 2007, 01:19:10 am

john theres no way I'd opt for the P20/AFD deal coming from a 1Ds Mk2...altho it is a sweet price.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: yaya on February 09, 2007, 02:48:35 am

All,

Please note that for commercial use, a square 16MP chip in reality only gives about 11.5MP when cropped into a page and an acutal area size of about 37X26MM

A 43X31 17MP chip gives more like 16.5MP and an actual area size of 43X30.5MM.

So there's quite a big difference in both practical resolution and the crop factor.

This may help in understanding the price, quality and usability differences between these two backs, along with speed (capture rate/ burst).

Rgds

Yair

Title: aptus 17
Post by: Dustbak on February 09, 2007, 08:48:49 am

Quote

All,

Please note that for commercial use, a square 16MP chip in reality only gives about 11.5MP when cropped into a page and an acutal area size of about 37X26MM

A 43X31 17MP chip gives more like 16.5MP and an actual area size of 43X30.5MM.

So there's quite a big difference in both practical resolution and the crop factor.

This may help in understanding the price, quality and usability differences between these two backs, along with speed (capture rate/ burst).

Rgds

Yair
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=99986\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I totally agree with the part that a 4:3 17MP back gives you more (in most cases) than the same resolution back with 1:1 format.

I do see the hesitation of buying when finding out that the back is over 13K USD in Israel and 9K USD in the US. This doesn't make a lot of sense. Especially considering that (in the EU) you basically only pay for shipping when importing from outside the country (VAT is deductible). Although costs for dealers may vary but not to the extent that a 50% price difference is justified and I assume the service on Leaf backs in the US is quite good as well. I know for a fact it is.

Benedmonson from this forum got a quote for a refurbished back of around 9K USD in the US. I bought mine in the US for even less.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: fishbain on February 09, 2007, 11:34:52 am

Quote

Benedmonson from this forum got a quote for a refurbished back of around 9K USD in the US. I bought mine in the US for even less.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=100012\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi Dustbak,

Actually, all I need now is some kind of a “proof” that I can show the dealer here in Israel.
If someone can direct me to a distributor or even send me e-mail with some kind of a buying offer or receipt, I guess their price will go down.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: Dustbak on February 09, 2007, 12:01:26 pm

Quote

Hi Dustbak,

Actually, all I need now is some kind of a “proof” that I can show the dealer here in Israel.
If someone can direct me to a distributor or even send me e-mail with some kind of a buying offer or receipt, I guess their price will go down.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=100040\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Would an emailed invoice be ok? Send me a PM.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: fishbain on February 09, 2007, 12:23:06 pm

Quote

Would an emailed invoice be ok? Send me a PM.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=100043\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks Dustbak,
I'v sent you a PM.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: rueyloon on February 09, 2007, 02:22:41 pm

I'll be interested to know where I can get a refurbished aptus 17 as well, especiallty if they take trade ins.

thanks.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: rueyloon on February 09, 2007, 02:25:14 pm

and another thing, I'm now looking into the aptus 17 and the p21+, any one with any experience on those 2 ? or any opinions ?

my plan is to use it with my mamiya system as well as the truewide adapter for architecture photography.

cheers

Title: aptus 17
Post by: filip baraka on February 13, 2007, 11:46:41 am

Hi Yair,

Can you point me to someone near Croatia, also interested in refurb/used Aptus17
I tried to contact dealer in Italy but they haven't repiled mail (same thing goes to phase, don't you guys live from selling?)

Thanks

Title: aptus 17
Post by: yaya on February 13, 2007, 06:08:04 pm

Can you PM or email me with your contact details please? I'll make sure someone gets in touch.

best

Yair

Quote

Hi Yair,

Can you point me to someone near Croatia, also interested in refurb/used Aptus17
I tried to contact dealer in Italy but they haven't repiled mail (same thing goes to phase, don't you guys live from selling?)

Thanks
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=100657\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Title: aptus 17
Post by: fishbain on February 16, 2007, 12:03:12 pm

Thanks Dustbak, Benedmonson, Yair & all, I’ve just ordered my first DB- Aptus-65 :-) .

Now I know where’s the best forum for MFDB.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: rueyloon on February 16, 2007, 11:01:54 pm

Quote

Thanks Dustbak, Benedmonson, Yair & all, I?e just ordered my first DB- Aptus-65 :-) .

Now I know where? the best forum for MFDB.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101229\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Way to go, me too

cheers

Title: aptus 17
Post by: yaya on February 17, 2007, 02:18:46 am

Glad we were able to help, enjoy!!!

Yair

Title: aptus 17
Post by: andybuk99 on February 17, 2007, 04:02:53 am

I have to say I have had no luck in getting any refurbished backs here in the UK, no dealers seem to be bothered in responding to emails or returning calls.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: awofinden on February 17, 2007, 01:37:59 pm

I got a p21 and it's really a great back, no flaws at all, totally blows away my old 1ds mark 2, great colour, great software, no moire so far, absolutely no problems at all. It's fairly cheap, fast and it'd be a rare shoot that needed more resolution and the files upsample amazingly well if needed.

Title: aptus 17
Post by: mda on March 08, 2007, 10:54:39 am

Hi everyone,
question regarding the Mamiya offer, and dilema.

I have the Canon 5D, and getting tired of the inablity to get the "right" perspective due to the 35mm contraints, without really pulling back and ending up cropping down to less than 1/2 of the frame.
( I shoot beauty and fashion)

So I did a side by side comparison in PS with the chip size, 11x14 crop and lens coverage of the 5D, P20, P21, P25, 6x6film, 6x45film, and 35MM.

I am debating taking that offer for the Mamiya with the P20, but afraid that I'll be in the same boat as I am now, with not getting the "right" perspectives that I need becuse of the crop factor, and the small square lens coverage of that chip.
I almost think (even with the larger chip size) that I would actually be in a worse boat than I am now?

Any thoughts?
thanks,

Title: aptus 17
Post by: filip baraka on March 09, 2007, 08:23:54 pm

Quote

I have to say I have had no luck in getting any refurbished backs here in the UK, no dealers seem to be bothered in responding to emails or returning calls.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101337\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

same situation here, no luck with replies

Title: aptus 17
Post by: Dustbak on March 10, 2007, 03:00:11 am

Quote

same situation here, no luck with replies
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=105745\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I think it is quite a ridiculous situation since most dealers would benefit most when they sell you an ordinary back and not a refurbished one.

My experiences with dealers are they are not really responsive in the first place, when asking for refurbished equipment I guess they have completely lost interest.

I guess some people have need for a dealer as far as I am concerned I will welcome the day when they have been cut out of the loop. I have never found any use for a dealer so why would I need to pay more for something that is useless to me.

Or at least should there be the possibility of choice which isn't there at the moment.