Luminous Landscape Forum
The Art of Photography => The Coffee Corner => Topic started by: Jeremy Roussak on October 19, 2020, 01:18:15 pm
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In April 2019, I decided to reopen the discussion boards here to political argument. Initially, it seemed to have been a good, or at least not a bad, idea.
But I hadn't anticipated that in March of this year, the world would change. Since then, we (or at least, we few, we happy few, who actually take photographs) have been severely restricted in what we are able to do and discussion of photography has decreased. Some contributors have wandered off and their loss has been keenly felt. Just as importantly from my point of view, it has become apparent that rather than moderating a photographic site with a political sideline, I am moderating a political discussion site with a side order of photographs - that's how the volumes of posts make it appear, in any event - and, depressingly, the political discussions are vituperative, repetitive and ill-informed, reflecting, I suppose, the politics they address.
I have wasted too much of my time reading the stuff and, at long last, I've had enough. I shan't prevent political discussion immediately, as I gather something important is due to take place early next month. After that, however, this is what is going to happen.
- On 4th November, or very soon thereafter depending on my other commitments, I shall lock active political threads.
- I will close any thread opened after that date which I consider to be political, whether wholly or in part.
- I shall open one thread in the Coffee Corner board, where those whose very survival might be threatened by an inability to spout politics here will be able to indulge themselves. That thread, which may or may not have a suitably droll title, will resemble the current Covid playpen thread: it will be largely unmoderated and those who choose to enter it will do so pretty much at their own risk. I may read it from time to time, either on my own initiative or if some particularly egregious comment is drawn to my attention; or I may not.
- Anyone who indulges in political discussion elsewhere at this site will be dealt with in a suitable fashion (or as close as I can get, given societal disapproval of thumbscrews).
So, enjoy the next fortnight. I'm sure those of you upset by this decision can use part of the time to find somewhere else to vent your spleen.
Jeremy
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Bravo, Jeremy!
I'm here for photography, and I now have dear friends on LuLa some of which may share my own political views and some who do not.
About once a month I glance briefly at one of the milder-seeming political threads and find that nothing has changed from the previous month.
Best, Eric
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Bravo, Jeremy!
+1
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Excellent decision!
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Bravo, Jeremy!
I'm here for photography, and I now have dear friends on LuLa some of which may share my own political views and some who do not.
About once a month I glance briefly at one of the milder-seeming political threads and find that nothing has changed from the previous month.
Best, Eric
I used to have similar concerns about TV programming until some kind soul alerted me to the existence of the OFF button. Revolutionised my life!
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I used to have similar concerns about TV programming until some kind soul alerted me to the existence of the OFF button. Revolutionised my life!
I have used it on you more than once, and you're right. It works a treat.
Jeremy
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Well there goes the activity level down to 1/2.
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Well there goes the activity level down to 1/2.
If the half that is lost is all or most of the drivel (which seems very likely), that would no bad thing.
Jeremy
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Well I do spend too much time on the coffee corner. So your plan would free up more time to shoot pictures. On the other hand, the coffee shop draws people to the site. Certainly I look at all the other posts and respond there to other things as well. I hope you're not shooting yourself in the foot.
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On the other hand, the coffee shop draws people to the site.
draws = "keeps people coming back to talk about nothing that's related to LuLa"
Please, don't let LuLa turn into the next 4chan or 8chan. Get rid of it. Kill it with fire. Nuke it from orbit; it's the only way to be sure. Survive off the merits of your photographic content.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGOtZDk6wRc
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In April 2019, I decided to reopen the discussion boards here to political argument. Initially, it seemed to have been a good, or at least not a bad, idea.
But I hadn't anticipated that in March of this year, the world would change. Since then, we (or at least, we few, we happy few, who actually take photographs) have been severely restricted in what we are able to do and discussion of photography has decreased. Some contributors have wandered off and their loss has been keenly felt. Just as importantly from my point of view, it has become apparent that rather than moderating a photographic site with a political sideline, I am moderating a political discussion site with a side order of photographs - that's how the volumes of posts make it appear, in any event - and, depressingly, the political discussions are vituperative, repetitive and ill-informed, reflecting, I suppose, the politics they address.
I have wasted too much of my time reading the stuff and, at long last, I've had enough. I shan't prevent political discussion immediately, as I gather something important is due to take place early next month. After that, however, this is what is going to happen.
- On 4th November, or very soon thereafter depending on my other commitments, I shall lock active political threads.
- I will close any thread opened after that date which I consider to be political, whether wholly or in part.
- I shall open one thread in the Coffee Corner board, where those whose very survival might be threatened by an inability to spout politics here will be able to indulge themselves. That thread, which may or may not have a suitably droll title, will resemble the current Covid playpen thread: it will be largely unmoderated and those who choose to enter it will do so pretty much at their own risk. I may read it from time to time, either on my own initiative or if some particularly egregious comment is drawn to my attention; or I may not.
- Anyone who indulges in political discussion elsewhere at this site will be dealt with in a suitable fashion (or as close as I can get, given societal disapproval of thumbscrews).
So, enjoy the next fortnight. I'm sure those of you upset by this decision can use part of the time to find somewhere else to vent your spleen.
Jeremy
Will there actually be anything political to talk about after Nov 4th? :)
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I have deleted some political posts. You may argue here about the wisdom of my decision (not that it will do you any good) but not about politics.
Jeremy
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I have deleted some political posts. You may argue here about the wisdom of my decision but not about politics.
Jeremy
Very wise decision.
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Time to close the Bear Pit.
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Time to close the Bear Pit.
Second the motion.
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Comments noted, but I indicated that it would persist, in isolation, until it intruded upon my time. It hasn't, yet.
I'm finding freedom from reading the various streams of political drivel, now amalgamated into one place I needn't visit, rather pleasant.
Jeremy
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Comments noted, but I indicated that it would persist, in isolation, until it intruded upon my time. It hasn't, yet.
I'm finding freedom from reading the various streams of political drivel, now amalgamated into one place I needn't visit, rather pleasant.
Jeremy
LuLa is well on the way of the Shutterbug and Popular Photography forums, whether you acknowledge that or not.
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LuLa is well on the way of the Shutterbug and Popular Photography forums, whether you acknowledge that or not.
Is that also where you've been spending your time instead of shooting Frans (whether you acknowledge that or not)? :D
Any progress on the Shutterbug and Popular Photography forums with 'Sensor heat'? :o
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Is that also where you've been spending your time instead of shooting Frans (whether you acknowledge that or not)? :D
Any progress on the Shutterbug and Popular Photography forums with 'Sensor heat'? :o
Shows how well you are informed; those forums ceased operations years ago. I hope Jeremy pays attention.
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Shows how well you are informed; those forums ceased operations years ago. I hope Jeremy pays attention.
Ceased forums you've brought up that have no bearing; OT again Frans. No luck anywhere on any forums with 'Sensor heat'? :o
Like many in these parts and others; plenty are not paying attention to your fantasies and requests. 😭
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Ceased forums you've brought up that have no bearing; OT again Frans. No luck anywhere on any forums with 'Sensor heat'? :o
Like many in these parts and others; plenty are not paying attention to your fantasies and requests. 😭
Let me spell it out for you why I referred to the now-defunct forums of Shutterbug and Popular Photography: the way the LuLa forum is going with it's hateful postings, not the least of which by you, it may very well go the same route.
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Let me spell it out for you why I referred to the now-defunct forums of Shutterbug and Popular Photography: the way the LuLa forum is going with it's hateful postings, not the least of which by you, it may very well go the same route.
Let me spell it out for you; it's not happening now. Despite your ongoing FUD.
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LuLa is well on the way of the Shutterbug and Popular Photography forums, whether you acknowledge that or not.
It isn't, and I don't.
If you and Andrew don't stop bickering, one or both of you will be suspended. I've had enough of this playground abuse.
Jeremy
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Important news.
It seems that the Forum moderator expressed some skepticism about one of LuLa's authors, based on the moderator's own experience on a workshop led by that author. LuLa's owner has retaliated by removing the (unpaid) moderator and his account from LuLa.
I expect that my post here will get me removed from LuLa as well. If so, I will be greatly disappointed, since I have made many good friends on LuLain the years I have been here.
-Eric Myrvaagnes
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I expect that my post here will get me removed from LuLa as well. If so, I will be greatly disappointed, since I have made many good friends on LuLain the years I have been here.
-Eric Myrvaagnes
Eric, I really don't see why or what would make you fear that. But to correct the record, Jeremy was not removed from LuLa, his account and posts are there for all to see (barring his last somewhat distasteful meltdown) and AFAIK, his exile is self inflicted.
His persistent snarky and disparaging attitude was called out by this site’s owner. It had been called out by others before. The site he’s absconded to is all but moribund, so let’s hope he’ll reflect, reform and be back to his old effervescent self soon - a reformed man, but not as moderator.
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Eric, I really don't see why or what would make you fear that. But to correct the record, Jeremy was not removed from LuLa, his account and posts are there for all to see (barring his last somewhat distasteful meltdown) and AFAIK, his exile is self inflicted.
His persistent snarky and disparaging attitude was called out by this site’s owner. It had been called out by others before. The site he’s absconded to is all but moribund, so let’s hope he’ll reflect, reform and be back to his old effervescent self soon - a reformed man, but not as moderator.
Indeed.
And thanks for putting in the labour to explain.
Josh
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His persistent snarky and disparaging attitude was called out by this site’s owner. It had been called out by others before.
Yes, I can see that but it didn't bother me FWIW. However, I do believe, and Josh may or may not agree, a moderator should do his/her job and say as little about it, publicly as possible. The "Stop Bickering" comment didn't ruffle my feathers at all, but he could have said this via PM. I think going forward, the less said publicly about moderation, the better.
Just do it.
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Yes, I can see that but it didn't bother me FWIW. However, I do believe, and Josh may or may not agree, a moderator should do his/her job and say as little about it, publicly as possible. The "Stop Bickering" comment didn't ruffle my feathers at all, but he could have said this via PM. I think going forward, the less said publicly about moderation, the better.
Just do it.
I do agree.
There is no need for posturing or displays of power.
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Eric, I really don't see why or what would make you fear that. But to correct the record, Jeremy was not removed from LuLa, his account and posts are there for all to see (barring his last somewhat distasteful meltdown) and AFAIK, his exile is self inflicted.
His persistent snarky and disparaging attitude was called out by this site’s owner. It had been called out by others before. The site he’s absconded to is all but moribund, so let’s hope he’ll reflect, reform and be back to his old effervescent self soon - a reformed man, but not as moderator.
What a bunch of bullshit!
Dealing with the likes of you has been a tough, thankless, and unpaid job done splendidly over the years.
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What a bunch of bullshit!
Dealing with the likes of you has been a tough, thankless, and unpaid job done splendidly over the years.
And now we have an excellent example of a post that needs some moderation.
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And now we have an excellent example of a post that needs some moderation.
Perhaps this negates my last response related to not posturing - but let me be clear, and I hope I won't have to repeat it. We are entering an era here at Lula where I will no longer tolerate toxic and inflammatory behavior. I will not be capricious and I will do my best to be fair. But I am done with bullies and people who sully the site. And no, there is no relativism when it comes to bullies. I'll use my judgment.
It's a photography site.
It's a social media forum - disagreements, even heated ones will happen. But there is a dug-in culture by a few that needs to be rooted out. I have no compunction or fear about doing so. I happen to know it will help ventilate the site. Voices are being silenced by the noisy and aggressive ones.
I leave it to each member to decide where they want to fit here. Healing, helping, developing the dialogue even when it's frustrating? Or degrading it inch by inch.
Choose wisely.
Josh
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Let's see how this progresses. I applaud progress.
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Perhaps this negates my last response related to not posturing - but let me be clear, and I hope I won't have to repeat it. We are entering an era here at Lula where I will no longer tolerate toxic and inflammatory behavior. I will not be capricious and I will do my best to be fair. But I am done with bullies and people who sully the site. And no, there is no relativism when it comes to bullies. I'll use my judgment.
It's a photography site.
It's a social media forum - disagreements, even heated ones will happen. But there is a dug-in culture by a few that needs to be rooted out. I have no compunction or fear about doing so. I happen to know it will help ventilate the site. Voices are being silenced by the noisy and aggressive ones.
I leave it to each member to decide where they want to fit here. Healing, helping, developing the dialogue even when it's frustrating? Or degrading it inch by inch.
Choose wisely.
Josh
Personal attacks should not be acceptable. Let's disagree without being disagreeable.
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Personal attacks should not be acceptable. Let's disagree without being disagreeable.
So with both agree:
What a bunch of bullshit!
Dealing with the likes of you has been a tough, thankless, and unpaid job done splendidly over the years.
... is that's exactly the tone that needs moderation?
Also stating others called you a liar when they never did, isn't acceptable as well?
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Re. Jeremy's contribution ...
[it] has been a tough, thankless, and unpaid job done splendidly over the years.
+1
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What a bunch of bullshit!
Dealing with the likes of you has been a tough, thankless, and unpaid job done splendidly over the years.
-1 :-)
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-1 :-)
I figured ;)
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Perhaps this negates my last response related to not posturing - but let me be clear, and I hope I won't have to repeat it. We are entering an era here at Lula where I will no longer tolerate toxic and inflammatory behavior. I will not be capricious and I will do my best to be fair. But I am done with bullies and people who sully the site. And no, there is no relativism when it comes to bullies. I'll use my judgment.
It's a photography site.
It's a social media forum - disagreements, even heated ones will happen. But there is a dug-in culture by a few that needs to be rooted out. I have no compunction or fear about doing so. I happen to know it will help ventilate the site. Voices are being silenced by the noisy and aggressive ones.
I leave it to each member to decide where they want to fit here. Healing, helping, developing the dialogue even when it's frustrating? Or degrading it inch by inch.
Choose wisely.
Josh
Since we seem to be starting out anew, I'm dropping all Ignores and will hope that posts going forward won't have personal attacks.
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Since we seem to be starting out anew, I'm dropping all Ignores and will hope that posts going forward won't have personal attacks.
I think that is a healthy approach. Let's see if we can refresh.