Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Computers & Peripherals => Topic started by: bernie west on April 15, 2020, 07:01:10 am
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I need to replace my current monitor. It was a cheapy (LG, couple of hundred dollars) but really decent quality for what it was. Recently I've had to get some more monitors for my work setup (non-photography) and while they are also cheapies, they are terrible monitors. One has a red colour cast that I can't seem to get rid of and no proper blacks, and the other one gets wild colour casts when you view it even slightly off centre. My current main monitor looks the same no matter what angle (within reason) you view it at.
So I need to get a new cheapie monitor (say a couple of hundred dollars) that doesn't have weird colour casts and looks consistent depending on viewing angle. And has reasonable blacks. There's a lot of terminology on monitors that I don't really understand. Are there some things I should look out for and/or avoid? IPS, LCD vs LED, backlit, other features...?
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i have had good luck with the Dell IPS based monitors for non colour critical work.
Otherwise, the NEC PA xxw series has give good results with their Spectraview colour calibration kit.
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My suggestion: go for a monitor with an IPS panel, do not go for Benq (poor track record on color casts), and by all means calibrate your monitor.
Regards,
Jaap.
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I've used two 27" NEC monitors with Spectraview II for the last five years. One died and I replaced it with an Eizo that is better in all respects. I found that with that version of the NEC, it was hard to determine really critical focus because of the coarse grain of the monitor surface.
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Eizo, SpectraView; great products. But it's going to fall on deaf hears because we need to read what the OP stated:
So I need to get a new cheapie monitor (say a couple of hundred dollars).
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Which is why I wouldn't dismiss BenQ monitors if cheap is the main driver.
This is probably the cheapest entry to monitors with hardware LUT tables. They are supposed to have improved their QC (this was mentioned in reviews of their newer 32" monitors) for better display uniformity. Buying from a store with a liberal return policy is a safer bet should the horror due to colour cast that Frodo mentioned in another thread happen again.
Cheers,
Fabien
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Is this new monitor for photo editing? I'm not clear on that from your initial post.
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Eizo, SpectraView; great products. But it's going to fall on deaf hears because we need to read what the OP stated:
So I need to get a new cheapie monitor (say a couple of hundred dollars).
“The Bitterness of Poor Quality Remains Long After the Sweetness of Low Price is Forgotten”
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“The Bitterness of Poor Quality Remains Long After the Sweetness of Low Price is Forgotten”
Absolutely true! Also: buy cheap ....... buy twice.
Regards,
Jaap.
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Absolutely true! Also: buy cheap ....... buy twice.
Regards,
Jaap.
True, if you buy cheap, you can then afford a second monitor. ;)
Cheers,
Fabien
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My very expensive 27" NEC Spectraview died and I replaced it with a $400 Acer 27" IPS panel. My pictures look just the same, both on-screen and on print.
That said, my customer service experience with NEC was excellent. It's just that the panel died and was not economically repairable.
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My very expensive 27" NEC Spectraview died and I replaced it with a $400 Acer 27" IPS panel. My pictures look just the same, both on-screen and on print.
That said, my customer service experience with NEC was excellent. It's just that the panel died and was not economically repairable.
How long did you have it, Peter?
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I got myself an IPS backlit HP for $200, sight unseen. It hasn't arrived yet. Could be my worst purchase yet.
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Why haven't BenQ, NEC, Eizo gone OLED yet? OLED/AMOLED is the future, no?
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Why haven't BenQ, NEC, Eizo gone OLED yet? OLED/AMOLED is the future, no?
OLEDs have longevity issues. I remember looking at them in 1994 when they were lab devices, and that was the big knock on them then. Fortunately, their life and stability has improved, but the issue hasn't gone away.
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I need to replace my current monitor. It was a cheapy (LG, couple of hundred dollars) but really decent quality for what it was. Recently I've had to get some more monitors for my work setup (non-photography) and while they are also cheapies, they are terrible monitors. One has a red colour cast that I can't seem to get rid of and no proper blacks, and the other one gets wild colour casts when you view it even slightly off centre. My current main monitor looks the same no matter what angle (within reason) you view it at.
So I need to get a new cheapie monitor (say a couple of hundred dollars) that doesn't have weird colour casts and looks consistent depending on viewing angle. And has reasonable blacks. There's a lot of terminology on monitors that I don't really understand. Are there some things I should look out for and/or avoid? IPS, LCD vs LED, backlit, other features...?
What's important to me in a photo editing monitor:
Calibration tables in the monitor.
Fast warm up to stable colors (10 min to <1 Delta-E from asymptote)
Low color variation with viewing angle.
Wide gamut.
Low color variation across the screen.
Low luminance variation across the screen.
Not a recipe for a cheap monitor.
Jim
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If you splurge on a pro display ( e.g. Digitaldog's extolled Spectraview), make sure your GPU supports 10-bit OpenGL in Photoshop. Otherwise, you'll be stuck with only 8-bit color. I hear that Nvidia has a new driver that makes some older GPUs compatible with 10-bit, but don't quote me on that.
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If you splurge on a pro display ( e.g. Digitaldog's extolled Spectraview), make sure your GPU supports 10-bit OpenGL in Photoshop. Otherwise, you'll be stuck with only 8-bit color. I hear that Nvidia has a new driver that makes some older GPUs compatible with 10-bit, but don't quote me on that.
The ‘Studio’ (vs ‘Game’) driver supports 10bit. As I remember, Andrew provided a step image to show if it worked on your monitor.
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The ‘Studio’ (vs ‘Game’) driver supports 10bit. As I remember, Andrew provided a step image to show if it worked on your monitor.
Both gaming and studio Nvidia drivers support 10bit now. Been that way for over a year now.
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Another differentiating factor: higher end Eizo ColorEdge and NEC Spectraview models have coatings that eliminate light bleed, particularly when viewed at angles. They also support multiple profiles.
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How long did you have it, Peter?
Sorry, Alan. I missed your question. A few years. Three, maybe. The power supply died.
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If you splurge on a pro display ( e.g. Digitaldog's extolled Spectraview), make sure your GPU supports 10-bit OpenGL in Photoshop. Otherwise, you'll be stuck with only 8-bit color. I hear that Nvidia has a new driver that makes some older GPUs compatible with 10-bit, but don't quote me on that.
I haven't found that 10 bit precision makes much difference for still image editing, if the calibration tables are in the monitor. If the OS and/or the app would support dithering, it wouldn't make any practical difference at all. As it is, unless I'm looking at images designed to show the difference, I can't see it.
Jim
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Both gaming and studio Nvidia drivers support 10bit now. Been that way for over a year now.
I thought GeForce & Titan ‘Gaming’ drivers still only supported 8bit. I thought that was the point of the SIGGRAPH 209 announcement
https://petapixel.com/2019/07/29/nvidia-unveils-new-studio-driver-with-support-for-10-bit-color-for-creatives/
https://www.cnet.com/news/nvidia-studio-drivers-deliver-geforce-30-bit-color-unto-photoshop-and-more/
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I thought GeForce & Titan ‘Gaming’ drivers still only supported 8bit. I thought that was the point of the SIGGRAPH 209 announcement
https://petapixel.com/2019/07/29/nvidia-unveils-new-studio-driver-with-support-for-10-bit-color-for-creatives/
https://www.cnet.com/news/nvidia-studio-drivers-deliver-geforce-30-bit-color-unto-photoshop-and-more/
No they all do. I am running a 2070 Super gaming drivers with 10 bit (and it works rather than indicating it does like the old drivers). They have done away with the distinction - probably too much extra work for little gain (plus competing with AMD).
https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/gamescom-2019-game-ready-driver/
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You also may want a monitor with high contrast.
I remember when I bought my 30" monitor ten years ago people advised me to get one with low contrast, supposedly because editing images on high contrast screens makes soft proofing for print difficult, since printers have much lower contrast than LCDs.
At the time, they recommended a 500:1 contrast ratio with 1,000:1 being the highest. In hind sight, I wish I bought a high contrast monitor instead because my printer (Epson 3800 at the time) consistently produced greater shadow detail than my 1,000:1 monitor ever could (the opposite of what you'd expect).This frustrated me to no end. I concluded that my monitor's native contrast was considerably lower than its official specs claimed. Next time I'm going HIGH contrast no matter what they say.
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You also may want a monitor with high contrast.
I remember when I bought my 30" monitor ten years ago people advised me to get one with low contrast, supposedly because editing images on high contrast screens makes soft proofing for print difficult, since printers have much lower contrast than LCDs.
At the time, they recommended a 500:1 contrast ratio with 1,000:1 being the highest. In hind sight, I wish I bought a high contrast monitor instead because my printer (Epson 3800 at the time) consistently produced greater shadow detail than my 1,000:1 monitor ever could (the opposite of what you'd expect).This frustrated me to no end. I concluded that my monitor's native contrast was considerably lower than its official specs claimed. Next time I'm going HIGH contrast no matter what they say.
The contrast you observe in use is almost always lower than the spec'd contrast, sometimes a lot lower, unless you work in the dark and wear black clothing.
Jim
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I found that with that version of the NEC, it was hard to determine really critical focus because of the coarse grain of the monitor surface.
Are matte surface screens really all that necessary? I would think the anti-reflective coating, plus a monitor hood, plus smart room lighting would be enough. Are there any pro level monitors that don't have a grainy matte screen other than Eizo?