Luminous Landscape Forum

The Art of Photography => User Critiques => Topic started by: Jeremy Roussak on October 26, 2019, 02:07:21 pm

Title: sun seeker
Post by: Jeremy Roussak on October 26, 2019, 02:07:21 pm
Thoughts?

Jeremy
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on October 26, 2019, 03:22:14 pm
Both shots very well done, Jeremy. Bravo!
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on October 26, 2019, 03:53:09 pm
Both shots very well done, Jeremy. Bravo!
+1.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Rajan Parrikar on November 01, 2019, 02:23:36 pm
Jeremy,

Love both. I try to get it in various conditions and you certainly made good here.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 02, 2019, 06:35:03 am
Normally, I would not react on this kind of photo's, but hey, come on, ... there is a limit on back padding. And Jeremy is not helped with making him believe these are fantastic photo's

Jeremy, why did you make those shots? Is it a registration of someone else's piece of art, or do you want to add something to it and what exactly? Or is it just an exercise in correct exposing a contre jour? (all perfect alibi's, no problem)
Take a second look at the first, straighten out the horizon would be better. Not? (Finding the major horizontal and vertical lines)

Ivo
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Jeremy Roussak on November 02, 2019, 09:35:18 am
Normally, I would not react on this kind of photo's, but hey, come on, ... there is a limit on back padding. And Jeremy is not helped with making him believe these are fantastic photo's

Just as well there's a Real Photographer in the forum, eh? Helps to stop any of us becoming deluded about ourselves and keeps Russ, Eric and Rajan in line.

Jeremy, why did you make those shots? Is it a registration of someone else's piece of art, or do you want to add something to it and what exactly? Or is it just an exercise in correct exposing a contre jour? (all perfect alibi's, no problem)

Oh dear.

I took them because the scene appealed to me and I considered that the resulting photographs would also appeal. They do, to me; and it appears that while you fail to see any merit in them, they appeal to others, whose opinions I respect.

Why does any of us take photographs? Why did you take "54", or any of your "shades of grey"? Why on earth did you take "cabbage"?

I have no idea what you are trying to convey with the parenthesised words. The word "alibi" doesn't mean what you appear to believe it means and your use of the apostrophe in what I would assume is a plural and not a possessive is wrong.

Take a second look at the first, straighten out the horizon would be better. Not? (Finding the major horizontal and vertical lines)

Take a second look at the first and you will see that the horizon is perfectly level. It isn't straight, because the coastline at that point isn't straight, but it is level.

Jeremy
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 02, 2019, 11:21:41 am


=> What a fantastic work, Jeremy. +3

Better?
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on November 02, 2019, 12:13:35 pm
Never pays to pontificate on subjects beyond your reach.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Jeremy Roussak on November 02, 2019, 01:20:50 pm

=> What a fantastic work, Jeremy. +3

Better?

No, just a silly little lie.

Jeremy
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 03, 2019, 04:43:30 am
No, just a silly little lie.

Jeremy

Yes, thatís where it started in first place. No? Silly lies.

Check out some reading about dominant lines in composition and the relation between camera position, focal length, perspective and those lines.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Rajan Parrikar on November 03, 2019, 05:20:52 am
I walk by or drive by Sůlfar every other day, and often stop to fire a frame or two. No two days in Iceland are alike in terms of conditions and lighting. Jeremy's interpretation of the subject is compelling, a little different, it appealed to me, and I said so. If that is "back padding," count me in as a prolific back padder.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: rabanito on November 03, 2019, 06:45:39 am
If that is "back padding," count me in as a prolific back padder.

My humble philosophy is, if I like something, I say so.
If not, as a rule, I don't say anything unless asked.
I'm master of no one.

"Back padding" is pejorative, I think. I'd call it "encouraging". And it is useful.
If only the "artists" in LuLa show their "opuses" most of us would land in the Coffee Corner.
Hopefully in the "humor" section and not in any of the others  ;)

Just MHO
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on November 03, 2019, 07:26:00 am
Check out some reading about dominant lines in composition and the relation between camera position, focal length, perspective and those lines.

Absolutely. That's what every photographer needs to do to improve his photography: read! Never mind about shooting pictures. Read!
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on November 03, 2019, 08:34:30 am
Check out some reading about dominant lines in composition and the relation between camera position, focal length, perspective and those lines.
And if you can't Strictly Obey the RULES of Composition, do NOT post images!!!

And don't ignore the Rule of Thirds;
Always have an Odd Number of central objects;
Have an Absolute Black and an Absolute White in EVERY photo, and ...        :-[
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 03, 2019, 08:42:04 am
And if you can't Strictly Obey the RULES of Composition, do NOT post images!!!

And don't ignore the Rule of Thirds;
Always have an Odd Number of central objects;
Have an Absolute Black and an Absolute White in EVERY photo, and ...        :-[

Hm, there is another perception of composition guidelines as there is about genre dogmas. Interesting. 🙄
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on November 03, 2019, 09:02:40 am
... there is a limit on back padding...

Absolutely! It is usually the price, weight, and space available  ;)

P.S. As someone who is an ESL himself (English as a Second Language) I donít like correcting other ESLs . But I also canít resist a little humorous detour  ;)

Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 03, 2019, 09:13:00 am
And if you can't Strictly Obey the RULES of Composition, do NOT post images!!!

And don't ignore the Rule of Thirds;
Always have an Odd Number of central objects;
Have an Absolute Black and an Absolute White in EVERY photo, and ...        :-[

Eric, basic understanding of composition and itís relation to perspective, position, etc could be beneficial to improve Jeremyís first image. Why is this so difficult to swallow.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 03, 2019, 09:18:26 am
Absolutely! It is usually the price, weight, and space available  ;)

P.S. As someone who is an ESL himself (English as a Second Language) I donít like correcting other ESLs . But I also canít resist a little humorous detour  ;)

😬👍🏻 🤣

Apart from the good joke, it is a bit on the person and not on the topic. But hey, this is the usual balcony comment that can be expected.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on November 03, 2019, 09:22:41 am
Eric, basic understanding of composition and itís relation to perspective, position, etc could be beneficial to improve Jeremyís first image. Why is this so difficult to swallow.

Then state whatís wrong with the image and how to improve it.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on November 03, 2019, 10:04:32 am
... Jeremy, why did you make those shots?..l

Or cabbage shots, for that matter.

There is a more general answer to that. An essay on the topic from more than a decade ago by a wonderful photographer and writer Andy Ilachinsky, about stages we all go through in our development as photographers:

ďThe Eightfold Path Toward Self-Discovery Through Photographyď

https://tao-of-digital-photography.blogspot.com/search?q=Stages

Suffice to say, not every photographer is at the same stage. Few of us can say we are even half way though, let alone reaching the ultimate stage. For some, the ultimate stage is cabbage, but hey, to each his own ;) I like cabbage. In my home country, it is a national delicacy and staple in winter months (sour cabbage).

Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on November 03, 2019, 10:07:13 am
Eric, basic understanding of composition and itís relation to perspective, position, etc could be beneficial to improve Jeremyís first image. Why is this so difficult to swallow.

Absolutely, Eric. When you see something that would make a good street shot, be sure to check the perspective relationships, position, and rules of composition. Of course, by the time you've checked all that stuff your shot is gone forever. But who cares? At least you've fulfilled the rules of composition you've read about. As long as you do that, who needs a picture?
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on November 03, 2019, 10:32:12 am
And always make sure your tripod is perfectly level for spontaneous Street photography.   ;)
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 03, 2019, 11:48:46 am
Then state whatís wrong with the image and how to improve it.

Nothing is wrong, but there is one insight that would improve the image.

Find the dominant vertical and horizontal lines in the composition before pressing the button and frame to taste.
Itís a small insight and improves the overal balans.
Dominant lines are often imaginary lines between two by perspective distorted lines.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 03, 2019, 11:51:54 am
And always make sure your tripod is perfectly level for spontaneous Street photography.   ;)

Ok, so the above pictures are Ďstreet photographyí ?
 ::)

Wat baten kaars en bril als de uil niet zien en wil?
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on November 03, 2019, 02:34:54 pm
Nothing is wrong, but there is one insight that would improve the image.

Find the dominant vertical and horizontal lines in the composition before pressing the button and frame to taste.
Itís a small insight and improves the overal balans.
Dominant lines are often imaginary lines between two by perspective distorted lines.

Why don't you give us a demonstration of what you mean, Ivo? Abstract and subjective statements never are as convincing as a clear example. Surely you have a clear example of this.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Jeremy Roussak on November 04, 2019, 02:55:31 am
Nothing is wrong, but there is one insight that would improve the image.

Find the dominant vertical and horizontal lines in the composition before pressing the button and frame to taste.
Itís a small insight and improves the overal balans.
Dominant lines are often imaginary lines between two by perspective distorted lines.

Ivo, your initial criticisms were based on your dislike of the photographs, expressed as mystification as to why they were taken. I have explained why I took them; you may accept that explanation or not, of course. You also included a misguided complaint about the horizon.

Now you have shifted ground, making vague allusions to extracts from "Noddy learns picture-taking". The buzzwords are there, but there's no hint that you have any idea of how their application to those photographs will, or even might, improve them.

I have always asserted that I do not post photographs here in order to receive applause. I have learned a great deal from contributors to the forum over the last 15 years; some of them are excellent phtoographers who are able not only to make good images but to write lucidly about technique. I hope to continue to do so. One can learn from others in two ways, of course: what to do and, perhaps inadvertently on their part, what not to do. Thus far, I see you falling into the latter group, but I'd be happy to be proved wrong. Respond to Russ's request.

Jeremy
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 04, 2019, 07:43:27 am
Iím not responsible for your perception of my feelings about your images, Jeremy.
I donít have any like or dislike towards your pictures, I find the applause not helpfully in a critique section. Especially not when it is applauding the person and not the work.

You donít need to give me instructions to what I have to respond, I always give answer to fair questions.

Read what I explained in earlier post.

Before pushing the button, find the dominant composition lines in the scene and in combination with focal length and position you can prevent the skewed impression of the composition. Itís nothing in Post processing, itís in the making.

When I ask why you made the picture it is not to look down on you or the picture, it is to genuinely understand what the purpose is.

If you wanted to shoot the sun seeker in two extreme lighting situations and nothing more, I had no remark.

Normally I donít give comments on this kind of pictures, itís like landscape, I donít know enough about it. But this touches something I know about because I shoot interiors and real estate: how to deal with visual balans in perspective distortion prone scenes.

What I try to explain was told too me as well. And that little insight improved the way I compose images where perspective lines can make a scene a bit tricky to frame.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on November 04, 2019, 07:52:06 am
And that little insight improved the way I compose images where perspective lines can make a scene a bit tricky to frame.

Then it should be very easy to give us a concrete example of what you're talking about, Ivo.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Ivo_B on November 04, 2019, 11:24:57 am
Then it should be very easy to give us a concrete example of what you're talking about, Ivo.

Yes it is. But it is out of my reach to make you understand.

Maybe when I find time this week, I could do some table top shots.


But,... why on earth would I put more time in it...
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on November 04, 2019, 12:00:19 pm
Ok, to ground this discussion somewhat:

Ivo, is this what you are talking about, that what you suppose needs to be vertical, isn't?
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on November 04, 2019, 01:53:24 pm
Yes it is. But it is out of my reach to make you understand.

Why is it "out of your reach?" All you have to do is show us an example. Since this is the way you claim you do your own work you must have plenty of examples already at hand. Just post one or two and tell us how they differ from what the rest of us do.
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: Jeremy Roussak on November 05, 2019, 02:55:59 pm
Why is it "out of your reach?" All you have to do is show us an example. Since this is the way you claim you do your own work you must have plenty of examples already at hand. Just post one or two and tell us how they differ from what the rest of us do.

It's not going to happen, Russ. As he's observed, he has better things to do with his time
But,... why on earth would I put more time in it...
and as he has such a good grasp of the terms of theory, practice is unimportant.

We must look elsewhere for our education, it seems.

Jeremy
Title: Re: sun seeker
Post by: RSL on November 05, 2019, 07:58:22 pm
Well, damn. I was hoping I could penetrate the fog. Ah well.