Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Other Raw Converters => Apple Aperture Q&A => Topic started by: ratz on November 09, 2006, 10:08:26 am
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It appeals to me in that it may help me keep only one copy of each image other than the Backup. Right now I end up having multiple copies of images because "I'm not sure if I have it somewhere else so just to be safe" thinking. I could really use the simple organization of having one library and the Versions of images in Aperture to output if needed.
The thing that worries me is how to handle it when I start getting low on disk space? I guess from what I understand you can back them up to another disk or DVD and have them referenced still in Aperture with full preview, then you would just have to go to the referenced location? How does the whole vault thing work. Can I back up the Vault to another Hard Disk or does it have to be a DVD? How long does it take to open Vaulted images to access them?
Any suggested workflow/organization tips?
Thanks all
PS: Love the Video Journals Michael
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Can I back up the Vault to another Hard Disk or does it have to be a DVD? How long does it take to open Vaulted images to access them?
Any suggested workflow/organization tips?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84310\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Yes, you can. Correct terminology would be to say that a Vault can reside on another hard disk. The vault is the backup. It's very easy to setup a Vault to test the function and get a feel for it, so it may be helpful to try it now when your entire image savings don't depend on it yet.
One thing to note:
if you opt to store images in the Aperture library, they end up somewhere deep each in their own folder, and you're dependent on Aperture for access.
if you opt to store the images somewhere else and manipulate "by reference", then the files will reside in your designated folder. But then the renaming of versions after the initial storage doesn't copy through to the referenced files.
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One thing to note:
if you opt to store images in the Aperture library, they end up somewhere deep each in their own folder, and you're dependent on Aperture for access.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84319\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
This is not nescessarily true, if the images reside in the Aperutre Library you can 'extract' them (so to speak) by selecting the show 'package contents' in the finder window.
As for backing up files from Aperutre, the Vault is by far the easiest way of storing images. It gets rid of all the hassle of having them on seperate disks, and means that should a drive fail, you can simply transfer them and 'rebuild the library' using the vault.
As you can have as many vaults as you want it makes it idea to back your files up this way. You can have the main library, one backup used onsite, another backup incase one of the drives fails, and then to be ultra sure you could have another backup offsite incase of fires,floods or theft.
The problem with referencing your images is it's all to easy to forget to backup the images.
Vaults take the hassle out of file management.
HTH
Andrew
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Ever thought of your pc/laptop being stolen or totaly broken, crashed or destroyed?
Make a back-up on a diffrent medium (dvd or external hdd) as far away from the originals as possible!
Always.
No matter what kind of software you use.
I don't use the vaults.
It does use up to much harddisk space.
But I export my images on a regular base to a back-up medium.
It is a little work.. maybe a click or two..three maybe four.
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This is not nescessarily true, if the images reside in the Aperutre Library you can 'extract' them (so to speak) by selecting the show 'package contents' in the finder window.
True, but like I said: the images reside each in an individual folder.
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Ever thought of your pc/laptop being stolen or totaly broken, crashed or destroyed?
Make a back-up on a diffrent medium (dvd or external hdd) as far away from the originals as possible!
Always.
No matter what kind of software you use.
I don't use the vaults.
It does use up to much harddisk space.
But I export my images on a regular base to a back-up medium.
It is a little work.. maybe a click or two..three maybe four.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84399\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
If you don't use the vaults, then how do you save your settings?
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I feel very blond right now because I think I don't understand your question very well
I export the images including versions and the metadata.
In "presets" > image export > you 'll find the option "including metadata".
Is this what you mean by "settings" ?
Or do you mean your management system...
the way you organised all the diffrent projects etc. ?
Is that what you call your (Library) settings?
Wel to be honest... that is a problem.
And I must confes that I have Aperture running on a laptop and a pc in in a diffrent building.
I export to folders on DVD on very regular basis and import only from time to time in exactly the same library on the pc. This is maybe a very complicated solution and not always a very up to date back-up (Library-wise)
But I feel a lot more secure this way.
Making a back-up for me is like keeping papers safe just in case there might be a fire.
It is no use keeping the originals in your living room and a copy in your bedroom.
I know that if my laptop crashes or is stolen or destroyed in anyother way..
I' ll probably have a lot of work to restore my Library.. but I know I will have no problem accessing all my original pictures and all the work I did on them.
But ... I am here with one reason... to learn ... !!
so if anybody can show me a diffrent way or teach me anything better ...please do !!!!!!
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I export the images including versions and the metadata.
In "presets" > image export > you 'll find the option "including metadata".
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84441\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Something might go horribly wrong here.
The Presets -> Image Export is meant only for exporting converted files. It doesn't refer to exporting a master file which is what you should want for back-up. And using the Export -> Master File option doesn't allow you to save any of the RAW development settings made in Aperture, nor the settings corresponding to different versions, a very minimum requirement for a backup. Having the library structure backed up as well, is another useful part of a backup.
You might want to reconsider your Vault strategy and you may want to give it a try. At startup, Aperture will display any discrepancies between the state of the library and the vaults.
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True, but like I said: the images reside each in an individual folder.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84435\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
No problem. In Finder create a smart folder. Set Kind to Images and use the 'Others...' menu to select the Folder where your Aperture Library resides. Now you have an auto updating view into all the images stored inside the Library.
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Ever thought of your pc/laptop being stolen or totaly broken, crashed or destroyed?
Make a back-up on a diffrent medium (dvd or external hdd) as far away from the originals as possible!
Always.
No matter what kind of software you use.
I don't use the vaults.
It does use up to much harddisk space.
But I export my images on a regular base to a back-up medium.
It is a little work.. maybe a click or two..three maybe four.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84399\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
That's the beauty of Vaults, you can have as many as you like and they are always up to date (well if you sync them they are). You can have the main Library on an external hard drive (for size reasons), and then a minimum of 1 backup, preferably 2.
That way, with 2 backups, you have the library which is used the most and then two other sources, one of these can be offsite, in a safety deposit box or at a friend/realative's house. Simply sync the vault once a month. If you do that then you should be safe, what's the chances of all 3 HDs going bad at once? Or if you house is broken into you have the other vault at an offsite location. Simply re-buidl the library from that, and then buy a new HD to have as a vault.
Also as hard drives get bigger you can migrate the vaults onto bigger drives.
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No problem. In Finder create a smart folder. Set Kind to Images and use the 'Others...' menu to select the Folder where your Aperture Library resides. Now you have an auto updating view into all the images stored inside the Library.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84453\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Are you sure it actually looks into the Aperture library package this way?
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Are you sure it actually looks into the Aperture library package this way?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84463\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Did you try it and it doesnt work?
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Did you try it and it doesnt work?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84464\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Yes, I tried and it didn't seem to work, unless I disect the package of course. But I have experienced problems with the find function previously where it doesn't find really obvious searches so it may be operator error...
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I use the Aperture library and vault system. The first time you create the vault it takes a while if your library is large. It took close to three hours for mine at ~250gigs. After that it doesn't take long for incremental updates. I have the main library on the computer HD, an external HD for one vault and another external HD that is kept off site and is backed up once a week.
Personally, I think this program is a godsend for me. I no longer have to make a bunch of tiffs from Raws that basically just sit on a HD taking up space. I select what I need , export them and submit them as required. The only tiffs that hang around are images that need photoshopping.
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My workflow is the following: I copy my images in one hard drive, having my own folder structure. All these files are backep up regularly on 2 different hard drives.
Once this is done, I import in Aperture library the files: I work, sort them, edit them, create multiple versions etc ... and I have 2 vaults, once updated every day, the second one every Friday.
In total, I have my original files backed up twice (outside aperture library); and I have all my files in Aperture with 2 vaults. Given the low cost / GB of hard drive today, it find it quite workable.
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My workflow is the following: I copy my images in one hard drive, having my own folder structure. All these files are backep up regularly on 2 different hard drives.
Once this is done, I import in Aperture library the files: I work, sort them, edit them, create multiple versions etc ... and I have 2 vaults, once updated every day, the second one every Friday.
In total, I have my original files backed up twice (outside aperture library); and I have all my files in Aperture with 2 vaults. Given the low cost / GB of hard drive today, it find it quite workable.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84501\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
If you use the vaults in Aperture why would you want to back the images up seperately on different HDs?
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If you use the vaults in Aperture why would you want to back the images up seperately on different HDs?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84504\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
So as to not depend entirely on Aperture...10 years down the road I can access my files without depending on having aperture.
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So as to not depend entirely on Aperture...10 years down the road I can access my files without depending on having aperture.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84510\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Fair enough, although if they are in vaults on external drives you can still access the images from inside, but it's harder to do than if they are coppied there seperately.
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Something might go horribly wrong here.
The Presets -> Image Export is meant only for exporting converted files. It doesn't refer to exporting a master file which is what you should want for back-up. And using the Export -> Master File option doesn't allow you to save any of the RAW development settings made in Aperture, nor the settings corresponding to different versions, a very minimum requirement for a backup. Having the library structure backed up as well, is another useful part of a backup.
You might want to reconsider your Vault strategy and you may want to give it a try. At startup, Aperture will display any discrepancies between the state of the library and the vaults.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84443\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I get it.
Yes I know.
But then again.. I make a back-up of my pictures the minute after I load them on my latop... sometimes even before I take a look at them. That is... the RAW masterfiles.
I am on the road a lot ... with camera and laptop.
Hotels, camping, car, etc. Very vunerable for theft & destruction.
So I make DVD at the end of every day .... hide them somewhere in my car or send even an extra copy DVD home by mail.
Back-up from versions and work done... that comes later.
When back at home I go on with this same "system"... but ofcourse yes... I could consider a external harddisk and use Apertures Vault on that harddisk.
I'll think about it !
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I use the Aperture library and vault system. The first time you create the vault it takes a while if your library is large. It took close to three hours for mine at ~250gigs. After that it doesn't take long for incremental updates. I have the main library on the computer HD, an external HD for one vault and another external HD that is kept off site and is backed up once a week.
Personally, I think this program is a godsend for me. I no longer have to make a bunch of tiffs from Raws that basically just sit on a HD taking up space. I select what I need , export them and submit them as required. The only tiffs that hang around are images that need photoshopping.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=84494\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Well I statred this post and now I have purchased Aperture.
I have found the same as quoted. I love using the Vault for incrimental backup and not having a million different full sized versions floating around my HD. My opinion is that you would have to be crazy NOT to use Apertures Library. That is just my opinion and if someone prefers not to that's up to them, so please don't go off about how I shouldn't be telling you whats best for you. I'm just trying to show MY strong liking of the Aperture Library and Vault system. I think it really simplifies digital photo management.
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May I nuance a little bit...
there is a diffrence between using the Aperture Library and using the Aperture Vaults!
Not using the Library is a little foolish because that is what makes Aperture ...well.. Aperture!
Not using the Vaults is an option that has pro's and con's.
I have been using Aperture since december 2005.
At first... I used Vaults.... after 2 month I emptied (deleted) all the Vaults.
There is no diffrence at all noticable.
Only when I will be in desperate need of an instant back-up ... then there will be a diffrence.
Correct me if I am wrong!
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btw
up till now... the new 1.5 version.... there was no option at all to store your pictures anywhere else but in the Aperture Library folder.
But the option not to use Vaults was there from the beginning.
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btw
up till now... the new 1.5 version.... there was no option at all to store your pictures anywhere else but in the Aperture Library folder.
But the option not to use Vaults was there from the beginning.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=85519\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Yes that is correct but why would you not want to use the Vault feature? It is one of the best things about the app, that and using Apertures Library.
I wasn't saying that the Vault and Library were the same thing. My comment about a million files all over my HDs was because I would not be sure if had that versionof the file saved somewhere else and I would save it yet again to make sure. I understand what the Aperture Library and the Vault are. The Library is the best because I know where all of my files are but the Vault also keeps me from having to many copies of the same file because I USE IT and therefore I don't end up saving a bunch of copies because I know I'm good with the Vaults backed up to external HDs.
I can see your confusion from my other post though.
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like I wrote before.....
I do not think that making back-ups on the same hardware as the originals is very effective...
no matter how fantastic the back-up system.... when somebody steals your laptop ... it's gone.
... including your Vaults.
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like I wrote before.....
I do not think that making back-ups on the same hardware as the originals is very effective...
no matter how fantastic the back-up system.... when somebody steals your laptop ... it's gone.
... including your Vaults.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=85522\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Well it is suggested to make your Vault backups to an external drive or 2 or 3 for that matter. I have 2 external drives that I use with Vault.
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Yes
and my answer was that I would think about it...
I am still thinking
You know... everybody has a unique way of working and keeping stuff organized....
my biggest "problem" is that most of the time I need to organize myself and manage my pictures
and make backups while I am 'en route'.