Luminous Landscape Forum

The Art of Photography => Street Showcase => Topic started by: OnlyNorth on February 01, 2019, 07:26:37 am

Title: A cooperation
Post by: OnlyNorth on February 01, 2019, 07:26:37 am
 with divinity?
 No,only a shot with street. ;)
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 07:29:49 am
Well, it's a picture of a street, so it's gotta be street photography. Right?
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 09:55:47 am
Another good street shot, OnlyNorth.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 10:03:17 am
Another good shot, OnlyNorth.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 10:30:07 am
Russ,

This shot ticks all the boxes: it has people, it has street, it has symbolism (two crosses), it has a touch of humor (again, two crosses), it has a decisive moment (a split second later and one cross would be gone). And it surely fits a broader, Magnum definition of street genre:
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Martin Kristiansen on February 01, 2019, 10:45:11 am
Lovely. Strong diagonal composition adds to the movement creating a very dynamic shot. Good choice of shutter speed. Very pleasing colour pallete. And that is all besides the two crosses and all the symbolism that goes with that.

The more I look at it the more I like it.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 10:51:39 am
it has people. . .

Where? Inside the truck?
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 11:10:24 am
Where? Inside the truck?

It is an ambulance vehicle. And unless Romania is so far ahead Elon Musk’s dream, it is still driven by humans.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 11:59:27 am
Sorry, Slobodan. You really need to study the classic street photographers before you pontificate about street.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 12:18:52 pm
Sorry, Slobodan. You really need to study the classic street photographers before you pontificate about street.

Maybe I do not have a PhD in those studies, but I've seen a few.

For instance, Elliott Erwitt:

Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 12:26:00 pm
Or Lee Friedlander:

Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 12:54:45 pm
Not everything Erwitt and Friedlander did was street. Not everything HCB did was street. Not everything Winogrand did was street. These guys were making their living with photography. You can't do that shooting street exclusively.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 01:32:32 pm
... These guys were making their living with photography. You can't do that shooting street exclusively.

I am sure Elliott and Lee made a lot of money with the examples I posted ;)
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on February 01, 2019, 01:47:50 pm
I suspect that many of us on LuLa don't care at all whether an image fits the Street genre or any other genre. What we most care about is  either
(1) Is it a good photograph?, or
(2) Do I like it?


P.S. The obvious corollary is that if I like a photo, then you should too.   :D
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: petermfiore on February 01, 2019, 02:57:10 pm
I suspect that many of us on LuLa don't care at all whether an image fits the Street genre or any other genre. What we most care about is  either
(1) Is it a good photograph?, or
(2) Do I like it?


P.S. The obvious corollary is that if I like a photo, then you should too.   :D

I agree....so I guess that means +1

Peter
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 03:09:30 pm
I don't have a problem with that, but why do we have a Landscape Showcase and a Street Showcase? Anything can go into User Critiques, but one would sort of expect specific categories to contain stuff specific to those categories. I've said it before and I'll say it again: Let's get rid of Street Showcase. It's more likely to confuse people than to enlighten them.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 03:40:30 pm
...one would sort of expect specific categories to contain stuff specific to those categories. I've said it before and I'll say it again: Let's get rid of Street Showcase. It's more likely to confuse people than to enlighten them.

Whis is the case here... according to Magnum, classic street photographers' examples, numerous books on street photography and contests on street photography, most reasonable people... just not according to Russ' idea of street.

As for abolishing the subforum, you are single handedly doing a pretty good job of driving people away from it, and scaring them for life to attempt anything related to street.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 04:19:09 pm
Good. If they’re not willing to learn something about the genre then I’m glad they’re staying away from it. All they can do is add confusion. It’s pretty obvious from his most recent post on here that Ivo understands the genre, though he may not always hit it. So far, I don’t remember Stamper missing, though I’m sure he has, as everyone does. But they’re the only two who seem able to post street photography that’s really street. Peter did some fine street for a while, but that’s not where his heart lies. There’s no reason why stuff like this can’t go into User Critiques. Then nobody has to worry about genre definitions, and those folks whom you’re telling me have had the crap scared out of them can stop peeing their pants and get on board.

As it stands at the moment, Street Showcase is doing a lot more damage than good.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 01, 2019, 04:27:32 pm
So you're telling me that colorful socks are street but this one isn't? I think that would do more damage to the genre.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 01, 2019, 04:42:57 pm
Whatever, Slobodan.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on February 01, 2019, 07:24:15 pm
Maybe we need two new threads: one for "Good photos" and one for "Bad photos."   :D
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Martin Kristiansen on February 02, 2019, 01:13:24 am
Seriously Russ you are like that one soldier in a drill platoon out of step and thinking you are the only one in step. By just about everyone’s definition including Magnum you are wrong. As a classification tool for people to use the definition is a recognised social contract and by now you must see that the generally used definition is different to what you use. That makes your definition pointless for anything other than a idealistic debate. Churchill defines a fanatic as someone who can’t change his mind and won’t change the subject. You are coming across as that person.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 02, 2019, 06:26:00 am
Martin, if you want to believe that a picture of an ambulance zooming down a street is street photography, be my guest. Street photography is photography that shows interesting and often ambiguous interrelationships between people and other people and between people and their environment. This picture doesn't show either thing.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Martin Kristiansen on February 02, 2019, 06:56:30 am
Russel you are so narrow minded that you can look through a key hole with both eyes simultaneously.

As per my point in my previous post. You seem to be in a massive minority in your definition of street. Most people disagree with you and while that doesn’t appear to bother you this forum isn’t just for you, it’s for all of us. As long as a significant percentage of us are in agreement as to how this sub forum should be used then that is how it will be used. I don’t care for your narrow definition and nor do many other people. So stand on the beach and tell the tide not to come in. You are going to get wet.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 02, 2019, 07:43:54 am
You seem to be in a massive minority in your definition of street.

Right, Martin. I'm in a minority who understand what street really is. But you've made clear that that minority is a long way from "massive." Looking at the way you write, I'm not surprised you're confused.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Martin Kristiansen on February 02, 2019, 08:05:40 am
Right, Martin. I'm in a minority who understand what street really is. But you've made clear that that minority is a long way from "massive." Looking at the way you write, I'm not surprised you're confused.

Ah Russ. A cheap insult. You are good at dishing them out aren’t you? Fortunately for me I consider your insults as unimaginative and dull as everything else you post. Keep trying Russ. You never know, one day you might have an imaginative thought.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 02, 2019, 08:56:56 am
Try to avoid a stroke or heart attack, Martin. Breathing into a paper bag may help.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: stamper on February 02, 2019, 09:46:37 am
Martin, if you want to believe that a picture of an ambulance zooming down a street is street photography, be my guest. Street photography is photography that shows interesting and often ambiguous interrelationships between people and other people and between people and their environment. This picture doesn't show either thing.

 Agreed.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 02, 2019, 11:12:30 am
Martin, if you want to believe that a picture of an ambulance zooming down a street is street photography, be my guest. Street photography is photography that shows interesting and often ambiguous interrelationships between people and other people and between people and their environment. This picture doesn't show either thing.

Ah, but it so does.

It is not just "an ambulance zooming down a street." It has something extra than makes the shot: the cross reflection. It also contains the exact moment the ambulance touches the reflection, merging for a split second with it symbolically and symbiotically.

It does contain people and their interaction with the environment.

Just like street photography doesn't need to happen only on the street, people street photography doesn't need to obviously show people, if their presence is palpable. There are people in that ambulance, one of which is in critical condition, and, like most people, turning to God for help, even if metaphorically so. And here we have a cross* (pardon the pun) between two crosses: one symbolizing modern medicine, on a modern vehicle, and the other ancient, symbolizing the eternal belief in divine intervention and ultimate salvation.

This image is so much more about human presence than, for instance, two old guys shooting the breeze, or someone sitting in a cafe window, or colorful socks.

* Or, as OnlyNorth rightly suggests, a cooperation
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 02, 2019, 11:36:38 am
It does contain people and their interaction with the environment.

Really, where? Point out the people to me, Slobodan. It's a damn machine zooming down a street. The fact that it's in a street doesn't make this a street photograph. I'm not saying it's a bad photograph. It's a fairly good photograph. But it's a long way from street photography.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 02, 2019, 02:21:14 pm
I shall remind myself more often of this ;)

Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: OnlyNorth on February 02, 2019, 03:14:24 pm
Generally speaking,various photographic genres,as other areas,can not be placed between impenetrable walls.There is more or less diffusion to the rest of the genres.My intention was not to divided You.Everywhere
can be a '' lighthouse keeper '' sometimes being more Catholic than the Pope-in most situation this being a good thing.
Apologizing for the annoyance that I have caused You,thank You all.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: RSL on February 02, 2019, 03:35:13 pm
It's not your fault, Only. It's LuLa's fault for continuing to hang on to the Street Showcase category when it only confuses people who are clueless about the genre. Your post would have been on the money in User Critiques. You're right: the walls around any genre are fairly porous, though not this porous.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 02, 2019, 03:54:52 pm
... So stand on the beach and tell the tide not to come in. You are going to get wet.

Well, Florida is a stand-your-ground state  ;)
Title: A cooperation
Post by: Ivophoto on February 03, 2019, 03:01:06 am
I shall remind myself more often of this ;)

I did this several times in keeping me away from this discussion. And did not have the time to decently replying this thread.

I like this picture for the reasons Slobodan explains here above.
And I agree with Slobodan’s  view on street photography. I also think magnum’s description is a good contemporary base of orientation.

Maybe Russ can find agreement in speaking about  ‘Classic Street Photography’ when speaking about the narrow definition and accept photography moved on the last 50 years. So much happened since HCB and the other ‘classics’..
Making other choices in taking pictures doesn’t mean peoples are unwilling to learn or understand.
This quixotic crusade is at the point that admiration turns into compassion.

In an article about photography the term ‘in the gamut of the human condition’ was used. I admit it sounds a bit vain or pretentious but it isn’t if you read it humble enough. For me it describes very well how I look to contemporary street photography and the term is far less pretentious than the ignorance of the incoming wave, described by Martin in one of his replies in this thread.

And yes, I would have left Lula because of those hostile and condescending and covered up ad hominem reactions against peoples who put their ‘not complying’ work in this street sub forum. But I learned the majority of members do not agree with this attitude and viewpoint and that’ll keep me here.

Ivo
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: OnlyNorth on February 03, 2019, 05:40:46 am
I did this several times in keeping me away from this discussion. And did not have the time to decently replying this thread.

I like this picture for the reasons Slobodan explains here above.
And I agree with Slobodan’s  view on street photography. I also I think magnum’s description is a good contemporary base of orientation.

Maybe Russ can find agreement in speaking about  ‘Classic Street Photography’ when speaking about the narrow definition and accept photography moved on the last 50 years. So much happened since HCB and the other ‘classics’..
Making other choices in taking pictures doesn’t mean peoples are unwilling to learn or understand.
This quixotic crusade is at the point that admiration turns into compassion.

In an article about photography the term ‘in the gamut of the human condition’ was used. I admit it sounds a bit vain or pretentious but it isn’t if you read it humble enough. For me it describes very well how I look to contemporary street photography and the term is far less pretentious than the ignorance of the incoming wave, described by Martin in one of his replies in this thread.

And yes, I would have left Lula because of those hostile and condescending and covered up ad hominem reactions against peoples who put their ‘not complying’ work in this street sub forum. But I learned the majority of members do not agree with this attitude and viewpoint and that’ll keep me here.

Ivo
I am glad You changed Your mind!
Thank You.
Title: Re: A cooperation
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on February 03, 2019, 12:44:16 pm
It's not your fault, Only. It's LuLa's fault for continuing to hang on to the Street Showcase category when it only confuses people who are clueless about the genre. Your post would have been on the money in User Critiques. You're right: the walls around any genre are fairly porous, though not this porous.
My personal solution is to think of this thread as "Street (and loosely related) Showcase."   ;)