Post by: jensputzier on August 04, 2018, 12:35:34 am
Post by: Ivophoto on August 04, 2018, 03:02:39 am
Chiloquin, OR.
Good composition. The electric pôle cuts the frame on an interesting spot.
I would have given more view on the left, but that’s a personal choice.
Post by: RSL on August 04, 2018, 06:04:57 am
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on August 04, 2018, 07:56:50 am
Good catch.
Post by: Rob C on August 04, 2018, 10:26:29 am
Right, Ivo. That way you'd get in more street, making it more a street photo.
Well, they keep telling us photography is "fun".
I'd always believed and hoped it was so much more.
:-)
Post by: KLaban on August 04, 2018, 10:58:23 am
Post by: Rob C on August 04, 2018, 11:13:03 am
Whatever it is, take the fun out of it and it is so much less.
Mathematically, I guess, that depends on the constitution of the compound. I vaguely remember something called chemical arithmetic, but that's probably been replaced by digital now.
As with sex, algorithms do it better. Or is that algorhythms?
Post by: Ivophoto on August 04, 2018, 12:33:39 pm
🤫
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on August 04, 2018, 12:47:03 pm
Post by: Ivophoto on August 04, 2018, 01:30:58 pm
Well, they keep telling us photography is "fun".
I'd always believed and hoped it was so much more.
:-)
Hm, the pretended much more is sometimes dangerously close to intellectual masturbation.
Post by: Rob C on August 04, 2018, 03:51:42 pm
Hm, the pretended much more is sometimes dangerously close to intellectual masturbation.
Well, they'll say that the intellectual ones keep it quiet, on the grounds that if they show signs of intelligence, then they are likely to be besieged by the rest, asking them to solve problems for them.
It's the origin of the things about hiding one's light under a bushel, no resting for the wicked, the burning of books etc. In other words, be a public idiot and the fans will cheer. It's why some need a place to be away from everything else, the opportunity to relax and just be.
However, with photography, unless there's more to it than "fun", there's a good chance that there is no intellect there to pleasure in the first place. Given a choice, I'd ride with my original belief.
Anyway, isn't that inner glow of achievement just another form of self-inflicted pleasure, whether in football, finance or photography? All is vanity, even failure.
:-)
Post by: KLaban on August 04, 2018, 03:59:53 pm
Post by: Rob C on August 04, 2018, 05:15:40 pm
Personally speaking there's far more to it than just fun, but without that fun I doubt I'd do it.
But did Vinnie van G have any fun?
I suppose, on and off, there must have been, but what percentage was blind faith to the mistress, she with the promise of better luck next time?
But then, as you know, there is commitment and there is commitment. Funny thing (no pun etc.) is, I can't really remember thinking of pro life as being fun, but certainly parts of it were pleasurable in the extreme. On the other hand, I have yet to determine what I get out of if all today, apart from knowing that it preserves a portion of sanity - maybe it has become therapy of sorts?
Fun strikes me as such a strange concept; much as the word nice, which tells one nothing at all. Does one have fun making love; is it merely nice or is it a sense of duty to the future or is it something for which there really is no word? Is it all of those things with a flash of fear thrown in for zest?
I guess that 23:12 is not the best time to worry about it.
:-)
Post by: KLaban on August 04, 2018, 05:46:13 pm
(https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*u2KOfeYDR1P3wkSOcljmCA.jpeg)
;-)
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on August 04, 2018, 08:36:20 pm
+100! :DVincent van Gogh on ProzacRobC on Prozac
(https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*u2KOfeYDR1P3wkSOcljmCA.jpeg)
;-)
Post by: Ivophoto on August 05, 2018, 02:10:53 am
+100! :D
Post by: Ivophoto on August 05, 2018, 02:20:05 am
But did Vinnie van G have any fun?
I suppose, on and off, there must have been, but what percentage was blind faith to the mistress, she with the promise of better luck next time?
But then, as you know, there is commitment and there's is commitment. Funny thing (no pun etc.) is, I can't really remember thinking of pro life as being fun, but certainly parts of it were pleasurable in the extreme. On the other hand, I have yet to determine what I get out of if all today, apart from knowing that it preserves a portion of sanity - maybe it has become therapy of sorts?
Fun strikes me as such a strange concept; much as the word nice, which tells one nothing at all. Does one have fun making love; is it merely nice or is it a sense of duty to the future or is it something for which there really is no word? Is it all of those things with a flash of fear thrown in for zest?
I guess that 23:12 is not the best time to worry about it.
:-)
‘Nice’ and ‘fun’ is just ‘not’
A ‘nice’ picture is just ‘not’
‘Nice’ is what they say about the ugly fiancé. But she’s ‘nice’.
There is nothing wrong with someone making ‘nice’ photos or nice paintings or nice ceramics or nice poems. But goddamned, don’t fill every square meter exposition wall with it.
Tell me about that inner fire, it’s not fun! It’s a frigging battle to overcome disappointment after disappointment to finally be utterly insecure about the outcome. But hell, yeah, that why I do things.
Eat that, Van Gogh on Prozac.
🤪🤪
Post by: Ivo_B on August 05, 2018, 03:14:58 am
But did Vinnie van G have any fun?
:-)
I'm reluctant to involve real artists in the discussion about photo's.
There is not much craft left in photography as it is these days. Even the final subject, the print (if there is a print), is most of the time a cheap paper spitted out a cheap inkjet with refill inkt.
I wonder how much of the so called 'fine art' images here on LULA are effectively craft-full finished in a skillful and well executed proper presented print. Prints on good material, printed in consideration with the place where it will hang, skillfully mounted, etc etc. I guess: 0% and I accept 0,5% error in my estimate.
Do we, photographers, have a so called art-form without the craft and lies the art in the cerebral effort to find the right moment to push the button? Or is it in the preparation, the set up, the organization of the props and models,....?
Sometimes I feel photography is a self indulged medium, and photographers an exponent of it, and it has nothing to do with art. A nice tool to grab what is there or snap something put in scene, with the attitude of 'art' and the nature of fake.
(speaking about intellectual masturbation,....... Tsss)
Post by: KLaban on August 05, 2018, 04:40:23 am
But hey, lets get those tissues out and have a joint curmudgeon fest in the hopes it will feed our creative juices.
;-)
Post by: Rob C on August 05, 2018, 05:38:12 am
I'm reluctant to involve real artists in the discussion about photo's.
There is not much craft left in photography as it is these days. Even the final subject, the print (if there is a print), is most of the time a cheap paper spitted out a cheap inkjet with refill inkt.
I wonder how much of the so called 'fine art' images here on LULA are effectively craft-full finished in a skillful and well executed proper presented print. Prints on good material, printed in consideration with the place where it will hang, skillfully mounted, etc etc. I guess: 0% and I accept 0,5% error in my estimate.
Do we, photographers, have a so called art-form without the craft and lies the art in the cerebral effort to find the right moment to push the button? Or is it in the preparation, the set up, the organization of the props and models,....?
Sometimes I feel photography is a self indulged medium, and photographers an exponent of it, and it has nothing to do with art. A nice tool to grab what is there or snap something put in scene, with the attitude of 'art' and the nature of fake.
(speaking about intellectual masturbation,....... Tsss)
I like the ideas you put forward, Ivo. I also like the way that when you make a direct link to something I have penned, it instantly shows me my frequent typos, typos that I obviously never see whan I check before posting. Quite amazing, that.
............................
To print or not to print.
For a while, I used to buy Hahnemeuhle (I always have to check the spelling) papers and print what I though worth the cost. I even had illusions of selling stuff and financing my "fun" that way. In the end, HP stopped supporting my printer and, after I raged at them for a couple of years, I realised they'd actually done me a huge, money-saving favour: there was suddenly no need to grow the stack of cardboard boxes enclosing beautiful prints, archivally stored in invisible polyester print sleeves. Silverprint 0: Rob C 1. I won!
Today, the final destination - unless I get ripped off - is my website, where I can flip through stuff whenever I want too, marvel at my own major and minor miracles and feel much better than I did before I peeped! (Is that also mental masturbation, he asked?)
Yeah, I think the photographic artform has changed; it used to be about craft, both at the shooting and the printing or lightbox stages. Today, much of the shooting skill is in defeating the camera's intentions and taming it to allow you to retain mastery of the situation. After that, you slip into the zone where you sit on your ass and repeat and repeat and repeat until you get to what you want. There is no penalty for not knowing what you do; it simply doesn't matter anymore (that Mr Holly still gets everywhere) because you can switch off, go and sit on the can or just have a cup of tea - hopefully, not both at the same time; you can go out for lunch or even cook it, if creativity is your thing, and even go on holiday and, unless the computer dies of loneliness in your absence, not a thing will have changed, no solutions will have gone off, no temperatures will have dropped - or gone up - and suddenly, as now, you get to that Damascene moment when you say hey, isn't that just like sculpture and drawing?
I submit that all art is self-indulgence. The sane mind only does it because of that drive, the drive that comes with its own reward even when nobody else wants to offer glittering prizes and open cheques... if that desire isn't there, I see no purpose to any of it because, as a business, for example, it is amongst the most difficult and the least financially rewarding - for most people doing it. As hobby, what do you get if not a rare ego-stroke? Nothing at all, beyond delusion. Frankly, better reading a good book than producing lousy pictures that only your mother or sister can bear to say are Great. (It's what sisters and mothers often have to do. It accounts for the rise in gin sales since the advent of digital cameras. In the UK, gin sales have rocketed of late, which may or may not be directly linked to mirrorless camera sales.)
Oh well, time for coffee before having a shower and making myself presentable for lunch. I don't want to smell like the other person's fish.
;-)
Post by: KLaban on August 05, 2018, 06:30:47 am
Today, the final destination - unless I get ripped off - is my website, where I can flip through stuff whenever I want too, marvel at my own major and minor miracles and feel much better than I did before I peeped! (Is that also mental masturbation, he asked?)
Geesh, Rob, I wish that could work for me. You'll not find my images on my walls in my house. In 50+ years I've made two images that would bear my repeated viewing. My drive is the hope I'll make that three.
Eat yer heart out, Van Gogh.
;-(
Post by: Rob C on August 05, 2018, 07:12:42 am
Geesh, Rob, I wish that could work for me. You'll not find my images on my walls in my house. In 50+ years I've made two images that would bear my repeated viewing. My drive is the hope I'll make that three.
Eat yer heart out, Van Gogh.
;-(
Keith, you are too hard on yourself; I could go to your site and point out many such images that make me wish I'd made 'em!
Looking ahead to the next image is fine, but that doesn't mean that those guys who used to say "my best shot is the one I'm going to make next" are right! Bailey says that six or seven a year is good going; that's on his Richter Scale, but mine is calibrated to a different pitch! Hence, my measurement of Earth-moving delights is equally subjective, with the multiplicity of "major and minor miracles" spread over a lifetime!
The more I think about Vincent, the more sad I become. All that fame and wealth so, so bloody posthumously! I don't suppose his brother got anything out of it either... You can't rely on the myth of fairness, despite the many people who turn it into party politics, poor sods. It's just a human device to compensate for personal failures, as I am perfectly aware. It is what it is, life. Until we can select parents, at least.
Post by: KLaban on August 05, 2018, 07:31:40 am
Rob, my problem with repeated viewing is I inevitably see those shortcomings that preclude the images qualifying for such a thread.
Hey ho.
Post by: Rob C on August 05, 2018, 08:02:47 am
I've often thought of starting a thread with the title Give us your best shot, an open thread inviting contributors to share what they consider to be their favourite shot and also share the thinking behind their choice. The obvious problem is it would be limited to one shot per contributor and it's not beyond imagination that many would fear being called out on their choice.
Rob, my problem with repeated viewing is I inevitably see those shortcomings that preclude the images qualifying for such a thread.
Hey ho
Yes, a tough call to make, especially as opinion of relative worth switches, depending on mood, circumstances and surroundings!
Even more difficult is reverse-rationalisation, possibly months after the emotion of the event. Unless one is totally trapped within a very tight definition of genre - which I think has value - then there's the added problem of exactly that: genre.
I think I could do it with calendar photography, which in my own case has been much preoccupied with what has been going down within the distant Pirelli world; let's give it a whirl and see where it goes!
Rob
P.S.
Done! See CC.
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on August 05, 2018, 09:21:14 am
... Tell me about that inner fire, it’s not fun! It’s a frigging battle to overcome disappointment after disappointment to finally be utterly insecure about the outcome. But hell, yeah, that why I do things...
Nicely put :)
Post by: RSL on August 05, 2018, 09:25:16 am
Yes, a tough call to make, especially as opinion of relative worth switches, depending on mood, circumstances and surroundings!
And time. What do you do if you've posted what you've identified as your best shot, and then a year later shoot something you believe is a world above your earlier choice? If you've posted the earlier picture on your own web it's not a problem, but if you've posted it on Keith's "My Best Shot" web..?
Post by: Rob C on August 05, 2018, 10:18:06 am
And time. What do you do if you've posted what you've identified as your best shot, and then a year later shoot something you believe is a world above your earlier choice? If you've posted the earlier picture on your own web it's not a problem, but if you've posted it on Keith's "My Best Shot" web..?
Return to it, and edit.
Remember, eligibility require explanation-with-pìcture! It's the rule!
Rob
Post by: Ivophoto on August 05, 2018, 10:24:26 am
I like the ideas you put forward, Ivo. I also like the way that when you make a direct link to something I have penned, it instantly shows me my frequent typos, typos that I obviously never see whan I check before posting. Quite amazing, that.
.
Not sure how to understand this. Do I have to quote differently? No bad means on my side.
About typos, at least you recognize them, I’m already happy I can communicate in something that resembles to a kind of English.
Post by: RSL on August 05, 2018, 10:26:01 am
Post by: Rob C on August 05, 2018, 10:58:55 am
Not sure how to understand this. Do I have to quote differently? No bad means on my side.
About typos, at least you recognize them, I’m already happy I can communicate in something that resembles to a kind of English.
Absolutely not! It just shows me how differently I see what I write when I write it, compared with how I see it when it is quoted in another post. Nothing wrong on your part at all - it's all about my own perception of the way things look in print, and how easily typing errors slip right past me! Mea culpa in every sense of it!
Post by: KLaban on August 05, 2018, 11:04:23 am
And time. What do you do if you've posted what you've identified as your best shot, and then a year later shoot something you believe is a world above your earlier choice? If you've posted the earlier picture on your own web it's not a problem, but if you've posted it on Keith's "My Best Shot" web..?
Russ, we are constantly adding to our portfolios, I don't think it's beyond the scope of the thread to allow a contributor to update their choice with a fresh post.
Thoughts?
Post by: Ivophoto on August 05, 2018, 11:52:50 am
I like the ideas you put forward, Ivo. I also like the way that when you make a direct link to something I have penned, it instantly shows me my frequent typos, typos that I obviously never see whan I check before posting. Quite amazing, that.
............................
To print or not to print.
For a while, I used to buy Hahnemeuhle (I always have to check the spelling) papers and print what I though worth the cost.
;-)
I use Hahnemühle Bamboo. Great paper.
I first used Hahnemühles photorag. It took me serious effort to get the profile correct, but eventually it worked out.
And then, Hahnemühle took over Harman and I had to buy in more photorag in the middle of a series of prints and the new badge turned out not to be the original Photorag I was used hence the profile became worthless.
After extensive communication with Hahnemühle and sending test strips they admitted they had to change the recipe due to unavailable raw materials. Fair enough. (I still think they swapped the Photorag for a cheaper to produce Harman sibling)
Hahnemühle sent me samples of all fine art paper and after I found Bamboo the most what I liked (to be honest, I like it more than the original photorag) they send me two A3+ 50pc packs free of charge. AND they’ve created a custom made profile for my printers (Epson 7600 and 2100)
What a service.
The 7600 is retired and because my workflow with the Bamboo in the old 2100 is so spot on, I ‘m not very enthusiast to buy a new printer. Tough I should, the 2100 is obsolete as a Ford T and the ink cartridges are filled with liquid gold.
Post by: RSL on August 05, 2018, 02:25:03 pm
Russ, we are constantly adding to our portfolios, I don't think it's beyond the scope of the thread to allow a contributor to update their choice with a fresh post.
Thoughts?
I think that would do it, Keith. In my own case I don't think it matters much. Until the wretched Florida summer's over I won't be able to get anywhere to do street, and it's too damn hot to do landscape. So until things improve I'll write short stories. I don't think one of those can go into this thread.
Post by: Rob C on August 05, 2018, 05:43:36 pm
I think that would do it, Keith. In my own case I don't think it matters much. Until the wretched Florida summer's over I won't be able to get anywhere to do street, and it's too damn hot to do landscape. So until things improve I'll write short stories. I don't think one of those can go into this thread.
It's no better here: last week we went to lunch and when we got back to the car, it read 45 degrees. No wonder animals left in cars in this weather can die! Once we got underway again, it fell back to 34 degrees, which is okay. The problem isn't so much the heat as the humidity. My wife fell in a faint on a trip to Key West, and being used to here, that was surprising, but the humidity was worse. One of our models did the same in Singapore, but anything goes there - except chewing gum.
;-)