Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: ahphoto on June 15, 2017, 05:03:22 pm
-
Does any one know if the Mirage RIP works in a similar way to Imageprint? i.e. bypassing the Epson driver and directly controlling to printer.
-
Does any one know if the Mirage RIP works in a similar way to Imageprint? i.e. bypassing the Epson driver and directly controlling to printer.
Yes.
http://mirage.dinax.de/
-
Thank you donbga.
-
Hi. I'm not sure how it works but I know it works really well. After 5 years I can say that you would never print from any application again once you get Mirage. There is a plugin for Photoshop but I never use it. Just export a 16bit ProPhoto TIF and print the same every time.
-
Bob and I agree on something :-) Mirage is very good.
-
Does any one know if the Mirage RIP works in a similar way to Imageprint? i.e. bypassing the Epson driver and directly controlling to printer.
Be informed that Qimage Ultimate is ported to the Mac, fall of 2017 available;
http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=118544.0
http://ddisoftware.com/tech/qimage-ultimate/mac-version/?PHPSESSID=sjte4c0rb4rrjgo8gavet9bou2
Pricing probably nicer, uses the OEM drivers so not limited to one printer or printer brand.
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
March 2017 update, 750+ inkjet media white spectral plots
-
Yes.
http://mirage.dinax.de/
Hi,
I'm not so sure. There is no mention of it on their website that I can find. To me, it always looked like a nice frontend to the printer driver, and since I already have Qimage, which additionally does add functionality that improves image quality before sending the data to the printer driver, I have not tried the more expensive Mirage software.
Cheers,
Bart
-
Mirage definitely takes advantage of the printer as do other RIPS. To a lesser extent in many ways, but for photographers in all the important ways. It is not bound by the driver and is able to directly address the device.
-
Mirage definitely takes advantage of the printer as do other RIPS. To a lesser extent in many ways, but for photographers in all the important ways. It is not bound by the driver and is able to directly address the device.
Hi Phil,
Thanks for confirming. I suppose that's why it is required to purchase different versions for different (inkjet only) printers/brands (only Canon/Epson), unlike Qimage which works for any (even non-inkjet) printer that is supported by the operating system with a driver that's maintained by the printer manufacturer, without the need to also purchase an additional dongle for use on multiple computers.
It's a bit strange why they never seem to explain that on their website though, and the trial version seems to be enabled for all supported printers, but gets limited for a specific model license. The manual also doesn't mention it, as far as I can find. They also do not mention future upgrade pricing, or cross-grade pricing when switching brands or Computers (the license seems to be linked to the Computer). One needs to assume that past upgrade/cross-grade pricing remains as it was in the past.
Cheers,
Bart
-
I have used Mirage for the trial period and it seems to be excellent, maybe not all the functionality of Image print but good enough for me to purchase. Image print is way overpriced in my opinion.
-
Thanks for confirming. I suppose that's why it is required to purchase different versions for different (inkjet only) printers/brands (only Canon/Epson), unlike Qimage which works for any (even non-inkjet) printer that is supported by the operating system with a driver that's maintained by the printer manufacturer, without the need to also purchase an additional dongle for use on multiple computers.
It's a bit strange why they never seem to explain that on their website though, and the trial version seems to be enabled for all supported printers, but gets limited for a specific model license. The manual also doesn't mention it, as far as I can find. They also do not mention future upgrade pricing, or cross-grade pricing when switching brands or Computers (the license seems to be linked to the Computer). One needs to assume that past upgrade/cross-grade pricing remains as it was in the past.
Yeah, I don't know. I suspect that the limits on which models can be used is just a pricing matrix for marketing and sales purposes - everything is under the hood - it would be a nightmare maintaining multiple versions of the code otherwise.
Most RIPs don't go out of their way to say "we don't use the driver" - that's just pretty much assumed in that part of the market. All these RIP vendors work directly with the manufacturers to gain access to the necessary materials to make their RIPs.
-
Mirage definitely takes advantage of the printer as do other RIPS. To a lesser extent in many ways, but for photographers in all the important ways. It is not bound by the driver and is able to directly address the device.
One example is the ability to print long panos. You can't do that with the driver.
Never having to worry about resizing is a huge advantage also. it just works it out.
-
One example is the ability to print long panos. You can't do that with the driver.
Maybe, it depends. On printers that use a printer driver that supports Roll paper, Qimage can also print lengths that the printer driver doesn't offer in the presets. It simply prints multiple pages seamlessly edge-to-edge as long as there is paper. A regular printer driver often limits the maximum print length due to page-buffer memory limitations, but Qimage sends the printer data in chunks instead of a single page to avoid buffer overflow. Apparently, Qimage is limited to 1 Giga-byte input file size, don't know if Mirage has a limitation.
Never having to worry about resizing is a huge advantage also. it just works it out.
Agreed, and that has a lot to do with the printer's page-buffer capacity, and the speed/chunk-size with which data arrives at the printer.
Cheers,
Bart
-
Hi Phil,
Thanks for confirming. I suppose that's why it is required to purchase different versions for different (inkjet only) printers/brands (only Canon/Epson), unlike Qimage which works for any (even non-inkjet) printer that is supported by the operating system with a driver that's maintained by the printer manufacturer, without the need to also purchase an additional dongle for use on multiple computers.
It's a bit strange why they never seem to explain that on their website though, and the trial version seems to be enabled for all supported printers, but gets limited for a specific model license. The manual also doesn't mention it, as far as I can find. They also do not mention future upgrade pricing, or cross-grade pricing when switching brands or Computers (the license seems to be linked to the Computer). One needs to assume that past upgrade/cross-grade pricing remains as it was in the past.
Cheers,
Bart
Hi Bart, The purpose of the dongle is so that one can use the software on different computers, at least that's what I understood.
Also, anyone wanting to get the LR plugin, don't. It's a waste of money. It's pretty much a preset, which anyone could create.
And lastly, one feature that I have recently started using is the Job Archive. If you have a print or set of prints you tend to re-print,
it will not only remember the settings, it remembers the file as well. So all you do is go into the Mirage Job Archive app, find the job and just hit print.
I sell postcards to a small company and works perfectly for that.
-
Does any one know if the Mirage RIP works in a similar way to Imageprint? i.e. bypassing the Epson driver and directly controlling to printer.
As far as I know, the answer is NO. It is thougtht to be so called "extended driver".
I have tried Mirage for my 3880 and P800 and in all cases it have used THE SAME ICC profiles (downoladed from Mirage www in packages) as the profiles from paper vendors for Epson driver...
-
Hi Bart, The purpose of the dongle is so that one can use the software on different computers, at least that's what I understood.
Also, anyone wanting to get the LR plugin, don't. It's a waste of money. It's pretty much a preset, which anyone could create.
And lastly, one feature that I have recently started using is the Job Archive. If you have a print or set of prints you tend to re-print,
it will not only remember the settings, it remembers the file as well. So all you do is go into the Mirage Job Archive app, find the job and just hit print.
I sell postcards to a small company and works perfectly for that.
Sounds like describing some of the features of Qimage Ultimate but the dongle, QU does that without a dongle. Not all the QU features described though.
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
March 2017 update, 750+ inkjet media white spectral plots
-
Hi Bart, The purpose of the dongle is so that one can use the software on different computers, at least that's what I understood.
The purpose of a dongle is to LIMIT use of the software to a single computer. You may have the option to move the dongle from computer to computer. One thing to keep in mind about dongles is how they attach to the computer. Many are USB 2 and in this day and age of frequent standards changes such as the recent USB-C, Thunderbolt, etc. the dongle could drive you crazy when your computers don't offer the same connection method. If the dongle dies do you have to purchase a new one?
I used dongle software once and swear I'll never do that again.
-
The purpose of a dongle is to LIMIT use of the software to a single computer. You may have the option to move the dongle from computer to computer. One thing to keep in mind about dongles is how they attach to the computer. Many are USB 2 and in this day and age of frequent standards changes such as the recent USB-C, Thunderbolt, etc. the dongle could drive you crazy when your computers don't offer the same connection method. If the dongle dies do you have to purchase a new one?
I used dongle software once and swear I'll never do that again.
Well, that's what I was saying. You aren't limited to a single computer but to a dongle. Move the dongle to whatever computer you are using.
Now the USB "version" is a valid concern and to be honest, I hadn't thought about it till you mentioned it. When I decided on Mirage, it came down to Mirage Vs Print Tao. At the time Print Tao didn't offer canvas presets, so I opted for Mirage. I'm about as loyal to printing software as I
am with toilet paper. QImage for Mac may be a game changer. I'll look into it when the time comes.
-
Now the USB "version" is a valid concern and to be honest, I hadn't thought about it till you mentioned it.
Well the answer is to go onto the mirage.dinax.de website and ask them I guess.
I just tried removing the dongle and putting it on a hub and it worked fine, so I suspect that as long as it is mounted it will work.
-
Well the answer is to go onto the mirage.dinax.de website and ask them I guess.
The last two times I had questions, their "support" never responded. But that's another topic for another thread.
-
I have little experience with RIPs, and I don't understand the notion of a "driver extender." I do know that I can (and love to) use Mirage to print panos on my Epson 3880, bypassing the 37" driver limit. But Mirage says they cannot do the same with the Canon Pro-1000.
-
Mirage is not a "driver extended" product. It can address the hardware directly.
-
It seems that the subject of RIP seems to be a bit of a black hole on this forum. Let me try and shine some light into it. Technically a CMYK RIP lets you adjust the individual inks independent of one another. The old X-Proof by Colorburst did this. I used it for years. The majority of the products most useful and easiest to use for photographers today are RGB RIPs which means they use the front end of the manufacturers driver. They do however and this is most important drive the printer directly and avoid the CMM(Color Management Module) in Adobe and the computer's OS. This makes the color more accurate and more importantly infinitely repeatable. In addition you can print at twice the resolution of Photoshop.( 720 vs. 360 DPI). I hope this answers a few of the questions and corrects some misunderstandings. I have been printing through RIPs for 15 years and wouldn't consider printing any other way.
-
mirage is not a full functioning rip
I have been using since v1
it happily runs both canon and epson, i have a 9900 and a pro4000 running with it
BUT it uses the adobe CMM module,
-
It seems that the subject of RIP seems to be a bit of a black hole on this forum. Let me try and shine some light into it. Technically a CMYK RIP lets you adjust the individual inks independent of one another. The old X-Proof by Colorburst did this. I used it for years. The majority of the products most useful and easiest to use for photographers today are RGB RIPs which means they use the front end of the manufacturers driver. They do however and this is most important drive the printer directly and avoid the CMM(Color Management Module) in Adobe and the computer's OS. This makes the color more accurate and more importantly infinitely repeatable. In addition you can print at twice the resolution of Photoshop.( 720 vs. 360 DPI). I hope this answers a few of the questions and corrects some misunderstandings. I have been printing through RIPs for 15 years and wouldn't consider printing any other way.
This message creates some confusion too, which is understandable as the there is a wide variety in RIPs, drivers, Semi-RIP front ends, suiting a wide variety of properties in printers.
A color engine is needed anyway, either the one from the OS the RIP is running on or an independent one. The last can be licensed, for example an open source one like LCMS. A semi RIP (front end) like Qimage Ultimate use the printer manufacturer's drivers but has LCMS as the color engine. However it does not use the CMYK side of that engine, you can only load RGB and Grayscale images and it does the translation to the printer driver RGB input side according the image assigned color space and the printer profile. So like RGB-device CM, comparable to CM for a monitor but with rendering choices. That means in the media preset chosen in the printer driver the RGB>CMYK translation descriptions are kept. Black box for the user. A printer like that can still have a calibration set up (integrated or external spectrometer, integrated densitometer) that takes care of color constancy over time. Adobe's, Apple's, Microsoft's, LCMS, Kodak"s, ArgyllCMS color engines are all quite reliable color engines these days, there can be slight differences in the rendering algorithms on perceptual, BPC, etc but the usual color print problems are user created or printer hardware problems and not bad color engines.
The Epson Photo Printer drivers can be set to a print quality that requests 720 PPI input. QU adds a step beyond that which extrapolates to 1440 PPI input, a kind of overdrive, I still guess comparable to sub pixel methods. The same but up to 1200 PPI input for Canon/HP. BTW, an early HP Z3100 driver had 1200 input factory wise. RIPS can have more odd dpi print output resolutions though, I recall the Wasatch SoftRip driver for the Epson 10000 having something like 540x1080 ? dpi droplet lay down which was not present in the manufacturer's driver.
Some true RIPs; the ones with their own resampling algorithms, with their own dithering/stochastic/etc algorithms for laying down the droplets, the ones that translate RGB to CMYK, accept both RGB and CMYK images + fonts and vectors on one print page, that interpret Postscript like that, have Pantone substitution for spot color etc, nest images, add registration marks for cutting plotters or sheet cutters. Can address N-color printers. Create color separation films for conventional printing. They may still not let the users access the inks individually when creating the CMYK printer profiles that contain the color mixing recipes; UCR, GCR, Hue/Saturation color ink substitution, drying time, paper feed speed alterations, head height, etc etc. The Wasatch SoftRIP has ink limitations, one can set the transfer point between C and LC ink, M and LM ink but 3K-4K is not getting more than that, a true quad set up is impossible. Ergosoft RIPs have more choices. Access to the individual inks can vary a lot between RIPs.
The QTR QuadTone RIP at least can address the individual inks but as a B&W RIP in the first place it lacks a color engine. A lot of other RIP functions are not there either. IMHO still a RIP as it has its own system of translation the (grayscale) pixels to the ink droplets. No OEM driver in between.
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
March 2017 update, 750+ inkjet media white spectral plots