Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Digital Image Processing => Topic started by: l_d_allan on December 04, 2013, 03:02:13 am
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With some reluctance, I decided to subscribe to PS + LR from my current CS5 + LR4. That gives me about a full month to really evaluate it, and see if I want to discontinue within 30 days.
$120 / year USD seems reasonable, but my question is whether there will be a "price bump" this time next year. It concerns me that we'll be a "captive audience".
I do get annoyed by "Loss Leader Teaser Deals", when the cost doubles or triples once the introductory offers ends.
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I think you are right to be worried. The current offer does make some economic sense for amateur photographers like us but, say, a doubling of the subscription in a year or two would make it unattractive to all but professionals or semi-pros.
It seems that Adobe are unwilling to give a sensible forward commitment on price, so my advice would be to hold on to your CS and LR so that you can revert to them if necessary. At least with Lightroom, you should, in a year's time, be able to upgrade it to LR5 (or LR6?) at the normal price if you do have to go back to using the perpetual licence.
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I make no assumptions about commercial companies, other than that they will try to stay legal (or legal enough to avoid action against them) and that they will maximise benefit for senior managers and their owners (in that order, generally).
However, there's a limit to how far you can stiff your customers without losing revenue, and thus impacting benefit for senior managers and owners, so I expect that the price of the bundle won't go up vastly. But that could still be inflation plus a bit - maybe a 10% rise.
It might depend on how many take up the offer. If it's a good take up, then expect a price rise in a year. If it's poor, and after a year CC subscriptions are still poor, then Adobe have a real problem. Screw up the price, and accept that only professionals will ever use CC? Even more tempting offers for amateurs? Who knows.
PS - FWIW, I've subscribed. I've got CS5 and LR5, and the subscription rate of £8.78 in the UK is about what I used to spend to upgrade LR every time, and to upgrade CS every other time (when you could do that). However, if the price goes up much, or we get fewer and fewer enhancements in Photoshop (enhancements useful to me, that is), then I'll drop back to using CS5 and LR by perpetual licence.
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With some reluctance, I decided to subscribe to PS + LR from my current CS5 + LR4. That gives me about a full month to really evaluate it, and see if I want to discontinue within 30 days.
$120 / year USD seems reasonable, but my question is whether there will be a "price bump" this time next year. It concerns me that we'll be a "captive audience".
I do get annoyed by "Lost Leader Teaser Deals", when the cost doubles or triples once the introductory offers ends.
The $9.99 price is the regular price, and not a promotional price that automatically goes up after a year (like some of our other promotions do). Each year when you renew, you renew at the current price, which may be higher or lower (or the same) than what you initially signed up for. This offer is NOT a price guarantee. I imagine, that sometime in the future, the price will change, but in general we don't have plans to raise the price.
Hope that helps...
mike chambers
[email protected]
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It concerns me that we'll be a "captive audience".
you are already, it is just a question whether you will continue to be captive with LR + old PS or LR + PS CC
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... but in general we don't have plans to raise the price.
Not to be argumentative ... but ... before early May of 2013, Adobe had no publicaly stated "plans" to cease development of the perpetual licensing model for their CS products beyond vCS6. With that example, I'm sure you can understand that at least a few potential customers may have some lingering doubt and/or trust issues and are not very reassured by your clarification. For some of us, it may take more than words and a low price threshold to have the confidence that venturing forth is in our best long-term interest.
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Like anything else in life...if the price goes up past what I am willing to pay, I'll stop paying. There are not guarantees in future pricing on anything I purchase or rent. That's just the way it is.
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I think you are right to be worried. The current offer does make some economic sense for amateur photographers like us but, say, a doubling of the subscription in a year or two would make it unattractive to all but professionals or semi-pros.
It seems that Adobe are unwilling to give a sensible forward commitment on price, so my advice would be to hold on to your CS and LR so that you can revert to them if necessary. At least with Lightroom, you should, in a year's time, be able to upgrade it to LR5 (or LR6?) at the normal price if you do have to go back to using the perpetual licence.
Truly, now, hypothetically, if Adobe provided us with a commitment, how many would have believe them ? After all the unmade promises in 2013, and the continuous flip-flopping ? Thanks, but no thanks !
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Not to be argumentative ... but ... before early May of 2013, Adobe had no publicaly stated "plans" to cease development of the perpetual licensing model for their CS products beyond vCS6. With that example, I'm sure you can understand that at least a few potential customers may have some lingering doubt and/or trust issues and are not very reassured by your clarification. For some of us, it may take more than words and a low price threshold to have the confidence that venturing forth is in our best long-term interest.
Yes, plans change over time. That is why in my original statement I said:
I imagine, that sometime in the future, the price will change, but in general we don't have plans to raise the price.
mike chambers
[email protected]
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If I remember right.....last year at this time you were saying there were no plans of ending perpetual licenses. Look what happened in a few months.....then how it flipped and flopped for a few more months. At this point Adobe's word means almost nothing to a lot of your long time users. I do believe right now at this point in time you are right this is the price......but as the past year has showed us this means almost nothing and will most likely change as soon as Adobe feels they are getting their desired amount of users...... or maybe even before that.
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$120 / year USD seems reasonable, but my question is whether there will be a "price bump" this time next year. It concerns me that we'll be a "captive audience".
Well... let's get together in December 2014 and see how it went. Speculation about future prices is futile, as numerous people losing money on the stock markets have found out.
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"captive audience".
Something that concerns me ... some p.p. we've done to images in CC's ACR 8.# could be "orphaned". I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one concerned about this issue.
For example, I'm really impressed with the much more capable and improved "spot removal" in the latest ACR that lets us drag along something to be removed, like a power-line. That's so much better than the old "series of circles" you used to have to do in all previous ACR's (and LR). That was really a "hold your nose work-around".
For me, the "series of circles of spot removal" didn't tend to work all that well anyway. Also, this CC ACR 8.# capability significantly increases the number of images that could be fully pp'ed with ACR, and don't need to get PS healing and/or content removal. For me, the more images that can stay in RAW as the "master" with no need for PS, the better.
I was hoping that when I did this to an image with ACR 8.2, I'd at least be able to see the power-lines removed in an older ACR, but that doesn't seem to be the case.
Soooo .... if I use the improved Spot-Removal a LOT (which I expect to do), and then decide to eventually drop my subscription, then that p.p. is lost. Or not?
I'm hoping that Adobe has some "compatibility enhancement" for older ACR's that let them "see" changes made in a later CC ACR version. That would be like ACR 6.7 with Pv2010 being able to "see" slider tweaks to images that had been processed with PV2012 in LR 4.#. You couldn't made further adjustments, but at least the PV2012 slider tweaks (and brushes and gradient and etc.) had been applied.
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I'm hoping that Adobe has some "compatibility enhancement" for older ACR's that let them "see" changes made in a later CC ACR version. That would be like ACR 6.7 with Pv2010 being able to "see" slider tweaks to images that had been processed with PV2012 in LR 4.#. You couldn't made further adjustments, but at least the PV2012 slider tweaks (and brushes and gradient and etc.) had been applied.
Hi,
Well, many have expressed their concerns with the lack of a real exit option to the subscription model. Since Adobe still have not come up with some kind of solution, it seems they want to make stopping to pay them for life, as painful as possible (even more painful as time goes by, to express their gratitude for loyalty).
Cheers,
Bart
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Hi,
Well, many have expressed their concerns with the lack of a real exit option to the subscription model. Since Adobe still have not come up with some kind of solution, it seems they want to make stopping to pay them for life, as painful as possible (even more painful as time goes by, to express their gratitude for loyalty).
Cheers,
Bart
This certainly seems the case. Not having a smooth exit option is the MAIN reason I am not moving to the cloud. Cost is an issue, but a secondary one in this case.
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Hi,
Well, many have expressed their concerns with the lack of a real exit option to the subscription model. Since Adobe still have not come up with some kind of solution, it seems they want to make stopping to pay them for life, as painful as possible (even more painful as time goes by, to express their gratitude for loyalty).
Cheers,
Bart
I agree this is an issue. But what exit option could Adobe offer, short of dropping back to a perpetual license model (which they say they won't do)?
My personal exit strategy (if I don't want to go on paying per month) is that I'll go back to my stand-alone LR5 and update that if necessary, and use my copy of Photoshop CS5.
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I agree this is an issue. But what exit option could Adobe offer, short of dropping back to a perpetual license model (which they say they won't do)?
Allow to purchase the last subscribed version for a reasonable price, and make the usage license for that version perpetual.
Cheers,
Bart
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My personal exit strategy (if I don't want to go on paying per month) is that I'll go back to my stand-alone LR5 and update that if necessary, and use my copy of Photoshop CS5.
That's close to what I have in mind, if CC goes up in price dramatically. But .... who knows?
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Allow to purchase the last subscribed version for a reasonable price, and make the usage license for that version perpetual.
Unlikely, but I hope you're right.
My hope would be that if you've subscribed for ## months, Adobe allows you to purchase a perpetual license for a reasonable amount.
Kind of like fulfilling your lease agreement on a car, then buying the car?
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I agree this is an issue. But what exit option could Adobe offer, short of dropping back to a perpetual license model (which they say they won't do)?
Allow to purchase the last subscribed version for a reasonable price, and make the usage license for that version perpetual.
Simon specifically asked "what exit option could Adobe offer, short of dropping back to a perpetual license model".
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My hope would be that if you've subscribed for ## months, Adobe allows you to purchase a perpetual license for a reasonable amount.
You're deluding yourself.
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Allow to purchase the last subscribed version for a reasonable price, and make the usage license for that version perpetual.
Simon specifically asked "what exit option could Adobe offer, short of dropping back to a perpetual license model".
It is not a perpetual license model, neither from a cash flow or Tax, nor from a development cycle perspective.
Cheers,
Bart
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I'm not going to quarrel about what you think is different between "a perpetual license model" and "make the usage license for that version perpetual".
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I was thinking of trying Photoshop CC, so went to download it. When I didn't enter the year of my birth correctly (such that I would be about one year old), access was denied... and now I am locked out for 24 hours according to the FAQ. After that, I'm done. Instead I purchased the upgrade from CS5 to CS6, which will probably be good for me for a very long while. Way to go Adobe, you just lost a CC customer. If they can't get something simple like that right, how would I trust them with rental software?
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When I didn't enter the year of my birth correctly ...
Hmmm, is that intended to be a "security" feature to help protect you from others using your account?
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Hmmm, is that intended to be a "security" feature to help protect you from others using your account?
Please explain, why an age entered on an internet 'form' is relevant if one also has to supply the credit card details?
Privacy is apparently a non-issue with you, or do you agree with withholding irrelevant info?
Cheers,
Bart
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Hmmm, is that intended to be a "security" feature to help protect you from others using your account?
No, I don't think they know my birthdate. If I had chosen 1920, it probably would have worked out fine (unless they have an age restriction for those that may have dementia ;) If it was a security feature, they probably would have sent an email warning me someone was trying to get into my account. I'm not really interested in giving out that sort of information anyway, so wouldn't have given them the correct date. I was stunned to find out that I was locked out for 24 hours, and that I couldn't post on the Photoshop forum either because I was locked out. See:
http://helpx.adobe.com/creative-cloud/kb/you-eligible-cc.html
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There are restrictions on maintaining data (accounts) etc for those under 13 years of age. It's not at all unusual for your DOB to be requested as a basic check in this regard (your CC details may not be your personal CC details).
I don't know if that's what was being done in this case, but it's very common for anywhere that you create an account for ongoing access.
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There are restrictions on maintaining data (accounts) etc for those under 13 years of age. It's not at all unusual for your DOB to be requested as a basic check in this regard (your CC details may not be your personal CC details).
I don't know if that's what was being done in this case, but it's very common for anywhere that you create an account for ongoing access.
The problem isn't the asking, it's the 24 hour lockout that occurs from a "wrong" answer. Unacceptable in the days of instantly downloadable software.
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Yeah, I can't see any reason for locking an account out in that situation. If I had to guess (and it's a wild arse guess), it might be due to the recent hack and someone's maybe over reacted on the security side.
Mike from Adobe has been posting here and may see and respond, or you could try emailing him direct (he's posted his address each time he's posted). I know you've already voted with your feet/wallet, but it may help.
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Mike from Adobe has been posting here and may see and respond, or you could try emailing him direct (he's posted his address each time he's posted). I know you've already voted with your feet/wallet, but it may help.
Yup, too late for me, no longer interested. I will check back in a few years if CS6 gets too stale for me.
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There are restrictions on maintaining data (accounts) etc for those under 13 years of age.
Hmmm.
The problem isn't the asking, it's the 24 hour lockout that occurs from a "wrong" answer. Unacceptable in the days of instantly downloadable software.
I guess you've never been locked-out of your bank website, and waited for a new card and pin to do separate transcontinental snail mail ;-)
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Hmmm.
I guess you've never been locked-out of your bank website, and waited for a new card and pin to do separate transcontinental snail mail ;-)
I feel so fortunate to benefit from your infinite wisdom. You certainly are perfection personified. Thanks for all you do to guide we mere mortals in our daily lives. We would be lost without your insight. ;)
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Right back at you.
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Hmmm, is that intended to be a "security" feature to help protect you from others using your account?
Please explain, why an age entered on an internet 'form' is relevant if one also has to supply the credit card details?
You seem confused. I am not asking for anyone's age "on an internet 'form'". Ask someone who is.
Privacy is apparently a non-issue with you, or do you agree with withholding irrelevant info?
You are confused.
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Hmmm.
I guess you've never been locked-out of your bank website, and waited for a new card and pin to do separate transcontinental snail mail ;-)
Correct. The bank gives you 3 tries. ;D
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Hmmm.
I guess you've never been locked-out of your bank website, and waited for a new card and pin to do separate transcontinental snail mail ;-)
Correct. The bank gives you 3 tries. ;D
Not my bank. If you use your card from a machine that the bank decides is dodgy, or a network error generates a message that the bank decides might be card misuse, or you use your card from a "high risk country" (even if you've told them that you are travelling to that country) the bank blocks the card instantly.
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My credit card ( Mastercard ) stopped working without any warning when the bank found a possible breach. Zero warning...
Correct. The bank gives you 3 tries. ;D
Not my bank. If you use your card from a machine that the bank decides is dodgy, or a network error generates a message that the bank decides might be card misuse, or you use your card from a "high risk country" (even if you've told them that you are travelling to that country) the bank blocks the card instantly.
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The question that occurs to me is whether buying Photoshop is actually necessary? I've been running CS for a while now but will be upgrading the PC in the near future and so my software needs are under the microscope. I already use Fastone on the laptop for printing at events so why not go the whole hog and use it on the new PC rather than get involved with Adobe once more? (actually numerous reasons) But then I read that CS2 is available as a free download (http://www.techspot.com/downloads/3689-adobe-photoshop-cs2.html Is this legit?) (http://www.techspot.com/downloads/3689-adobe-photoshop-cs2.html) so what's the point of spending on a later version, especially if DXO will clean things up at a one off price and I'm not in to manipulation.
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so what's the point of spending on a later version
Seems like a question for John Hollenberg given that he apparently thought it worth "the upgrade from CS5 to CS6".
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No, I don't think they know my birthdate. If I had chosen 1920, it probably would have worked out fine (unless they have an age restriction for those that may have dementia ;) If it was a security feature, they probably would have sent an email warning me someone was trying to get into my account. I'm not really interested in giving out that sort of information anyway, so wouldn't have given them the correct date. I was stunned to find out that I was locked out for 24 hours, and that I couldn't post on the Photoshop forum either because I was locked out. See:
http://helpx.adobe.com/creative-cloud/kb/you-eligible-cc.html
Donning my tin foil hat I'd point out that attaching a birth date to web communications is very helpful to the good ol' boys in the NSA and the jolly decent chaps at GCHQ, it's something I try and avoid doing as well. Adobe are probably just as keen on keeping tabs on people as well, whether it's at all useful to them is a different matter.
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Seems like a question for John Hollenberg given that he apparently thought it worth "the upgrade from CS5 to CS6".
To my way of thinking Adobe took PS and made it an elitist product simply because they had no competition. Over the years there was very much the insinuation that if you can't afford a couple of thou every year on keeping up to date then you ain't really a proper photographer. PS is still the big daddy but thankfully there are now smaller fish nibbling at the edges and I'm inclined to see if it's possible to live without it on the PC.
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Yeah, it might even help keep photographers honest ;)
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Quite.
Adobe told the world that proper photography was impossible without PS, and that will be 2K thank you very much.
Then they sat back and wondered why everybody (an awful lot anyway) was pirating the software!
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The reason for Adobe's age requirement is legal. Depending on the jurisdiction, ie. state, a person under 18 cannot contract for future performance.
Ken Richmond
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The reason for Adobe's age requirement is legal. Depending on the jurisdiction, ie. state, a person under 18 cannot contract for future performance.
Hi Ken,
I've been wondering about how specific one needs to be (and I realize it may differ by jurisdiction) to comply with local law. Does a simple statement that one declares to be over 18 suffice, or does one need to specify a date of birth. The latter also constitutes a privacy risk (as the recent hack with credit card details and passwords proves).
Cheers,
Bart
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The reason for Adobe's age requirement is legal. Depending on the jurisdiction, ie. state, a person under 18 cannot contract for future performance.
And the truth shall set you free!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jQP0Y2T2OQ
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Bart,
Adobe can protect itself with an affirmation that, "I am legally competent to enter a contract for future performance.", but I think it would cause some consternation, so they do it by requiring one to indicate a birth date. There's little likelihood that they undertake any effort to confirm the information.
Ken Richmond
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Bart,
Adobe can protect itself with an affirmation that, "I am legally competent to enter a contract for future performance.", but I think it would cause some consternation, so they do it by requiring one to indicate a birth date. There's little likelihood that they undertake any effort to confirm the information.
Hi Ken,
Thanks for confirming what I sort of assumed.
Cheers,
Bart
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Sorry, but if you lie about date of birth, Adobe may - according to license agreement - terminate your account... http://macperformanceguide.com/blog/2013/20130508_1a-Adobe-legal-agreement.html
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Sorry, but if you lie about date of birth, Adobe may - according to license agreement - terminate your account... http://macperformanceguide.com/blog/2013/20130508_1a-Adobe-legal-agreement.html
It's a lot worse than I thought. Looks like CS6 will be my final version of Photoshop... should save me considerable amount of money over the years.
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Why? They need to confirm that you have the legal capacity to enter into a contract and for them to store certain information about you. That's a pretty normal requirement.
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Why? They need to confirm that you have the legal capacity to enter into a contract and for them to store certain information about you. That's a pretty normal requirement.
All they would need to do is ask if you are over 18 (or whatever age is required). I doubt they have a way to check your date of birth, so this is just giving out private information they have no need for with potential for misuse. Since Adobe has been hacked already, why would I want to give them information they don't need?
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It's a lot worse than I thought. Looks like CS6 will be my final version of Photoshop... should save me considerable amount of money over the years.
Seems to me quite a petty reason to make a decision around. This forum actually asked you to fill in your age in your profile.
Maybe Adobe plans to send everyone a present on their birthdays. ;D
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Seems to me quite a petty reason to make a decision around. This forum actually asked you to fill in your age in your profile.
Well, one man's petty is another man's final straw. As a hobbyist, I don't have a strong "need" to upgrade, although I do find some additional features (e.g., non-destructive crop in CS6) useful. I don't really care to "rent" software or anything else anyway. Since I was on the fence about whether to get Photoshop CC, it didn't take much of a push to keep me from signing up... and Adobe was ready. If you read earlier in the thread, the problem wasn't so much the asking for my birthdate, it was locking me out for 24 hours for providing an unacceptable date. If they can screw up something this simple, I don't trust them to have my rental software always available for me to use.
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If they can screw up something this simple, I don't trust them to have my rental software always available for me to use.
I've no quarrel with the choices you make, they're your choices to make; but as the "rental software" is installed locally on your computer, and the software license is only validated every 30 days, and you could continue to use the software (http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html#) for something between 30 and 90 days offline - I'm plain puzzled about the "don't trust them to have my rental software always available for me to use" hypothetical.
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As the "rental software" is installed locally on your computer, and the software license is only validated every 30 days, and you could continue to use the software (http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html#) for something between 30 and 90 days offline - I'm plain puzzled about the "don't trust them to have my rental software always available for me to use" hypothetical.
Yes, that is what the current terms of use are... but I don't trust they will stay the same (nor do I trust the price won't increase significantly if they think they can wring more revenue from a higher monthly charge). I don't see this as a road I want to start traveling down. This is a way for Adobe to get a steady income without any guarantee that the improvements in the software will be of any benefit to me. Apparently they don't think they can get enough people to upgrade with the perpetual software license model, given that Photoshop is a pretty mature product.
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Yes, that is what the current terms of use are... but I don't trust they will stay the same (nor do I trust the price won't increase significantly if they think they can wring more revenue from a higher monthly charge). I don't see this as a road I want to start traveling down. This is a way for Adobe to get a steady income without any guarantee that the improvements in the software will be of any benefit to me. Apparently they don't think they can get enough people to upgrade with the perpetual software license model, given that Photoshop is a pretty mature product.
I guess time will tell all...but for $120 for the year, I am willing to see how things shake out with CC. I might be very pleasantly surprised and continue with the subscription or I might be dissapointed and stop the subscription. That is a small amount of cash to lay out to really try the product for yourself rather than listening to people's rants on the boards, mostly from people who have not subscribed and really don't know anything about CC.
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PS is still the big daddy but thankfully there are now smaller fish nibbling at the edges and I'm inclined to see if it's possible to live without it on the PC.
That, of course, very much depends on what you are trying to do -- I don't use PS, but these luminosity mask post processing techniques (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=84941.msg688399#msg688399) are all explained in terms of PS.
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The whole discussion on Adobe subscriptions seems completely idiotic to me:
1) It's a fantastic offer, even at $25/month. At $12/month it's literally a steal. Photoshop used to be around $1000 for a single license and then hundreds at least for updates. For beginners this was seriously too expensive. Now everybody can afford Photoshop. Everybody. $12/month is really cheap even if editing pictures is a hobby. We are literally talking the equivalent of 2 lattes, 2 beers or a single lunch here.
2) Nothing comes close to Photoshop. I have tried all the alternatives from commercial to Open Source and in the end they all suck. Sure, for some basic editing you probably can do this with Gimp. And if you are clever then probably even make it do some more advanced things. But nothing comes close to Photoshop. It's usability is better. It's features are better. The algos are better. It's literally super bowl vs. little league.
3) So $12/month for the best software in the world and people complain? The same people that happily drop $500 or even $5000 on some other gear? Insanity.
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If you actually read, you'll see people aren't questioning it on the basis of the cost (though there are plenty of doubts about what it will be in future). Good for you if you consider it OK for you, but don't deny others the right to take a different view.
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these luminosity mask post processing techniques (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=84941.msg688399#msg688399) are all explained in terms of PS.
That was one of the big factors in my original decision to tackle the PS learning curve ... there was so much more support / forum / documentation / videos / etc. for PS compared to other options.
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And as a contrast to our discussion of Lua, those Photoshop learning resources are varied enough to suit all levels or types of user.
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If you actually read, you'll see people aren't questioning it on the basis of the cost (though there are plenty of doubts about what it will be in future). Good for you if you consider it OK for you, but don't deny others the right to take a different view.
Agreed. My objections to the CC licensing model have NEVER been about price. I am more than will to pay whatever it takes to do business. I'm actually willing to pay a little extra if I can get what I want, and use it for as long as I want. In my estimation, affordability has zero influence with the situation. Short-term bargains quite often don't turn out to be fiscally sound long-term solutions for the end user. Even hobbyists, should have the foresight to at least look past the initial price of entry and evaluate their long-term interests.
I don't think it should be considered insane to question a business model that imposes an expiration date set in stone. Or that forces it's users to underwrite future development regardless of the direction the executives in charge decide to go. Or that removes all control to speak with their wallets to voice their displeasure with the direction of development. Once everyone is locked in, and CS6 has reached is end of life, and Adobe is gleefully depositing their monthly stipends (at whatever price they deem proper) ... how much effort in "listening" do you suppose they will invest in order to offer their subscribers a better product? If the past six months is any indicator ... they really didn't have a clue who their customers were, or what their customers actually thought about them.
One last thought ... If it were not for those of us who have spent hundreds and thousands for Adobe products over the past many decades, Adobe would hardly be in a condition to offer a $12 per month plan for anyone ... best not to make light of those who saw to it that Adobe succeeded to this point ...
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Agreed. My objections to the CC licensing model have NEVER been about price. I am more than will to pay whatever it takes to do business. I'm actually willing to pay a little extra if I can get what I want, and use it for as long as I want. In my estimation, affordability has zero influence with the situation. Short-term bargains quite often don't turn out to be fiscally sound long-term solutions for the end user. Even hobbyists, should have the foresight to at least look past the initial price of entry and evaluate their long-term interests.
I don't think it should be considered insane to question a business model that imposes an expiration date set in stone. Or that forces it's users to underwrite future development regardless of the direction the executives in charge decide to go. Or that removes all control to speak with their wallets to voice their displeasure with the direction of development. Once everyone is locked in, and CS6 has reached is end of life, and Adobe is gleefully depositing their monthly stipends (at whatever price they deem proper) ... how much effort in "listening" do you suppose they will invest in order to offer their subscribers a better product? If the past six months is any indicator ... they really didn't have a clue who their customers were, or what their customers actually thought about them.
One last thought ... If it were not for those of us who have spent hundreds and thousands for Adobe products over the past many decades, Adobe would hardly be in a condition to offer a $12 per month plan for anyone ... best not to make light of those who saw to it that Adobe succeeded to this point ...
So if it's not about money, what is it about? You get exactly the same software and you don't care how much it costs? Why not be happy? For you nothing changes then.
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Why don't you read what he said?
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Money is still an issue, but far less than having to RENT the software. When we stop paying, we lose the software. That's the main point.
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Your comment in another thread shows that's the "money" point in a slightly different form --
Sure, if I knew I could afford to keep "renting" the full suite of Adobe products until I was 120, then I wouldn't care,...
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For you nothing changes then.
If that is your assertion of my comments on the matter. You really didn't read what I offered.
Sure, nothing would change that dramatically in the actual expense incurred, though, I, as a consumer, would lose all control over my financial power in any form to influence future development. No longer can users withhold funds to send a message to Adobe about their product. Based upon their "listening" over the past six months ... they really did not have a clue about a significant portion of their users. Once they are on the gravy train of perpetual deposits ... for whatever they may decide to offer ... I seriously doubt their listening skills will improve.
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If that is your assertion of my comments on the matter. You really didn't read what I offered.
Sure, nothing would change that dramatically in the actual expense incurred, though, I, as a consumer, would lose all control over my financial power in any form to influence future development. No longer can users withhold funds to send a message to Adobe about their product. Based upon their "listening" over the past six months ... they really did not have a clue about a significant portion of their users. Once they are on the gravy train of perpetual deposits ... for whatever they may decide to offer ... I seriously doubt their listening skills will improve.
Even more reasons I don't like this new model of theirs. We lose control to tell them what we think. At least in a way that is impactful (since it seems corporations listen to money, not customers)
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We lose control to tell them what we think.
Unsubscribe!
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Your comment in another thread shows that's the "money" point in a slightly different form --
Yeah, money is a factor, just not the main cause of aggravation. In the end, none of this really matters, it's just some software. I would just rather have an upgrade path for my CS6—that doesn't require a monthly payment to maintain—if and when I need to upgrade.
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What happens in 12 months can best be evaluated by a quick look at Adobe's financial statements. Merry Christmas to all .....and Oh Yes have you called Adobe support lately? ::)
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E-mail from Adobe this morning extending their £8.78 per month "limited time offer" until 28th February.
I wonder how many similar extensions we will see?
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E-mail from Adobe this morning extending their £8.78 per month "limited time offer" until 28th February.
I wonder how many similar extensions we will see?
and still the offer on their website says 31 december...
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There it is...
http://blogs.adobe.com/photoshopdotcom/2013/12/photoshop-photography-program-extended-to-feb-28-for-photoshop-cs3-cs6-customers.html
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There it is...
http://blogs.adobe.com/photoshopdotcom/2013/12/photoshop-photography-program-extended-to-feb-28-for-photoshop-cs3-cs6-customers.html
So ... according to the date on that blog posting ... Hogarty knew as early as Dec. 18 that the deal was extended to Feb 2014? ...
I really wonder who is in charge of marketing at Adobe ... sooner or later they are going to have to focus on a target and stick with it ... the information is all over the place ... very difficult to actually know what is real ... or what may have been obscured by Content Aware Fill ... ;-)
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That date could be extended for as long as they want. Adobe could say "$9.95 until June 2014" too. Probably will too.
They need to coerce people into the cloud contract. Plain old Marketing 101. Once you are locked into the contract, then they can do what they like with your rate while trying to get others in at the "Special introductory offer of $9.95 good until..."
No different than any other contract service that has special "Intro fees" to get people signed up. Start cable at $19.95, and then it creeps up to $100 per month. Others not yet signed on will get the $19.95 you started with, while you pay $100 as you are under contract. My neighbor paid $19 for his new Dish Network plan, while I got gouged for $100 after a couple of years (Which I dropped after 2 years there was no early sign-off fee and I had then completed my contract period. Now they're back offering it at $19/mo. Ha!).
Threaten to quit and they might lower it 30%. Doubtful if they'll drop it back down to the introductory special rate. That or you have to remain off the service for so long before the let you back in for the "Introductory cable $19.95 plan" - if they will.
SG
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The UK adobe still says Dec 31 ? .So have taken the plunge and joined as the deal is good compared with the price of upgrades, and compared to high end CAD programs is pretty cheap .However if Adobe does extend the offer again then the 30 day bail out will have to be taken.As sombody who has paid and used Photoshop for over 10 years this really is a mess .