Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: Mike Guilbault on September 27, 2013, 09:32:59 am
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I'm looking to upgrade my hand stapler to something better. Hammering the staples in after using the hand stapler is getting old real fast. From what I've read so far, the electric ones aren't much better. I've never used a compressor before so have no idea what to look for - and then there's the gun itself. I don't want cheap, or overboard, but only want to buy this once, i.e. don't want to have to upgrade later.
Any advice?
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Hi Mike,
I'm using a California Air Tools compressor and a Paslode stapler. Works very well.
Cheers,
Jay
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Check out the Porter Cable Upholstery stapler. Mine is model US58 1/4" min, 5/8" max length staple, air powered. Pretty much any air compressor will work it... and you DO need an air compressor, don't you?
Seriously, once you have a nice little compressor, the world opens up for you to a myriad of possible uses!!
You're a man. dam it!! BUY MORE TOOLS!!! It's your destiny! ;D
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I've been using a Harbor Freight 20 gauge stapler with no problems for several years, and probably 50-60 thousand staples.
http://www.harborfreight.com/20-gauge-wide-crown-stapler-68029.html
Probably their little pancake compressor should be adequate for just the stapler but if you want to run other tools. . . .
You should have been thinking ahead when you got that expensive Fuji sprayer. If I were you, I'ld sell the Fuji, and for that money buy a decent sized compressor, the cheap HVLP spray gun from Harbor Freight (the $15 model works just fine for spraying canvas') and the stapler and other air tools you might like.
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mike
Like Framah says You're a man. dam it!! BUY MORE TOOLS!!! It's your destiny!
Seriously a small compressor is so handy. once you have one there all sorts of needs, from pumping up your tires to.... well you name it. I got started when I decided to lay some hardwood flooring and was tired of the armstrong method. Bought a compressor and then a Stanley floor nailer off ebay. did the job and sold the nailer. Sure beat renting...
Canadian Tire have compressors on sale quite often and various nailer/staplers too. You will not regret it and as framah said......
enjoy and watch where your fingers are.... they don't look good connected...
Martin
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After using a compressor wide crown gun for years, it finally broke and I move to this Maestri Electric. I have used it now for over 2 years without any issues on hundreds of canvas prints. Just personal preference I didn't want the compressor noise since my studio is in my house.
Here is the gun:
http://www.romeomaestri.it/serie_lng-1-Id-98-prdId-129-Me.html (http://www.romeomaestri.it/serie_lng-1-Id-98-prdId-129-Me.html)
And here are the staples it takes:
http://secure.stapleheadquarters.com/ItemForm.aspx?Item=EB8010 (http://secure.stapleheadquarters.com/ItemForm.aspx?Item=EB8010)
Works great and so far no problems. Note, I did a bit of checking and apparently Maestri no longer sells to the U.S. They are all over Europe but no one sells them any longer here.
Paul Caldwell
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You're a man. dam it!! BUY MORE TOOLS!!! It's your destiny! ;D
I like the way you think Framah! lol
I'll have to start looking next week. I'm not sure which brands are available in my area. I have Home Depot, Canadian Tire, Lowes and Rona to choose from unless there's another choice I'm not aware of - but that's mostly what I have in the area I live (about two hours north of Toronto).
Paul, I'll be using mine in the house as well - my basement office where I have my framing/stretching table, next to my wood shop. I just wasn't sure if the electric models would have enough 'umph'. Is there something comparable to the Maestri? Are there different specs on the electric ones that I should be aware of?
What sort of power should I be looking at, and is there other specs I should be considering too? How about the size of staples for most canvas work, and are there any other attachments I should be looking at?
Sorry for all the questions guys. After some initial searches on the web, most of what I get are price comparisons and irrelevant information, so came to the best source I know.
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Well I've been doing some more research and kinda looking at this 2.5HP-4.2-GALLON-MAKITA (http://www.busybeetools.com/products/COMPRESSOR-2.5HP-4.2-GALLON-MAKITA.html)
From what I've read, the 4.2 CSM and 1720 RPMs for low noise is almost ideal. It's oil lubricated though and wondering if that could be a problem.
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Two hours north of Toronto... varies a lot. Friday afternoon, on the 400, in the summer? That's about Vaughan, isn't it? There's a Busy Bee Tools in Barrie now, might be of use to you...
Mike.
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Two hours north of Toronto... varies a lot. Friday afternoon, on the 400, in the summer? That's about Vaughan, isn't it? There's a Busy Bee Tools in Barrie now, might be of use to you...
Mike.
You're about right Mike. I drove to Barrie last night and the 400 was bumper to bumper headin north. Luckily I know the backroads to get back home.
I checked Busy Bee online last night and they have a good selection and some of the prices are better too. thanks.
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4 gallon ( metric or imperial) is good for most things and is what I have. Still a small enough size/weight to move around. Yes, any of these makes a noise while building up pressure in the tank. But once up to pressure it only runs when the pressure has decreased and so is not running all the time. Usually you can set the full pressure and also the pressure you are using. For instance the tank might be at 110 pounds and you set your gun for 60 pounds. For attaching canvas you will not need big staples and thus less driving power. Try on some scrap.
One thing to remember about any compressor is to turn it off when not in use. Just think of the middle of the night and the pressure has decreased and the unit starts up..... Not appreciated by the wife ;D
Good luck
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Duo-Fast EWC5018A (http://www.amazon.com/EWC5018A-Gauge-2-Inch-Electric-Stapler/dp/B001BNQXYW) used in the video here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7V5m3dxTgAc) seems to work well
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Mike...
That's the exact one I just bought to replace an old compressor that finally died! I bought it thru Amazon for $299 and as I have Amazon Prime, the shipping was free.
It now supplies air for the v-nailer, the computerized mat cutter, the air locking measuring stops on my chop saw and a couple of air guns at work tables. As none are pulling full air at the same time, it works great. I'm sure it would work fine for your uses.
As for staple guns, I'd stay away from any electric guns as they just don't have the pushing power that an air gun has. The biggest problem is possibly hitting a denser part of the wood in a strainer bar and the staple doesn't go all the way in and then you still have to go back and hammer them in.
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Looks like that's the one I'll get. It's $325 (CDN) at Busy Bee Tools in Barrie (close by).
Now to decide on the stapler!
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If you are getting the air compressor the Senco line of guns are top notch.
SFW10XP 1/2" x 3/8 crown stapler is the one to check out.
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Duo-Fast EWC5018A (http://www.amazon.com/EWC5018A-Gauge-2-Inch-Electric-Stapler/dp/B001BNQXYW) used in the video here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7V5m3dxTgAc) seems to work well
+1 to Justin. I think electric has its advantages. I have a nice pancake style compressor and 3 nailing guns, and freely admit they are fun to use. But i drive only 5/16" staples and the electric stapler cord is a lot more flexible than an air hose - and less noisy. Sure, the odd staple stands up if it hits a knot but its not that difficult to knock it down.
I've worn out my first Stanley stapler, the second no name stapler i got from Home Depot fits nicely in the hand but has this probably dangerous quirk of expelling a staple on its own - 3 times now :-( I need to step up the quality and find a real tool outlet in my area or order from Amazon, i guess. i don't want to buy a pneumatic one - no waiting for power up or power down with electric. But i only do about 70 stretch jobs a year
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I used the compressed guns for years, and they will also miss cause staples to only get in 1/2 way. I used only wide crown guns mainly the Italian Fasco brands but there were a few others also.
The Maestri is the crown jewel of the electric guns in a league by itself. This is not a light weight unit and it easily drives a 1/2 inch wide crown that is 1/2 or longer. It's sad that the Maestri company decided to pull out of the U.S. market. I am driving into a Larson 6011 bar which is a finger joined stretcher bar 1 1/2 not sure of the wood but it appears to be fir.
With both compressed and electric, by far my biggest issue is when a staple only goes in on one side and flattens on the other, which requires a total pull out. This seems more due to the brand of staple.
Each solution has their merits I went electric and only regret that the Maestri brand has pulled out of the U.S as I can't find a replacement if mine decides to break.
Paul Caldwell
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Looks like that's the one I'll get. It's $325 (CDN) at Busy Bee Tools in Barrie (close by).
Now to decide on the stapler!
I got the Porter Cable Upholstery stapler a while back based on reading some old posts here. It is pretty much ideal. Small and easily maneuverable but can even drive staples below the surface if needed. I use it for assembling by frames and doing the canvas stapling for my gallery wraps. Highly recommend this. Looks like it is built to last a lifetime too.
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It was probably one of my old posts. :)
I know i have mentioned it before.
My gun is at least 10 years old and just keeps working.
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The Maestri line of staplers is widely sold in Australia, and it's not a language hassle to buy online from there.
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I think you do want a compressor that uses oil. Typically, the oil-less ones are noisier and in an unpleasant way. If you drain the water out of the tank after use, a good compressor ( w/ oil reservoir ) could last you the rest of your life. The only issue with one that uses oil, to my knowledge, is if you use the air to blow off dust, small amounts of oil (minute) can be spit out and contaminate the art. For interior use, I recommend you consider locating the compressor in a different room than you will use it for noise relief. Air hoses are cheap, but it is really worth it to have a hose or a short hose that you connect to the gun that is really flexible. They cost more but a stiff hose will drive you crazy, especially if you aren't used to air tools.
Also, the air tool recommendations about a tool that really lasts is not very meaningful, as none of the old designs are still in production. The good news is there are lots of good choices and they are less expensive than they used to be. Framing is a very easy life for an air tool. Most are designed for construction sites or industrial use. The most important characteristic is how far the tool drives the staple. I think an adjustable depth is nice, but many guns are designed to drive staples flush and others are designed to not cut through the fabric by leaving the crown proud. I have no expertise with which current guns are best w canvas, but obviously others here do.
Stuart
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I heard, or read somewhere the same thing about oil being sprayed out as well and why I asked about it. I was really hoping to use it to blow dust as well. I'm looking at the Porter Cable US58 which has a "rear exhaust port channels air and tool oil/condensation away from user" - and I assume away from whatever you're blowing.
It's also considered an upholstery gun, so I would think work well with the canvas.
Framah... is this the model you mentioned you have? Any problems with oil?
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Stapling the back of stretched canvas onto bars is fairly light duty fare, so no need to go too crazy on a staple gun outside of selecting a reliable performer.
I use a Surebonder 9600 with a small built-in compressor in my studio. It does use a couple of drops of air tool oil, but never a problem with it "spitting out." Oil is used sparingly! Air tools can also "spit out" moisture from the air compressor, but very occasional draining of the tank is all that is really needed to address this. There are small reservoirs you can install between the air hose and tool to catch the spit, but frankly I really think that would be unnecessary and overkill. My Surebonder 9600 never jams (really) and is simply a reliable tool. It makes stapling easy every time.
:)
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Stapling the back of stretched canvas onto bars is fairly light duty fare, so no need to go too crazy on a staple gun outside of selecting a reliable performer.
I use a Surebonder 9600 with a small built-in compressor in my studio. It does use a couple of drops of air tool oil, but never a problem with it "spitting out." Oil is used sparingly! Air tools can also "spit out" moisture from the air compressor, but very occasional draining of the tank is all that is really needed to address this. There are small reservoirs you can install between the air hose and tool to catch the spit, but frankly I really think that would be unnecessary and overkill. My Surebonder 9600 never jams (really) and is simply a reliable tool. It makes stapling easy every time.
:)
Thanks for this. I keep wondering what I'm doing wrong? My staple gun is not fancy, it doesn't have any power (what a luddite) and it works - really! without banging in afterwards.
It is however annoying at times because it jams so I appreciate the information on this thread because I would like to upgrade - but I really don't want to invest in a compressor.
Just like the three bears...some staplers are too heavy, some are too soft, but this one is just right.
;)
ETA: Question - did you recommend the expensive one (all of $56 Cdn) or the cheaper one?
http://www.amazon.ca/Surebonder-9600A-Heavy-Duty-Staple/dp/B000EOJPC6/ref=pd_sim_sbs_hi_1
http://www.amazon.ca/Surebonder-Pneumatic-Narrow-Stapler-Carrying/dp/B006KBJ98M/ref=pd_rhf_dp_p_t_1_G6RJ
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....
ETA: Question - did you recommend the expensive one (all of $56 Cdn) or the cheaper one?
http://www.amazon.ca/Surebonder-9600A-Heavy-Duty-Staple/dp/B000EOJPC6/ref=pd_sim_sbs_hi_1
http://www.amazon.ca/Surebonder-Pneumatic-Narrow-Stapler-Carrying/dp/B006KBJ98M/ref=pd_rhf_dp_p_t_1_G6RJ
I didn't know about the heavy duty "A" model. They look alike! I have the erudite plebian model 9600. ;) I use it with a small Cambell Hausted air compressor. It is small and tucks away nicely--I probably spent no more than ~$100 on the compressor.
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Yep. That's the stapler I have and no problems with it at all.
As for oil in the air from the compressor.. that's why you install filters in line. My compressor has 2 lines coming from it that go up into the drop ceiling and then splitters off to different parts of the room.
The old compressor was a pancake one and very noisy and was in the utility room enclosed with rigid styrofoam to help muffle the sound.
The new one is out in the room and tho i plan to make a tiny "room" over it to quiet it, it only comes on when I'm using air and it isn't that bad.
Unfortunately, it was about 2" bigger all around than the place where the old one was so I had to reroute all of the hoses to the new spot.
By the way.... when you get your compressor, use quick connect thingies for all of the connections.
Now, I have to replace my 4366 heat press as it is getting old and cranky.
It never ends!!
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I didn't know about the heavy duty "A" model. They look alike! I have the erudite plebian model 9600. ;) I use it with a small Cambell Hausted air compressor. It is small and tucks away nicely--I probably spent no more than ~$100 on the compressor.
Thanks. I need to read to figure out if the heavy duty is worth the investment.
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Framah... since you have the same compressor and gun I'm looking at I'll ask you directly... when stretching a typical canvas, how often does the compressor recycle? I'm thinking about noise levels here. I have a laundry room right beside my framing/stretching area and could probably put the compressor in there and run a hose through the wall if needed. But if only comes on occasionally then even that may not be necessary.
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Another recommendation for putting a filter on the air line. If there is no filter you can expect water and oil to come through the hose. The more humid the air in general, the more water will be spit out.
If you’re gonna adapt to using an air compressor, get one with a larger air tank/reservoir. They cycle a lot less frequently and don’t cost that much more.
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So far, the compressor comes on while I'm blowing off the work table and the chop saw with the air gun. When stapling, it might come on only once.... and even then because it might not have been at full pressure when you started.
V-nailing and it only comes on after 3 or 4 frame joins. Depends also on how many times I depress and release the clamps to get the mldg. tight.
Figure that the stapler uses alot less air than the v-nailer.
Personally, I'd go ahead and put it into the laundry room. Even a quiet one is still an annoyance when you are trying to listen to Mozart while you are working. :)
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Well I got the Makita Mac2400.. damn that sucker is heavy! Luckily it's going to stay in one spot but at least I have the option of moving it if I have to. I got everything except the stapler. The PC US58 could not be found anywhere in Barrie. The only 'upholstery style' stapler I could find was the Paslode US-100 (http://www.paslode.ca/products/57/us-100-upholstery-craft-stapler). I may have to order it online.
The manual that comes with it is pathetic. There is no diagram to indicate what the different components are - only and exploded parts diagram - but they don't label those parts with the same name they mention in the instructions. A little frustrating but I think I have it figured out. Too late now to run the 'break-in' period so I'll have to do it tomorrow night.
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Well I got the Makita Mac2400.. damn that sucker is heavy! Luckily it's going to stay in one spot but at least I have the option of moving it if I have to. I got everything except the stapler. The PC US58 could not be found anywhere in Barrie. The only 'upholstery style' stapler I could find was the Paslode US-100 (http://www.paslode.ca/products/57/us-100-upholstery-craft-stapler). I may have to order it online...
I got it here on Amazon...
http://www.amazon.com/Porter-Cable-US58-22-Gauge-C-Crown-Upholstery/dp/B00004SBC3/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1380596809&sr=8-1
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The main thing is to remember to remove the plastic plug on the left side of the compressor and screw in the air filter.
If you don't remove the plug, the compressor will run but no air will compress as no air can get in.
...and YES! I know that for EXACTLY the reason you think I know it. ::)
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Amazon has the Porter Cable US58 listed for $79. Can't you buy stuff from Amazon in Canada?
Heck... if you want it, I can buy it for you and send it to you listed as a personal gift and you can send me a money order or check.
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It's about $109 from Busy Bee in Canada - listed on their website but the guy in the store said they don't carry it anymore. I left to look elsewhere so didn't follow up on it at the store. I noticed now that Larson-Juhl carries the Senco SJS. It's also been discontinued but they think they may have a couple left and are getting back to me. Not sure what the replacement to that one is, but Senco seem to list two upholstery staplers, the SFT10XP and SFW09.
I'm trying to find something I can pick up in the next couple of days as I have a bunch of canvases to stretch... but if I can't get a decent one in that time I may take you up on your offer Framah - or just order one online. I appreciate the offer!
YIIKES! Just got the quote from Larson on the Senco SJS at $$308.
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The main thing is to remember to remove the plastic plug on the left side of the compressor and screw in the air filter.
If you don't remove the plug, the compressor will run but no air will compress as no air can get in.
...and YES! I know that for EXACTLY the reason you think I know it. ::)
Figured that one out... but thanks for the head's up. No mention of that in the manual! :o
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Yeah, the manual pretty much sucks.
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Called Busy Bee this morning to order the US58 and they just got one on their truck this morning. Drove down right away and got it so I'm good to go!
I also picked up a box of 3/8" upholstery staples. Seemed like the most useful size. Is there any preference for staple sizes?
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I also picked up a box of 3/8" upholstery staples. Seemed like the most useful size. Is there any preference for staple sizes?
That is what I am using for canvas in this gun and they work well. Also still easy enough to take one back out if you decide to redo one. Would probably not like to remove an entire canvas worth though!