Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: xianql on May 18, 2012, 05:27:08 pm
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Film: Kodak 160NC film.
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Just goes to show, it's not the equipment... ???
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I just want to hear some commends about the photo, maybe I should move it to somewhere...
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That was a comment about the photo, and a very positive one.
This image is nicely seen and composed. The subject's expression and pose combine to make a very nice portrait.
I see you have the same issues with dust on 120 film scans as I always did.
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That was a comment about the photo, and a very positive one...
Only if you disregard the emoticon, otherwise it is a rather negative one (and rightly so).
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Oh, yeah, I see that now. Just goes to show how much attention I'm paying when I read stuff. Heh. D'oh.
But I disagree, I like this portrait for the expression.
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Only if you disregard the emoticon, otherwise it is a rather negative one (and rightly so).
+1
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I just want to hear some commends about the photo, maybe I should move it to somewhere...
We use this thread (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=56053.0)for posting such examples of our "non-professional" work, and getting artistic feedback. Normally we only start a new thread about a particular photo if it illustrates a problem or technical issue.
Some people here are quite meanspirited. If you're not impressed with a photo, do the decent thing and either stay shtum or give a particular reason why it could be better - you know, constructive feedback.
Ray
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Well, the "meanspirited" remained "shtum" for a couple of days, along with anyone else. Which is a comment in itself. However, if someone insists...
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I'll bite with some constructive criticism.
Aside from the sweet expression, the picture doesn't work. As a snap shot of a moment, personal to you, its probably great. But . . .
Why doesn't the photo work? Composition is confused, incomplete, cluttered. The background is cluttered, the forground is cluttered, which is distracting to say the least. There are no interesting forms in the photo, the form I want to see are her intertwined arms, without the empty and dirty glasses in the forground, without the tilted lampshade in the background. The negative space of the windows is also distracting from, rather than balancing, the composition. I look at her arms and the beauty of their form is cut off.
I would suggest you look at great photos, in a book, in a museum. Look at mid century photographers using 6x6 format, like Avedon, Vivianne Mayer, and countless others. Look at Bresson's street work. Look at how they composed their frames, how uncluttered they are, how they allow the subject breathing room, how simple they are. Then go shoot, and shoot, and shoot.
Bresson said your first 10,000 photographs are your worst photographs. So get out there and shoot, and think, and evluate your work objectively.
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Well, I agree with the above criticism, but wish to take the opposite position. Not to be contrary, but I think there is something in the image. Its not classically correct, in fact, in many ways its classically very awkward as has been noted above. Yet... there seems to be something about it, some presence. Its one of those images that breaks the rules and somehow engages the viewer as if it were just a snap, but something more.
This is not to say its a great picture, but rather there is a thread of something there in it, a line of work to be followed. Do I think the photog knew this and is sure of their path? No, not likely. But it would be interesting for that photog to go (as rec'd above) study the masters, study formal composition, and then come back to this and see if there is something he could pick up from it and build upon.
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I took my son to a park last week, and snapped a picture of him under a tree. The eyes came out nice :P
Some photography works precisely because it is infused with familiarity; your average shrink-wrapped model will never give you family photos, or the thrill of making your date hold her breath in a café.
Edmund
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actually, only 'the' eye ;)
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actually, only 'the' eye ;)
Yeah, I'll put the picture up on Facebook with the heading "My Sun" :)
Edmund
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xianql
Some like square format but for me the square format offers one the luxury of cropping and here I think is where the image because of the way it was taken gives the cluttered look that others have already touched on.
So without any offence intended this is my take on the crop, the lamp in the background I have taken out roughly as it distracts.
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That was a comment about the photo, and a very positive one.
This image is nicely seen and composed. The subject's expression and pose combine to make a very nice portrait.
I see you have the same issues with dust on 120 film scans as I always did.
I just saw all your messages and comments, thank you guys!
Yes, I am lazy, since it take too long time if I turn on ICE dust removal, I used Epson V700.
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We use this thread (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=56053.0)for posting such examples of our "non-professional" work, and getting artistic feedback. Normally we only start a new thread about a particular photo if it illustrates a problem or technical issue.
Some people here are quite meanspirited. If you're not impressed with a photo, do the decent thing and either stay shtum or give a particular reason why it could be better - you know, constructive feedback.
Ray
Thank you! All constructive feedback are appreciated!
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I'll bite with some constructive criticism.
Aside from the sweet expression, the picture doesn't work. As a snap shot of a moment, personal to you, its probably great. But . . .
Why doesn't the photo work? Composition is confused, incomplete, cluttered. The background is cluttered, the forground is cluttered, which is distracting to say the least. There are no interesting forms in the photo, the form I want to see are her intertwined arms, without the empty and dirty glasses in the forground, without the tilted lampshade in the background. The negative space of the windows is also distracting from, rather than balancing, the composition. I look at her arms and the beauty of their form is cut off.
I would suggest you look at great photos, in a book, in a museum. Look at mid century photographers using 6x6 format, like Avedon, Vivianne Mayer, and countless others. Look at Bresson's street work. Look at how they composed their frames, how uncluttered they are, how they allow the subject breathing room, how simple they are. Then go shoot, and shoot, and shoot.
Bresson said your first 10,000 photographs are your worst photographs. So get out there and shoot, and think, and evluate your work objectively.
Hi TMARK,
Thank you very much for your detailed explanation!
I will pay more attention to foreground and background in my next portrait shoot!
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Well, I agree with the above criticism, but wish to take the opposite position. Not to be contrary, but I think there is something in the image. Its not classically correct, in fact, in many ways its classically very awkward as has been noted above. Yet... there seems to be something about it, some presence. Its one of those images that breaks the rules and somehow engages the viewer as if it were just a snap, but something more.
This is not to say its a great picture, but rather there is a thread of something there in it, a line of work to be followed. Do I think the photog knew this and is sure of their path? No, not likely. But it would be interesting for that photog to go (as rec'd above) study the masters, study formal composition, and then come back to this and see if there is something he could pick up from it and build upon.
Thank you Geoffreyg!
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I took my son to a park last week, and snapped a picture of him under a tree. The eyes came out nice :P
Some photography works precisely because it is infused with familiarity; your average shrink-wrapped model will never give you family photos, or the thrill of making your date hold her breath in a café.
Edmund
Thanks! What a nice portrait of your son!
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xianql
Some like square format but for me the square format offers one the luxury of cropping and here I think is where the image because of the way it was taken gives the cluttered look that others have already touched on.
So without any offence intended this is my take on the crop, the lamp in the background I have taken out roughly as it distracts.
Absolutely not offend, I can understand why people don't like distracts in foreground and background, that's really good suggestion.
Thanks for your work, I like it!
:)
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French photographer Raymond Depardon shoots new french president with various cameras. The one from the Rolleiflex is chosen for the official portrait. Another victory for Rollei, the waist level finder and film.
Via The Online Photographer.
http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/portfolio/2012/06/04/les-coulisses-du-portrait-officiel-de-francois-hollande_1712189_823448.html
Eduardo
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There are some photographs made to share with there's for certain messages, well, depends on how each one looks into the photographs. And there are photographs that people took it to make sure the camera and lens work alright, and the person just happened to be there, either intentional or not.
The problem is if we are to spend a lot of time try to make sense of every image happening hundreds of million times a day, I would say LL is not such place.
I certainly don't own the forum, and after years of success management, perhaps MR can't say he own it as well, it is owned by all visitors now, so we need it give it a little more respect.
Pingang
Shanghai
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How can one disagree with such a masterly quote?
But hey, with digital 10000 images can be shot and reviewed in 3 months at most!
My advice to any colleague, pro or hobbyist: Ditch film. If you don't know how to use it yet, it will only hobble you. If you know how to use it, then of course you don't need advice, and even less criticism.
Edmund
I'll bite with some constructive criticism.
Bresson said your first 10,000 photographs are your worst photographs. So get out there and shoot, and think, and evluate your work objectively.
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I'm not offering any sage advice, images of my own, or criticism of others but I will say that I love my Rollei 2.8F. This is a camera that is still quite capable of taking anyones best work. In addition to the high quality images, I like it that I can still use the meter and that it has no batteries and is very light weight.
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How can one disagree with such a masterly quote?
But hey, with digital 10000 images can be shot and reviewed in 3 months at most!
My advice to any colleague, pro or hobbyist: Ditch film. If you don't know how to use it yet, it will only hobble you. If you know how to use it, then of course you don't need advice, and even less criticism.
Edmund
I'm going to quote you on that Edmund!
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... And there are photographs that people took it to make sure the camera and lens work alright, and the person just happened to be there, either intentional or not... I certainly don't own the forum, and after years of success management, perhaps MR can't say he own it as well, it is owned by all visitors now, so we need it give it a little more respect...
+1
I love it!
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xianql
Some like square format but for me the square format offers one the luxury of cropping and here I think is where the image because of the way it was taken gives the cluttered look that others have already touched on.
So without any offence intended this is my take on the crop, the lamp in the background I have taken out roughly as it distracts.
Come on Ced !
I know your pp intention is good and you saved the composition with what you had in the frame, but now the girl looks like a colorfull magenta candy sweet.
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Fred,
there are days when I'm not sure decriminalisation in Spain was a good thing :P
Edmund
Come on Ced !
I know your pp intention is good and you saved the composition with what you had in the frame, but now the girl looks like a colorfull magenta candy sweet.
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Fred,
there are days when I'm not sure decriminalisation in Spain was a good thing :P
Edmund
I really hope this country will be rescued by Merkel.
You'll see what Europe technocrats will discover on the corruption level if they put their nose on the spanish politics affairs.
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Com'on Fred I just love colorful magenta candy sweets & can't get enough of them...
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I really hope this country will be rescued by Merkel.
Fred,
You live surrounded by prettily pouting pretty women in pretty clothes, all brands of cameras and video equipment, cheap Rioja wine, and I presume unlimited entirely legal drugs, and you still think about politics? What is the matter with you?
Edmund
PS. You have been tied to Merkel's excessively strong currency, so the problems you have are partly caused by her ...
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Com'on Fred I just love colorful magenta candy sweets & can't get enough of them...
;D great repply Ced.
I confess, I like colorful magenta candy sweets too.
Edmund,
The pretty women in pretty clothes are 1m90 tall and wear 10cm minimum high-heels, and I'm 1,70...it gives you an idea of the very unbalanced (and unfair...) situation.
Even with platform boots like Prince, I'd be still short.
And I never involved myself personaly with work when it comes to women. It's a golden rule, apart from the fact that I don't really like tall women as for personal tastes.
All brand of cameras? mmm...it's been a while since I haven't touched a MF.
Legal drugs? Well, after 20 years of heavy smoking and now starting to have "problems" because of abuses of night life and tabacco, I hardly go out, doing sport, eating finally well, stopped completly alcohool and reduced drastically smoking and I'm closest to the monastery in my daily life to be honest than to the happy Madame Claude's bordel. Well, the ideal would be a decadent monastery now that I think about it.
I need to investigate this.
Cheers.
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Edmund,
The pretty women in pretty clothes are 1m90 tall and wear 10cm minimum high-heels, and I'm 1,70...it gives you an idea of the very unbalanced (and unfair...) situation.
Even with platform boots like Prince, I'd be still short.
And I never involved myself personaly with work when it comes to women. It's a golden rule, apart from the fact that I don't really like tall women as for personal tastes.
All brand of cameras? mmm...it's been a while since I haven't touched a MF.
Legal drugs? Well, after 20 years of heavy smoking and now starting to have "problems" because of abuses of night life and tabacco, I hardly go out, doing sport, eating finally well, stopped completly alcohool and reduced drastically smoking and I'm closest to the monastery in my daily life to be honest than to the happy Madame Claude's bordel. Well, the ideal would be a decadent monastery now that I think about it.
I need to investigate this.
Cheers.
Life is terrible, Fred.
Will you become a Xenobite, an Anchorite, or as I rather think a Sarabite (http://www.mcah.columbia.edu/medmil/pages/non-mma-pages/text_links/bretano_monasticpattern.html)?
Edmund
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Wonderful lecture Edmund, highly recommended.
It suits well with me indeed...
Man, it reminds me of the rules they gave us in fine arts.
But hey, don't get me wrong, I'm happy with my life and with my 1m70. (although...10cm more maybe wouldn't have been a luxury)
Ok, on this inspiring link I'm going to sleep.
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Sorry not for me on several issues. Dirty glass wonky lampshade and cluttered background, the eyes could of benefitted from a highlight. Like someone else said a good shot of a moment for you, but nothing to get the world of portrait photography jumping up and down.
The comment about the equipment, the Rolleiflex is just about the perfect portrait camera. Silent, easy viewing, easy to use, great quality. I would much prefer to shoot portraits with my Rolleiflex 3.5f than any of my DSLR's or film cameras. The only inconvenience is film loading after 12 shots (24 if it takes 220).
I also have an Art deco Rolleicord I suspect if I used that for portraits there would be little chance of shooting anyone without a huge grin on their face.
Kevin.
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Rolleiflex is just a jewel! Check out if you don't already know this story behind her work with this as a sample using the said camera on the street.
Nobody had ever seen an image of hers till about 100 thousand negs turned up at a clearance sale.
Vivian Maier: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cbcl2MDtLp0&feature=fvst
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Nice shot but it needed work, it was at least a stop underexposed either at the point of capture or when being scanned.
I colour corrected a bit too but not as much as it needed.
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Good street photography, actually captured interesting images. Unlike a lot of what I see now, which is just anything that happens to be in front of the camera when the button gets pressed.
I'm bias towards the Rolleiflex, as a camera I don't think it's been bettered.
Kevin.
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Yeah the Rolleiflex TLR is one of my favorite cameras for relaxing stuff like family hikes. I dunno why I don't shoot it more for professional work.
I've been resisting posting images but here's one from a hike last week with my son. T-Max 400 pushed 1 stop. No edits, just " scanned" with my MFDB and a lightbox.
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Nice use of square format.
Edmund.
Yeah the Rolleiflex TLR is one of my favorite cameras for relaxing stuff like family hikes. I dunno why I don't shoot it more for professional work.
I've been resisting posting images but here's one from a hike last week with my son. T-Max 400 pushed 1 stop. No edits, just " scanned" with my MFDB and a lightbox.
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Thanks and the square is one of the other things I love about the TLR.
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Now, THIS works. Much improved!
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Now, THIS works. Much improved!
This is an unusual thread, all the images are intimate and show emotional engagement.
Of course Eric's image is a little masterpiece of composition.
Edmund
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Nice use of square format.
Edmund.
you know the other great thing about the Rolleiflex? It holds or increases in value. I've yet to see anything digital manage that. Being square is a good thing :-)