Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: Alex MacPherson on June 12, 2009, 04:14:40 am
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Hey. I am looking at getting the RZ67 Pro II system.
What are your favorite lenses for fashion/beauty photography?
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With film or a digital back? It makes a huge difference to the FOV on the RZ.
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Hi,
The 180mm is great and I recently got the 140mm macro that I really like.
Both used on a Leaf Aptus 22.
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I too love the RZ in studio...
I really like the contrast the lens have also.
My favorites are the 110 and 145 and the 180 for beauty..:+}
You can get a whole set up for relatively cheap now a days.
here are some recent beauties with that set up..:+}
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....st&p=284689 (http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=28709&view=findpost&p=284689)
Snook
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The lens that produces 90% of my work is 110mm. Just love it from wide open all the way to 5.6. This lens rivals my 110/2.0 on AFI.
Since I got the AFI to Rz adapter the back never goes back on AFI.
65mm is also outstanding lens. I never shoot longer than 110mm on digital.
50mm is so so.
75mm is nice but heavy.
90mm is a good lens but not as magical as 110mm
I shoot Rz digital for many years.
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The 110 2.8 is a must have. It was my workhorse for many years.
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The 110 2.8 is a must have. It was my workhorse for many years.
I have to agree that the 110mm is my workhorse and I use it 80% of the time. I love the look
of the 180mm, but you will need some space to be able to pull back if you need to do full length.
As another post had mentioned, lens choice will be effected by the lens factor of the digital back.
Chris Lawery(e-mail Me) (http://mailto:[email protected])
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I know it's a different question and i know that the mamiya 645 and the RZ are different cameras, but how do you compare the sharpness and cromatic aberration between Digital 645 and analogic rz lenses?
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Coke and diet Coke
some people can not taste the difference.
Andre
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I use both on a regular base.
The quality is different, I find the images of the RZ more 3D looking.
Sharpness varies per lens, the 120mm macro of the 645AFD is stunning but the 55-110 is avarage.
On the RZ the sharpness of the 110/180/140 is scary when proper focussed.
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The 55-110 has to be the SHITTIEST lens I have EVER used. Cannot focus less than like 20 feet (LOL)
and it hunts and hunts to focus under my profoto 500 watt modeling lights!! and the quality is CRAP!
Did I make my point clear...:+]
Snook
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Thank you Frank, Andre, Snook
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@Snook.
Remove the lens and turn it upside down on the table.
You see a sort of screw, this is the AF control.
Take a screwdriver and turn it a bit, also use some oil to make sure everything is loose and running fine.
But start with just turning it a bit and now test it again.
my 55-110 frontfocussed like crazy and could not lock focus.
I decided that before sending it in I would look at it myself and check if all the screws were tight and running perfectly.
Everything was perfect and I turned the focusscrew just to see if it would run, to my BIG surprise when I reconnected the lens it focussed great and did not hunt anymore and focus was spot on.
On paper this should never happen but it did.
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@Snook.
Remove the lens and turn it upside down on the table.
You see a sort of screw, this is the AF control.
Take a screwdriver and turn it a bit, also use some oil to make sure everything is loose and running fine.
But start with just turning it a bit and now test it again.
my 55-110 frontfocussed like crazy and could not lock focus.
I decided that before sending it in I would look at it myself and check if all the screws were tight and running perfectly.
Everything was perfect and I turned the focusscrew just to see if it would run, to my BIG surprise when I reconnected the lens it focussed great and did not hunt anymore and focus was spot on.
On paper this should never happen but it did.
Cool Thanks Frank for the Information, I will try it next time in the studio..:+]
Shot a campaign the other day with some local actresses and the dang thing kept searching and searching and I missed many shots because of it. It was really embarrassing to say the least.
Thanks and I will let you know how it worked out.
Snook
PS. Frank,Turn it Counter Clockwise or Clockwise? or is it just a matter off trying both?
Thanks for any further info..:+]
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Wow thanks everyone!
Is it worthwhile to get a split-prism focusing screen? I really miss having in on my dslr. (I know I should trust AF but I don't)
I will be shooting film for the first while before I get my digital back. I will probably end up with a Phase One P21 to start with.
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In reality it should not work at all so I guess turning any way.
I just did to check if everything worked before sending it away, and it still works today.
So what happened I don't know but it worked for me.
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@Dolca,
I'm using a custom focusscreen from brightscreen, they are not cheap but they really make a HUGE difference in the studio.
They have several options.
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hi,
on film my favorite lenses were the 90, 127 and 180, with my back i'm shooting most of the time the 90 and 140, occassionally the 65. first thing, i sold, when i got my back, was the 250, but I'm still looking for a 50
best regards,
marcel
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Brightscreens website is the shits! I tried to order a screen and I couldn't figure out how to
get the right model or even how to get to the cart!
bleh!
Anyways, I have made an offer on a Pro IID. I might soon be a member of Club RZ67
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Brightscreens website is the shits! I tried to order a screen and I couldn't figure out how to
get the right model or even how to get to the cart!
bleh!
Anyways, I have made an offer on a Pro IID. I might soon be a member of Club RZ67
If you shooting WLF try first to use Mamiya screen. I find it much superior to Maxwell or Beatie. I have them all.
Yes they are brighter but all the circle lines interfer with fine detail focusing for me. Mamiya screen is plenty bright with WLF.
Also remember that every time you change the screen on Rz you need to adjust focus. Focusing screws are right below the screen.
My Bright Screen was originally 10' off on 30' distance.
Andre
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If you shooting WLF try first to use Mamiya screen. I find it much superior to Maxwell or Beatie. I have them all.
Yes they are brighter but all the circle lines interfer with fine detail focusing for me. Mamiya screen is plenty bright with WLF.
Also remember that every time you change the screen on Rz you need to adjust focus. Focusing screws are right below the screen.
My Bright Screen was originally 10' off on 30' distance.
Andre
Andre,
Outside the original screen is great, but inside with studio lights the original screen was very dimm and without the focus aid it's almost impossible to do a quick and proper focus.
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Shot a campaign the other day with some local actresses and the dang thing kept searching and searching and I missed many shots because of it. It was really embarrassing to say the least.
Snook
Snook
Not to hi-jack the thread, but just to share your pain! That is exactly the feeling I got with my brand new F4s every time I tried to load a film. Automatic loading indeed! It took about three tries each and every new film, but I learned how to blush again.
That´s why now, years later, I still have one of the last of the F3 bodies produced - the best trade-in-backwards I ever made, even if it´s becoming an expensive museum exhibit.
Rob C
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Frank,
I would assume you are using a prism instead of WLF. I could not focus the prism if my life depended on it, but WLF dark???
I shoot 90+% in studio. I can focus with 200w Broncolor ring on Para light from across the studio and I do not have perfect eyes.
Andre
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Frank,
I would assume you are using a prism instead of WLF. I could not focus the prism if my life depended on it, but WLF dark???
I shoot 90+% in studio. I can focus with 200w Broncolor ring on Para light from across the studio and I do not have perfect eyes.
Andre
I own the prism and focussing is ok with that but my eyes are still very good
99.9% of the time I use the wlf but I did not like the glass I got with it maybe you have a better one ?
There was no focus confirmation be it's not that bright.
I heard there are a lot of screens out there maybe I got a bad one. Anyway love the new one even with the prism focus works nice.
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Frank,
I would assume you are using a prism instead of WLF. I could not focus the prism if my life depended on it, but WLF dark???
I shoot 90+% in studio. I can focus with 200w Broncolor ring on Para light from across the studio and I do not have perfect eyes.
Andre
Andre you must have laser eyes, b/c I have 20/20 vision and had a HELL of time focusing with the regular RZ prism WLF screen. it was close to impossible. AS every one knows I was ripped off by s seller of my Bill Maxell screen so never got to try it out.
I did by another mamiya split screen prism which is better to focus with but still it is not the easiest of the bunch to focus and I usually have a strained eye at the end of the day shooting in studio with profoto and 500 watt modeling lights!!!!
Snook
PS. I have the PD prism finder which SUCKS and looks like you looking down a long dark tube!!
Does any body recommend the AE newer Prism finders or are they just as horrible?
Been trying to win one of ebay rather cheap but not sure if I would be wasting my money.
The PD prism which is really cheap is just crap!
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Viewing through PD prism is identical to AE prism. Same glass.
andre
Andre you must have laser eyes, b/c I have 20/20 vision and had a HELL of time focusing with the regular RZ prism WLF screen. it was close to impossible. AS every one knows I was ripped off by s seller of my Bill Maxell screen so never got to try it out.
I did by another mamiya split screen prism which is better to focus with but still it is not the easiest of the bunch to focus and I usually have a strained eye at the end of the day shooting in studio with profoto and 500 watt modeling lights!!!!
Snook
PS. I have the PD prism finder which SUCKS and looks like you looking down a long dark tube!!
Does any body recommend the AE newer Prism finders or are they just as horrible?
Been trying to win one of ebay rather cheap but not sure if I would be wasting my money.
The PD prism which is really cheap is just crap!
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I have used the much loved (Beatie?) after market sceen and a split RZ screen, and both are tough to do critical focus. This with 2-4 250w modeling lights(still need to squint with my 20/20 vision). I use the prizm with a magnify loop on it, that flips up. This is the best method I found. As far as the lens I like.... the wide 37, its fun, 180, 65 and the 140 for serious stuff. Focusing is a bit differnt on the RZ glass as it has the distance ring, and this on the 140 makes a difference. Its been a few months since I have used it, as I got tired of trying to figure out the motor drive to lens setting (M,R..etc) and what shutter release setting it needs to be on (white dot, orange, ?), etc. The issues I had with the RZ, I am sure are things I didn't allow to really sink in for me to be fully grasp, as I didn't need them on a day to day basis to be natural with the system. That can be with any system. Having said that....
I think the RZ can do everything the Hy6 can in regards to the points Foto-z makes. As much as I love a well made durable product like the Hy6 looks to be(the RZ's plastic on the WLF corner where you lock and unlock it from the body has chipped off, yet still functions and locks).... I can't see where it makes a $10k+ leap over the RZ as a MF system. I finally put it aside when the limitation of the Tiltshift bellows and the fact that you really can't measure your extensions without jotting things down, for me had too many drawbacks for my shooting at the time. Are my Rod glasses better, yes, but depending on the subject, is it detectable. I will still use my RZ for the jobs that fit best for it.
What are the main benifits of the Pro IID vs the ProII....As far as using a PhaseOne back with it (not a Mamiya back)? I would think you still need a RZ to V adapter (for v backs)?
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I have used the much loved (Beatie?) after market sceen and a split RZ screen, and both are tough to do critical focus. This with 2-4 250w modeling lights(still need to squint with my 20/20 vision). I use the prizm with a magnify loop on it, that flips up. This is the best method I found. As far as the lens I like.... the wide 37, its fun, 180, 65 and the 140 for serious stuff. Focusing is a bit differnt on the RZ glass as it has the distance ring, and this on the 140 makes a difference. Its been a few months since I have used it, as I got tired of trying to figure out the motor drive to lens setting (M,R..etc) and what shutter release setting it needs to be on (white dot, orange, ?), etc. The issues I had with the RZ, I am sure are things I didn't allow to really sink in for me to be fully grasp, as I didn't need them on a day to day basis to be natural with the system. That can be with any system. Having said that....
I think the RZ can do everything the Hy6 can in regards to the points Foto-z makes. As much as I love a well made durable product like the Hy6 looks to be(the RZ's plastic on the WLF corner where you lock and unlock it from the body has chipped off, yet still functions and locks).... I can't see where it makes a $10k+ leap over the RZ as a MF system. I finally put it aside when the limitation of the Tiltshift bellows and the fact that you really can't measure your extensions without jotting things down, for me had too many drawbacks for my shooting at the time. Are my Rod glasses better, yes, but depending on the subject, is it detectable. I will still use my RZ for the jobs that fit best for it.
What are the main benifits of the Pro IID vs the ProII....As far as using a PhaseOne back with it (not a Mamiya back)? I would think you still need a RZ to V adapter (for v backs)?
@phil
The ProIID doesn't require connecting cables with the Phase One. It was the deciding factor for me to get the Pro IID
http://www.phaseone.com/Content/Support/Ar...mp;languageid=1 (http://www.phaseone.com/Content/Support/Article.aspx?articleid=1123&languageid=1)
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I am looking at buying a 50 mm right now and was wondering if there is a BIG difference between the ULD and NON ULD version of this lens.
Does anybody know what the difference is and would be on a P30 RZIID combo?
Thanks for any information.
Is one sharper than the other or does it just have less CA?
Thank you.
PS. I will be shooting people mainly in studio but will shoot outdoors as well.
Snook
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Snook,
I am a lens maniac so I have both.
For fun macro work ULD focuses much closer than regular. ULD is also substantially sharper if properly set up on a distance.
However they are both quite dark lenses and not as good as 65mm.
andre
here 50mm ULD at its best
shooting distance about 4 inches
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Thanks andre I appreciate it..
I have the 65 and love it.. Just wanted to try a little wider considering I have a P30 that is not full frame so I lose a bit.
Do you find the 50mm to wide for most work re: people portrait/fashion.
I shoot mainly fashion and use the RZ for just fashion work really.
Also on a side note which extension tubes do you recommend to start out with.
I have the 65,90,110,127,145mm "M",180. I shoot a lot of beauty as well. which would be good for getting up pretty close for like an eye or Lip shot with the 145 macro?
Do you know which tube/s I would need. Sure hate to buy extra stuff and where I live there is zero chance of trying stuff out first...:+}
Thanks again.
Snook
PS. I still do not know how you focus so easily with your RZ..:+} My eyes are really tired at the end of the day.
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having owned and used both i can agree with andre - the ULD is far superior, and setting the distance properly on the floating element makes a big difference
it is not quite as good as the 65, which is a fantastic lens, but very close in my opinion
the old 50 W was pretty good for shooting 665 negs
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Thanks andre I appreciate it..
I have the 65 and love it.. Just wanted to try a little wider considering I have a P30 that is not full frame so I lose a bit.
Snook
PS. I still do not know how you focus so easily with your RZ..:+} My eyes are really tired at the end of the day.
I do not know if it will make sens to you but after years of using it I know where the focus is. I never go back and forth like with other cameras. I turn the knob and the moment the focus is there I shoot without giving model a chance to move. I am composing the same time that focusing. It works for me with -1.5 diopter. My shooting rate is about 40 and I shot mostly 4.0 or 5.6 with 90+% in focus.
Do you find the 50mm to wide for most work re: people portrait/fashion.
I shoot mainly fashion and use the RZ for just fashion work really.
50mm is a beautiful length but very difficult to work with correctly. 50mm also makes a great portrait lens ( for some models )
I will try the extensions tomorrow. I do not use them a lot.
Andre
Also on a side note which extension tubes do you recommend to start out with.
I have the 65,90,110,127,145mm "M",180. I shoot a lot of beauty as well. which would be good for getting up pretty close for like an eye or Lip shot with the 145 macro?
Do you know which tube/s I would need. Sure hate to buy extra stuff and where I live there is zero chance of trying stuff out first...:+}
Thanks again.
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I do not know if it will make sens to you but after years of using it I know where the focus is. I never go back and forth like with other cameras. I turn the knob and the moment the focus is there I shoot without giving model a chance to move. I am composing the same time that focusing. It works for me with -1.5 diopter. My shooting rate is about 40 and I shot mostly 4.0 or 5.6 with 90+% in focus.
Do you find the 50mm to wide for most work re: people portrait/fashion.
I shoot mainly fashion and use the RZ for just fashion work really.
50mm is a beautiful length but very difficult to work with correctly. 50mm also makes a great portrait lens ( for some models )
I will try the extensions tomorrow. I do not use them a lot.
Andre
Also on a side note which extension tubes do you recommend to start out with.
I have the 65,90,110,127,145mm "M",180. I shoot a lot of beauty as well. which would be good for getting up pretty close for like an eye or Lip shot with the 145 macro?
Do you know which tube/s I would need. Sure hate to buy extra stuff and where I live there is zero chance of trying stuff out first...:+}
Thanks again.
I would love to see some sample fashion images shot with the 50mm and the 65mm if you have any
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Do you use the motor drive? It sometimes starts to wind and doesnt stop, then I turn the dail to M, and it stops, but then doesnt fire on the shutter button on white, or while the dail is on R, then the shutter switch needs to be on orange...hehehe, Once I got it working, it was great. Then I set it down for a week or 2, and again the hoops and hurdles to get it "synced"....I forget! ...I want to love it(when I get it running I do)..... I should jot down some notes on the setup and keep in on the camera so i don't frustrate myself everytime I want to use it. :-) So on the ProIID, you still need the adapter plate, but not the communication cable. Nice...Is it just convenience, or perhaps something else ?
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@phil
The ProIID doesn't require connecting cables with the Phase One. It was the deciding factor for me to get the Pro IID
http://www.phaseone.com/Content/Support/Ar...mp;languageid=1 (http://www.phaseone.com/Content/Support/Article.aspx?articleid=1123&languageid=1)
The ProIID uses the same crappy Mamiya Serial Interface as the originla AFd. It sucks, is unreliable, and slow. Save the money and get an RZ Pro (not II) and a Leaf plate, and use the cable. Its no big deal.
As to focusing, what Andre said is absolutely correct: You have to sort of train yourself to know when an image is in focus. I used the RZ with film for years, with the matt daigonal split screen. I know when its in focus. I get 85% in focus, using either day light, modeling lights, or even room light with F4 lenses.
As to lenses, the 65 is nice, the 110 the nicest. The 180 W-N is the bees knees for beauty. be warned, the 65 is very sharp and if used too close t the subject result in forced perspective distortion. It takes a while to figure out how close you can use it on a human subject.
Good luck.
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Focusing my RZs was a delight after coming from Hasselblad 500 systems. That is a hard system to focus. I found RZ bellows focusing way better in that regard. What you do have to have in account is that as in LF you have to compensate exposure for bellows extension, especially when focusing really close. There is a scale on the side that makes that easier.
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@Tmark,
Why a Pro and not a ProII.
I agree on the ProIID by the way, I also use a ProII for the same reasons.
On focussing, when used to it it's indeed fast especially with a splitscreen which I use, the microadjust is a dream for closeup portrait work.
But with the original it was too much guess work unless I put my modelling lamps on full power.
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Here are 2 recently with the 65mm.
I really like this lens.
I have the "D" an prefer not having another cable but I got a good deal on my "D"
Snook
[attachment=14771:Vanidades_49981_T_.jpg]
[attachment=14772:Vanidades_50189_T_.jpg]
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Here are 2 recently with the 65mm.
I really like this lens.
I have the "D" an prefer not having another cable but I got a good deal on my "D"
Snook
[attachment=14771:Vanidades_49981_T_.jpg]
[attachment=14772:Vanidades_50189_T_.jpg]
Thanks Snook
Somehow I was expecting the images to be "wider" meaning showing a little wide angle distortion (which I kinda like for some fashion shots)
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Thanks Snook
Somehow I was expecting the images to be "wider" meaning showing a little wide angle distortion (which I kinda like for some fashion shots)
On a P30 that is about it.. depends on the crop factor maybe.
I am looking for a 50mm ULD to see if it is wider, but on a crop sensor you lose quite a bit actually.
Snook
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On a P30 that is about it.. depends on the crop factor maybe.
I am looking for a 50mm ULD to see if it is wider, but on a crop sensor you lose quite a bit actually.
Snook
Snook,
I was shooting today my Rz and thinking about your focusing problems. I do not know if you already do that but I went through my check list and I think that your problems may lay here:
Shut off all modeling lights on background including hair light and any model's backlit. Leave just the modeling light on your key light. It makes a huge difference since your ability to see do not really depends on the amount of light but rather the amount of contrast. In completely dark room your eyes can easily focus across the room using light from your cell phone lcd.
Second do not press your eye against your WLF but rather keep it about 1" away. Again huge difference.
I do not have perfect vision but I constantly hit 95% focus on RZ. I do not see any other reason why I could and you could not. Let me know.
Andre
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Hey Andre Thanks for your reply.. I appreciate it.
I have been getting use to it more often to tell you the truth..
I have the vertical split screen and like it better than the original standard screen that came with my RZ. I was suppose to have a Bill Maxell screen but was "ripped" off, but that is water under the bridge and NO one wants to here that story again here..
I always turn off the lights in the studio and funny you mentioned the hair lights and background lights as today I left those off.
What I find strange is that supposedly on a full length shot @F11 I should have a BIG leeway with focus but find that distance where everything should be in focus theory is BS. If my models lean or sway slightly they are out of focus...
But I have to say lately I am in the 85% in focus range which is fine by me...
Thanks for your information and help, I appreciate it.
I guess seeing things at 100% in the monitor makes us less secure than in the film days when maybe somethings were a little soft but would not be noticed in print for catalogues and magazines. Now a days as I am a retocuher also I am viewing and retouching at 100% which any slight OOF is quite noticeable in the my case.
Thanks
Snook