Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: Frank Doorhof on April 06, 2009, 03:03:07 am
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I know it's been just released but does anyone work with the new MBP17" and a digital back (prefarable Leaf) ?
I know with the old 17" there were some problems powering a digital back and I thought that with the new one this would be solved untill I got a tip that I had to check this to make sure because probarbly also the new one has the problem.
I will be using the new laptop for mainly shooting tethered and the new 8 hour battery looks very promising, hoping to get somewhere between 2-3 hours shooting from it (my MBP15" gives me app 1.5 hours continues use).
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I have no experience with the new 17" Mac, but I want to comment.
I use a Macbook 13" 2.4/4Gb (not Pro) with the Leaf 65.
I not experienced a single problems with Power, Software, Digital Back, Cables, etc during a 5-6 hours non-stop photo session in studio!
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I know it's been just released but does anyone work with the new MBP17" and a digital back (prefarable Leaf) ?
I know with the old 17" there were some problems powering a digital back and I thought that with the new one this would be solved untill I got a tip that I had to check this to make sure because probarbly also the new one has the problem.
I will be using the new laptop for mainly shooting tethered and the new 8 hour battery looks very promising, hoping to get somewhere between 2-3 hours shooting from it (my MBP15" gives me app 1.5 hours continues use).
Good Morning Frank,
When shooting tethered from one of the new MBP's you'll still only be able to shoot until the battery meter hits about 70-75%. However, we do have a new external battery system for Macs that we are the European dealers for. It's called Applejuicz. If you want more details then Lawrie or Andy here at Peartree can help.
The extended battery quoted on the new macs tends to only be relevant when doing simple low charge draw tasks like word processing. To get the full 8 hours out of these mac batteries you have to set the laptop to the 'Better Battery Consumption" setting which dims the screen brightness to around 50% from memory and it will tend to go into sleep mode a lot sooner as well. If you want to shoot remotely for extended periods with any back, your best bet would be to go with the external battery solution rather than a new macintosh.
Hope this has been of some help!
Ben
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Hi,
I already mailed to you about this product and am waiting for more news
Main reason to switch for me is also the better/bigger screen and speed.
The laptop is used almost constant and in the studio the bigger screen is not really an issue but on location it's wonderful with doing editing and selecting.
For tethered shooting 2 hours max would be perfect.
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Hi,
I'm using a macbook (hte 13") running 10.5.6 and leaf capture 11.2.4 for an Afi-ii 7 tethered - with or without battery power. I haven't yet encountered any problems. I am very impressed and pleased with this equipment! Frank, you did some nice studies of people-
Neil Folberg
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Hi,
With the 15" MBP I also never experienced any problems, that's why I want to make sure on the 17" new version
Thank you so much for the comment on my work.
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Good Morning Frank,
When shooting tethered from one of the new MBP's you'll still only be able to shoot until the battery meter hits about 70-75%. However, we do have a new external battery system for Macs that we are the European dealers for. It's called Applejuicz. If you want more details then Lawrie or Andy here at Peartree can help.
The extended battery quoted on the new macs tends to only be relevant when doing simple low charge draw tasks like word processing. To get the full 8 hours out of these mac batteries you have to set the laptop to the 'Better Battery Consumption" setting which dims the screen brightness to around 50% from memory and it will tend to go into sleep mode a lot sooner as well. If you want to shoot remotely for extended periods with any back, your best bet would be to go with the external battery solution rather than a new macintosh.
Hope this has been of some help!
Ben
Welcome on board Ben, it's about time Brits gave Yankees some stick on these boards!!! Keep at it!!! (if only for the better (proper) English )
Yair
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No No , I don't need anyone correcting my crappy English. LOL
This thread does remind me though I need to order a new Firewire 800 to 400 15 foot cable. I just bought a new 15 inch 2.93 unibody and it is only Firewire 800
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No No , I don't need anyone correcting my crappy English. LOL
This thread does remind me though I need to order a new Firewire 800 to 400 15 foot cable. I just bought a new 15 inch 2.93 unibody and it is only Firewire 800
If you already have a cable, just get the little converter, no?
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If I were using Phase One digital backs, I'd probably get an ExpressCard to use existing Firewire 400 cables
and avoid Firewire 800 connectors which easily wiggle loose.
http://www.sonnettech.com/product/fwusbexpresscard34.html (http://www.sonnettech.com/product/fwusbexpresscard34.html)
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If I were using Phase One digital backs, I'd probably get an ExpressCard to use existing Firewire 400 cables
and avoid Firewire 800 connectors which easily wiggle loose.
http://www.sonnettech.com/product/fwusbexpresscard34.html (http://www.sonnettech.com/product/fwusbexpresscard34.html)
Has anyone else had this problem of FW 800 cables coming loose? Never heard of it. Anyone have experience of the new screen?
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If you already have a cable, just get the little converter, no?
I could just another thing to get lose though. I could also just get a express card for Firewire 400
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If I were using Phase One digital backs, I'd probably get an ExpressCard to use existing Firewire 400 cables
and avoid Firewire 800 connectors which easily wiggle loose.
http://www.sonnettech.com/product/fwusbexpresscard34.html (http://www.sonnettech.com/product/fwusbexpresscard34.html)
I have one of these that I use on my New 17" MBP and to be honest its more likely to wiggle loose than a FW800 cable plugged into the machine. Also, express cards don't have "power" so you need to use your Digital backs power. In general I have just been using the FW800 port (had to buy new cables) and running the Phase on battery.
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Has anyone else had this problem of FW 800 cables coming loose? Never heard of it. Anyone have experience of the new screen?
Not sure but mine is a pretty tight fit. I have it connected to my Drobo in the office. The new MPB it seems the connectors are built better for some reason. They seem to have more metal around the connections and the fittings are pretty tight. I know it is new so give it some time may apply here but for some reason it seems better made in this area
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I have one of these that I use on my New 17" MBP and to be honest its more likely to wiggle loose than a FW800 cable plugged into the machine. Also, express cards don't have "power" so you need to use your Digital backs power. In general I have just been using the FW800 port (had to buy new cables) and running the Phase on battery.
Thanks, sounds like i should just get new cables. I know Doug has them over at CI for a reasonable price
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Thanks, sounds like i should just get new cables. I know Doug has them over at CI for a reasonable price
How are you liking the screen? Have you compared it to a good external, how does it compare? I'm getting to the end of my tether with lugging my Eizo round the world and I'm hoping to just use the 17 inch MBP screen.
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I have it hooked up to my Apple 30 and it is very nice. I have a 15 inch glossy which I like but some like matte big debate about that one but not available on the new 15 . You would have to go 17 and glossy on that one is very dim. The matte on the 17 is very nice. Highly recommend though find a away to a Apple store before making that call. I like the 15 because it is easier to deal with. As it is the color looks very good compared to the 30 which is calibrated. I need to profile the laptop screen itself but it is pretty darn close as it is.
BTW 8gb is supposed to not work on the 15 well I am trying it today. Have 6gb in it now and it is fine. Lets see how 8gb will do
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I just ordered the 17" MBP.
Will also probarbly order the macjuisz battery if peartree has them in.
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BTW I got 8gb of Ram in the 15 inch 2.93, just like the 17 inch and it works
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Here is a link to the cables we offer that will help with the new MacBook Pro:
http://www.captureintegration.com/solutions/featuredproduct/ (http://www.captureintegration.com/solutions/featuredproduct/)
Chris Lawery (e-mail Me) (http://mailto:[email protected])
__________________
Sales Manager, Capture Integration
Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870 | Cell: 404.234.5195
Newsletter: Read Latest or Sign Up (http://www.captureintegration.com/our-company/newsletters/)
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So what are these mac juice battery's or whatever you call them, just did a quick google and couldn't find them?
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If this is the Apple Juicz , then no thanks :
http://www.quickertek.com/products/apple_juicz.php (http://www.quickertek.com/products/apple_juicz.php)
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It's not the solar panel, but the accu pack.
I would also not want to drag arround a solar panel
The MBP arrived yesterday, screen looks gorgous and the 1920x1200 resolution is exactly what I needed.
One thing that really stood out is the firewire800 connector, on the 15" MBP it's not a tight fit, some of the time it would come loose and I would loose connection to my harddrive so I was afraid for the tethered shooting, but on the 17" MBP the connector is rocksolid, it really clicked.
Overal my first impressions are very positive (still have to work with it), but what was Apple thinking with the black keyboard ??
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It's not the solar panel, but the accu pack.
I would also not want to drag arround a solar panel
The MBP arrived yesterday, screen looks gorgous and the 1920x1200 resolution is exactly what I needed.
One thing that really stood out is the firewire800 connector, on the 15" MBP it's not a tight fit, some of the time it would come loose and I would loose connection to my harddrive so I was afraid for the tethered shooting, but on the 17" MBP the connector is rocksolid, it really clicked.
Overal my first impressions are very positive (still have to work with it), but what was Apple thinking with the black keyboard ??
So how about that screen, have you calibrated it? Do you think it's good enough for colour critical work? Can I leave my eizo at home.
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Don't know yet, it came in yesterday and I was home late so I just installed the laptop.
Will start working with it tomorrow and friday in the first photoshoot, will report back then.
It depends on what you do on location of course, if you do colorcritical work I would probarbly not use the notebook.
I think the screen from the very quick glance I had last night is good enough for normal work on location and editing for most work.
But again if it really counts I would trust my studio monitor, but than again most monitors used for that work are equal the MBP in cost.
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My 15 inch screen looks good but I would still shoot a WB shoot tethered and go that route for the shoot just to be on the safe side. I just ordered a new 400 to 800 cable from CI so i will check it out also when that comes in. Frank it will take 8gbs of Ram and i actually put in two SSD drives running Raid 0 with Intel XM 25 80gb drives .Very nice little setup, not cheap though. I'm hooked up to my 30 inch display and that did calibrate very nicely.
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Hi,
The whitebalance card is a nobrainer of course
We always do that.
I'm waiting for the 4GB modules to come down a bit in price, my wife owns a PC/MAC store so she keeps an eye out for me.
For the moment the 4GB will do just fine, I'm using the MBP only in the studio for shooting and on location of course.
For the photoshop and video work I'm using a macpro 8 core with 12 GB that flies.
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.... i actually put in two SSD drives running Raid 0 with Intel XM 25 80gb drives .Very nice little setup, not cheap though. I'm hooked up to my 30 inch display and that did calibrate very nicely.
Guy, I've been thinking of going the SSD route. Any issues? Any worry of Raid 0 failing? How much speedier is it? For example, does it process files any faster? When teethered do the images load in any faster? When browsing to a new folder do thumbnails load faster, and so forth.
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Guy, I've been thinking of going the SSD route. Any issues? Any worry of Raid 0 failing? How much speedier is it? For example, does it process files any faster? When teethered do the images load in any faster? When browsing to a new folder do thumbnails load faster, and so forth.
Great questions . Let me give you some thoughts on this. No issues with the Raid 0 and the SSD drives. I have the Intel XM -25 80gbs and than in the optical bay i used the bracket from maxupgrades for the second drive and pretty easy to install http://www.maxupgrades.com/istore/index.cf...FTOKEN=10088962 (http://www.maxupgrades.com/istore/index.cfm?fuseaction=Product.display&product_id=186&CFID=2087961&CFTOKEN=10088962) . I would have loved to get the E class drives but there 700 each. Ouch but I am running extremely fast here and as always have a backup OS system on a external and I also have a OS backup on a Firewire 800 LaCie Rugged drive that i always take with me on the road . So there is a backup always around. I actually took out the 7200 drive that came with the laptop made two partitions one for OS backup and one for road storage than put that in the Lacie. Also let me state too that you CAN put 8gb of Ram in the 15 inch 2.66 or 2.93 models only. Worth that upgrade right there. Now as far as speed this all depends on the program. In CS4 with this setup I am actually beating my old MacPro 2.66 667 12gb of Ram and 10 k drives, and the reason for this is CS4 is not core hungry and only runs on a single core. So in this case lR and ACR would be great programs on the laptop running like this. Now C1 which i use is more core hungry than ram hungry and this is where I have actually slowed down from the desktop. C1 does like more cores but also likes Ram and drive speed but I am not that much slower by the truck load. Basically 10 P45 files processed full res is a minute slower than the MacPro was. Considering this is a laptop that is damn good. Now the new 8 core MacPros will smoke me by 2 minutes. So with any laptop we are limited too two cores and core hungry programs will run slower. I actually sold my MacPro and went this route because i wanted something much more road worthy and still able to process quickly. No regrets yes it is a little slower here but I can work in the office and on the road. At this point the only way to actually speed this up more and i am flying here is to actually go with the E class SSD which the issue is with SSD the reads are amazingly fast . CS4 loads in less than 3 seconds but that is somewhat meaningless in real world work. Anyway it is the writes that you have to watch and they are by a single SSD slower than a 7200 drive with the Raid 0 that increases but with the E class SSD i think i could even get faster in C1 since the box itself has big improvements alone with 2.93 1056 mhz a bigger L2 cache and better DDR 3 ram so all that stuff combined makes the system pretty darn quick. Than add the SSD and your off to the races butwith those limits i mentioned. So in real world it will depend a lot on the programs you are running. For Raw processing the one program like C1 will take the most hit because even Aperture is Ram hungry and not as much core hungry. So it will come down to programs other than that the system flies. Now we should remember I am speaking from a Photographers point of view and we all know of the heavy demands we place on speed of workflow. Even with C1 i go usually one image at a time and setting up the next image during the processing time going in the background so depending how you work on the fly like this maybe not such a big issue. But if you save everything in batch than at the end hit 200 images to process in batch at the end than obviously you will wait for them to process longer than you would a MacPro. Now i will say this smokes my old 2.4 667 mhz 6gb ram 2006 model so as a laptop it is a big improvement with the SSD. Tethered i have not tried yet waiting for the new Firewire cord but I will assume yes no question because it has extremely fast reads. That I will report on when that test comes in. Hope that helps but the SSD are really nice , just expensive as heck right now.
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Decided to do a quick calibration on the MBP17"
Grayscale tracking is fair for a notebook but not perfect, on the higher IRE patterns red and blue are too hot but it's better than the MBP15".
Looking at some pictures I know very well I can say that the screen is very nice and good enough for on the road editing.
With the old MBP I did not do that because the colors were always a little funky in the skintones the MBP17" seems to be improved there.
I can't do a colorspace measurement under MACOS because my calibration software I use for the ISF calibrations runs under windows, I will do a quick measurement under windows tomorrow with a spectrum radio meter to see what the colorspace under windows does (probarbly the same as under MacOS).
I will try to upload the raw data tomorrow if you are interested.
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Decided to do a quick calibration on the MBP17"
Grayscale tracking is fair for a notebook but not perfect, on the higher IRE patterns red and blue are too hot but it's better than the MBP15".
Looking at some pictures I know very well I can say that the screen is very nice and good enough for on the road editing.
With the old MBP I did not do that because the colors were always a little funky in the skintones the MBP17" seems to be improved there.
I can't do a colorspace measurement under MACOS because my calibration software I use for the ISF calibrations runs under windows, I will do a quick measurement under windows tomorrow with a spectrum radio meter to see what the colorspace under windows does (probarbly the same as under MacOS).
I will try to upload the raw data tomorrow if you are interested.
Frank,
I have the previous generation MPB 17 with an H2 and a Leaf 75. No problems tethered
Don
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I posted some measurements on my blog for those interested in seeing what the color/grayscale tracking does on the new 17" MBP
Share the link with others who are interested.
http://www.doorhof.nl/blog/index.php?topic=2434.0 (http://www.doorhof.nl/blog/index.php?topic=2434.0)
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Updated the review with measurements comparing aRGB to the MBP.
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Today I tested the time I can shoot with the Leaf Aptus22 connected to the MBP on battery power alone.
One hour was without a problem, after app 70 minutes sometimes a corrupted image came in, after app 80 minutes it was three good one corrupted, three good, one corrupted etc.
So at this moment the real shooting time is app 70 minutes on battery power with the Leaf Aptus 22.
Not so bad but not good, especially because my battery still was for 55% full, would love to be able to shoot till it's really empty, but possibly the power on the firewire connector drops after that time.
Best solution for location work without power would be to shoot on the card and empty the card in between sessions.
With a firewire 800 card reader that is a relative quick process to I think for most people it's a good option (or shoot with a Canon tethered with it's own power).
After the workshops in Hertfordshire I hope to bring the Applejuisz with me that claims to run the laptop 5-6 hours before it goes over to it's own accu pack.
That would mean that I can shoot 6 hours in a worst case scenario which sounds very tempting.
Will update the review on my blog and make a new review there when I bring the applejuicz with me.
Full review on www.doorhof.nl/blog under reviews.
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Hi,
I have to add that I'm on my fourth cycle, with my MBP15" after a week or three the accu was on it's normal behaviour.
I'm still not getting the 8 hours claimed worktime, it tops out at maybe 6 hours, but when it was new it was on 4 hours so were getting there
I will repeat the test in a week or two.
I have to add that while we were shooting tethered internet radio was playing and the USB ports were in use for a keyboard and mouse plus the miniport was driving a LCD.
I don't know if it takes a lot of power but I guess everything combined will drain the battery more than running the laptop dedicated.
The files do come in by the way after 80 minutes but the artifacts are horizontal lines, first in the half of the frame, later 3 or 4 and when I stopped testing it were dozens of them with every now and than a good shot, when I connected the power it work flawless again.
I'm a bit dissapointed indeed, to be safe I could work for maybe an hour.
I will also test with the monitor on half (it was now on 75%) that should also help.
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Hi,
I have to add that I'm on my fourth cycle, with my MBP15" after a week or three the accu was on it's normal behaviour.
I'm still not getting the 8 hours claimed worktime, it tops out at maybe 6 hours, but when it was new it was on 4 hours so were getting there
I think that only the MBP 17" has 8 hours of battery life. The 15" (which I also have) gets around 5 with wireless active. I haven't tried yet without, but 6 seems plausible.
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Hi,
I'm using the 17"MBP2009 my previous laptop was the MBP15june2008 model.
By the way good tip on the wireless that's also on, will disconnect that one also (totally forgot).
Will test it solo in the coming weeks with everything off.
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Hi,
I'm using the 17"MBP2009 my previous laptop was the MBP15june2008 model.
By the way good tip on the wireless that's also on, will disconnect that one also (totally forgot).
Will test it solo in the coming weeks with everything off.
Ah, I read your sentence wrong then. Don't forget Bluetooth and don't make the screen any brighter than necessary!
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noted bluetooth also
Will check everything and do the test again.
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I have a couple of the QuickerTek MacBook Pro batteries as well as the new MacBook Pro 17" 2.93GHz.
I do digital capture with the Leaf Aptus 75 and Aptus 54S. I'm not using the 17" on-location for capturing; I use the 15" instead.
The 15" will last for about half a day of computer work and for 400-500 frames with the Leaf Aptus.
For a full day I need two batteries.
About the colorgamut:
I did a quick comparison between the new 17" 2.93GHz anti-glare vs. the early 2008 MacBook Pro 15" matted screen.
The grid represents the colorgamut of the 17" and the solid is the colorgamut of the 15".
Enjoy!
Best,
Esben
[attachment=13230:Picture_1.png]
[attachment=13231:Picture_2.png]
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That confirms what I see the new screen is ALOT better than the 15" version I used before.
400-500 frames with the leaf would be possible if I shot them after each other, but normally in 1-2 hours I shoot like 150-200 frames max.
I will try to test again with everything disconnected.
Blu tooth was off already but the wireless was on.
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That confirms what I see the new screen is ALOT better than the 15" version I used before.
400-500 frames with the leaf would be possible if I shot them after each other, but normally in 1-2 hours I shoot like 150-200 frames max.
I will try to test again with everything disconnected.
Blu tooth was off already but the wireless was on.
That gamut difference is huge! Do you know how the new 15" compares?
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I did not test the 15"
I did do a comparison with a ARGB monitor and the 17" MBP2009 is not that huge
But for a notebook, it's wow.
The comparison can be seen on www.doorhof.nl/blog under reviews.
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the new 17" matt screen mbp seems to be the first apple mobile computer which is really useable for color editing and cmyk soft proofing when calibrated ! the gamut is very similar to sRGB and like other sRGB monitors it covers almost the entire cmyk space like isocoated v2 / g7 except some high saturated cyan. this is really a step forward.
there is not much of a differance between an eizo cg21 and the 17".