Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: Anders_HK on January 27, 2008, 09:01:17 am
-
Hi
I have demoed both Phase One and Leaf Aptus, and now serious consider refurbished A65/A22 or refurbished P30/P25 since those seem to be what are within my reach. I current lean towards A65 or P30 since seems they have newer sensor technology and larger MPs.
My photography is a hobby on travels and living in different countries; landscapes, scenery and people living traditional lives. Leaf is said to be more film like, but what does most people use for landscapes?
I still am not perfect clear on which one excels in image quality and at low noise, both at native and high ISOs. Most my shooting is at low ISO but usable higher ISO is welcome since I do not want to add a DSLR on travels.
What about dependability and use in dusty, hot and humid environments? Life length (as amateur I wish to buy durable to last very long time)?
With 50 ISO being native, with ETTR that equals about 25 ISO which is slow. Is that reason to go with P30 for landscape that has 100 ISO native?
How about crop sensors in Mamiya 645AFDII viewfinder; bright, simple to frame?
Leaf Histogram seems to excel;
Info: +/-EV = exposure compensation from exif.
Histogram: +/-EV is relating to gamma of histogram, or the exceeding of bright limits in histogram? How?
Much thanks for advises and explanations.
Regards
Anders
-
Hi Anders
You may want to reference a series of posts called "The $64,000 Question" from Nov last year where there are several pages of posts - many of which will be relevant. Here is an extract of what I wrote.
.... I found that Phase has a very basic, simple set of controls, almost a minimalist approach. Leaf seemed to offer far more LCD functionality. For example; pre shoot file naming, job folders, metadata, file annotations....etc.
For me I preferred the very quick and easy 4 button approach of Phase so I bought a Mamiya 645 AFD2 and a P30+. But everyone's workflow is personal and you may find the Leaf more suitable. I'm sure you won't go wrong with either. Also check Michael's excellent article on MFDB's which underlines the importance of your dealer relationship.....
And finally don't forget the upcoming Phase camera to be announced around Mar 19th
Regards
Hi
I have demoed both Phase One and Leaf Aptus, and now serious consider refurbished A65/A22 or refurbished P30/P25 since those seem to be what are within my reach. I current lean towards A65 or P30 since seems they have newer sensor technology and larger MPs.
My photography is a hobby on travels and living in different countries; landscapes, scenery and people living traditional lives. Leaf is said to be more film like, but what does most people use for landscapes?
I still am not perfect clear on which one excels in image quality and at low noise, both at native and high ISOs. Most my shooting is at low ISO but usable higher ISO is welcome since I do not want to add a DSLR on travels.
What about dependability and use in dusty, hot and humid environments? Life length (as amateur I wish to buy durable to last very long time)?
With 50 ISO being native, with ETTR that equals about 25 ISO which is slow. Is that reason to go with P30 for landscape that has 100 ISO native?
How about crop sensors in Mamiya 645AFDII viewfinder; bright, simple to frame?
Leaf Histogram seems to excel;
Info: +/-EV = exposure compensation from exif.
Histogram: +/-EV is relating to gamma of histogram, or the exceeding of bright limits in histogram? How?
Much thanks for advises and explanations.
Regards
Anders
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=169942\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
-
Yeah, this question has been answered ad nauseam, just do a search on the board. As I've said before though, the whole leaf being more film like is bs. It all depends on your RAW-developing and PS work. They're all good backs with their advantages and disadvantages, more than anything it's the user that sets them apart. But if harsh environments are a concern to you you might want to go with phase because of the fan-less cooling. The simple and rugged design of P1 was def. one thing that made me go phase over leaf.
cheers
-
This may piss off Phase users, but skin tones for whatever reason just look better "right out of the box" with Leaf backs. That's using LR, LC11. I have always seen somewhat undesirable skin tones in Phase files that can be corrected, any file can be corrected practically in Photoshop, but there is something to say about getting very pleasing skin tones at capture.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=169954\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Having a Leaf Valeo (=Dalsa Chip) and a Hasselblad H3D (=Kodak Chip, like Phase One) I can absolutely confirm this.
Imagine a client does not want the one picture, where you can twiggle for hours in photoshop, but who wants lets say 30 pictures of a shooting, life is much more simple with skin tones from a leaf back.
Image processing of the Leaf files also works very well with ACR and Lightroom.
Bernd
-
From what seems to be Anders main photographic content, outdoors, landscapes, travel, I would say that Phase would be the better choice for many reasons, and this comes from a very content Leaf user.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=169954\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I'd have to agree with John. It's similar to the Snook, "Which camera should I buy?", saga a few months ago. It also sounds like Anders' will have the time to deal with Phase files in post with C1, LR, and ACR rather than the simple solution of LC11 to PS. Forgot to add, if you're running on a PC, get the Phase!
David
-
Again with "out of the box" argument. Who cares how the default settings look in any RAW-converter? It takes you maybe 5 minutes to make a profile that pleases YOUR eyes and then you can just have your raw converter apply that profile by default as you open your files. I shoot high-end fashion, and I'm hardly the only one doing this with a phase back, so I can assure you there is no problem getting gorgeous skin tones.
-
Forgot to add, if you're running on a PC, get the Phase!
David
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=169969\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
David,
could you elaborate on precisely why having one platform (pc vs mac) would influence your choice of purchase of either Phase1 or Sinar? As a potential buyer I'm interested to hear what you (and others) have to say about that.
Thanks,
Sean
-
I'm not in a position to comment on which (Phase or Leaf) is better but I have just started working with a Mamiya AFD/P30. Photography for me is a hobby also. Be prepared to spend more time post-processing the files than what you did with your DSLR. If you end up with the Phase send me a PM and I'll help you as best as I can. I found my eye was conditioned to like the output of my 5D and DxO, the P30/C1V4 looked a bit washed out and foliage too yellow (slightly pea green instead of forest green). After a bit of time I have found the 5D a bit to magenta. So I now have 2 stored curves one for the 5D which increases the green channel just a bit and one for the P30 which reduces the green channel just a bit. They now look closer and more accurate. Because of the 12 stops that the DB can capture I found a normal ETTR daylight scene (exposure then reduced to normal) not as contrasty as the 5D so again in curves I have 2 stored RGB curves that address compressing the shadows (where the extra stops lie) so the mid tones have some contrast. Again if you end up with a Phase send me a PM. I was looking for a Mamiya ZD back $7k last December When a leaf aptus 22 was available for $12K and a Phase P30 for $11K I went with the Phase w/o regret.
Marc
-
I too went with P30... And love it.. I never got a chance to shoot with the leaf but the Fan and Battery deal with leaf turned me off to tell you the truth.
Skin tones were the LAST thing I was worried about as I usually calibrate the skin tones how I want and never liked canned Skin tones...If that makes sense.
The Screen on the Leaf looks better but I never saw it in "real" life.
The P30 LCD is A Joke.. It sucks big time and is actually embarrassing when clients/art directors are used to looking at a 1DsMII or 5D back and zoom.
The P30 just let's me know the picture went through and that is it..:+}
I agree that you probably cannot go wrong with either
but I sealed my marriage with Phase after they got together with Mamiya..:+}
That is a no brainer as far as I am concerned
Snook
-
two things about the phase:
battery size is pretty much fixed
and it needs to wake up to take a shot
which requires a special cable if you're using certain types of cameras...
on my leaf I use a 3rd party battery that's pretty big (I never find that the standard battery runs long enough)
of course the leaf is stupid enough to have the firewire port covered by the battery so you HAVE to tether it powered by the computer.
btw I managed to get a PC version of leaf capture 11 and I tether my aptus to my pc...so it's not just a mac thing
-
I agree that you probably cannot go wrong with either
but I sealed my marriage with Phase after they got together with Mamiya..:+}
That is a no brainer as far as I am concerned
Snook
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170077\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Bear in mind that the strategic alliance between Phase One and Mamiya does not necessarily preclude that Leaf and Mamiya will not continue their own strategic cooperation, and that the upcoming AFDIII will also not necessarily be restricted to a Phase One partnership.
While it's clear that Leaf (and Sinar with the Hy6) is moving strongly in the direction of AFi technology, Leaf has not signaled any intention to minimize their digital back lineup with regards to compatibility with their traditional partner Mamiya, as well as other camera manufacturers.
Steve Hendrix
www.ppratlanta.com/digital.php
-
... and so does Sinar, with all camera manufacturers.
Best regards,
Thierry
...., Leaf has not signaled any intention to minimize their digital back lineup with regards to compatibility with their traditional partner Mamiya, as well as other camera manufacturers.
Steve Hendrix
www.ppratlanta.com/digital.php
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170114\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
-
I choose Leaf over Phase any time. This is just an opinion of mine but never less an opinion that I formulated over seven years of shooting with all generations of Phase backs prior to switching to Aptus.
I have owned:
LightPhase - 2 years
H20 - 1.5 years
H25 - 1 year
P20 & P25 - 2 years
P45 - 6 months
I put a total of 245,000 frames on Phase backs before my first Aptus was purchased 18 months ago.
For my kind of work Leaf is not only marginally better but far superior to Phase backs.
My post work flow is cut down 50% as I no longer chase the perfect colors and fight orange cast and fringing.
http://AndreNapier.com (http://AndreNapier.com)
...and no I never got anything free from Leaf, on a contrary I was offer a no cost switch back to Phase which I kindly refused.
-
Dear Andre and All
Granted my final choice may come down to final pricing and availibility within certain timeframe, and... the 10-15 second startup time of Leaf!
However, very important are also
- Colors
- Simple to PP
- Noise (clean @ 50-100 ISO, useable @ higher)
- Durability
- Long problem free life
Colors are what make a photograph and simpler post saves also an amateur from spending too much time in computer.
Much thanks to all above comments already. How about above for landscape works and perhaps specific A65 vs P30?
Much thanks
Regards
Anders
-
Anders,
I would get the P30. The P30 is a more flexible solution than the A22, if for no other reason than ISO. The Phase is OK at 800, and I've heard the plus is OK at 1600. The Aptus backs need light and lots of it to shine, although I've seen some A75 files at 400 that looked pretty good. And I do agree that the Aptus backs provide great results out of the box for people, but you can get the same results with Phase backs, you just have to have your presets in order in whatever raw converter you use.
Also remember that the Aptus is the same generation tech as the ZD, although it has a better pipeline. I'd get the newest tech you can find that fits your budget.
After all of my bitching about MFDB prices and my evangelizing for rentals, I pulled the trigger on a P30+. I usually rent Aptus backs for jobs, at least since LC11 came out. I really like the A22 and I think the A75 is the best back available, but they cost too much. The A22 is old tech, and now that the Hallmark refurbs are all sold, the prices are back in the $13,500 - $15,500 range, which is just stupid. A75 prices for refurbs are generally in the $16,000 - 17,500 range, which is better but too high for my Scottish heart to bear for last generation tech. The A22 needs too much light, in my opinion, and therefore requires strobes or at least bright, bright sun. ISO 160 seems to be the max for client usable files. In my experience shooting beauty, the P30 has clean files to 400, 800 in a pinch. I ended up getting a new P30+ (Thanks Lance at Capture Integration!) for what was a very good deal. While I've never shot the + back, I am told 1600 is usable if need be. I'll find out when the + arrives. I also find the Phase backs very reliable. The whole package just works and works and is simple, its usable in low light, and you can use a higher ISO to get better hand held shutter speeds in natural/ambient light.
In looking at your list I think the Phase hits all of your requirements. You may also look into a used H3D. I retouched a bunch of H3D files for a friend last week and wow, really nice files and clean at 400. The files out of Flex have a certain lightness to them, the colors seem delicate and very smooth, almost like a pastel. The lens correction in Flex is real. It really is nice. Used H3d-22 with the H3 and 80mm runs about $13,500 - $14,000. Lenses are expensive.
I also like Sinar backs and have used the 54m when it first came out. Fantastic quality. But Sinar's presence in the US is strange. The best resource Sinar-Bron has in the US is Thierry on this board. Thierry, a Swiss expat Sinar employee stationed in SE Asia is the best source of info for potential US buyers? Isn't Sinar USA in Jersey? Or I could deal with the Fotocare, which sucks.
Good luck with this process. Its worse than buying a house or car.
-
Anders,
I would get the P30. The P30 is a more flexible solution than the A22, if for no other reason than ISO. The Phase is OK at 800, and I've heard the plus is OK at 1600. The Aptus backs need light and lots of it to shine, although I've seen some A75 files at 400 that looked pretty good. And I do agree that the Aptus backs provide great results out of the box for people, but you can get the same results with Phase backs, you just have to have your presets in order in whatever raw converter you use.
Also remember that the Aptus is the same generation tech as the ZD, although it has a better pipeline. I'd get the newest tech you can find that fits your budget.
After all of my bitching about MFDB prices and my evangelizing for rentals, I pulled the trigger on a P30+. I usually rent Aptus backs for jobs, at least since LC11 came out. I really like the A22 and I think the A75 is the best back available, but they cost too much. The A22 is old tech, and now that the Hallmark refurbs are all sold, the prices are back in the $13,500 - $15,500 range, which is just stupid. A75 prices for refurbs are generally in the $16,000 - 17,500 range, which is better but too high for my Scottish heart to bear for last generation tech. The A22 needs too much light, in my opinion, and therefore requires strobes or at least bright, bright sun. ISO 160 seems to be the max for client usable files. In my experience shooting beauty, the P30 has clean files to 400, 800 in a pinch. I ended up getting a new P30+ (Thanks Lance at Capture Integration!) for what was a very good deal. While I've never shot the + back, I am told 1600 is usable if need be. I'll find out when the + arrives. I also find the Phase backs very reliable. The whole package just works and works and is simple, its usable in low light, and you can use a higher ISO to get better hand held shutter speeds in natural/ambient light.
In looking at your list I think the Phase hits all of your requirements. You may also look into a used H3D. I retouched a bunch of H3D files for a friend last week and wow, really nice files and clean at 400. The files out of Flex have a certain lightness to them, the colors seem delicate and very smooth, almost like a pastel. The lens correction in Flex is real. It really is nice. Used H3d-22 with the H3 and 80mm runs about $13,500 - $14,000. Lenses are expensive.
I also like Sinar backs and have used the 54m when it first came out. Fantastic quality. But Sinar's presence in the US is strange. The best resource Sinar-Bron has in the US is Thierry on this board. Thierry, a Swiss expat Sinar employee stationed in SE Asia is the best source of info for potential US buyers? Isn't Sinar USA in Jersey? Or I could deal with the Fotocare, which sucks.
Good luck with this process. Its worse than buying a house or car.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170176\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Hi TMARK
Indeed is tough choosing. Is not A65 same as A75, only smaller sensor size, thus newer technology and same performance as A75?
From your experience is thus P30 useable at one stop higher ISO than A65/A75?
Regards
Anders
-
9 year Phase user here. Never used a Leaf although I did look into one way back but it was a bizarre three capture system that was useless for my needs at the time. Just last year i sold the original Lightphase back I bought in 99 that saw horrendously heavy use in the studio and out with three different photographers using it. Never had ONE problem with that thing it worked as well the day i sold it as the first day in the studio the only time it was ever in for service was to have the filter added to the sensor as the originals were naked and the filter went over the lens.
Cant say anything bad about Leaf as I have no experience but for durability I cannot possibly see how anything could be better than Phase IMO. Only reason I sold it was the 6mp was now too small for any of my services and it had been sitting for months unused.
-
Just a small detail: my P25 can be triggered from my laptop while tethered and my friend's Leaf cannot. A high end dealer here in New York told me that "the most communication between a back and a camera is Phase/Mamiya," I have not independently confirmed that, but it may be a fact.
The Phase backs are also considered to be much better at long exposures than the Leaf backs, even Leaf dealers admit this much.
Color control seams to be more precisely done on Leaf.
Phase backs are extremely robust - they can be frozen on dry ice and be in working order -- all metal case. Everything is made to be energy efficient while maintaining the sensor cool to produce cleaner files. There is no fan bringing in the outside world in to the back casing.
Phase One C1 software used to be the leader but now Leaf is catching up...
I think that the partnership of Phase with Mamiya could be a factor to consider --as opposed to the new 6x6 system that Leaf is proposing--
There are many factors to consider but at the end the two are excellent working instruments and at the same time they lack something that the other has and vise versa.
The thing with this forum topics is that we all want to think that wen we spent all that money on a camera of a particular brand that was "the smartest thing in the world"... I think that to be smart is to get the system that can do best the project/assignment at hand...
-
I don't recall having trouble remotely triggering Leaf Valeo 11 and 22, and Aptus 75 on Hasselblad 555ELD and Mamiya RZ67 over the years.
-
On Leaf's robustness.
This past summer I was shooting an assignment for a winery in Central California, standing on top of a ladder and tried to raise my tripod up. I screwed up big time and the several pound geared head along with the Mamiya and Leaf A75 flies off and does a perfect one and half somersault and hit the rock and dirt strewn road. Height, maybe 7-8 feet from where it began it's flight back to earth. It lands directly upon the back which disengages itself from the camera and tumbles around in the dirt.
The back suffered a large dent on the edge and scratched to crap. One of the attachment lugs on the back is bent. I rocket blow off the sensor which is totally, and I mean totally covered in dust, force the back onto the camera and do a wide open auto focus and it's tack sharp. Back works perfectly still.
Also this fall I did an extended backpack into the mountains. It dipped into the low teens F (-9C) several nights and I took no particular extra care to protect the back from the cold. Besides the battery life, the back performed flawlessly.
-
Granted i am a dedicated leaf user, I once had to use a phase, and although I didn't have any glitches it seems there is too much in-built sharpening that you cannot turn off. This may be ok for some subjects, but I felt with my people shots, it just looked to "digital". I think this is the reason that everyone thinks the Leaf files look more natural and film like. I would much rather have the choice to add more sharpening then be in a situation where I cannot dial it down.
Just my own observation
-
Hi TMARK
Indeed is tough choosing. Is not A65 same as A75, only smaller sensor size, thus newer technology and same performance as A75?
From your experience is thus P30 useable at one stop higher ISO than A65/A75?
Regards
Anders
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170177\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Anders,
The P30 has very usable ISO 400. I just received my P30+ a few hours ago. ISO 800 is very usable, very film like grain structure. The speed increase over the P30 is noticable to me. Nice bonus
I LOVE the A75, but for some reason I found the A65 lacking. Nice color, but 200 looked bad. This was just my sample. I know some people love their A65.
As to the comments on C1 and sharpening, I think this is over played. People seem to be saying that Leaf is the only back for people, mainly because the color from the Leaf is superior and C1 doesn't let you leave your files neutral. I call BS on these claims. You can turn sharpening off in C1, but the default curves add contrast to the file. Just go linear and have a custom curve. Leaf defaults to excellent color, LC 11 does a really nice job with color for fashion and catalogue work. Great! You can set up C1 to do the same thing, but you have set the defaults. Use color editor to make a profile. Disable sharpening, choose a linear curve and make your own custom curves from there. You can also use Lightroom or Raw Developer or whatever converter floats your boat to get you where you want to be.
The difference among all the backs is really noise, exposure times, and workflow. There are other issues as well, but these are pretty minor.
-
Granted i am a dedicated leaf user, I once had to use a phase, and although I didn't have any glitches it seems there is too much in-built sharpening that you cannot turn off. This may be ok for some subjects, but I felt with my people shots, it just looked to "digital". I think this is the reason that everyone thinks the Leaf files look more natural and film like. I would much rather have the choice to add more sharpening then be in a situation where I cannot dial it down.
Just my own observation
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170329\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Again, not even remotely true. There is no in-camera sharpening on phase files. Maybe you left some default sharpening on in your RAW developer or something. If anything (like most digital cameras) they are slightly soft when opened but become tack sharp with minimal sharpening applied.
As for leaf being more film like is just utter nonsense, they are both digital capture devices and you can get whatever look you want with the right editing in post, it has nothing to do with the camera brand. What people seem to forget over and over again is that digital RAW files have no "look", it's all decided in your RAW program and further editing in PS. It's not like film which had certain chemical properties that created one look or another.
Enough with the myth-spreading already.
-
Thanks to clarify something which to I adhere 100%
Thierry
Enough with the myth-spreading already.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170401\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
-
A seeming trivial issue to throw in, but important; what about 10-15 sec start up time of Leaf vs. the sleeping mode of Phase? Any comments on them for actual shooting?
Also seems many recommend P30 vs. A65, yet A65 is supposedly a crop of identic sensor of A75, and seems A75 is highly regarded over P30??
Thus... much appreciate more info, on above and all else. Thanks!
Regards
Anders
-
What people seem to forget over and over again is that digital RAW files have no "look", it's all decided in your RAW program and further editing in PS.
I absolutely agree. FWIW if real world usage is any indication I can tell you this much with a pretty experienced and informed viewpoint. A large portion of the MAJOR commercial studios in NA use Phase. This is the environments where abuse really happens. Photographers who dont own their own gear but use it daily. No one will care for stuff they do not own as if it were their own and if they do its the exception not the rule. No I do not work for Phase I just think the quote above is true.
FWIW if anyone here wants a certain look? PM me and I'll connect you with a couple retouchers that can turn water into wine and have done so for campaigns you have likely seen and admired.
-
Thus... much appreciate more info, on above and all else. Thanks!
Regards
Anders
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170409\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Anders,
No offense, but you've been on this forum long enough and have heretofore displayed enough MFDB 'intelligence' to be able to make your own decision. It may be fun for you, but for the rest of us I assure you, this nonsense debate is a pain in the ass. Why don't you just buy whatever it is you think you want. We can't help you, buy what you are going to buy, you can't go wrong. and get off it already!
Thanks,
David
-
Anders,
No offense, but you've been on this forum long enough and have heretofore displayed enough MFDB 'intelligence' to be able to make your own decision. It may be fun for you, but for the rest of us I assure you, this nonsense debate is a pain in the ass. Why don't you just buy whatever it is you think you want. We can't help you, buy what you are going to buy, you can't go wrong. and get off it already!
Thanks,
David
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170424\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
David
No offense taken. This thread has yielded ALOT of good info for me, it is current still circulating in my brain
Much thanks to all.
Regards
Anders
-
Anders,
No offense, but you've been on this forum long enough and have heretofore displayed enough MFDB 'intelligence' to be able to make your own decision. It may be fun for you, but for the rest of us I assure you, this nonsense debate is a pain in the ass. Why don't you just buy whatever it is you think you want. We can't help you, buy what you are going to buy, you can't go wrong. and get off it already!
Thanks,
David
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170424\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
People here are more irritable these days - is it the weather ?
Maybe we need more participants from the summering southern hemisphere.
Edmund
-
People here are more irritable these days - is it the weather ?
Maybe we need more participants from the summering southern hemisphere.
Edmund
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170438\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Maybe some Hawaiian sunshine will help (this is how bad winters are here!).
Marc
[attachment=4941:attachment]
-
Maybe some Hawaiian sunshine will help (this is how bad winters are here!).
Marc
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170447\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Hey Marc, rainbows are ok but could you post a pic of the turquoise water/surf from your island (on this or another thread)? That would be appreciated by those of us enduring the dull gray of a cloudy and rainy Winter. As little as 10 years ago we used to have much colder temperatures with snow on the ground that would reflect more light in the air brightening our short days. Now as the planet gets warmer and with rain instead of snow, the light is more gray....and dull.
Sean
-
Hey Marc, rainbows are ok but could you post a pic of the turquoise water/surf from your island (on this or another thread)? That would be appreciated by those of us enduring the dull gray of a cloudy and rainy Winter. As little as 10 years ago we used to have much colder temperatures with snow on the ground that would reflect more light in the air brightening our short days. Now as the planet gets warmer and with rain instead of snow, the light is more gray....and dull.
Sean
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170475\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Sure
Hows this one?
Marc
[attachment=4943:attachment]
-
Hey Marc, rainbows are ok but could you post a pic of the turquoise water/surf from your island (on this or another thread)? That would be appreciated by those of us enduring the dull gray of a cloudy and rainy Winter. As little as 10 years ago we used to have much colder temperatures with snow on the ground that would reflect more light in the air brightening our short days. Now as the planet gets warmer and with rain instead of snow, the light is more gray....and dull.
Sean
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170475\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Or this one?
Marc
[attachment=4944:attachment]
-
Thanks Marc -- exactly what I needed !!
Sean
-
I was in Maui last month. same area at sunrise and an hour or so before sunset. [attachment=4945:attachment][attachment=4946:attachment][attachment=4946:attachm
ent]
Or this one?
Marc
[attachment=4944:attachment]
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170504\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
-
Its late here and I'm tired and I didn't realise that there are two Marks/marcs here -- so thanks to both of you.
Axel recently told me about getting up really early to capture the light at dawn and I can see from your photo that he's right.
-
Or this one?
Marc
[attachment=4944:attachment]
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170504\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Hehe.... thanks for your TORTURE photos guys, I am in office still 7 more work days . Then off 6-25 Feb to India & Sweden (incl one night in Bangkok), thus reason I desperate am trying settle on my back before.
Oh, in March I am off 3-4 weeks to lovely Boracay in Philippines... beautiful sunsets..., cheap, tropical beach, camera and some books, did I say cheap place?... just before my new relocation in Asia...
Sunshine, sunshine, sand, palms... water...
Ehh... Phase vs. Leaf?????
Anders
-
Hehe.... thanks for your TORTURE photos guys, I am in office still 7 more work days . Then off 6-25 Feb to India & Sweden (incl one night in Bangkok), thus reason I desperate am trying settle on my back before.
Oh, in March I am off 3-4 weeks to lovely Boracay in Philippines... beautiful sunsets..., cheap, tropical beach, camera and some books, did I say cheap place?... just before my new relocation in Asia...
Sunshine, sunshine, sand, palms... water...
Ehh... Phase vs. Leaf?????
Anders
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170518\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
There probably isn't a wrong decision?
Marc
-
There probably isn't a wrong decision?
Marc
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=170523\")
Marc,
I think you are right; either Phase, Leaf (lets not forget Sinar & Hassy) are seeming very good. It comes down to pros, cons and preferences. This thread certainly has been informative. For anyone else considering here are two older good threads;
[a href=\"http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=11866&st=0]http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....opic=11866&st=0[/url]
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....showtopic=20790 (http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=20790)
Now the images posted of warm landscapes... that reminds of actual photography
Kind thanks to all who have posted!!!
>>> RAW files of P30 and A65 much desired -> www.yousendit.com, attach link to private message. <<<
Sincere thanks + Please
Regards
Anders
-
Hey the weather is great here, not always good... I'm on crutches for the week after tearing my calf muscle at the beach last weekend.
People here are more irritable these days - is it the weather ?
Maybe we need more participants from the summering southern hemisphere.
Edmund
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170438\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
-
Enjoy your travels Anders!
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....showtopic=20309 (http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=20309)
David
-
Enjoy your travels Anders!
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....showtopic=20309 (http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=20309)
David
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=170608\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Dear all,
Much thanks for all replies here. I went for the Aptus 65 and a 28mm. It was tough choice because as amateur it is important for me to choose what hopefully will last very long. I do not like the switching of gear that digital has until now led me to. Coming from F100 over D200 and ZD indeed it was lots of money with a Leaf and the 28mm, but I simply wish enjoy photography and medium format has made me feel joy in advancement over my F100 slides. The Leaf gives more feedback on exposures than P30 and with large display, also they gave me a loaner which Phase One would not. A new A65 was 2000 usd more than a refurbished P30 and three years warranty.
Wednesday morning I am off on travels for near three weeks, and after that another few weeks in Philippines before my next contract starts. I plan to enjoy photography in this time, not because I have fancy gear but because it hopeful will be good tool to capture and review images (heck I bought a used AFD in anticipation of the AFDIII being affordable, so prestigous gear is not what counts to me!). It will be awesome to experience photographing poor people and being able to show them a display with a 6x7cm version of their photo right after capture. I am sure the smiles that alone will bring will be very rewarding. That alone will be a trophy for my photography!
Again very much thanks to all help above replies have given to me.
Regards
Anders
-
Good luck with your new gear, I'm sure it will serve you well.
cheers
-
Dear all,
It will be awesome to experience photographing poor people and being able to show them a display with a 6x7cm version of their photo right after capture. I am sure the smiles that alone will bring will be very rewarding. That alone will be a trophy for my photography!
Regards
Anders
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=172204\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
The "poor people" will be rolling in laughter when they see what the Leaf screen looks like in daylight and they ask how much you paid for the camera.
-
The "poor people" will be rolling in laughter when they see what the Leaf screen looks like in daylight and they ask how much you paid for the camera.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=172225\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
lol
-
The "poor people" will be rolling in laughter when they see what the Leaf screen looks like in daylight and they ask how much you paid for the camera.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=172225\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Hm... not sure what makes you think they are material? Also a used compact is far outside their reach of concept of cost.
Possibly the greatest reward in my photography was when I handed prints to a poor family in Philippines. They cannot afford such. I will never forget the joy I saw in their eyes of them seeing their children in print.
The screen? Hand over shades it.
-
Anders,
Let me know what you think of the ISO 200 and above noise levels.
Thanks!
-
Anders,
Let me know what you think of the ISO 200 and above noise levels.
Thanks!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=172812\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Back from Bangkok floating market this morning; based on quick look in Camera RAW, ISO 400 fully usable. It was what I had to use there. However, not clean, with fine noise. Due 28.6MP finer noise than a 22MP. Shadow details but if very dark of course more noise. For large prints, maybe not perfect, for smaller indeed very and complete fully usable, but depending on subject a littla also and DR of subjects.
Based on testing during demo at purchase, image quality of A65 appear identical to A75 but a few less pixels and more crop.
Regards
Anders
-
The "poor people" will be rolling in laughter when they see what the Leaf screen looks like in daylight and they ask how much you paid for the camera.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=172225\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Dear All,
Actually, per attached the poor people very much enjoyed the Leaf screen. That photo is from a tribal village at Araku in mountains about two hours drive from Visakhapatnam, India. I walked there with an Indian from Visakhapatnam who helped to translate with me speaking to people. The tribal people were very accepting to me photographing them and found great joy in seeing their image on the large screen right after I had taken a photo. Actually, many of them got excited of seeing themselves that way. It felt to point of touching my heart, not due to expensive gear but in seeing their smiles and excitement. Children in particular giggled in great excitement to see their photo. These people cannot afford to take photos themselves, nor afford pay to have someone to give them such precious memories. I took numerous photos there and also got the address to their village so I can send them prints now after (however normal print size so that I not come across at extravagant or make them request photos from each foreigner who visit their village). I am sure they will feel happiness when receive them.
Speaking to a local newpaper reporter after the visit to their village, I was told that about 6% of the tribal population die each year due to Malaria and unclean water. It puts life in a very scary perspective. Photos speak... even though poor people display wonderful characteristic faces and smiles, life is not always simple and fair. Nor is it simple to help. Donations make people dependent on donations or begging as a job. Same time... another side of the coin is perhaps that if we bring them to wealth then their tribal culture may be lost or mere on display in museums... also perhaps the kind and respecting values they showed me may turn to the gread and cheating I was met by in other parts of my travels in India (Delhi, Varanasi, Agra etc.).
Above said; now a gigantic step to our gear...
I took many more photos than the one I post. The Leaf Aptus 65 is exceeding my expectations. One thing that repeatedly struck me was that the images looked good on its screen, but when opening in CS3 they looked consistent more impressive. Also that even at default settings in CS3 the colors and other image parameters already appeared very pleasing. There seem to be not so many adjustments required until get pleasing colors and image parameters as I was used to from ZD and D200. I did not quite anticipate this. The A65 is also excellent at up to around 30 second night exposures during which it produces clean noise free files at ISO 50. As an amateur and traveler I find also ISO 800 very useful. It is of course not noise free, but clear exceeds the performance of ISO 800 of Nikon D200, not to mention ZDs high ISO. Perhaps it is on pair or better than ISO 165 on ZD, much also due to the more pixels. Due to 28.6MP the noise is very fine grained noise. It can be partly cleaned in PP making images slight softer. Such images when much smaller than 28.6MP are fully useful to me, while of course not of same quality as ISO50. ISO 50 is super clean.
Much thanks again to all posters above for good help on info and viewpoints on Phase One and Leaf. The feeling after three weeks travel with the A65 is that it feels like a rather excellent tool for my photography. The feeling of India? At times strong. Some scenes and experiences can be difficult to comprehend. It certainly puts life in perspective...
Thanks for above posts.
Regards
Anders