Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: zineevo on July 15, 2016, 05:22:16 am
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Hello everybody
I'm currently a PhaseOne XF IQ user and I'm pretty happy with the system, although I don't use / need all the features.
As a Portrait Photographer I use the camera very casually - no HDR, Focus-Stacking, LiveView, Auto-Exposre and so on...
Since my first encounter with Hasselblad H-System which was many years ago, I fell in love with the handling and the grip of the system.
Now I had the chance to test drive the new H6D and the Grip with it's ergonomics is fabulous. Also the weight difference is big - especially for my usage of the camera.
Because I'm thinking of upgrading to the 100MP Sensor on the PhaseOne-Side, I'm also considering the H6D-100c System.
Now my questions to this community:
Are there any PhaseOne-Users which switched to the Hasselblad-System or vice versa?
Are there things you miss about the P1 or the Hassy-System after the Switch?
How reliable is the Hassy-System compared to the P1?
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I don't believe any of the Hasselblad gear has shipped to the general population yet has it? Either camera or back.
I agree the ergonomics of the new camera look great.
Paul C
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That's right, Paul.
The 50c is being shipped here but the 100c is not available at the moment.
But I'm generally speaking about the Hasselblad H-System, of course the H6D is a complete new generation...
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Many folks have switched both directions, Hasselblad and Phase. I haven't seen as much since the XF came out, but it still happens.
The one thing that most Phase users miss is CaptureOne. Phocus is getting better, but it's behind what CaptureOne does (how much depends on the user). If you don't currently use the wireless tethering / CapturePilot, then you won't miss them.
Reliability numbers are hit and miss - some folks never have an issue, some folks are issues themselves. How do you currently handle a camera down situation, and would it change?
I would consider what lenses you have and use, and what would need to be swapped out. As much as you test driving the -50c model will give you workflow, color and retouch ability, I would recommend holding off a bit as the 100mp with the different visual crop and lens selection may play into your decision. I consider the 35-90mm my favorite H lens, and would want to see how shooting it works (mapped out area and all).
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Joe, that's a very good answer and some good points.
Phocus 3.x is bad, but fast compared to Capture One, but that probably depends on the user. For me it's not that big of a deal. I still can use C1 for my other camera systems.
In terms of C1 for my PhaseOne System - I only use it to tether and for the RAW-Processing. After the import of the files, I export those directly as TIFF to continue my work in Photoshop.
As I've heard from my H-Dealer, Hasselblad has 13 new developers who work exclusively on Phocus, which should it make better over time.
I handle all my Equipment very carefully and I'll continue to do so. But it should be weather-sealed and handle the outdoors.
For the lens selection, that's not a problem. I own an IQ380 with the same sensor size than the 100MP - I also compared the Hassy-Lenses with the H4D-60 which has the same sensor.
The 35mm, 50mm, 80mm, 120mm are the lenses I consider.
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I am not a pro, but I have used both systems (just up to H4D) for many years.
The Hasselblad feels lighter and nicer to hold and work with, I agree.
BUT, most of the lenses are inferior to the new Phase LS lenses. Some of them
have been upgraded like the 50 and 120, but most of them are weak compared to Phase one
Schneider lenses. At least the way my eyes see it.
I think the H6 seems like a big step in the right direction, but they realy need to come up
with some high quality lenses. I am sure many will disagree on this ;D
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As I've heard from my H-Dealer, Hasselblad has 13 new developers who work exclusively on Phocus, which should it make better over time.
This is a joke ... 13 ??!
If Hasselblad wants to be really strong in this market, they can not forget that the software is very important if not more important than the hardware itself.
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13 new developers over the ones already there sounds like a lot for a single piece of software.
Sure, it's not going to have the same amount of people Office or the Adobe suite may have, but Hasselblad is a much smaller company and that is a rather huge investment in human resources.
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13 new developers over the ones already there sounds like a lot for a single piece of software.
Sure, it's not going to have the same amount of people Office or the Adobe suite may have, but Hasselblad is a much smaller company and that is a rather huge investment in human resources.
Drats, you beat me to the reply. That said, I wonder how many total are in the development team. I was on a flight a few years ago with a microsoft engineer who worked on the internationalization team for Office. Coming from a small team of web developers, I was mind blown by the amount of people and teams it took to do a single piece of software. And, not ever having to worry about internationalization, how much was involved in that process alone.
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As I said - I've heard the number 13 from my Hassy-Dealer. I can't guarantee this number :)
But if it's true, that's awesome!
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Office is also one of the main source of income for Microsoft, so it's not surprising they are willing to spend as much as needed on it. But yeah, it is mind boggling. The biggest team I worked with was four people, we developed a small software for warehouse management with PocketPC, barcode scanner and RFID support for a few local companies, but I've since moved on. With enough people and the right plan you can achieve a lot in very little time, as we did it all in the span of seven months from scratch to finished product.
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As I said - I've heard the number 13 from my Hassy-Dealer. I can't guarantee this number :)
But if it's true, that's awesome!
You said 13 NEW. That new is a lovely marketing term to make it seem like they are expanding the team and throwing more resources at it than previously. But is it 13 completely new positions and the loss of 5 old ones? Of course, we are completely arguing theoretics and unless someone on the team or closely related to it pops in, we may never know.
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It was mentioned that the weight difference is big. I must be reading the specs wrong but on the websites Phase One has the XF100 with the 80mm lens at 2180 grams and Hasselblad has the weight of the H6D with the 80mm lens at 2130 grams. I have the XF100 and I have not handled so perhaps the Hasselblad is easier to handle. I must admit that the handling the XF100 has been OK. My biggest complaint is the total weight when hiking into an area - a 50 gram weight difference won't matter to me.
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I started in medium format with the Mamiya AF then AFD and was looking to get a digital back. I bought an ex rental H1 Hasselblad with a Phase One digital back and was hooked on Hasselblad. Everything was much better on the Hasselblad than the Mamiya AFD which became the Phase One camera, but still looks like a brick.
I then upgraded to an H2 with the Phase One back and was using Capture One to process. I found the image quality was good but did not like the separate batteries which the Phase One back just ate. Also if you want to use it on a view camera you have that wake up cable problem. I made my own cable and used a one shot system to overcome it. Capture One was OK but I didn't think it was good as Aperture which I already used. This was version 7 so it has no doubt improved.
I then had the opportunity to get an H3D-II 31 and found it to be a far better system with the integrated back. I have since upgraded to an H3DII-39. I sold all of the Phase / Mamiya gear and have never looked back. All in all it is a much better camera and system. I look longingly at an H5D or maybe X1D in the future. I also shoot Canon for anything that needs action or portability. The X1D will overcome the portability and give medium format in the backpack.
A lot seems to be made of Capture One vs Phocus. Most of it seems to be from people that don't understand that they perform different functions. Phocus is a raw converter and capture tool and that is it. It excels at these things, particularly if you do reproduction as the colour correction if required is built in. It does not do Digital Asset Management at all. That is something we all hope for but use other programmes for currently. The answer is that you simply export a TIFF or use Photoshop after FFF conversion. Photoshop doesn't do DAM either, but no one complains about that.
Capture One and Lightroom are jacks of all trades, but to me they are master of none.
I still use Aperture for DAM. It works reliably. I think it is better than Capture One and supports all of my Smart Albums. It also works on a server which Lightroom doesn't. Capture One works on a server but doesn't support Hasselblad, so it is not an option for me.
So if you are looking to get into Hasselblad you won't be disappointed and the Phocus thing is just something that people who don't use Hasselblad just say to make themselves feel better. (:-)
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13 dev's, but how many testers? Dev's shouldn't test their own code, and as much fun as public beta folks are, they aren't trained testers.
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BUT, most of the lenses are inferior to the new Phase LS lenses. Some of them
have been upgraded like the 50 and 120, but most of them are weak compared to Phase one
Schneider lenses. At least the way my eyes see it.
I am a bit surprised to read this. From what I have seen the Hassy 28mm and 100mm are also outstanding in absolute terms and, although I haven't seen direct comparisons, they didn't seem inferior to their Schneider counterparts?
The one Hassy lens that seems really below par is the 35mm that I used to own.
Cheers,
Bernard
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It was mentioned that the weight difference is big. I must be reading the specs wrong but on the websites Phase One has the XF100 with the 80mm lens at 2180 grams and Hasselblad has the weight of the H6D with the 80mm lens at 2130 grams. I have the XF100 and I have not handled so perhaps the Hasselblad is easier to handle. I must admit that the handling the XF100 has been OK. My biggest complaint is the total weight when hiking into an area - a 50 gram weight difference won't matter to me.
About the weight difference - we tested it on our own.
I compared my PhaseOne XF IQ380 + Prism with an SK 80mm LS (Blue ring) against the H6D-50c + Prism with 80mm f/2.8 and the weight difference was almost 700g. That's huge - also the balance is much better on the Hassy.
Hasselblad said 2130g complete with Prism, Body, Back, Battery, Card and lens. On the PhaseOne site it says: XF with Prism 1390g + IQ100 695g + SK 80mm 500g => 2585g without batteries or card.
For me who shoots 95% handheld and this on long commercial-shoots, it's very important. I had no Problem shooting one hour straight with the H6D, but when picking up the Phase, after a few minutes I want to let go if it, because of the weight.
And no, I'm not weak guy ;)
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I started in medium format with the Mamiya AF then AFD and was looking to get a digital back. I bought an ex rental H1 Hasselblad with a Phase One digital back and was hooked on Hasselblad. Everything was much better on the Hasselblad than the Mamiya AFD which became the Phase One camera, but still looks like a brick.
I then upgraded to an H2 with the Phase One back and was using Capture One to process. I found the image quality was good but did not like the separate batteries which the Phase One back just ate. Also if you want to use it on a view camera you have that wake up cable problem. I made my own cable and used a one shot system to overcome it. Capture One was OK but I didn't think it was good as Aperture which I already used. This was version 7 so it has no doubt improved.
I then had the opportunity to get an H3D-II 31 and found it to be a far better system with the integrated back. I have since upgraded to an H3DII-39. I sold all of the Phase / Mamiya gear and have never looked back. All in all it is a much better camera and system. I look longingly at an H5D or maybe X1D in the future. I also shoot Canon for anything that needs action or portability. The X1D will overcome the portability and give medium format in the backpack.
A lot seems to be made of Capture One vs Phocus. Most of it seems to be from people that don't understand that they perform different functions. Phocus is a raw converter and capture tool and that is it. It excels at these things, particularly if you do reproduction as the colour correction if required is built in. It does not do Digital Asset Management at all. That is something we all hope for but use other programmes for currently. The answer is that you simply export a TIFF or use Photoshop after FFF conversion. Photoshop doesn't do DAM either, but no one complains about that.
Capture One and Lightroom are jacks of all trades, but to me they are master of none.
I still use Aperture for DAM. It works reliably. I think it is better than Capture One and supports all of my Smart Albums. It also works on a server which Lightroom doesn't. Capture One works on a server but doesn't support Hasselblad, so it is not an option for me.
So if you are looking to get into Hasselblad you won't be disappointed and the Phocus thing is just something that people who don't use Hasselblad just say to make themselves feel better. (:-)
These are some good insights. Thank you for that.
About the battery issue. The new XF still uses two batteries, but are the same. Sadly I couldn't test the new H6D batteries which have more power - I was testing the H5D's Battery. And I have to say, that the PhaseOne XF does a better job here.
An important point is that the new H6D-Batteries cost almost 400.00 in my country. And I need at least 5 spare batteries. That are some costs, compared to 80.00 per P1-Battery.
As I've said, the Phocus Software does it's job very good for rendering the files and export as TIFF.
I wouldn't "develop" the files in Phocus or do anything bigger to it. That's mainly because I work in Photoshop almost all of the time, and second, I'm used to the results in Capture One. But over time, this can change :)
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An important point is that the new H6D-Batteries cost almost 400.00 in my country. And I need at least 5 spare batteries.
Ouch - you may want to look into a DC-DC adapter using the power plug on the back, if that works for you. Even as a belt pack, just not having to think about the power would be nice, and to get in at a discount would be great.
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Ouch - you may want to look into a DC-DC adapter using the power plug on the back, if that works for you. Even as a belt pack, just not having to think about the power would be nice, and to get in at a discount would be great.
Inside the Studio this is a possible option. But if I'm tethering and use the DC-Power at the same time, working with two cables from two destinations is not ideal.
That's also a plus point to the Phase-System. I can tether and the battery can be charged while shooting to the laptop.
If the battery prices for the Hasselblad were less, that's not a big deal then.
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I'm a Hasselblad user.
Software
Phocus vS C1 as Bob said chalk and cheese. Phocus just exists get your images from RAW to whatever and it does that very well. They are adding features (I know, I'm a beta) but it will never be as featured as the excellent C1.
Lenses.
Hasselblad lenses are excellent (bar the 35mm which is not so great) and they benefit from digital corrections based on the shooting conditions, aperture, focus distance etc. C1 does not have this level of precision at least not with HC and HCD lenses. Probably not your thing but the HTS corrections are amazing.
Camera/back
I haven't used an XF so can't comment there. I really like my H series and True Focus. Hasselblad were behind the IQ series until the H6D with which I think they have caught up, but again I'm not familiar with the IQ series.
The X1D is awesome, just saying:)
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I'm a Hasselblad user.
Software
Phocus vS C1 as Bob said chalk and cheese. Phocus just exists get your images from RAW to whatever and it does that very well. They are adding features (I know, I'm a beta) but it will never be as featured as the excellent C1.
Lenses.
Hasselblad lenses are excellent (bar the 35mm which is not so great) and they benefit from digital corrections based on the shooting conditions, aperture, focus distance etc. C1 does not have this level of precision at least not with HC and HCD lenses. Probably not your thing but the HTS corrections are amazing.
Camera/back
I haven't used an XF so can't comment there. I really like my H series and True Focus. Hasselblad were behind the IQ series until the H6D with which I think they have caught up, but again I'm not familiar with the IQ series.
The X1D is awesome, just saying:)
The IQ-Series were better than the H4D, H5D in my opinion. But now they really stepped up to the game.
What I experienced is that the Menu and the layout of the back is easier to navigate than on the PhaseOne. But you feel that the H6D is not as mature as the IQ in terms of option.
But Hasselblad is putting out Firmware-Updates very fast and it starts to get better and better.
One point that scares me a little when I think to switch to Hasselblad is the Upgrade-Options in terms of Software:
The PhaseOne XF Body and Back getting great Software and Feature Updates through the Firmware and they improve over time.
I don't know how the H6D is capable in terms of that... Does anybody know more?
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The IQ-Series were better than the H4D, H5D in my opinion. But now they really stepped up to the game.
What I experienced is that the Menu and the layout of the back is easier to navigate than on the PhaseOne. But you feel that the H6D is not as mature as the IQ in terms of option.
But Hasselblad is putting out Firmware-Updates very fast and it starts to get better and better.
One point that scares me a little when I think to switch to Hasselblad is the Upgrade-Options in terms of Software:
The PhaseOne XF Body and Back getting great Software and Feature Updates through the Firmware and they improve over time.
I don't know how the H6D is capable in terms of that... Does anybody know more?
I am kind of betting on the fact that P1 will continue to do updates to their XF which really seems to be a platform on which they wish to expand upon. Looking at the history of Hasselblad, it seems they release a camera and then don't do much to it. If you look at the update between H4 and H5, I'm certain they could have updated the H4 with firmware to update it to True Focus II which takes into account the curvature of each lens. But they didn't do it. So I wouldn't hold my breath that Hasselblad will release major updates to a current lineup, they will most likely save it to the next version instead.
But I could be wrong of course :)
The XF has an extreme amount of potential, but it is up to how good their developers are and what they can do that won't infringe on others patents. And whether they decide to release a new housing later on and ditch the XF.
This was a factor for me choosing P1 instead of the H6 / X1D, the other factor is that Phocus is a rubbish software in its current version, imho.
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I am kind of betting on the fact that P1 will continue to do updates to their XF which really seems to be a platform on which they wish to expand upon. Looking at the history of Hasselblad, it seems they release a camera and then don't do much to it. If you look at the update between H4 and H5, I'm certain they could have updated the H4 with firmware to update it to True Focus II which takes into account the curvature of each lens. But they didn't do it. So I wouldn't hold my breath that Hasselblad will release major updates to a current lineup, they will most likely save it to the next version instead.
But I could be wrong of course :)
The XF has an extreme amount of potential, but it is up to how good their developers are and what they can do that won't infringe on others patents. And whether they decide to release a new housing later on and ditch the XF.
This was a factor for me choosing P1 instead of the H6 / X1D, the other factor is that Phocus is a rubbish software in its current version, imho.
That is an important point. I don't really know about the past H-Models and their Updates.
The only thing I saw is, that with the H6D, they're putting out a lot of Updates. I also think, that this will continue because of the new electronic platform - as my dealer said, they have now a better base to produce Updates.
But time will tell :)
As I said - Phocus doesn't really bother me.
But the preview of the image on the back is much more accurate on the Phase than on the H6D... I also don't know if this can be fixed or improved with a Firmware-Update.
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That is an important point. I don't really know about the past H-Models and their Updates.
The only thing I saw is, that with the H6D, they're putting out a lot of Updates. I also think, that this will continue because of the new electronic platform - as my dealer said, they have now a better base to produce Updates.
But time will tell :)
As I said - Phocus doesn't really bother me.
But the preview of the image on the back is much more accurate on the Phase than on the H6D... I also don't know if this can be fixed or improved with a Firmware-Update.
Well it remains to be seen, I'm only looking at their track record. The new electronics platform they refer to is basically a refresh of all internal components to make sure that you get an intuitive fast interface and speed to be able to shoot fast even with 100MP, not extra features. Hasselblad certainly doesn't tout the H6D as a platform they wish to expand upon with new features, and it's not as if the H6D has received a 6-axis gyro with all the features that could entail like the XF has.
The feature with Phocus that bugs me the most is the highlight recovery which is useless. It adds an unnecessary amount of work for a feature that really should be spot on in a RAW-software.
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Inside the Studio this is a possible option. But if I'm tethering and use the DC-Power at the same time, working with two cables from two destinations is not ideal.
That's also a plus point to the Phase-System. I can tether and the battery can be charged while shooting to the laptop.
If the battery prices for the Hasselblad were less, that's not a big deal then.
As far as I've heard, Hasselblad is working on powering the back through the USB cable, and hopefully it will charge the battery too. Currently I have to use the DC grip with my H6 and dislike the two cables going from the camera, it's very restrictive and messy. I only own two batteries because my H5 battery would last days if not weeks if I shot tethered. I'm not willing to buy more batteries when a firmware update has been promised to provide power over USB. So hopefully this point will be equal between the two systems.
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From a feature perspective, there is not much one can gain from switching from one system to another (In either direction); at least nothing that will offset the costs that you will incur from selling one and gettign another. You will win some and lose some on either end, but nothing that you won't be able to live without.
I am a Phamiya user and thus, completely dependent on C1P, but there are plenty of Hassy users who are perfectly happy with Phocus+PS. Similarly, Hassy users love Tru focus, but there are plenty of P1 users who do portraiture without it. etc.
What WILL make a big difference is the ergonomics that you mentioned. This is extremely subjective and one can't put a price on it. If you feel that the ergos of the H system will make a big difference in how you work, then go ahead and make that swap.
This was one of the biggest reasons I chose to go with Nikon over Canon back when I started digital photography. I just could not get used to the Canon ergos and I felt that the Nikon ergos will let me forget about the camera and focus on the work.
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From a feature perspective, there is not much one can gain from switching from one system to another (In either direction); at least nothing that will offset the costs that you will incur from selling one and gettign another. You will win some and lose some on either end, but nothing that you won't be able to live without.
I am a Phamiya user and thus, completely dependent on C1P, but there are plenty of Hassy users who are perfectly happy with Phocus+PS. Similarly, Hassy users love Tru focus, but there are plenty of P1 users who do portraiture without it. etc.
What WILL make a big difference is the ergonomics that you mentioned. This is extremely subjective and one can't put a price on it. If you feel that the ergos of the H system will make a big difference in how you work, then go ahead and make that swap.
This was one of the biggest reasons I chose to go with Nikon over Canon back when I started digital photography. I just could not get used to the Canon ergos and I felt that the Nikon ergos will let me forget about the camera and focus on the work.
For the last few days I've compared both systems, made some pro and contra sheets in Excel.
Sometimes it's more a personal decision than a logical as you said. I'll miss the better preview on the back, but if the ergonomics and the grip is better it makes sense to switch. Because I work a lot with the camera and if I can focus more on the shoot than on the camera, that's a huge plus :)
But it's a great discussion in this thread and some good insights into the H-System.
Switching from a Brand on the "same level" is much more complicated than upgrading. There's always the fear of regretting :)
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Well it remains to be seen, I'm only looking at their track record. The new electronics platform they refer to is basically a refresh of all internal components to make sure that you get an intuitive fast interface and speed to be able to shoot fast even with 100MP, not extra features. Hasselblad certainly doesn't tout the H6D as a platform they wish to expand upon with new features, and it's not as if the H6D has received a 6-axis gyro with all the features that could entail like the XF has.
The feature with Phocus that bugs me the most is the highlight recovery which is useless. It adds an unnecessary amount of work for a feature that really should be spot on in a RAW-software.
I think the H6D already has a Gyro, in fact the H4 has one, that is how TrueFocus works. I spent 2 weeks struggling with the drift on my Lego toy Gyro, and now have great respect for Hasselblad engineers.
There may be some truth to the idea that with the XF all users benefit from the latest body updates. On the other hand Contax and Leica afficionados will say that sometimes good enough is good enough.
It is nice to see Phase and Hassy now both have products which their users really appreciate. There is now some honest enthusiasm in this forum from actual owners.
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I think the H6D already has a Gyro, in fact the H4 has one, that is how TrueFocus works. I spent 2 weeks struggling with the drift on my Lego toy Gyro, and now have great respect for Hasselblad engineers.
There may be some truth to the idea that with the XF all users benefit from the latest body updates. On the other hand Contax and Leica afficionados will say that sometimes good enough is good enough.
It is nice to see Phase and Hassy now both have products which their users really appreciate. There is now some honest enthusiasm in this forum from actual owners.
The gyro is limited to detecting 2d movement (or at least I've read so on the internet, thus it must be true? ;) ) so it's not a 6-axis gyro which opens up a whole lot more possibilities. My hope is that P1 soon release support for image stabilization for instance. They already save the gyro information in the raw file. My hope is that they release a true focus on steroids as well which takes into account all kinds of movements even laterally.
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The glaring omission from medium format is one fast lens, something like the Contax 80mm f2.0.
The Hasselblad 110 2.2 is ok-ish but it's not grabbing me. The Zeiss 110mm Planar is incredible but old and you have to adapt and stop down. The contax 80 f2 would be amazing but that is a done deal except for on a Leica S and who knows if that will even kick on, but 37MP is not something I will buy in medium format.
Why won't Phase or Hasselblad give us something? 80mm f2 or even 1.8? This for me would make this decision, Phase or Hasselblad, an easy one. Phase One even have the Mamiya f1.9 design to build from.
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The gyro is limited to detecting 2d movement (or at least I've read so on the internet, thus it must be true? ;) ) so it's not a 6-axis gyro which opens up a whole lot more possibilities. My hope is that P1 soon release support for image stabilization for instance. They already save the gyro information in the raw file. My hope is that they release a true focus on steroids as well which takes into account all kinds of movements even laterally.
You need 2 axes data for the type of focus correction which Hassy pioneered, I think the names would be yaw and pitch. Roll doesn't imply a focus correction. The other"axes" are actually AFAIK inertial shake measurements and not rotation numbers; I have no idea what Hassy are using as a chip but I assume nowadays 6 "D" is standard and one just throws data away. All the Sony and Olympus cameras run such chips for IBIS.
I am sure any system you hope for from Phase is superior in your imagination to whatever Hassy has released 10 years ago; personally I think their seismometer is quite nifty and the best they can probably do without infringing someone's IP. Another application would be handheld stitching and panos.
Edmund
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One would think that if your competitor has a slight advantage of software features you would hire a team of engineers to make your products if not similar close as far as features go....H has hire on some of those people. Crippling any features that were present with the H5D and now not present on the H6D is not a way I personally would proceed with a new platform!
However changing the body is a much more complicated and costly adventure especially now (today's money) the change would need to include a strong growth forecast for sales to recover tooling and R&D costs which would take a lot of money from new customers, I'm not sure the market is now that big to justify that venture.
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What's crippled on the H6 that was on the H5? (not yet used an H6, waiting to see if an H6x model comes out)
One would think that if your competitor has a slight advantage of software features you would hire a team of engineers to make your products if not similar close as far as features go....H has hire on some of those people. Crippling any features that were present with the H5D and now not present on the H6D is not a way I personally would proceed with a new platform!
However changing the body is a much more complicated and costly adventure especially now (today's money) the change would need to include a strong growth forecast for sales to recover tooling and R&D costs which would take a lot of money from new customers, I'm not sure the market is now that big to justify that venture.
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Sometimes it's more a personal decision than a logical as you said.
Actually, it's more and more a personal decision. As has been said on this forum and many others, what works best for you may not work for someone else. Knowing and discerning the differences is really important as there are trade-offs, but in the end, you have to be happy with your decision, and more importantly use the tools to create something. As we all have different hands, how a camera fits in yours matters.
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You need 2 axes data for the type of focus correction which Hassy pioneered, I think the names would be yaw and pitch. Roll doesn't imply a focus correction. The other"axes" are actually AFAIK inertial shake measurements and not rotation numbers; I have no idea what Hassy are using as a chip but I assume nowadays 6 "D" is standard and one just throws data away. All the Sony and Olympus cameras run such chips for IBIS.
I am sure any system you hope for from Phase is superior in your imagination to whatever Hassy has released 10 years ago; personally I think their seismometer is quite nifty and the best they can probably do without infringing someone's IP. Another application would be handheld stitching and panos.
Edmund
Roll was certainly not what I meant when i said "lateral", but imho I disagree as to lateral movement. To get the third dimension would be awesome and would eliminate user errors in many situations. I would think if Hassy had updated their gyros to include 6-axis they would mention it.
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Roll was certainly not what I meant when i said "lateral", but imho I disagree as to lateral movement. To get the third dimension would be awesome and would eliminate user errors in many situations. I would think if Hassy had updated their gyros to include 6-axis they would mention it.
You are right, precise z axis integration would help for precise focus eg. with the 100 f2.2.
Edmund
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Why won't Phase or Hasselblad give us something 80mm f2 or even 1.8?
The central shutter in H lenses makes the design of fast lenses tricky.
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That's why I love my Phase 150/2,8 and never warmed up to the leaf shutter version
Christopher Hauser
[email protected]
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The central shutter in H lenses makes the design of fast lenses tricky.
Yup, which is why I'm not holding my breath for anything to speak of with the X1D. I think an 80mm f2 or 1.8 would be a massive point of leverage for Phase One at this point.
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Actually, it's more and more a personal decision. As has been said on this forum and many others, what works best for you may not work for someone else. Knowing and discerning the differences is really important as there are trade-offs, but in the end, you have to be happy with your decision, and more importantly use the tools to create something. As we all have different hands, how a camera fits in yours matters.
Yes! The "tool" needs to help my work and be more efficient.
There are trade-offs and there are some improvements. Sometimes it's not that easy to decide when reading through a forum like LuLa and see all the different opinions about the systems.
At the moment I'm favoring the H6D-100c, for the ergonomics, weight, ease of use, 4K-Video, TrueFocus and also the pricing of their bodies and lenses.
So my PhaseOne XF IQ380 and the lenses maybe for sale in a few days ;)
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An important point is that the new H6D-Batteries cost almost 400.00 in my country. And I need at least 5 spare batteries. That are some costs, compared to 80.00 per P1-Battery.
Ouch. I just checked and in Australia they $596. I have 4 of batteries for my H3D and none are new, but have chargers in the studio and car. They don't take long to charge and I have the dry cell back up.
I haven't seen the H6D battery but no doubt the price will fall. Are they compatible with H5D batteries?
When I had a Phase back they used Canon batteries but didn't last long.
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Ouch. I just checked and in Australia they $596. I have 4 of batteries for my H3D and none are new, but have chargers in the studio and car. They don't take long to charge and I have the dry cell back up.
I haven't seen the H6D battery but no doubt the price will fall. Are they compatible with H5D batteries?
When I had a Phase back they used Canon batteries but didn't last long.
The H6D can be used with the H5D-Batteries but I don't know if the H6D-Batteries can be used with older bodies.
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At the moment I'm favoring the H6D-100c, for the ergonomics, weight, ease of use, 4K-Video, TrueFocus and also the pricing of their bodies and lenses.
So my PhaseOne XF IQ380 and the lenses maybe for sale in a few days ;)
I'm curious as to what some of the video centric or dual purpose guys like Bcooter as to the 4k files, as I can't grade footage quality. It'll do in a pinch, but I'll be happy to see what they come up with.
-Joe
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I'm curious as to what some of the video centric or dual purpose guys like Bcooter as to the 4k files, as I can't grade footage quality. It'll do in a pinch, but I'll be happy to see what they come up with.
-Joe
The 4K-Video isn't a big deal for me. But having that in a camera is a plus.
I can shortly record a small video and have something to show. I wouldn't rely on the Hassy for a real Video shoot - we work with rented REDs, but it's a nice addition. Be it only for BTS footage :)
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Just one small request, zineevo.
As one of the very few here who would have an opportunity to have both bodies at his disposal, could you please do some sort of a comparison shoot? Perhaps you could select a static scene, shoot it with your phase kit, then reshoot it when you get your blad kit?
Thanks in advance!
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Just one small request, zineevo.
As one of the very few here who would have an opportunity to have both bodies at his disposal, could you please do some sort of a comparison shoot? Perhaps you could select a static scene, shoot it with your phase kit, then reshoot it when you get your blad kit?
Thanks in advance!
I had a comparison shoot with the IQ380 vs. H6D-50c - it's not the perfect comparison because of the sensor size and the megapixel difference.
When my Phase One Equipment finds a new home, I'll get the H6D-50c with the TradeUp to the 100c as soon as the system starts shipping, so I will not have the option to compare it 1:1.
But if you have any questions about the two system head-by-head - just ask ;)
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But if you have any questions about the two system head-by-head - just ask ;)
I wonder how does the AF compare for portraiture, not necessarily in speed but in accuracy especially at f/4 and below.
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I wonder how does the AF compare for portraiture, not necessarily in speed but in accuracy especially at f/4 and below.
The AF on the H6D seems to hunt a little more but is faster than the XF. The accuracy on f/4 and below - tested on f/2.8 - is remarkable.
I've never had any issues, TrueFocus is a great feature, as long as you know how to use it :)