Luminous Landscape Forum

Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Colour Management => Topic started by: NickXavi on January 11, 2016, 02:39:29 pm

Title: Some Hahnemuhle papers Dmax with Epson P800
Post by: NickXavi on January 11, 2016, 02:39:29 pm
In reviewing with Gamutvision the printer profiles I've generated with i1Pro 2 with i1Profiler, for the Epson P800 and some Hahnemuhle papers, I have obtained these Dmax values:

* German Etching: 1,72
* Photo Rag 308: 1,67
* William Turner: 1,74

* Fine Art Baryta: 2,52
* Fine Art Baryta Satin: 2,58
* Photo Rag Baryta: 2,45
* Harman Gloss Baryta (made by Hahnemühle): 2,4

* Daguerre Canvas: 1,5 (not varnished)
* Monet Canvas: 1,47 (not varnished)
* Leonardo Canvas: 2,26

It seems as right Dmax.



Title: Re: Some Hahnemuhle papers Dmax with Epson P800
Post by: nihil on January 12, 2016, 09:52:20 am
Here is an 11880 vs. P800 comparison I posted earlier:

DMAXP800 ICC    11880 ICC    Difference      P800 ABW    11880 ABW    Difference   
Permajet Oyster2,632,210,422,812,530,28
Ilford Smooth Pearl2,652,190,462,822,580,24
Hahnemühle Photo Rag Baryta   2,642,220,422,762,570,19
Permajet Fibre Base Royal2,612,180,432,772,540,23
Permajet Photo Art Pearl2,431,980,452,582,280,30
Epson Archival Matte1,721,680,041,731,710,02
Permajet Portrait Classic1,691,600,091,691,610,08

Profiles created with i1pro 2 in i1Profiler, and measured with BabelColor. Permajet Portrait Classic is a rebranded Hahnemühle Photo Rag, and Permajet Photo Art Pearl is a rebranded Hahnemühle Fine Art Pearl.
Title: Re: Some Hahnemuhle papers Dmax with Epson P800
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on January 13, 2016, 06:11:05 am
Quote from: NickXavi on January 11, 2016, 02:39:29 pm
In reviewing with Gamutvision the printer profiles I've generated with i1Pro 2 for the Epson P800 and some Hahnemuhle papers, I have obtained these Dmax values:

* German Etching: 1,72
* Photo Rag 308: 1,58
* William Turner: 1,74

* Fine Art Baryta: 2,52
* Fine Art Baryta Satin: 2,58
* Photo Rag Baryta: 2,45
* Harman Gloss Baryta (made by Hahnemühle): 2,4

* Daguerre Canvas: 1,5
* Monet Canvas: 1,47
* Leonardo Canvas: 2,26

It seems as right Dmax.

The Photorag should have a higher Dmax. Coating does not differ much compared to the German Etching and I doubt more texture helps the GE in getting a better Dmax (at least not in measuring the Dmax). Print the Photorag with the German Etching profile and measure again is my advice. And check whether different media preset choices were used for both papers.

I create profiles for canvas after the target print is varnished to the same quality the canvas is used in products. I guess your Dmax is from unvarnished targets. the Daquerre and Monet.

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
December 2014 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots
Title: Re: Some Hahnemuhle papers Dmax with Epson P800
Post by: NickXavi on January 13, 2016, 08:23:45 am
Nihil: Your comparison data are very interesting for me, both ABW (I note) as with the 11880. The relative small differences in results, I think is probably originate on the calculation modules used in ours respective applications.

Ernst: you are right with Photo Rag, I made a typo, the right Dmax is 1.67. I've corrected the post.

The small difference with the German Etching Dmax is perhaps because on the Photo Rag I used a target of 1105 patches and on German Etching 2033.

The Dmax of Monet and Daguerre Canvas was measured on unvarnished print.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Some Hahnemuhle papers Dmax with Epson P800
Post by: GrahamBy on January 13, 2016, 09:38:59 am
So there is more than 3 stops difference in the tonal range between Ilford smooth pearl and Epson archival matte.

Naive question from someone who doesn't use matte papers: assuming paper-white reflectance is not that different, does a gloss paper need to be lit with 3EV brighter lighting in order to see the shadow detail?

The numbers suggest to me that if you could see right down into the shadows on the matte paper lit with, say, 20 lux, then you'd need about 200 lux to see into the much deeper shadows on the gloss/smooth paper...

(Edit: wrote Cd, meant lux, doh)