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Author Topic: help choose a setup for night street photography  (Read 1726 times)

bwana

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help choose a setup for night street photography
« on: April 19, 2015, 05:42:04 pm »

I am debating between a sony a7ii or a d810. I think the main benefit if large sensor (which I do want to try) is low light (the flip side which does not interest me is high speed). I would also need to rent the adapter- metabones probably. The sensor shift of the sony vs the high dynamic range of the d810 are the two unique qualities which when combined with a fast sharp lens would allow unique captures in low light settings. I  wonder what experiences people have in this regard. Are the a7ii files good? I heard they have a non-standard compression scheme but do not know how that translates into noise. Of course the sony should be capable of the same dynamic range as the Nikon since the sensor is the same(?). But I have not tried either.

I would be using a fast wide angle prime - 24 to 35 mm nikon , sigma or zeiss. Obviously, the sony would require an adapter and I get the metabones.

Of course the ability to focus in low light is key. If the sony sux in this regard then sensor stabilization is useless since wide open fast glass requires critical focus. Again any info u have would be appreciated.

Stefan
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dwswager

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2015, 10:13:09 am »

I am debating between a sony a7ii or a d810. I think the main benefit if large sensor (which I do want to try) is low light (the flip side which does not interest me is high speed). I would also need to rent the adapter- metabones probably. The sensor shift of the sony vs the high dynamic range of the d810 are the two unique qualities which when combined with a fast sharp lens would allow unique captures in low light settings. I  wonder what experiences people have in this regard. Are the a7ii files good? I heard they have a non-standard compression scheme but do not know how that translates into noise. Of course the sony should be capable of the same dynamic range as the Nikon since the sensor is the same(?). But I have not tried either.

I would be using a fast wide angle prime - 24 to 35 mm nikon , sigma or zeiss. Obviously, the sony would require an adapter and I get the metabones.

Of course the ability to focus in low light is key. If the sony sux in this regard then sensor stabilization is useless since wide open fast glass requires critical focus. Again any info u have would be appreciated.

Stefan

It sounds like candid shots of people versus cityscapes.  The particular qualities of the lens is going to be paramount in the setup beyond the camera body in my opinion. 

I can't speak to the Sony, but I have the D810.  It is a great camera for low light though a the D750 and D610 with lower pixel densities (larger sensor sites) are also viable options.  I wouldn't drive the D810 over about ISO 6400.  Don't be afraid to use negative exposure compensation to keep the shutter speed up and ISO down.  You can pull clean detail from the shadows on the Sony sensors so underexposure is not a big detriment to the image.  I've shot the D810 for night sports with up to 3 stops of under exposure and still haven't clipped the shadows in the raw files.  Depending on the scene, the highlight weighted metering of the D810 could be handy.  It exposes to keep the highlights from clipping so if you have street lights or other bright areas in the scene it can help while still being able to bring up the shadows.
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bwana

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2015, 10:35:04 am »

mostly handheld street at night. of course the d4 and the a7s come to mind. with lower pixel density and higher sensitivity, these cameras would be the natural first thoughts. and of course the lower pixel density would hide the lens/motion defects compared to the 36 megapixel hypercriticality that worries me.

but again, i am not capturing night sporting events- I am tending towards the 810 as the versatility without the need for an adapter and faster focus seem to be a big plus. i currently use an em1 and keep the iso below 1600. 6400 is two extra stops that compensates for the in camera stab that the em1 has. i will prob pair the 810 with the nikon 24 1.4 or the samsung 35 1.4. also at night, the bulkiness of the setup is not noticed as much. like when i use the fuji x100 during the day - i feel the camera is invisible.

but i am looking for that medium format 'fluditiy and 3Dness' in the images that i would want to print - i remember what my old mamiya 645 used to put out. the film was slow but wow, what presence and lifelike feeling those images had.
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JeanMichel

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2015, 10:50:40 am »

I am sure that either of your choices would work fine. Both appear to have great technical specifications, and greater specs that the camera used by Mark Tomalty (a Leica), see what he manages to do:  http://www.camtecphoto.com/en/gallery/Mark-Tomalty-Montreal-Winter-Nights 
Jean-Michel
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MatthewCromer

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2015, 12:21:51 pm »

Sony A7S instead of A7II.
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dwswager

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2015, 12:50:27 pm »

mostly handheld street at night. of course the d4 and the a7s come to mind. with lower pixel density and higher sensitivity, these cameras would be the natural first thoughts. and of course the lower pixel density would hide the lens/motion defects compared to the 36 megapixel hypercriticality that worries me.

but again, i am not capturing night sporting events- I am tending towards the 810 as the versatility without the need for an adapter and faster focus seem to be a big plus. i currently use an em1 and keep the iso below 1600. 6400 is two extra stops that compensates for the in camera stab that the em1 has. i will prob pair the 810 with the nikon 24 1.4 or the samsung 35 1.4. also at night, the bulkiness of the setup is not noticed as much. like when i use the fuji x100 during the day - i feel the camera is invisible.

but i am looking for that medium format 'fluditiy and 3Dness' in the images that i would want to print - i remember what my old mamiya 645 used to put out. the film was slow but wow, what presence and lifelike feeling those images had.

If you are using AF, then yes, I concur that the D810 makes more sense.  IMHO, in addition to being at the top of the Landscape DSLR list, it is also at the top of the general purpose camera list. And as to size and weight, I just don't find it that big and heavy.  Hell, my 24-70mm f/2.8 weighs more than the camera body!

The image below (Getty Images) shows a shot that I might have taken in highlight weighted metering with the D810 (I concede that this may have been an immediacy issue and the photo pulled as JPG from the camera without any post processing, I just don't know as all the data scrubbed from the image).  Doing so would have preserved most of the sparks created when the car bottoms out and scrapes the titanium skid plate on the asphalt while allowing much better shadow detail to be pulled out between the wheels of the cars. 



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brianrybolt

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2015, 02:21:46 pm »

mcbroomf

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2015, 04:36:46 pm »

There are rumours that Sony will introduce an A7rII variation, announcement in May, so if that is true (and you can wait) then the 36MP sensor will be available in a package with IBIS.
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LKaven

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2015, 10:54:24 pm »

I have a D4 and a D800.  Much of my work is done in very low light settings (in dark clubs, at night, etc).

There are times where I might favor either of these cameras in low light.  But the D4/D4s/Df are the cameras that can handle these situations with no questions asked.  

The Sony sensor cameras, to varying degrees, exhibit color pollution (bluish-magenta with local hot spots), some think due to thermal noise caused by the huge amount of active electronics on the sensor.  You can mitigate these effects with a dark frame subtraction.  But this is quite a bit of extra work to do by hand when processing a large number of images.  The newer cameras (e.g., the D750) have improved in this regard, but the issues have not been entirely eliminated.

There is one nice thing about the 36MP Sony sensor in low light.  For the parts of a low-light scene that have better lighting, the level of detail retained is extraordinary.  A relatively well lighted portrait subject in a very murky environment can exhibit lovely detail in the eyes, for example, enough to make the subject really pop.  

But the D4/D4s/Df sensor is much more obliging overall.  The color response is exceptionally good, and there is no need for exceptional effort in post production.

If you need to go Sony, the A7s will oblige.  It uses a different sensor architecture than other Sony sensors, and is optimized for controlled noise in very low light.  But it is only 12MP.  

I see that Sony does not provide a lossless raw format, and some have noted that this makes their work in post much more difficult.  I can't say from experience, but I am still inclined to stick with the Nikon cameras until Sony comes up with something improved.  And we'll see, as the A7riII appears to be coming shortly.  I'll be interested to see if Sony has finally delivered on the lossless raw format.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2015, 06:42:51 pm by LKaven »
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davewolfs

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Re: help choose a setup for night street photography
« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2015, 06:26:38 pm »

Before you invest in the Sony I would rent it or talk to someone who actually uses it in poor lighting conditions e.g. low light.  DSLR's can do very well in low light (either D750 or D810).  I don't think you would get the same experience with the A7x cameras.  They are great but I don't think they are quite there yet with respect to their focusing capabilities.

Your requirement is specific, make sure to test it out or consult with someone who is familiar with both systems.
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