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Author Topic: Heat Press & Inkjet prints  (Read 5826 times)

Mike Guilbault

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Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« on: December 18, 2014, 07:16:32 pm »

I'm considering getting a heat press for dry-mounting prints, but wondering... is there any problem using one on prints made on inkjet, ie. Epson 9900.
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Mike Guilbault

Geraldo Garcia

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2014, 08:02:51 pm »

RC paper printed on Inkjet will be as problematic as RC photographic paper regarding the heat. You should watch closely the temperature and favor lower temp thermal adhesives.

The matte/FB media is quite resistant to higher temperature but, (and here comes the catch) you may think carefully about the destination/usage of the mounted prints. Heat is energy and it will have some impact on the longevity of the print. I am not aware of any extensive test, but is almost a consensus that a few minutes of higher temperatures may cost you some years on longevity.

If longevity is not a concern, it can be used. From the conservation perspective mounting/gluing should be avoided, of course, but, as we can not avoid it on large prints (like 24x36" and over) some preservation specialists suggested cold mounting on ACM with GUDY 831 as the least problematic mounting option for large prints.
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Phil Indeblanc

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2014, 08:18:18 pm »

If your talking about the vacuum ones, with glass top door similar is style that I used to use for contact negatives...They take up a lot of space if you want to go large.
Also, have heard of a couple incidents/issues as mentioned. Enough heat can make the images fade.
I think I remember it right...200F is in the range of what you should stay around(?)
I think I read someplace the machines can do 300, but that maybe for something else?

BUT, heat is something I rather avoid if it makes sense and there are alternates. Then costs come into play.


Have you thought of a roller machine?  I think this uses less space and no heat/air. A sheet of adhesive material(National), and the backing.
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Mike Guilbault

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2014, 08:32:51 pm »

I think the majority of prints would be either Epson Premium Lustre, or enhanced matte.  I'm not worried about losing a few years... I don't sell these as 'archival' anyway.  Sometimes they're for reproductions of restored photographs (I live in a farming community and 30-50 year old aerial photographs are coming in for restoration and re-mounting, for example).

I had considered a roller, but couldn't afford the one I wanted at the time... and I can get a 40x60 heat press for half the price of a 24" roller - which would then allow me to do other work, and larger work as well.
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Mike Guilbault

Phil Indeblanc

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2014, 08:46:45 pm »

I didn't know the price difference was so drastic.

The problem I remember was not over such a long time, it was a matter of less than couple years.
The prints were left in the trunk with outside temps in the 100+/Palm desert. Not sure what the inside temp of a truck can get to over the day/s of desert heat?
(Just to help be clear).

Anyway. Maybe others with 1st hand experience can help give you some real expectations.


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davidh202

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2014, 10:43:44 pm »

I have been using a Seal Masterpiece TX 24x30" for over 20 years in my framing business ,and do big stuff in multiple passes (bites)...
no problem at all with digital ...
watch you temps and dwell time, use low temp tissue adhesives from Drytac, and follow their directions to stay in the 160-180 F degree range.
  I mount all my digital photos including  Epson Exhibition Fiber I have large prints hanging at home for 5 years with absolutely no degradation whatsoever.
You have to cool the prints under weight ( I use a 3x6' 1/4 plate glass on a dedicated table  ) so they stay flat and don't loosen in spots. I don't trust the self adhesive substrates.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2014, 10:47:39 pm by davidh202 »
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huguito

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2014, 12:47:51 am »

Hi David.
How many seconds or minutes do you press the prints?
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Paul2660

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2014, 07:52:39 am »

I used a 4x8 press for years on RC paper. No problems.  Heat was always 105 to 115.  This was a 15 year old press and the thermostat a bit off.

For mounting material I would consider bienfang rag mount if it's still around. Thicker material and eaiser to work with. 

Added benefit of the dry mount with heat is you pretty much remove all outgassing from the RC paper.

Paul
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eosnead

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2014, 08:24:11 am »

I use a Seal 210M Dry Mount Press @ 75 degrees for 3 minutes and have had no problems using either foam board, poster board or door skin plywood panels.
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Phil Indeblanc

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2014, 11:54:21 am »

At what size does it make sense to go with a roller? Don't most of those top out at 16x20"?
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BillK

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2014, 12:10:16 pm »

My experience is closest to DavidH.
Use the lower temp adhesives  160-180F  at around 3 minutes and no problems.
Mounted a lot of epson luster that way.
You need to be very careful you get no dust or debris between the print/adhesive tissue/mount board layers
or it will be ruined. Can be very frustrating when one tiny speck causes a very noticeable bump in a large print.
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Phil Indeblanc

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2014, 01:56:37 pm »

True... I use a room air cleaner, Austin Air, which does help with dust in general.
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huguito

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2014, 03:56:25 pm »

Is it possible to overlap sheets of mounting tissue?
I have a box of 16x20 mounting tissue sheets and there's a print I just finished that I would like to mount using my heat press, this print larger than the sheets I have.

If that doesn't seem possible; What tissue would you recomend that will work on Baryta papers and Matte textured? Like Canson Photographique and Epson Hot Press?
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davidh202

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2014, 08:31:21 pm »

You cannot overlap tissue it will show a lump!!  I have tried to join sheets of tissue butting edges and it's tricky if the tissue shrinks you can have a gap that shows the seam ...not worth it

For 20 years I was using a generic all purpose tissue that was available from a supplier that is no longer in business. the equivalent today would be Trimount Tissue from Drytac
« Last Edit: December 19, 2014, 08:48:15 pm by davidh202 »
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davidh202

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #14 on: December 19, 2014, 09:10:21 pm »

As BillK said about 160-180F for about 2 1/2-3 minutes ( with the tissue I described above)  that also depends on the tissue you use all come with recommended times and temps... practice is the best teacher.
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huguito

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #15 on: December 20, 2014, 01:28:15 am »

Would you use the same Trimount with resin coated like Baryta or Luster papers AND for Matte papers?
The Drytac website lists Trimount as made for resin coated substrates
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Richard.Wills

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #16 on: December 20, 2014, 11:38:58 am »

One thing to be aware of with the vacuum presses, is that it can be very difficult to mount RC prints to impermeable materials (such as DiBond or aluminium). If all the air isn't driven out from between the print and the substrate, before the heat comes on, you can end up with very annoying bubbles.

We started out with a Drytac Hotpress 360, but these days do 95% of mounting on a 44" roller machine, which take ups less space and doesn't need its own 20A (240v here) power feed. We'll be selling the hotpress once the winter is over (we use it more for heating substrates and laminates, prior to running through the rollers!)

We used the Unimount adhesive, but these days I'd look at the Artsafe 200DMT, for ultra low temperature activation.
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Wayne Fox

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #17 on: December 20, 2014, 05:00:32 pm »

Heat is energy and it will have some impact on the longevity of the print. I am not aware of any extensive test, but is almost a consensus that a few minutes of higher temperatures may cost you some years on longevity.

While it may be a consensus (shown through testing) that higher temperature over long term is detrimental to color prints (both chromogenic and inkjet), I'm not sure this applies to a minute or so in a heat press at 130-180 degress  - I just can't imagine this would cost years of longevity in regards to the fade characteristics of the dyes - or any significant period of time for that matter.  This would mean the heat would have to create some substantial degradation in the dye characteristics of the ink which could be tested and seen pretty easily and I"ve never seen any evidence like this. But one reason heat is detrimental is it accelerates the process of other image degrading processes such as humidity, gases, UV. I think this is a case of logical or cirumstantial thinking, but without any real basis. Dry mounting has a long track record (it's been around for over a century), much longer than any current color print process.

Usually when mounting and archivability is discussed the concerns are more about the inability to remove the print from the mounting material (which technically makes in "non" archival by some), the adhesive and mount board used in the process, and the durablity of the adhesion between the two surfaces. Additionally with any mounting of inkjet prints that have been printed from rolls, the mounting process can stress the receptor coating and make it crack.  Of course somehow the print has to be flattened, and maybe dry mounting may be better than reverse curling.

Cold mounting removes the heat part of the equation , but there is some question that adhesion qualities between the two surfaces is subject to failing more than most dry mounting techniques. That doesn't make it bad, it also has a long track record and using proper materials certainly makes it worth considering.

Avoiding any type of mounting for those trying to offer museum archivability would make sense, but then the print would need to be cared for with the same attention that a museum offers.  That's probably not going to happen unless it is owned by a museum, and as much as we wring our hands about fading issues, fading is one of the least likely reason a print will die over time.
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Mike Guilbault

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #18 on: December 20, 2014, 06:39:45 pm »

Your last point is so true Wayne. There are so many other things that can flounder a print.
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Mike Guilbault

Geraldo Garcia

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Re: Heat Press & Inkjet prints
« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2014, 09:07:29 pm »

Avoiding any type of mounting for those trying to offer museum archivability would make sense, but then the print would need to be cared for with the same attention that a museum offers.  That's probably not going to happen unless it is owned by a museum, and as much as we wring our hands about fading issues, fading is one of the least likely reason a print will die over time.

Well... of course, but sometimes we (who work printing for others including actual museums) face some complicated real life situations that are beyond our power to decide. This one happened early this year: A museum sponsored an exhibit from a world famous artist and one piece would be given to the museum as gift. He decided it would be a print measuring 42x63" and at that size there is no other option than mounting it to a rigid substrate. No one was really concerned about making it "archival" as we all know the limitations. The idea was to use the method that would give the longest life possible to a mounted image on an actual museum.

The artist is used to drymount (heat) but the museum did not like the idea. The so called "consensus" was the result of several consults to various conservation specialists including one that was pointed by the paper's manufacturer (one they use to conduct their tests, mounting/framing/handling tests, not accelerated fading tests). They all said that the preferable mounting method for that size and the storage condition was to roller mount (cold) to ACM with GUDY 831 adhesive.

I, for my use, have nothing against drymounting. On my (small) collection I have some BW photos on FB paper drymounted to gator that are older than me (I am 41) and, I must confess, the pictures are displaying far less signs of aging than myself!  :P
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