LR5 Printing, Yellow/Green Cast

[Gary Ferguson]

I'm using the following set up,

-Lightroom 5.7
-Mac OS 10.10 (Yosemite)
-Eizo Coloredge CG277 (calibrated with ColorMunki because Yosemite doesn't yet support the CG277), luminance set to 95cd/m
-Epson 3880

Across a range of different papers prints are consistently showing a yellow/green cast. Soft proofing (with "Simulate Paper & Ink" checked) doesn't predict the problem. I've run nozzle checks etc but to no effect.

For example the colour cast is present using Ilford Gold Fibre Silk and with the following settings,

Settings in Lightroom Print module:-

Print Resolution - 720
Print Sharpening - Standard
Media Type - Gloss
Color Management:
Profile - Epson ICC paper profile
Intent - Perceptual (colour cast still present with Relative)

Settings in Printer Properties Dialog:-

Ink - Photo Black
Media Type - Semi Gloss
Color - Color
Print Quality: Super Photo
                     High Speed Off
Mode - Off (No Color Adjustment)

I've searched the forum archives and although similar problems have been reported before there's no suggested solution.

Thanks for reading, any help appreciated!

[jferrari]

You say you've run a nozzle check but is it 100% clear? Meaning are there any clogged nozzles? This sounds to me that your magenta might be clogged.     - Jim

[Gary Ferguson]

Thanks for the suggestion Jim, but the nozzle check showed no problems, and I ran a flush to be completely sure.

[AFairley]

Are you seeing this cast on unadjusted reference images printed out of LR?

http://www.jirvana.com/printer_tests/PrinterEvaluationImage_V002.zip

[Gary Ferguson]

I printed the reference print you linked to, but darkness has fallen here in the UK so I'll wait until tomorrow to evaluate it in the daylight. Thanks for your input, that's appreciated, and I'll follow up tomorrow.

[PhotoEcosse]

For what it may or may not be worth, here are the settings that I use when printing to Gold Fibre Silk on my R3000 from Lightroom:





Never any colour cast at all. I think it is important, when printing from Lightroom, to allow the software to choose the resolution rather than entering any value in the dialogue. For mono, the only difference is selecting Advanced B&W, rather than colour, in the Epson dialogue.

[Mac Mahon]

Gary

Your system is nearly the same as mine (NEC rather than Eizo, here)

Your settings are more or less the same as I would choose for printing on IGFS. (I use a home built paper profile rather than the Epson supplied one, but I'd be surprised if that's the issue.)

I too suspect some problem with one of the magenta inks.

I hope you resolve this.  I'm not looking forward to similar problems at my end!

Tim

[Wayne Fox]

For what it may or may not be worth, here are the settings that I use when printing to Gold Fibre Silk on my R3000 from Lightroom:

Certainly not a recommended setup, you are not using color managment.

to the OP, why are you using an Epson ICC profile for Gold Fiber Silk? The selected profile should match the paper.

[Gary Ferguson]

to the OP, why are you using an Epson ICC profile for Gold Fiber Silk? The selected profile should match the paper.

My mistake, I'm using the relevant Ilford profile.

[digitaldog]

For what it may or may not be worth, here are the settings that I use when printing to Gold Fibre Silk on my R3000 from Lightroom:

Managed by Printer is your first problem. You want Application Manages color, by selecting the proper ICC profile.

[Gary Ferguson]

Thanks A Fairley, I downloaded and printed your test image, but unfortunately there's the same yellow/green cast.

I've doubled checked everything (including nozzle checks and flushes...all the magenta inks are operating fine), but the problem persists.

I'm beginning to think it's an issue with the Eizo CG277 monitor and Mac Yosemite. My previous computer died and I replaced it with a new Mac Pro which had Yosemite already installed. Eizo advised against upgrading to Yosemite as there's a problem with this OS and their built in calibration system. However because it's a new computer I don't have a choice but to run Yosemite. Eizo advised that calibrating with a third party device (I'm using a ColorMunki) should work, but I'm coming to the conclusion that there's still a problem.

In the meantime I've got a clunky and not particularly accurate soft proofing workaround, and I guess I'll have to persevere until the Eizo/Mac fix arrives. Black marks to Eizo/Mac for allowing this to persist long after NEC/Mac have sorted it all out!

[PhotoEcosse]

Managed by Printer is your first problem. You want Application Manages color, by selecting the proper ICC profile.

Eh?

I don't have a problem.

Without any fannying about with "custom ICC profiles", my set-up and printer gives me prints that perfectly match what I see on my monitors using the papers that I routinely employ - mainly Gold Fibre Silk, Gold Mono Silk and Fotospeed Platinum Baryta.

I never cease to be amazed by how many folk on this chatroom (and others) rabbit on about profiles and, in so-doing, completely unnecessarily complicate their workflow.

If the simplest solution works, it is usually the best solution.

[howardm]

The OP states he's using a 'Colormunki'.  That is a family of products of widely different capabilities.  Which EXACT model?

Photo?  Smile?  Display?  Design?

[Gary Ferguson]

Display

[Simon Garrett]

Eh?

I don't have a problem.

Without any fannying about with "custom ICC profiles", my set-up and printer gives me prints that perfectly match what I see on my monitors using the papers that I routinely employ - mainly Gold Fibre Silk, Gold Mono Silk and Fotospeed Platinum Baryta.

I never cease to be amazed by how many folk on this chatroom (and others) rabbit on about profiles and, in so-doing, completely unnecessarily complicate their workflow.

If the simplest solution works, it is usually the best solution.

Odd that, because I use colour management and find that the simplest solution.  I agree with you that if the simplest solution works, it is usually the best solution!

It wasn't clear from your post whether it's just printer profiles that are "fannying about" or whether you were also referring to calibration and profiling of monitors, and use of colour-managed software.  For me, colour management is simple and straightforward.  It provides an objective and fairly mechanistic way of knowing that colours are correct.   

I know that if the colours of my images don't look right then it's all down to me, not the monitor or printer!

[digitaldog]

Eh?
I don't have a problem.

Application Manages Color AND selecting a profile is the wrong setup. Print Matching in the print dialog has to be set correctly, a dialog you didn’t present. IF the OP takes your advise, just changes his settings in LR to AMC, he’ll be in far worse case as he’s specifying an ICC profile in the print driver.

I never cease to be amazed by how many folk on this chatroom (and others) rabbit on about profiles and, in so-doing, completely unnecessarily complicate their workflow.

It’s the proper and most feature rich way to work in a color managed setup. It’s not at all complicated, no more than using AMC. It allows one to soft proof and actually maintain the CMS through to the print driver, control Rendering Intent etc.

[digitaldog]

I'm beginning to think it's an issue with the Eizo CG277 monitor and Mac Yosemite.

Not the display IF you printed a reference image and the output still has a color issue. A reference image is one that you don’t edit so the display isn’t a factor (you didn’t alter the correct RGB values based on an incorrect display condition). You might try another reference image. Maybe two in different working space to see if that makes any difference:

http://www.digitaldog.net/files/2014PrinterTestFileFlat.tif.zip

http://digitaldog.net/files/Printer%20Test%20file.jpg

[Evanford]

Gary,

The monitor and monitor profile has nothing to do with printed output.  You stated this occurs on multiple papers and I assume multiple paper profiles which would rule out a bad paper profile.  The key I think is the new Mac.  I would check for the latest print driver for your printer.  I believe I read on these LuLa forums some Macs will overwrite the printer driver with a generic one from Apple - something to that affect.  I print from windows so I don't have any direct knowledge of this issue.   Try downloading the latest driver from the printer maker.  Make sure it is bring used and not some generic Apple one. 

Evan

[Gary Ferguson]

Gary,

The monitor and monitor profile has nothing to do with printed output.  You stated this occurs on multiple papers and I assume multiple paper profiles which would rule out a bad paper profile.  The key I think is the new Mac.  I would check for the latest print driver for your printer.  I believe I read on these LuLa forums some Macs will overwrite the printer driver with a generic one from Apple - something to that affect.  I print from windows so I don't have any direct knowledge of this issue.   Try downloading the latest driver from the printer maker.  Make sure it is bring used and not some generic Apple one. 

Evan

Hello Evan, thanks for the suggestion, I read about this some time back in one of Jeff Schewe's books, and sure enough he's right! As I understand it the "canned drivers" that come with the Mac OS aren't that bad, but they may be missing one or two minor features, none the less I replaced the Mac driver with the latest Epson driver right from the get go.

[Gary Ferguson]

Not the display IF you printed a reference image and the output still has a color issue. A reference image is one that you don’t edit so the display isn’t a factor (you didn’t alter the correct RGB values based on an incorrect display condition). You might try another reference image. Maybe two in different working space to see if that makes any difference:

http://www.digitaldog.net/files/2014PrinterTestFileFlat.tif.zip

http://digitaldog.net/files/Printer%20Test%20file.jpg

Hello Andrew, thank you very much for those reference images. I printed them and there's a big improvement, maybe not 100% perfect (three "Tint units" of added green plus a very small increase in Temperature brought the screen image and the printed image back to identical) but that's much better than I have been getting.

Your help has been very much appreciated, but may I ask for some more advice about what this means and where I should go from here?

Best regards,

Gary