Mamiya ZD sample images

[BernardLanguillier]

http://www.mamiya-op.co.jp/home/camera/dig...ple/sample.html

Regards,
Bernard

[Jonathan Wienke]

My first impression is that the JPEGs appear to be somewhat overprocessed. The Nature_A image foliage has a slightly "smeared" look like slightly over-aggressive noise reduction, mixed with a salt-and-pepper like sprinkling of random black and white pixels. Dynamic range appears to be pretty good, as does color, and there's a bit of sensor dust visible in the sky. And there's a lot of resolution to work with. I'm not necessarily impressed with in-camera JPEGs, but I'd be real interested in playing with a RAW to see what the camera can really do. I suspect that the JPEGs don't really do the camera justice.

[Richowens]

Bernard,

Thank you for the link. They certainly have my interest piqued.

Rich

[BernardLanguillier]

My first impression is that the JPEGs appear to be somewhat overprocessed. The Nature_A image foliage has a slightly "smeared" look like slightly over-aggressive noise reduction, mixed with a salt-and-pepper like sprinkling of random black and white pixels. Dynamic range appears to be pretty good, as does color, and there's a bit of sensor dust visible in the sky. And there's a lot of resolution to work with. I'm not necessarily impressed with in-camera JPEGs, but I'd be real interested in playing with a RAW to see what the camera can really do. I suspect that the JPEGs don't really do the camera justice.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53733\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Jonathan,

Your observations match mine. The only problem being that these images are said to be RAW images converted to jpg using Mamiya Digital Photostudio.

I have also noticed some softness in the corners of the frame in Nature_A.jpg.

Regards,
Bernard

[Jonathan Wienke]

That still leaves open the question regarding whether the artifacts are due to the camera or Mamiya's RAW converter. I guess what I'd like to see is a RAW run through a well-known converter like ACR or Capture One or RawShooter to help distinguish camera artifacts from converter artifacts, as the characteristics of the major RAW converters are fairly well-known. What disturbs me the most about the samples is the salt-and-pepper speckling which is an artifact I've not really encountered before. The "smudged" look could simply be the result of someone turning up noise reduction too far, meaning that turning it down or off in the RAW converter and using Neat Image or Noise Ninja or nothing at all could solve that issue. But I have no idea how the salt-and-pepper speckling could be avoided or fixed unless it's the result of a bug in Mamiya's RAW converter or in-camera JPEG firmware.

[BernardLanguillier]

What disturbs me the most about the samples is the salt-and-pepper speckling which is an artifact I've not really encountered before. [a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53751\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Isn't it a bit similar to the capture sharpening done by PK sharpener (high resolution digital camera/medium edge setting)?

Regards,
Bernard

[alainbriot]

From the samples I just looked at, following the link in this thread, I am not impressed.  However, until seeing an actual raw file it is difficult to say what the actual quality that this camera can deliver might be.  So many changes can be caused by processing, compression, noise removal and the like.

Maybe Bernard can visit a Mamiya shop in Japan and snap a few images with the ZD on his own CF card?

Alain  

[BernardLanguillier]

Maybe Bernard can visit a Mamiya shop in Japan and snap a few images with the ZD on his own CF card?

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53763\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Maybe he could.  The ZD is due out this coming Wednesday (Dec 21st), but I am not sure when I'll have the opportunity to go to one of these shops at day time in the coming weeks.

The ski season has started big in Japan (already 3 meters of snow in many major resorts), and I am not sure to what extend the ZD samples can compete with a good run in deep powder snow...  I'll do my best.

Cheers,
Bernard

[alainbriot]

Bernard,

That sounds good.  We are all eager to see what the ZD can do, I am sure!

Have fun skiing in Japan.  I know this is one of your favorite activities.  As you say, skiing is guaranteed excitement!

Alain

[BernardLanguillier]

Have fun skiing in Japan.  I know this is one of your favorite activities.  As you say, skiing is guaranteed excitement!

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53791\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thank you Alain.

Regards,
Bernard

[Eric Myrvaagnes]

Bernard,

That sounds good.  We are all eager to see what the ZD can do, I am sure!

Have fun skiing in Japan.  I know this is one of your favorite activities.  As you say, skiing is guaranteed excitement!

Alain
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53791\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Ah, but Bernard: Remember that skiing will only guarantee excitement for you, while getting some sample pix from an actual ZD will guarantee excitement for all your friends on the LL forum.    

Eric

[Jonathan Wienke]

Isn't it a bit similar to the capture sharpening done by PK sharpener (high resolution digital camera/medium edge setting)?

I haven't used PK, so I wouldn't know. I use Focus Magic for capture sharpening, my own home-cooked midtone sharpening actions for creative sharpening, and QImage handles output sharpening. I've never encountered salt-and-pepper artifacts with that workflow.

[Quentin]

the first jpeg images released for a new camera almost always disappoint.  Then a few days or weeks later, someone who knows what they are doing processes a raw file and it looks a lot better.  

Quentin

PS these images remind me a little of the first (awful) sample shots posted when the Kodak 14n came out.  They are better than those images, but its the same principle - too much agressive NR smearing fine detail.  I think the samples are still pretty good.  I still use the Kodak with the upgraded sensor, and the are raw solutions now that finally do that camera justice.  Strange how software can play uch a big part in the whole process.

[BernardLanguillier]

Ah, but Bernard: Remember that skiing will only guarantee excitement for you, while getting some sample pix from an actual ZD will guarantee excitement for all your friends on the LL forum.   

Eric
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53797\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I guess that the best would be if I could borrow the ZD and take the samples somewhere in the backcountry... I am not sure whether I can convince mr. Mamiya to lend me his baby for a few days...

Cheers,
Bernard

[Eric Myrvaagnes]

I guess that the best would be if I could borrow the ZD and take the samples somewhere in the backcountry... I am not sure whether I can convince mr. Mamiya to lend me his baby for a few days...

Cheers,
Bernard
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53818\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Sounds good. Just tell him that 16,103 of your closest friends are eagerly waiting for the results. (Today the LL statistics say: "We have 16,103 registered members").    

Eric

[eleanorbrown]

After looking at these ZD files I get the impression that their RAW processing and jpg. compression has some major issues.  I don't imagine this chip is too different from what I have in my contax/phase P25 combination, but the output of the ZD files on the internet does not leave a good impression.  Supporting electonics and RAW processing is so important....a good chip is just the start.  Eleanor

the first jpeg images released for a new camera almost always disappoint.  Then a few days or weeks later, someone who knows what they are doing processes a raw file and it looks a lot better. 

Quentin

PS these images remind me a little of the first (awful) sample shots posted when the Kodak 14n came out.  They are better than those images, but its the same principle - too much agressive NR smearing fine detail.  I think the samples are still pretty good.  I still use the Kodak with the upgraded sensor, and the are raw solutions now that finally do that camera justice.  Strange how software can play uch a big part in the whole process.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53817\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[Ben Rubinstein]

Anyone remember how unimpressive the initial 5D files posted up by canon were?

[Jonathan Wienke]

I doubt the posted images represent the full potential of the camera. Hopefully they are merely indicative of poor-quality Mamiya software, and once ACR and C1 support the ZD all will be well.

[BJL]

Hopefully they are merely indicative of poor-quality Mamiya software.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=53869\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I am definitely hopeful. Mamiya is a tiny company (only a few hundred employees?), and are making their first venture into digital photographic hardware and software. Given that even the software from many more established digital camera makers, including Canon, often falls well short of the state of the art, I am very optimistic that industry leading software from Adobe, Phase One et al can do much better with Mamiya's RAW files.

[NikonMike]

I just realized how old this thread is, and the ZD is still not widely available.

Michael's recent review made me look for more information and I found the Japanese site mentioned here with official samples. However, actual full res files appear to be pulled, I always get errors when trying to get them.

Site says "Access to image files may be denied when server is overloaded", but I can't imagine that site to be in such a high demand...

I was interested in the portrait samples, especially the low-key shot using normal lens (portrait_b). If anybody has them archived, I'll appreciate if you let me know and/or e-mail them to:

miu at corena dot com

Thanks,

Mike