Pages: [1] 2   Go Down

Author Topic: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?  (Read 6869 times)

allegretto

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 660
Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« on: November 02, 2014, 09:11:11 pm »

This has been a hectic weekend. I rented a Sony A7s to evaluate where it might fit into my camera collection. Originally the idea was that perhaps with a good set of adapters I could use it in lieu of my 6D and M240. I have a good deal of EF- and M-glass so it’s natural to want to condense the herd.

Further, the kilo-bucks so liberated could be diverted for more wonderful glass. Was looking covetously at the Zeiss OTUS 55 and perhaps 85 if the the 55 is that good. But in the back of my mind, the Sigma ART 50 looks good also,and of course has AF... good old AF

Well, the weekend was indeed frenetic with about 600 images collected at various lighting thresholds and ISO settings (and still more images will be taken before i send the Sony back tomorrow). Sometimes I would stand there with all three bodies thinking, “...OK, what next... “. Great fun on the cheap actually.

Well, long story short, the Sony can replace the M for some things, though I still prefer the subjective feel of the M-images. However the Sony is razor sharp and a bit of post will draw the apparent IQ’s very close indeed. While the Nocutlux is a bundle to focus in any light that you’d actually use it, my keeper rate with the A7s was about the same as with the M240.

Where the A7s really disappointed was with the Metabones IV and AF. Just awful in terms of lock and hold. Upgraded it to V.36 but still meek in both departments. The 6D was several times faster in acquisition (even in fair to good light) and far more tenacious in holding or AF-C mode.

Through all the work, and using Zeiss EF- lenses (21 f2.8 and 100 f2) as well as an M- workout it occurs to me that Manual Focus is great! The Sony has a very good way of getting good manual a couple different ways and the EVF is so good that often neither the mag system or peaking are necessary. Ditto the 6D and it’s oft- dismissed few points. I grew up with central manual focusing and re-composure and of course for very critical shots this is not always best, but it does just fine most of the time. One simply has to know when to go an alternative route.

Yes, for sports, wildlife and wild children AF helps get more keepers, but it also often misses the focus for those special shots with thin DoF and sharp eyelash focus. I would say I’m almost hooked on MF except where only AF will do

Does anyone here strictly or mainly go MF even if their equipment can do AF just fine? It’s almost a joy to MF and stops the spraying that I might do to statistically enhance my rate of getting what was intended. I realize that MF lenses have some keen advantages and won't go there right now. Just want to hear about other's impressions.

What say you more experienced People?

As always, thanks in advance for sharing your experiences
« Last Edit: November 02, 2014, 09:13:05 pm by allegretto »
Logged

dwswager

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1375
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2014, 10:45:40 pm »

I'm not strictly MF, but I do MF alot.  Of course, when I'm on a tripod, I almost exclusively MF.  And when shooting different sports, I decide based on the type of shot I'm trying to execute, whether MF or AF is better suited also based on the camera/lens I'm using.
Logged

ErikKaffehr

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11311
    • Echophoto
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2014, 05:10:09 am »

Hi,

I use magnified live view for MF whenever I can.

Regarding the A7r, I would expect an upgrade of that camera pretty soon. In my view it needs Electronic First Shutter Curtain badly. So, if I could, I would wait.

Another point, the A7 has thick cover glass, among other things, so it will not work optimally with Leica M-lenses, but it depends a lot on the lens.

Best regards
Erik
I'm not strictly MF, but I do MF alot.  Of course, when I'm on a tripod, I almost exclusively MF.  And when shooting different sports, I decide based on the type of shot I'm trying to execute, whether MF or AF is better suited also based on the camera/lens I'm using.
Logged
Erik Kaffehr
 

Manoli

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2296
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2014, 06:48:40 am »

Regarding the A7r, I would expect an upgrade of that camera pretty soon. In my view it needs Electronic First Shutter Curtain badly. So, if I could, I would wait.

Well that's wonderful Erik, but allegretto is talking about the A7s and MF.

I grew up with central manual focusing and re-composure and of course for very critical shots this is not always best, but it does just fine most of the time. One simply has to know when to go an alternative route.

Yes, for sports, wildlife and wild children AF helps get more keepers, but it also often misses the focus for those special shots with thin DoF and sharp eyelash focus. I would say I’m almost hooked on MF except where only AF will do

In answer to the OP's question, I use MF all the time, or at least 95% of it. Welcome to the big advantage of mirrorless. Sony in particular, with Fuji a close second have an excellent EVF / FP / Live View implementation. If your genre of photography permits it , it's a no-brainer IMO.

The only avenues where AF is 'de rigeur', would be sports, press, ( running children!) anything requiring more of a run & gun approach rather than a controlled environment. I've used and still do use Leica M8's. but for reliable, repeatable critical focus it's CSC. Not only faster, more reliable, more second nature. And at least you know where the cam is focussed !

Small point, which you may or may not require. Sony's tether with their remote app into Lr or any converter that can use a hot folder. Since CaptureOne V8 - Alpha's (at least the A7's ) tether directly into C1. There's no camera control, but at least you do have a 'live' link. Great combination for any studio /focus related shooting.
Logged

allegretto

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 660
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2014, 07:42:11 am »

yes A7s thanks

Interesting point about C1 8.0  Tried C1 7.X and use LR a lot. The new C1 8 has a "Sony" version. S it doesn't really weather? Bummer since I wanted to do some focus stacking. Will the Canon 6D work with Helicon Pro and LR or C1 8 in automated fashion? Sony with LR...???

If someone knows I'd appreciate it since it will save me set up aggravation...
Logged

Chrisso26

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 78
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2014, 03:41:58 pm »

Yes, I use MF almost exclusively as most of my best lenses are manual (Alpa and Leica M).
I'm also shooting video now with the Blackmagic Pocket Cam and manual focus is pretty much a must with that set up.
So far I've manually focussed using Panasonic GH1, Sony Nex 7 and Panasonic GX7. I'm only now starting to use auto with two new Sigma Merrill's as the lenses are fixed (native).
Logged

Telecaster

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3686
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2014, 04:00:20 pm »

My A7r almost always has an adapted manual focus lens mounted on it. I do like the FE 35 & 55mm lenses too, but lacking FE 28 & 85/90mms to pair 'em with means I don't use 'em much. Magnified EVF manual focusing is fantastic for accuracy if not speed.

-Dave-
Logged

scooby70

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 489
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2014, 08:43:19 pm »

I use MF with my A7 and Rokkor, Zuiko and FD lenses.

I used to use MF with my Panasonic G1 and the same lenses but since getting the A7 I now rarely use my Panasonic cameras (as well as the G1 I also have a GX7) although when I do it may well be with a Minolta mount Sigma 50mm f2.8 macro.

Occasionally I rely on peaking but mostly I use the magnified view.
Logged

BernardLanguillier

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 13983
    • http://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardlanguillier/sets/
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2014, 10:18:25 pm »

I use MF a lot, but with lenses designed to be manually focused.

My experience with most AF (at least Nikon) lenses is that they are difficult to accurately focus manually.

Cheers,
Bernard

ErikKaffehr

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11311
    • Echophoto
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2014, 11:32:30 pm »

Hi,

The best way to work tethered with Sony in Lightroom is to use a watched folder and use Sony's own software to set exposure and release. That is my experience, albeit with the Alpha 99 (and all other Sonys I had).

I don't know about C1 8.0.

Best regards
Erik


yes A7s thanks

Interesting point about C1 8.0  Tried C1 7.X and use LR a lot. The new C1 8 has a "Sony" version. S it doesn't really weather? Bummer since I wanted to do some focus stacking. Will the Canon 6D work with Helicon Pro and LR or C1 8 in automated fashion? Sony with LR...???

If someone knows I'd appreciate it since it will save me set up aggravation...
Logged
Erik Kaffehr
 

telyt

  • Guest
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2014, 08:05:31 am »

All of my lenses are manual focus.  I have not had pleasurable or productive experience focussing AF lenses manually.
Logged

joneil

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 163
  • This is what beer does to you....
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2014, 08:23:19 am »

Same here.  I use mostly manual focus lenses that are manual focus to begin with.   both Zeiss and some MF Nikkors.   I too find that autofocus lenses are very difficult to manually focus.

Also I have found, and your mileage can and will vary, that I have lost good shots to auto focus lenses.  Maybe it is just me.

One last thing.  The D800 is a power hog.  I suspect all high MP cameras/sensors are.   Add a GPS, and you suck batteries dry pretty fast over a day.   I find that manual focus lenses help save my battery.  For example, I have the 24-70mm Nikkor zoom AF.  Wonderful, wonderful lens, but I do find battery life on my D800 with that lens goes down as opposed to a zeiss prime MF lens.   I do not own any lenses that have VS or IS, but I did once, and I foudn that drained batteries too.

So it is all what works for you.   I do think however, it is almost easier to go mostly all one way or the other.  I found it hard to switch back and forth between MF and AF lenses, easier just to do one and stick with it.

good luck
Logged

dwswager

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1375
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2014, 10:24:22 am »

My experience with most AF (at least Nikon) lenses is that they are difficult to accurately focus manually.

Cheers,
Bernard

My AF-D Nikkors seem touchy with lots of slop, but I find the G lenses to be much better for MF.  It might be that my AF-D lenses, other than the 80-200mm F/2.8D (3rd version with tripod foot) that I sold for the 70-200mm f/2.8G VRII, are lower quality lenses than the G models I have.

To me, the trick is to know when to AF and when to MF.  That comes from knowledge of the subject and experience.  Some people AF Track and blast away and some just know the movement and can capture it in 1 or 2 exposures.  Make me do wildlife and I would AF and blast away since I have no experience in that area.  Put me on a race track and it's another story.
Logged

Jim Kasson

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2370
    • The Last Word
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2014, 11:14:31 am »

If the camera's on a tripod, and I have decent LV, and the lens' focusing mechanism's halfway decent, I'll use MF. I have many MF-only lenses that I use on AF-capable cameras. I'll even use MF on focus-by-wire lenses on the a7x series cams, now that Sony has improved the firmware.

I often zone focus wide angle manual focus lenses; you can't do that very well with AF lenses, due to their shorter throws, sloppier rings, and inadequate distance markings. Is that manual focusing?

I don't trust green focus confirmation dots.

In general I much prefer LV with adjustable zoom points to the ones that are stuck in the middle of the frame (I'm talking about you, Leica).

Jim

Paul2660

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4066
    • Photos of Arkansas
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #14 on: November 05, 2014, 09:07:13 pm »

The A7 family has such a good EVF, and focus peaking/with live view, I tend to lead with MF on the Sony.  I no longer own any Canon glass, but have used several of my Nikkors on the A7 and A7r.  Sony just has peaking down, so much better and accurate than Fuji, even with their latest firmware (at least to me).

The only issue I find with the A7r, is battery life with a lot of live viewing.  While using a Arca DSLR2 and several of my R mount lenses, I did see the Sony battery life present a bit of a problem, but on this setup, it's live view for pretty much every shot.  Results are most impressive however.

On the flip side, as I only use MF on my medium format back/tech camera, when I can use my Nikon's with AF, I tend to, but it's very dependent on the shot and timing.

Paul

Logged
Paul Caldwell
Little Rock, Arkansas U.S.
www.photosofarkansas.com

JohnBrew

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 868
    • http://www.johnbrewton.zenfolio.com
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2014, 07:05:36 am »

Most of my lenses are MF. I have two Nikon AF lenses but they are difficult to MF due to the limited focus throw.

LawrenceBraunstein

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 89
    • My SmugMug Galeries
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2014, 07:55:54 am »

Add me to the list of MF aficionados. When scouting around for photos, most of the lenses I take along are MF (Nikon PC-E’s and Zeiss ZF.2’s). Since much of my work is done on a tripod, I use LV quite a bit (and a good loupe) and rely heavily on the 100% enlargement for critical focus. Sometimes I use contrast detection (if the lens allows it), but that’s seldom. I simply feel more confident ‘eyeballing’ it.

Larry
Logged

mcbroomf

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1534
    • Mike Broomfield
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2014, 10:16:52 am »

Add me to the "MF all the time" crew.  Not sure what you meant by this "The new C1 8 has a "Sony" version. S it doesn't really weather? Bummer since I wanted to do some focus stacking."  I have the A7r and have quite a few images that are focus stacked using LR to develop the files and PSCC to stack, align and blend.  I loaded up and tried out C1 Sony Express and stuck with LR (and I have a reasonable amount of experience with C1 Pro in the past)
Logged

allegretto

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 660
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2014, 05:51:32 pm »

Add me to the "MF all the time" crew.  Not sure what you meant by this "The new C1 8 has a "Sony" version. S it doesn't really weather? Bummer since I wanted to do some focus stacking."  I have the A7r and have quite a few images that are focus stacked using LR to develop the files and PSCC to stack, align and blend.  I loaded up and tried out C1 Sony Express and stuck with LR (and I have a reasonable amount of experience with C1 Pro in the past)

Oh, thats more like an observation I made while playing with the new versions of software.

no comment

I've now tried

LR>DxO 10>LR

and C1_8.0 all the way with the A7s

Both are very good at default settings but the C1_8.0 is more accurate to my eye, and easier. Will try to set up Media Pro again....
Logged

kitalight

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 72
Re: Anyone using MF a lot, even with AF-capable equipment?
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2014, 10:39:30 pm »

I'm moving over from Canon to Nikon to use all my 10 MF lenses....8 Nikkor primes from 50 to 300mm, and two Vivitar Series1 zooms 28-90mm/70-210mm...."correctly"...viewing/focusing at wide open apertures while shooting stopped down....on Canons I had to focus/shoot "stopped-down"...darker and harder to focus...but even on Canons on which I can mount AF lenses, I would choose the MF lenses nearly all the time...
The capability of viewing/shooting wide open on full-size 35mm sensor makes focusing a lot easier on the Nikon and the higher ISO capability makes for higher IQ

Here's a link to my first test shots taken with the Nikon D610....taken with the MF Vivitar Series1 28-90mm F2.8-3.5...
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1329119
I do have an AF "walk-around" Nikkor zoom in this FL range, and it IS nice....so it will be interesting to see how much I use it when I can choose between it and its MF twin counterpart.

Here's a 100% crop taken with the Canon on the MF Vivitar Series1 70-210mm...

_MG_3597rCu23s by kitaflix, on Flickr

I have complete confidence in my MF gear...and with practice, will also have it with my new Nikon technology....
Logged
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up