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Author Topic: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?  (Read 60644 times)

Joe Towner

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #160 on: October 30, 2014, 12:15:04 am »

Back on topic.  The Z has proven that I need an 80mp version...



Looking close, I can only identify a few folks - at 80mp, I'm sure I'd be able to identify everyone :D
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eronald

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #161 on: October 30, 2014, 01:20:09 am »

You hate Professional Photographers also?


Nah, I admire their charm, unflappable calm, unfailing courtesy, and their ability to herd cats on set :)
I think I was a professional photographer with very small p's.

Edmund
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 02:04:08 am by eronald »
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eronald

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #162 on: October 30, 2014, 01:36:24 am »

And your point is?


IMO

BC

No real point.
I'm just surprised how accessible the engineers are, compared to the "artists". Of course, most bright-eyed,moneyed and eager students who flock to a photo workshop will not be interested in a course consisting of page after page of equations.

Edmund

context:

Robert William Gainer Hunt

Born at Sidcup, Kent, England, 28th July 1923.

Robert Hunt was awarded a B.Sc (Bachelor of Science) with first class honours, and an A.R.C.S. (Associate of the Royal College of Science), in physics,1940-1943, and a D.I.C. (Diploma of Imperial College) in Technical Optics,1946-47, all from the Imperial College of Science and Technology, University of London. He was also awarded a Ph.D (Doctor of Philosophy), 1953, and a D.Sc (Doctor of Science), 1968, from the University of London. He worked as an Experimental Officer at the Ministry of Supply on optical sighting devices for tanks, 1943-46. He was a research scientist at the Kodak Research Laboratories, Harrow, 1946-82, where he worked on factors affecting the quality of colour images, and devices for making reflection prints from both negative and positive images on film; he was finally Assistant Director of Research. Since 1982 he has worked as an independent colour consultant, and has taken a leading role in the development of colour appearance models. He was a Visiting Professor of Physiological Optics at the City University, London, 1967-1998, a Visiting Professor of Colour Science at the Colour & Imaging Institute at the University of Derby, England, 1994-2004, and a Visiting professor of Colour Science at the Department of Colour Science at the University of Leeds, 2004-2009. He has been Chairman of the Colour Group of Great Britain, 1961-63; Chairman of the Colorimetry Committee of the Commission Internationale de l'Éclairage (CIE), 1975-83; and President of the International Colour Association (AIC), 1981-85. He has written over a hundred papers on colour vision, colour reproduction, and colour measurement, and two books 'The Reproduction of Colour' now in its sixth edition, and 'Measuring Colour' now in its fourth edition co-authored with Michael Pointer. His current research interests include modelling the human system of colour vision so as to be able to predict how colours will appear in different viewing conditions, and applying colour science to practical problems in industry and in the environment. He is an Honorary Fellow of the Royal Photographic Society, Fellow of the Royal Society of Arts, Fellow of the Royal Television Society, Honorary Fellow of the British Kinematography Sound and Television Society, Honorary Member of the Society for Imaging Science and Technology, and Honorary Fellow of the Society of Dyers and Colourists. He is a member of the Royal Institution and has served as one of its Vice-Presidents, 1985-87. He has been awarded the Newton Medal of the Colour Group (Great Britain), 1974, the Progress Medal of the Royal Photographic Society, 1984, the Judd-AIC Medal of the International Colour Association, 1987, the Gold Medal of the Institute of Printing, 1989, the Johann Gutenberg Prize of the Society for Information Display, 2002, the Godlove Award of the Inter-Society Color Council (U.S.A.), 2007. and Honorary Fellowship of the Society of Dyers and Colourists, 2009. For services to the field of colour science and to young people through Crusaders he was appointed an Officer of the British Empire (O.B.E.) in 2009.

His interests include: all aspects of colour science, visiting interesting places in the world, photography, and railways. The most important things in his life are: his Christian Faith, he is an Elder and lay preacher in his local church; and his family, he married Eileen Mary (née Redhead) in 1947, and his family consist of his wife, their four children and their four spouses, twelve grandchildren, and three great-grandchildren.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 02:25:57 am by eronald »
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #163 on: October 30, 2014, 01:47:04 am »

Hi,

He may say that photographers charge 5000 for an equivalent workshop. Defining equivalent may be a bit hard.

Best regards
Erik

And your point is?


IMO

BC
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #164 on: October 30, 2014, 01:58:38 am »

... I always wanted to take some photography classes, but photographers seem to value their time at 10x that of scientists of "equivalent" caliber.

While the intrinsic value of a scientific class might be higher, the reality is that it is a demand and supply that determines the price, not how much each group values their time. There are simply 10x more people interested in a photography class than in a scientific one.

eronald

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #165 on: October 30, 2014, 02:11:27 am »

While the intrinsic value of a scientific class might be higher, the reality is that it is a demand and supply that determines the price, not how much each group values their time. There are simply 10x more people interested in a photography class than in a scientific one.


I'm not making any call on "intrinsic value", however in a way I'm surprised that some photo guys don't just teach in order to teach.  In the case of Hunt, that seemed to be the case. Teaching is often its own reward, even though that sounds corny, I've done a lot of it and it's fun.

Edmund
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 02:17:48 am by eronald »
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #166 on: October 30, 2014, 02:56:59 am »

Hi,

Just to note, I took part in one of Hans Kruse's workshops in the Dolomites, that was around 1100€ (1400$) and included 10 hours of classroom instruction, 50 hours of photography, five nights at a good hotel all meals and drinks. Also, it included a good company of engineers and scientists, five of the participants were engineers, two were senior scientists, but all 10 participants were enthusiastic photographers.

I wouldn't say that was expensive. But, I wouldn't say anything of this relates to the Pentax 645Z.

My take from what I have read is that Pentax 645Z owners are extremely happy.

Best regards
Erik







While the intrinsic value of a scientific class might be higher, the reality is that it is a demand and supply that determines the price, not how much each group values their time. There are simply 10x more people interested in a photography class than in a scientific one.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #167 on: October 30, 2014, 03:10:25 am »

I would argue that those photographers writing articles for LL teach for free. ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

eronald

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #168 on: October 30, 2014, 03:15:56 am »

I wanna go too!

Those pix are wonderfully pleasant to look at.

Edmund

Hi,

Just to note, I took part in one of Hans Kruse's workshops in the Dolomites, that was around 1100€ (1400$) and included 10 hours of classroom instruction, 50 hours of photography, five nights at a good hotel all meals and drinks. Also, it included a good company of engineers and scientists, five of the participants were engineers, two were senior scientists, but all 10 participants were enthusiastic photographers.

I wouldn't say that was expensive. But, I wouldn't say anything of this relates to the Pentax 645Z.

My take from what I have read is that Pentax 645Z owners are extremely happy.

Best regards
Erik







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bcooter

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #169 on: October 30, 2014, 03:54:25 am »

I'll tell ya a secret I love photography.

Now I have to say that in a low voice because some people think that if you love something you should do it for free.

That's kind of a strange thought to me, because in my world good photography, no matter how much you dig doing it is big, hard work, and work and free don't really belong in the same sentence.

I understand shooting for yourself because that will open doors down the line, but giving it up for free because somebody wants it . . . I dunno bout that.

I don't mind sharing, to a point, I'll answer a lot of questions, to a point, but in a world where every bit of knowledge should be put online for the world to "share" just doesn't make sense.

It's funny, I dig cars and have a few fast ones.  Nothing fancy, just rods.    

The owner of the rod shop I go to digs cars, loves cars, makes beautiful cars and I've never, ever, never asked him to do a single thing for free or even for a discount.

I'm a good customer, I'll bet he will cut me a deal, but just cause he loves doing something doesn't give me the opening to leverage his passion for my benefit.

FWIW:  Everybody finds their own way and I'd never think my way was the best way . . . but. . .

I've never had a photography class, only assisted two days to help a friend and sure didn't come from money.

What I did was build a small studio in my garage and once I was ready, I found people that paid for photography and sold myself as a photographer.  

So far it's worked out pretty good, but I've been lucky, have a great partner, work with good people and work for good clients.

But nothing makes you better, learn faster than an empty stomach, metaphorically and physically.




IMO

BC
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 04:06:50 am by bcooter »
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Manoli

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #170 on: October 30, 2014, 04:31:44 am »

That people who do real work couldn't care less about his paper qualifications ...

... and I thought your day job was in marketing.
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #171 on: October 30, 2014, 04:49:11 am »

Hi,

Sharing experience and knowledge is a pleasant experience for many… It is quite possible to share experience for pleasure, but that is not a commercial venue.

Now, I would say that world would be a boring place to live if everything was measured in commercial terms. Much innovation originates in curiosity, the urge to find out. Without that urge we wouldn't have lenses, film, cameras or digital sensors. Another point possibly made, this site (LuLa) is very much a commercial one, but it was started because Michael Reichmann wanted to share.

People making their living from photography are hard working self made people doing success in a market that is both demanding and competitive, they deserve all respect.

Best regards
Erik




I would argue that those photographers writing articles for LL teach for free. ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

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ndevlin

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #172 on: October 30, 2014, 12:07:17 pm »

I don't understand how you can like the appearance of the skin even on the "in focus" Z pictures. It's just look unreal textures. I would expect that such systems  (high price systems) offer texture quality as good at 400-800 iso than CCD system like P1 or Hassy at 50-100 iso. It is not the case at all. Low noise, all right, but terrible textures. I prefer a little bit of noise.

What images are you speaking of? Is it your own 645z that's doing this? If not, I'm wondering what you're looking at, bc this is not consistent with my experience at all.

- N.
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #173 on: October 30, 2014, 05:05:13 pm »

These?

https://www.copy.com/s/ZXn6jNBoS0MyQQrw/Hass-Pentax

Personally, I am quite glad to have some raw samples, so I would not complain about quality of the samples.

Best regards
Erik


What images are you speaking of? Is it your own 645z that's doing this? If not, I'm wondering what you're looking at, bc this is not consistent with my experience at all.

- N.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 05:11:37 pm by ErikKaffehr »
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #174 on: October 30, 2014, 05:33:43 pm »

I don't understand how you can like the appearance of the skin even on the "in focus" Z pictures. It's just look unreal textures. I would expect that such systems  (high price systems) offer texture quality as good at 400-800 iso than CCD system like P1 or Hassy at 50-100 iso. It is not the case at all. Low noise, all right, but terrible textures. I prefer a little bit of noise.

What the hell is "texture"!?

I heard a lot about magic ingredients in the Leica vs. Contax, CMOS vs. CCD, etc. debates, but... "texture"!?

eronald

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #175 on: October 30, 2014, 07:19:16 pm »

What the hell is "texture"!?

I heard a lot about magic ingredients in the Leica vs. Contax, CMOS vs. CCD, etc. debates, but... "texture"!?


Texture is something that gets destroyed by some CMOS camera filtering - you then have "plastic skin" or "orange peel".

Edmund
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #176 on: October 30, 2014, 07:25:10 pm »

Texture is something that gets destroyed by some CMOS camera filtering - you then have "plastic skin" or "orange peel".

Edmund

In other words, detail? As far as I could see, there is plenty of detail in those files, every pore and wrinkle is visible in those faces.

mattbr

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #177 on: October 31, 2014, 06:00:47 am »

I would argue that those photographers writing articles for LL teach for free. ;)

Cheers,
Bernard


Or, if you were cynical, you'd say that, in some cases, they could be commoditising their complement (whether it be workshops or prints) ;)
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bcooter

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #178 on: October 31, 2014, 06:31:23 am »

In other words, detail? As far as I could see, there is plenty of detail in those files, every pore and wrinkle is visible in those faces.

What cameras do you regularly work with?

IMO

BC
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: How are the Pentax Z645 owners feeling?
« Reply #179 on: October 31, 2014, 12:52:23 pm »

What cameras do you regularly work with?

Canon 60D currently, film Hasselblads in the bygone era.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 01:22:15 pm by Slobodan Blagojevic »
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