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Author Topic: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs  (Read 8815 times)

Michael West

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Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« on: September 25, 2014, 01:02:05 pm »

Forest Service Wants to Charge $1,500 to Take Pictures On Public Lands

Yes, it’s true that the lion’s share of the Forest Service budget is now going to dealing with wildfires, but is it so desperate for money that it has to hit up the people who do most of its marketing, photographers? A new policy, quietly proposed by the USFS on September 4 but now catching the public’s attention in a big way, would require $1,500 permits for media taking pictures in wilderness, with fines up to $1,000 for failing to comply. The rules could be applied to anyone taking pictures that result in some kind of commerce, from bloggers to amateur photographers who sell a print or two.

http://www.adventure-journal.com/2014/09/forest-service-wants-to-charge-1500-to-take-pictures-on-public-lands/

How about a Mass Photo Shoot At Yosemite??
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mbaginy

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2014, 01:10:46 pm »

Madness!!!  :o  But the fine is cheaper than the permit, so I'd take my chances.  Seems as if this will require a giant bureaucracy to search for such images and investigate when they were taken (before the law?) and then press charges.  Some pencil-pusher had a great idea for making money.  Sad, really sad.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2014, 03:24:46 pm »

Madness!!!  :o  But the fine is cheaper than the permit, so I'd take my chances...

The fine is per image.

RSL

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #3 on: September 25, 2014, 05:44:17 pm »

The federal government has done something stupid and counterproductive? Perish the thought. Tell me it isn't true.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2014, 05:51:50 pm »

 Somehow the forests survived all these years of picture taking.  Until now.  Another government regulation to take away our freedom.

DennisWilliams

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« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2014, 08:08:16 pm »

There has been a fee for commercial shoots for decades. Falls under the category of don't run your business in a state or federal park or monument -and lots of other places.   While it may affect landscape photographers who have been sliding thru, pop open a reflector in Joshua Tree with a model at hand  and a ranger will arrive shortly.

If you are a hobbyist the law  will not make a difference and if you are a pro, or out to make a buck,  own it.   It is really that simple. Too many people want to be respected as a professional until it is inconvenient and  then suddenly they're just a hobbyist.

http://www.commdiginews.com/politics-2/feds-you-cant-photograph-my-national-park-26671/ttp://

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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2014, 08:14:41 pm »

There has been a fee for commercial shoots for decades....

We are not talking about those. And were not talking about pro egos either. We are talking about a basic freedom to take pictures.

mezzoduomo

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2014, 09:36:34 pm »

I'd like to see the actual statute. If its not a whole lot more specific than "The rules could be applied to anyone taking pictures that result in some kind of commerce, from bloggers to amateur photographers who sell a print or two.", it's unlikely to stand.

Here's another version of the story that specifies 'media', and 'reporters', and goes no further in defining exactly what this is all about.

http://www.oregonlive.com/environment/index.ssf/2014/09/forest_service_delaying_media.html

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Robert Roaldi

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2014, 11:04:49 pm »

I'm not a US citizen but I am amused by threads of this nature that pop up from time to time. Odds are that this will turn out to be the usual tempest in a teapot about fees for commercial use.

But the outrage expressed that the guvmint charges people a fee to use public parks even though as citizens you already own it, is comical. I own my house, but I still to pay for maintenance, don't I? Why would you expect to use those public lands without paying for their maintenance?

Since those guvmint departments have had their budgets cut in recent decades, because taxes were too high being the usual silly obvious argument, they were simultaneously told to behave more like private enterprise. Why then would you be surprised that they raise their fees? What's the other option, magic? Those departments were put into that position by elected guvmints, weren't they? You can always change it back by changing the elected guvmint.

Or are you taking some sort of armchair libertarian position that all guvmint action is bad as a matter or principle. If that's the case, maybe you should be lobbying for Disney or someone else to take over the national parks system. Then the fees will magically come down and they'll let you take all the pictures you want for free, I'm sure, and even sell them.

So long as we're complaining about things, I have a complaint about visual space. Why is it that some company can rent space at the top of some building and from then on limit my use of that visual space? If I want to take a photo of an urban panorama to sell, I may find myself limited in the usage rights of that photo because of the presence of a company trademark or logo. But nobody compensated me for the loss of that visual space. Why did that company get that for nothing?
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DennisWilliams

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mbaginy

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2014, 04:28:05 am »

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PhotoEcosse

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #11 on: September 26, 2014, 05:54:25 am »

I have never heard of "Adventure Journal" but they seem to be a typical sensation-seeking organ of the media.

Only the most perverse editor would choose to illustrate that article with a photograph of a wee lassie on a hiking trip taking a snap of a canyon on a tiny point and shoot compact camera.

The licence fee seems to be clearly aimed at commercial exploitation. We have the same in Britain where many public authorities charge fees for allowing photography for commercial purposes. That does not, in any way, get in the way of genuine amateur photography.

Presumably your main amateur photography organisations will be clarifying the issue for the benefit of their members and lobbying the government agencies should they consider that to be necessary.
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shawnino

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #12 on: September 26, 2014, 10:33:01 am »

"Forest Service Wants to Charge $1,500 to Take Pictures On Public Lands"

... and I want a solid gold toilet seat for Christmas. Doesn't mean I'll get it.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #13 on: September 26, 2014, 11:19:21 am »

I have never heard of "Adventure Journal" but they seem to be a typical sensation-seeking organ of the media.

Only the most perverse editor would choose to illustrate that article with a photograph of a wee lassie on a hiking trip taking a snap of a canyon on a tiny point and shoot compact camera.

The licence fee seems to be clearly aimed at commercial exploitation. We have the same in Britain where many public authorities charge fees for allowing photography for commercial purposes. That does not, in any way, get in the way of genuine amateur photography.

Presumably your main amateur photography organisations will be clarifying the issue for the benefit of their members and lobbying the government agencies should they consider that to be necessary.

Are you really sure this won't effect non-pro shooters?  What if they decide that a photo class given by a pro photographer is commercial because the pro-photographer gets fees from his students.  Then all classes which are on public lands could be charged the $1500 which will be passed on to students in their fees.  This would effect income for people like Reichman and Raber and higher costs for people who sign up for their tours

Alan Klein

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #14 on: September 26, 2014, 11:25:11 am »

I wonder Michael and Kevin if you're using your esteemed positions and those of LuLa to present arguments against these fees?

RSL

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #15 on: September 26, 2014, 05:55:16 pm »

Won't help, Alan. Canada already has risen above this kind of out-of-control government swamp.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #16 on: September 26, 2014, 06:07:44 pm »

Really?  What happened and what did they do?

Ed B

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RSL

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #18 on: September 27, 2014, 01:51:13 pm »

Really?  What happened and what did they do?

They elected a reasonably conservative government which has been partially dismantling the nanny state, which is one of the reasons Wendy's is moving north.
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RSL

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Re: Feds Want Fee for Photographing on Public Lancs
« Reply #19 on: September 27, 2014, 01:54:17 pm »

It would seem this was greatly exaggerated.

http://petapixel.com/2014/09/26/forest-service-delays-decision-controversial-permit-rules-amid-public-outcry/

According to this it wasn't exaggerated at all. What this says is that they got caught with their hand in the cookie jar and the adverse publicity was giving them serious heartburn.
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