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Author Topic: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor  (Read 9275 times)

brntoki

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Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« on: September 07, 2014, 03:18:45 am »

I would be very grateful for a link, or basic rundown here, of how to setup my new monitor, an Eizo CS230-CNX (only sRGB :( ). I'm not terribly new at calibration, profiling, and color management, but I'm looking for a good starting point to match prints to a desktop Epson photo printer (for now). Just a place to get me in the ballpark at least so I can fine tune from there.

I'm wondering mostly about white point and brightness settings.

http://www.eizo.com/global/products/coloredge/cs230/index.html

There are basic tutorials on the Eizo site, but I'm thinking they are a little too general???

Anyway, just a general understanding of the things that go into print matching would be helpful. I've forgotten so much! And I never had much luck with my ancient and, finally, dying Dell panel.
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D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2014, 06:54:36 am »

The Eizo tutorials are general because they have to be. In fact I think they are too specific, if anything. They keep recommending a very low and warm white point (around 5000K and 80-100 cd/m²), which will only work under very special and tightly controlled conditions.

But much of this is best done visually, rather than following a recipe. Basically what you want is a white point that gives you a visual match to paper white. Whatever gets you there will work, depending on your working environment.

Then you want a black point/contrast range that also matches the paper. This is equally important and often underrated. As an example, I work mostly for offset print, and I currently have my black point at 0.5 cd/m², which is fairly high. This gives me a contrast ratio as low as 200:1. It looks pretty dull on screen, but it gives me a reasonably reliable preview of the finished result.

The CG246's advertised contrast range of 1000:1 or so I really have little use for...

The CNX edition has ColorNavigator included, right? If not, get it ASAP. It's a brilliant piece of software. I suggest you use it to set up several targets for different scenarios, which you can then switch on the fly just by clicking on them in the list in the ColorNavigator main window. This not only changes the calibration targets, but also switches to the corresponding display profile at system level (which Photoshop/Lightroom uses to display). The only thing you need to remember is to relaunch PS/Lr so that it can pick up the correct profile at startup.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2014, 07:02:50 am by D Fosse »
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brntoki

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2014, 07:10:51 am »

Yes, it comes with both Navigator and the calibrator puck, so I'm basically set there. It was only about a $100 more for that option than just the display, so I figured I'd be stupid not to spring for that. I'm in Japan and the Eizos aren't too pricey here.

Thanks for the advice.

I suppose I should have asked in the original post, but what is a relatively inexpensive solution for lighting my bedroom/editing studio? As much as I wanted to get a wide gamut display, I was struggling to pull the trigger on the sRGB model, and couldn't bring myself to pay about double for the wide gamut version. So, as is often the case, money is a constraining factor :( .
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D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2014, 08:41:33 am »

Don't worry, the CS230 is a very fine monitor and one of the smartest budget buys out there (and yes, we all have budgets). It's in a league above many wide gamut models like the Dell Ultrasharps and so on.

Wide gamut is nice as a bonus. But basic panel quality is infinitely more important.

As long as you have sensible and consistent room lighting I think you should be good to go; you set your calibration targets accordingly. Windows and shifting outside light is the biggest problem, so you should try to control that. But you obviously can't work in a bunker. Fluorescent tubes should be avoided because of weird spectral spikes and troughs.

Other than that, the Eizo tutorials have good tips for setting up your working environment.
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D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2014, 09:11:21 am »

BTW, the reason the CS230 isn't wide gamut is the same reason the NEC P232 isn't: no wide gamut 23 inch IPS panels exist. LG Display, which is where all IPS panels come from, doesn't make them and so all 23 inch IPS models everywhere are standard gamut.

There used to be an Eizo CG223 and an NEC PA221, both using 22 inch wide gamut VA panels from Samsung. But the VA technology is more or less abandoned by now. It'll be interesting to see whether Samsung's new PLS technology (used in the Eizo CG246) will come in smaller panel sizes and wide gamut.

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brntoki

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2014, 11:19:57 am »

Thanks! Yes, based on my research, what this sRGB panel offered is far more important to me than a lower quality but wide gamut panel. I've struggled with this Dell for a long while now and know that the Eizo is the right choice. I am not going to settle for a non-uniform display, nor one that cannot be calibrated internally rather than through software.

Yes, I think I'm getting a clearer picture of setting up a nice space for my digital darkroom. I was having a hard time finding the right posts through the search function at first, but I've now gotten some good results. I'd read quite a lot on these forums some time ago, but got busy with other projects and forgot many things I had learned.

If you (or anyone else) doesn't mind, could you give me some advice about a graphics card? My current card doesn't offer a display port connection, but only DVI and HDMI. Would it be advisable to upgrade to a card with a display port? According to the Eizo site, I can get a 10 bit signal using the display port connection. Is it that much better? I'm thinking yes, but don't know.
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D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2014, 01:47:04 pm »

AFAIK the CS230 has an 8-bit panel. That's still a whole lot better than the 6-bit + frame rate control of most consumer grade displays.

The advantage of a 10-bit pipeline is to eliminate all traces of banding, with 1024 discrete levels instead of 256. Whether you will see a real difference is questionable as long as the unit is hardware calibrated to an internal 16-bit LUT. This is a more urgent issue with software calibration to the video card, where banding rapidly becomes a real problem.

My CG246 does have a 10 bit panel, but I still haven't upgraded to a 10-bit capable video card. It's just not a high priority.

The thing is to distinguish between "impressive" display and real usefulness as a proofing device. I go for the latter.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2014, 01:50:46 pm by D Fosse »
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Czornyj

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2014, 03:08:00 pm »

AFAIK the CS230 has an 8-bit panel. That's still a whole lot better than the 6-bit + frame rate control of most consumer grade displays.

The advantage of a 10-bit pipeline is to eliminate all traces of banding, with 1024 discrete levels instead of 256. Whether you will see a real difference is questionable as long as the unit is hardware calibrated to an internal 16-bit LUT. This is a more urgent issue with software calibration to the video card, where banding rapidly becomes a real problem.

My CG246 does have a 10 bit panel, but I still haven't upgraded to a 10-bit capable video card. It's just not a high priority.

The thing is to distinguish between "impressive" display and real usefulness as a proofing device. I go for the latter.

Actually CS230 has 6+2HiFRC bit panel. There's virtually no visible difference between 10bit vs 8bit pipeline in real world images, and it only works in PS + Fire Pro/Quadro + Windows configurations.
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Marcin Kałuża | [URL=http://zarzadzaniebarwa

D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2014, 04:36:47 pm »

Well, according to Eizo we're both wrong. They claim 10-bit capability in the CS230:

http://www.eizo.com/global/products/coloredge/cs230/index.html
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Czornyj

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2014, 05:20:07 pm »

It's 6bit + HiFRC panel, 100%.
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Marcin Kałuża | [URL=http://zarzadzaniebarwa

D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2014, 05:29:42 pm »

Not to argue (you usually know what you're talking about) - but how do you know? What specific panel are they using? Is it different from the NEC P232?
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brntoki

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2014, 10:23:32 am »

Actually CS230 has 6+2HiFRC bit panel. There's virtually no visible difference between 10bit vs 8bit pipeline in real world images, and it only works in PS + Fire Pro/Quadro + Windows configurations.

Thanks to you both. I didn't know for sure if the advantage was only with the Fire Pro/Quadro cards, or if any recent card with a display port would offer the 10 bit throughput. Eizo wasn't clear about that . . . Oops! They were:

"Using the DisplayPort input, the monitor offers 10-bit simultaneous color display* from a 16-bit look-up table which means it can show more than one billion colors simultaneously. This is 64 times as many colors as you get with 8-bit display which results in even smoother color gradations and reduced Delta-E between two adjacent colors.
*A graphics board and software which support 10-bit output are also necessary for 10-bit display."

Well, looking forward to get started with this monitor in the next day or two.

Thanks again to you both for your guidance.
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digitaldog

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2014, 12:29:14 pm »

*A graphics board and software which support 10-bit output are also necessary for 10-bit display."
And an OS and application that support it. If you're on a Mac, you're out of luck.
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Author "Color Management for Photographers".

brntoki

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2014, 11:14:12 am »

The Eizo is nice! Right out of the box and it's worlds apart from the Dell! Impressive. I'll probably go through some calibration/profiling tomorrow.

Thanks for the tips, everyone.
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D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2014, 02:10:45 pm »

it's worlds apart from the Dell!

I can believe that. I had a Dell U2410 once, for exactly 22 hours before I returned it and demanded my money back. The thing was a virtual rainbow from left side to right side and totally useless. I still don't understand how they can get away with this.

As it happens, I've just finished setting up a CX240 at home, to complement the CG246 I have in my office at work. Aside from no hood and a limited built-in sensor (will only maintain calibration targets, but not perform a full profiling), they seem pretty identical.

It replaces an NEC P232 which was also a great little monitor, very similar to your CS230. The standard gamut of the NEC didn't bother me for a second. But with these two more or less identical Eizos it will be much easier to work from either system without missing a step, especially since the built-in sensor in the CG can be set to match the i1 Display 3 sensor I use with the CX. Calibration targets will have to be slightly different, though - I seem to end up with 6400K and 115 cd at work; 6300K and 100 at home.
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brntoki

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2014, 12:53:16 pm »

I'm a little confused after running a calibration routine and validating. I've gotten a max delta E of 5.12??? That seems crazy, but the average is .57, and white is .49. I really don't know what to make of that. This is according to color navigator, using the supplied puck (an Eizo branded Spyder4), and relying for now on the Eizo "Photo" target brightness 100 c/dm2, white point of 5500, gamma 2.2. Contrast result is 357:1.

Can someone tell me what all this means? I'm really surprised that I couldn't find any information about acceptable/unacceptable results.
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D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2014, 03:08:58 pm »

That does seem strange and way too high. Is the unit properly warmed up? Did you perform the validation immediately after calibration, and without moving the sensor?

If you click Detail > Validation Record > Detail, you get a list of all the patches used, with delta E values. This should give you an idea of where the problem is.
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brntoki

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2014, 10:46:25 pm »

Yes, the monitor was warmed up for a couple hours before calibrating. I did move the puck, but replaced it where it was supposed to go when validating.

I looked at the detail report but was a little confused as to what I was looking at. I think I understand it better now and will look again. From memory, black was whacked (but even then, I wasn't sure because I couldn't find any info about how to read/interpret the results).
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brntoki

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2014, 11:31:45 pm »

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwudOi4bS0JIaTI3MGtRcWFYU1U/edit?usp=sharing

Hopefully you will be able to see this PDF. If not, let me know. It seems, basically, the darker colors are not validating well.
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D Fosse

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Re: Link or advice to setup new Eizo monitor
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2014, 02:19:28 am »

Yeah, it's the black patch. Nothing to worry about since you have black point at minimum. With the default settings, this will attempt to maximize contrast (deepest possible black) at the expense of accuracy.

Skip the presets and create a new target. Check "set the target black level" and lift it a little bit - 0.3 or 0.4 is a realistic starting point. Minimum black is fine for watching movies, but not really useful for proofing prints.

Then in the next step you have three options for "priority". Check "Gray Balance" here. With this setting, gray balance is maintained at the white point temperature all the way down to black:
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