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Author Topic: stops on velvia and provia  (Read 2525 times)

bambanx

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stops on velvia and provia
« on: August 29, 2014, 04:56:14 am »

Hello Guys,
- using fuji velvia if i meter with a spot meter the eg. the sun(my highlight) on sunset, how many stops i need for add light necesary for keep on hightlights?
- if i meter using spot meter the same film, a shadow how many stops for reduce the light and keep that shadows in deep shadows .
in resume how many stops i have in the scale of a velvia and provia?
thanks very much.
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2014, 05:20:48 am »

Hi,

When I was shooting Velvia I used +1.5 stop for non specular highlights and -2.0 for shadow detail. My Spotmeter F had highligh and shadow settings, may have been +2.3 and -2.7 on the Spotmeter but I felt my values worked better.

Same for Provia, really.

Best regards
Erik


Hello Guys,
- using fuji velvia if i meter with a spot meter the eg. the sun(my highlight) on sunset, how many stops i need for add light necesary for keep on hightlights?
- if i meter using spot meter the same film, a shadow how many stops for reduce the light and keep that shadows in deep shadows .
in resume how many stops i have in the scale of a velvia and provia?
thanks very much.
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Erik Kaffehr
 

bambanx

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2014, 05:45:44 am »

thanks for the reply , i have a sekonic 758 dr just a few days, i am not sure how use it , but in base about you said, is correct for example in a sunset meter direct on the sun or very close to it, and it give me the neutral and the next is give a +1.5 stop of light ?
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epines

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2014, 10:24:01 am »

Simplest answer is, for a highlight with detail (for example, a person's white shirt, or a light-colored wall), spot-meter it and open two stops. For a shadow with detail, spot-meter it and close two stops. Shoot a roll while bracketing in half-stops around these exposures, keep notes, and see which exposures you like the best.

But I wouldn't meter the actual sun and then close down two stops. What you'll end up is a fireball with detail, and a dark shot all the way around it. At sunset, you could try metering a little to the side of the sun, then open one stop. Again, bracket, keep notes, and see which you like. There's no exact formula for exposure, especially at a subjective time like sunset. Different exposures will give you different moods. Depends if you want light and airy, or more saturated (a bit darker), or even more moody (even more dark).

bambanx

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Re:
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2014, 04:37:07 pm »

Thanks very much epines , will try what you say.
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bambanx

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Re:
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2014, 04:54:43 pm »

Epines and the same question for ektar ? Negatives has more latituded a i know. Thanks again
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epines

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2014, 01:41:34 am »

I've never used Ektar, but color negatives have much more latitude. If I'm using a spot meter, I tend to rate the film at box ISO. I've shot test rolls showing detail in zone 1 (closing down four stops from meter reading) and zones 9-10 (opening up 4-5 stops from meter reading). I wouldn't be surprised if you could still hold detail past there. Color negs hold highlights very well. That being said, it's generally good to give them nice solid exposure. At box ISO, the shadows in zones 0-2 can look pretty thin and grainy / noisy. When using an incident meter, I rate the negs at one stop over box ISO (e.g., I rate a 400 film at ISO 200). 

As for the sunset question, I'd say the same advice applies. There's no formula, but a safe bet is to place the highlights (but not the sun itself) at zone 7, two stops open from your meter reading. Bracket in full stops (half-stops are pretty hard to see on color negs) and see which exposure suits you the most.

Again, the best way to answer your questions is to shoot a few test rolls. You could probably shoot two rolls, bracket, keep notes, and learn what you like, how you like to rate your film, what zone 6 and zone 7 highlights look like, etc.

Bear in mind, with color negs, using proofsheets or small prints to evaluate your results is tough. An individual negative can be printed to look just right, or too dark, or too light, etc. I'd just compare the negatives themselves. See which one has detail everywhere you want it without having blocked-up, too-dense highlights.

Chris Livsey

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2014, 02:54:41 am »

It is essential when using colour negatives to have a good relationship with whoever is scanning.
If you run a test roll varying by a stop a shot across a broad range and then run the processing/scan at a mini-lab for quick results all the prints will look similar as they will scan to "normal"  and push or pull each frame.

This pro lab for example, no affiliation except I pay them, has good pages of how exposure really affects negative stock and the looks the scanner cn achieve.

http://ukfilmlab.com/2014/04/24/film-stock-and-exposure-comparisons-kodak-portra-and-fuji/

Don't forget you can push as well for another "look"

http://ukfilmlab.com/2013/11/14/kodak-ektar-fuji-400h-pushed/

Richard Photo lab in the USA has a reputation for top quality work, no doubt others here will have used them, rather than link them this post explains in plain terms what is going on with pro labs.

http://www.johnnypatience.com/richard-photo-lab/


Remember: with Velvia you decide the look, with exposure and filtration, the lab just develops. with negative you just expose (with some control) and the lab decides the look, it's up to you to work with them so they know what you want.

Have fun  ;D
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jerome_m

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2014, 05:28:16 am »

A very simple trick to get correct exposure: put the palm on your hand under the same light as the subject, and make sure your meter reading is "+1". The palm of your hand is used as a gray card, but you always have it with you.

The colour of the palm is also fairly constant amongst various people, since this area does not tan.


Edit: I wrongly wrote "close one stop" at first, which is the opposite of what is needed. The palm is one stop lighter than a gray card. When using a camera built-in meter in manual mode (the only meter or mode for which this trick is useful as external meters can directly read incident light), there is usually some indication of the value by which one overexposes. That value should be +1.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2014, 10:53:58 am by jerome_m »
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Alan Klein

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2014, 10:16:10 am »

I bracket +1 and -1 stop using box speed of ASA50 for my Velvia 50 shots https://www.flickr.com/photos/alanklein2000/tags/velvia/

Especially important during "magic hour".  Play with bracketing, record what your exposure settings were, and then compare to the results for future guidance.

At sunset, only a grad ND filter will help and even then the difference may be too great to capture.  Think about silhouettes as a possibility and forget shadow details. 

epines

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2014, 10:41:48 am »

Very useful tip, with one note -- you should open 1 stop from the meter reading of your palm, not close 1 stop.

ErikKaffehr

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2014, 12:50:22 pm »

Alan,

Thanks for sharing!

Best regards
Erik

I bracket +1 and -1 stop using box speed of ASA50 for my Velvia 50 shots https://www.flickr.com/photos/alanklein2000/tags/velvia/

Especially important during "magic hour".  Play with bracketing, record what your exposure settings were, and then compare to the results for future guidance.

At sunset, only a grad ND filter will help and even then the difference may be too great to capture.  Think about silhouettes as a possibility and forget shadow details. 
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Lorenzo Pierucci

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2014, 02:10:04 pm »

Hi,

When I was shooting Velvia I used +1.5 stop for non specular highlights and -2.0 for shadow detail. My Spotmeter F had highligh and shadow settings, may have been +2.3 and -2.7 on the Spotmeter but I felt my values worked better.

Same for Provia, really.

Best regards
Erik

+1


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bambanx

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2014, 12:02:45 pm »

thanks for the advices guys , first tests with velvia and digitized with my nikon today in morning , i think i can improve the digitizing becouse it was very quick setup and the negatives was with dust , not flat at all .

last two shoots are :
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ivanvilches/ 
thanks again
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Lorenzo Pierucci

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Re: stops on velvia and provia
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2014, 10:34:53 pm »

To my experience, those are the colour u looking for in Velvia
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