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Author Topic: Aperture or Lightroom ??  (Read 66032 times)

Bob Rockefeller

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #80 on: July 01, 2014, 07:25:28 AM »

The thing about the modules is not so much about the context switch between the Library and Develop modules. But that's what you hear most about - probably due to Lightroom's lag in switching (it should be seamless).

It's more about the pervasive non-modalness of Aperture. For example, if you are making a book and you see a photo that's not cropped right, you can crop it right there in the book tool. Does it need to be a little brighter? Fix it right there.

You can use the loupe over a thumbnail in the light table. And so on. Almost all the tools are available almost all the time, regardless of what tool you're working with. THAT's what's really different between the two.
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john beardsworth

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #81 on: July 01, 2014, 07:34:47 AM »

Or to put it another way, Lightroom offers dedicated full-screen workspaces so you focus on the task you're performing. Aperture makes everything available all the time, so you don't need to focus.
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jjj

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #82 on: July 01, 2014, 06:12:15 PM »

Or to put it another way, Lightroom offers dedicated full-screen workspaces so you focus on the task you're performing. Aperture makes everything available all the time, so you don't need to focus.
Or to put it yet another way, Aperture has a load of irrelevant features taking up space on your monitor  :P
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jjj

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #83 on: July 01, 2014, 06:33:14 PM »

It's more about the pervasive non-modalness of Aperture. For example, if you are making a book and you see a photo that's not cropped right, you can crop it right there in the book tool.
If you can even work out how to use the crop tool. Never been stumped by such a basic tool before. And as for all the stupid pallets that clutter up the workspace, dear me. What is the point of 2 crop UI sections, one in the adjustments tab and one obscuring the image. I guess the Ap interface must appeal to those whose monitors look like this.....
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jjj

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #84 on: July 01, 2014, 06:38:43 PM »

On another thread, someone was espousing how uncluttered Ap was compared to LR Yet hard to get any less minimal than LR without removing all the tools. And yet Ap still has those floating pallets that are so last century. Calling them HUDs doesn't change that.


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CatOne

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #85 on: July 01, 2014, 07:14:42 PM »

Or to put it another way, Lightroom offers dedicated full-screen workspaces so you focus on the task you're performing. Aperture makes everything available all the time, so you don't need to focus.

Well I think that's a bit reductive ;-)

As someone who started with Aperture, I can't overstate how frustrating the "modal" workflow can be. It is EXTREMELY common when I'm in LR's Library module to look at a photo and to not be able to make a decision on whether it's a keeper until I level a horizon or something. In Aperture, it's G + rotate + A and I'm done in less than a second. In LR I have to hit D or R, then wait a second for the image to re-render, and then switch back. It's at least 3x as long and it's a mess. And I have never, ever gotten used to it. "Don't have to focus" isn't really a fair characterization; it's just the clunkiness is continually thrust in my face when doing just a few simple things I want to do.

jjj

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #86 on: July 02, 2014, 11:30:45 AM »

Well I think that's a bit reductive ;-)
Or nail, Head. Hit.  :P

Quote
As someone who started with Aperture, I can't overstate how frustrating the "modal" workflow can be. It is EXTREMELY common when I'm in LR's Library module to look at a photo and to not be able to make a decision on whether it's a keeper until I level a horizon or something. In Aperture, it's G + rotate + A and I'm done in less than a second. In LR I have to hit D or R, then wait a second for the image to re-render, and then switch back. It's at least 3x as long and it's a mess. And I have never, ever gotten used to it. "Don't have to focus" isn't really a fair characterization; it's just the clunkiness is continually thrust in my face when doing just a few simple things I want to do.
Why not simply stay in Dev module and rate/flag/cull there?   ???  Sounds like you are the one making things complicated.
Nearly every criticism I've come across of LR from Ap users is solved by their learning to use LR correctly and I'm sure the reverse is also quite likely. Not that LR is without flaws, certainly plenty of places where LR could be improved.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 12:34:42 PM by jjj »
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James R

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #87 on: July 03, 2014, 02:23:08 AM »

Well I think that's a bit reductive ;-)

As someone who started with Aperture, I can't overstate how frustrating the "modal" workflow can be. It is EXTREMELY common when I'm in LR's Library module to look at a photo and to not be able to make a decision on whether it's a keeper until I level a horizon or something. In Aperture, it's G + rotate + A and I'm done in less than a second. In LR I have to hit D or R, then wait a second for the image to re-render, and then switch back. It's at least 3x as long and it's a mess. And I have never, ever gotten used to it. "Don't have to focus" isn't really a fair characterization; it's just the clunkiness is continually thrust in my face when doing just a few simple things I want to do.

In Library mode, you hit R and you are in crop mode where you can rotate, level, crop, etc. Hitting G E brings you back.  I don't see this taking 3X  longer.  Getting familiar with Lr shortcuts will help.
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budjames

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #88 on: July 03, 2014, 02:49:30 AM »

I guess with Apple's recent announcement to discontinue development of Aperture, this old debate can now be retired. Long live Lightroom! Hoorah!

Although I own and use both programs, but for different reasons, I'm now very happy that I have always used Lightroom for my "serious" photography.

Cheers.
Bud

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jjj

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #89 on: July 03, 2014, 04:37:57 AM »

In Library mode, you hit R and you are in crop mode where you can rotate, level, crop, etc. Hitting G E brings you back.  I don't see this taking 3X  longer.  Getting familiar with Lr shortcuts will help.
He is using LR shortcuts, but you don't actually need to switch back, which is one thing that needs learning. Plus if you render all your previews on import then switching back and for between modules is instant. No different from switching tabs in Ap.
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James R

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #90 on: July 03, 2014, 05:07:46 AM »

He is using LR shortcuts, but you don't actually need to switch back, which is one thing that needs learning. Plus if you render all your previews on import then switching back and for between modules is instant. No different from switching tabs in Ap.

I read his complaint to mean he wanted to round trip to Dev mod to Library mod and thought it was too slow.  I have never used Ap, been using Lr since its inception.   
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trichardlin

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #91 on: July 04, 2014, 02:21:36 AM »

I read his complaint to mean he wanted to round trip to Dev mod to Library mod and thought it was too slow.  I have never used Ap, been using Lr since its inception.   

Ok, all you LR experts here, can you help me with this: in the Library mode, I would look at a photo, perhaps clicking at it to zoom in and out, then swipe my mouse (on a Mac) thinking I can to go to the next photo (since my hand is already on the mouse).  Instead, LR would advance some random number of photos rather than going to the next photo.  Is there a way to fix this?

Here's another question, in Library mode, I would look at a photo, decide that I don't like it and hit the 'delete' key to delete it.  If I then use the arrow key or mouse swipe to go to the next photo, LR would toss me all the way to the end of the library.  I would then have to browse my way back to where I was.  This doesn't seem to make any sense.  What am I doing wrong here?
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hjulenissen

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #92 on: July 04, 2014, 02:34:00 AM »

...Getting familiar with Lr shortcuts will help.
Sure. And that is one of my gripes with Adobe software products. User interfaces should ideally let you do what you want fast and intuitively. Shortcuts fixes the "fast" part, but hardly the "intuitive" part.

Lightroom is the most intuitive Adobe product that I have used (and the only that I have been satisfied with), but there is still a disconnect between the hints and feedback that the interface gives you, and the actual operations that you want to do. People spending many hours with the product will develop variable degrees of skills that allows them to work around UI warts, but I am guessing that they would prefer to be more productive from day#1. That is probably one reason why Microsoft Word "won" over Word Perfect.

I am not claiming that designing a UI is easy.

-h
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sbay

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #93 on: July 04, 2014, 05:58:58 PM »

Ok, all you LR experts here, can you help me with this: in the Library mode, I would look at a photo, perhaps clicking at it to zoom in and out, then swipe my mouse (on a Mac) thinking I can to go to the next photo (since my hand is already on the mouse).  Instead, LR would advance some random number of photos rather than going to the next photo.  Is there a way to fix this?

I think you need to use a very small finger movement instead of a full swipe (think of it more like scrolling). If I'm not careful it's easy to advance too far.

Quote
Here's another question, in Library mode, I would look at a photo, decide that I don't like it and hit the 'delete' key to delete it.  If I then use the arrow key or mouse swipe to go to the next photo, LR would toss me all the way to the end of the library.  I would then have to browse my way back to where I was.  This doesn't seem to make any sense.  What am I doing wrong here?

Not sure what's going on here. When I delete a photo, LR automatically advances me to the next one without any additional actions.
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Hywel

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #94 on: July 05, 2014, 11:34:50 AM »

Or to put it another way, Lightroom offers dedicated full-screen workspaces so you focus on the task you're performing. Aperture makes everything available all the time, so you don't need to focus.

John, I'm sorry to go all ad hominem on you... but why do you hang around Aperture boards making snarky comments about software you plainly don't like?

I don't hang around the LR5 boards doing likewise.

And why can you not accept that some people demonstrably do find the modal nature of Lightroom fecking annoying? It's not like the modality is up for discussion.

Kindly stop preaching at me and telling me how I should want to do what is both my artistic vision and my job.

Regards,

  Hywel Phillips


« Last Edit: July 05, 2014, 11:36:40 AM by Hywel »
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john beardsworth

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #95 on: July 05, 2014, 12:12:19 PM »

John, I'm sorry to go all ad hominem on you... but why do you hang around Aperture boards making snarky comments about software you plainly don't like?

I don't hang around the LR5 boards doing likewise.

And why can you not accept that some people demonstrably do find the modal nature of Lightroom fecking annoying? It's not like the modality is up for discussion.

Kindly stop preaching at me and telling me how I should want to do what is both my artistic vision and my job.

Regards,

  Hywel Phillips

Maybe you should ask yourself why you take my comment so personally? You look after your posts, I'll look after mine.
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Hywel

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #96 on: July 05, 2014, 12:30:21 PM »

Maybe you should ask yourself why you take my comment so personally? You look after your posts, I'll look after mine.

I just wonder at the apparent need to tell other photographers how ill-disciplined their preferred workflow is, that's all.

I most certainly shall look after my posts.

Hywel Phillips
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john beardsworth

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #97 on: July 05, 2014, 12:45:16 PM »

I just wonder at the apparent need to tell other photographers how ill-disciplined their preferred workflow is, that's all.

Sure, I said Aperture allows a less disciplined workflow, and I feel the different approaches appeal to different personality types. But if you want to infer it the way you do, that's not my problem.
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Bruce MacNeil

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #98 on: July 05, 2014, 01:29:47 PM »

Aperture is the only truly reliable professional data management tool available.

Expect that the new "Photo" app from Apple will be head and shoulders above.
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john beardsworth

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Re: Aperture or Lightroom ??
« Reply #99 on: July 05, 2014, 01:38:19 PM »

Said with a straight face, too.
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