Cost of 44x33 Sony "MF" sensor?

[BernardLanguillier]

Team,

Lloyd chamber published this intriguing piece this morning: http://www.diglloyd.com/

He writes that the cost of the Sony 44x33 sensor should be around 2000~2,500~3,500 US$.

My personal belief is that is probably only half that, especially if we are talking about actual cost that Sony camera would have to pay to Sony Semi-Conductor, and not the external price to other companies.

Any educated guesses about how much it would cost for me to buy 10,000 of those sensors from Sony?

Cheers,
Bernard

[yaya]

Any educated guesses about how much it would cost for me to buy 10,000 of those sensors from Sony?
Cheers,
Bernard

If the figures are correct then it would be $35M

But jokes aside, a mirrorless, interchangeable lens, leaf-shuttered camera with a Sony 50MP CMOS sensor has just been announced...

Phase One iXU 150

BR

Yair

[Schewe]

Nope...but if you had a check to place the order, I'll be you could get a really good deal...

[eronald]

Well, I don't want to guess, as I would like to purchase some of these for the open source back project
Just got another query today from somebody who would also like to do a cheaper back.
I would be very very surprised if Dalsa, Truesense and CMOSIS do not quickly announce their own larger CMOS sensors.

Edmund

Team,

Lloyd chamber published this intriguing piece this morning: http://www.diglloyd.com/

He writes that the cost of the Sony 44x33 sensor should be around 2000~2,500~3,500 US$.

My personal belief is that is probably only half that, especially if we are talking about actual cost that Sony camera would have to pay to Sony Semi-Conductor, and not the external price to other companies.

Any educated guesses about how much it would cost for me to buy 10,000 of those sensors from Sony?

Cheers,
Bernard

[MrSmith]

According to sony rumour sites they are bringing out their own camera based around the 50mp chip. While it's just a rumour they do have a partnership with zeiss who have experience with lenses for such a system so it's perfectly feasible that they have something in development. What shape or form that takes is just guesswork.

[hjulenissen]

According to sony rumour sites they are bringing out their own camera based around the 50mp chip. While it's just a rumour they do have a partnership with zeiss who have experience with lenses for such a system so it's perfectly feasible that they have something in development. What shape or form that takes is just guesswork.

Judging by their other camera products, they seem able and willing to try out different camera concepts at a fast pace.

An "A9" mirrorless with the MF CMOS at an aggressive price point (scavenging what they could from the A7) would sure be interesting. Not sure that their MF sensor customers would like such a move though.

-h

[bcooter]

According to sony rumour sites they are bringing out their own camera based around the 50mp chip. While it's just a rumour they do have a partnership with zeiss who have experience with lenses for such a system so it's perfectly feasible that they have something in development. What shape or form that takes is just guesswork.

At this point do you call it medium format?

What I mean is medium format really came from 6x6, 6x7, 645 film cameras that were retro fitted with digital sensors that almost . . . then finally filled the frame.

Now with the cmos sensor they're going smaller again, so if someone comes out with a complete new camera, maybe even mirrorless, then is it medium format or is it just a larger digital camera?

I don't really see the Leica S2 as a "medium format" camera.   If so then to me it's just a modern version of a Pentax 6x7, kind of a big 35mm camera. 

Anyway.

I also read that same rumor and Sony said they're camera wouldn't compete with the standard medium format customers.  I don't know what that means, other than they might go mirroless, or maybe they just go so low in price that it doesn't compete on a price point.

Regardless, I'll bet that Phase camera Yair linked to is referred to it's users as just "a camera".    Can you see guys that are assembling a spy drone to say, hey Harold, don't give the the dslr, give me the Phase One Medium Format Digital Capture Camera?

IMO

BC

[MrSmith]

MF is a state of mind not a 6x6 box.
 

[Theodoros]

If the figures are correct then it would be $35M

But jokes aside, a mirrorless, interchangeable lens, leaf-shuttered camera with a Sony 50MP CMOS sensor has just been announced...

Phase One iXU 150

BR

Yair

I wonder when you'll be releasing your version of a 50mp sensor based Credo MFDB Yair… I suspect it shouldn't be long…

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi,

I would guess Sony may have a 44x33 recording module, usable with different mounts. A short flange distance would make it possible. It would be possible to adapt to different lens systems, pretty much like A7/A7r but larger bayonet. EVF and HDMI output, possibly 4K.


Best regards
Erik

[design_freak]

At this point do you call it medium format?

What I mean is medium format really came from 6x6, 6x7, 645 film cameras that were retro fitted with digital sensors that almost . . . then finally filled the frame.

Now with the cmos sensor they're going smaller again, so if someone comes out with a complete new camera, maybe even mirrorless, then is it medium format or is it just a larger digital camera?

I don't really see the Leica S2 as a "medium format" camera.   If so then to me it's just a modern version of a Pentax 6x7, kind of a big 35mm camera. 

Anyway.

I also read that same rumor and Sony said they're camera wouldn't compete with the standard medium format customers.  I don't know what that means, other than they might go mirroless, or maybe they just go so low in price that it doesn't compete on a price point.

Regardless, I'll bet that Phase camera Yair linked to is referred to it's users as just "a camera".    Can you see guys that are assembling a spy drone to say, hey Harold, don't give the the dslr, give me the Phase One Medium Format Digital Capture Camera?

IMO

BC

+1

[hjulenissen]

At this point do you call it medium format?

I don't know. Does it matter what it is called?

I am guessing that for those people who bought the D800(e) or the A7r for landscape photography, wanting the highest (system) spatial resolution possible with a single shot on a budget and with constraints on weight, having 50MP in a cheap-ish, small-ish package with good CDAF/focus peaking, that offered new lens options might be tempting.

Could/would Sony sell an MF A9 for $5000, if it offered the same platform as the A7 except sensor and lens mount?

-h

[Kolor-Pikker]

Barring sensor size, if Sony chooses to make a consumer-oriented high ISO monster without leaf shutter lenses and fast tethering capability, it's likely going to create competition more for high-res DSLRs and the future Pentax, rather than anything from Phase or Hasselblad.

[Justinr]

Barring sensor size, if Sony chooses to make a consumer-oriented high ISO monster without leaf shutter lenses and fast tethering capability, it's likely going to create competition more for high-res DSLRs and the future Pentax, rather than anything from Phase or Hasselblad.

Future Pentax?

Pentax have been playing along for years now about FF, I for one got tired of waiting and switched to Nikon, so am I to regret my impatience?

[BJL]

At this point do you call it medium format?

What I mean is medium format really came from 6x6, 6x7, 645 film cameras that were retro fitted with digital sensors that almost . . . then finally filled the frame.

Now with the cmos sensor they're going smaller again ...

Not really: the 44x33mm format is already used in multiple current CCD cameras; indeed it is the format used by the greatest number of DMF systems (all except Leica, whose 45x30mm format is no bigger).  The pay-off for Sony is immediately being able to sell it to three makers: Phase One, Hasselblad and Pentax. So all I see is a plan of starting with the "MF" option that promises the highest sales volume and revenues and probably also the lowest R&D costs, before upscaling even further.


But I agree that the name "medium format" is dubious: all sizes from 36x24mm up are way above medium in the digital still camera world, with 54x42mm probably locked in as the largest single-shot sensor format we will see, so these sensors would better be called "large digital formats".


P. S. I note that Phase One already offers multiple cameras with no optical viewfinder: its technical cameras like the iXR models for document/art reproduction and the iXA (and now iXU) models for aerial photography.  These are dependent on tethere operation, and so are likely to benefit greatly from the vastly superior live view capabilities of modern CMOS active pixel sensors (called "APS" in the trade, just to confuse us).  With the dependence of "artistic" medium format cameras on sensors developments driven by other "technical" camera uses like this, this is one more reason why I expect such sensors to take-over from CCDs in "medium format" over the next one or two model generations. Fortunately, those uses like big formats for as much image detail as possible, so I expect them to drive CMOS formats towards full 645 frame coverage.

[Theodoros]

I guess the term MF has the meaning of "larger image area than 135" these days… I don't know if the term LF is of sense anymore…

[synn]

In the film days, 6x6/ 6x7 was "Medium format" because there was 4x5 and 8x10 above it.
In digital, full frame MF sensors are the large format now since there's nothing bigger. In that perspective, 44x33 is definitely "Medium format".

[uaiomex]

If 44x33 being 68% bigger than 24x36 is medium format, then 54x42 being 56% bigger than 44x33 is large format? Furthermore, a true real film 645 was 56x42.5. So, a true digital 645 sensor would be 64% bigger than 44x33.            Eduardo

[synn]

I am talking in terms of relativity. Not mathematics.
Feel free to reach your own conclusions.

[eronald]

I am talking in terms of relativity. Not mathematics.

Ah. A physicist
Cost is relative too

Edmund