Any experiences with the Sinar Xact back?

[henrikfoto]

Can anyone tell me how the quality of results are from this back compared to the 54H etc?
I also wonder if the new Sinar captureflow is better than the older Captureshop ?

[Theodoros]

Can anyone tell me how the quality of results are from this back compared to the 54H etc?
I also wonder if the new Sinar captureflow is better than the older Captureshop ?

I'm curious as well… does it do 16x the way that the old 22mp backs did? …Hasselblad 200ms doesn't, it has a "new" 6x mode that creates wonder on its performance, that one looks promising but does it do the same way as my Imacon 528c does? Up to now, I've never seen anything matching my back for still performance, but I haven't tried this one, nor I know anyone that has…

[henrikfoto]

I'm curious as well… does it do 16x the way that the old 22mp backs did? …Hasselblad 200ms doesn't, it has a "new" 6x mode that creates wonder on its performance, that one looks promising but does it do the same way as my Imacon 528c does? Up to now, I've never seen anything matching my back for still performance, but I haven't tried this one, nor I know anyone that has…

Yes the Xact does 4 and 16 shots like the old 22 mp backs.
But it is 48 mp. I am wondering if it is even harder than with the 22 mp to do
100% steady 16-shots? (Bacause the movements must be less than half between
each shot)

[Theodoros]

Yes the Xact does 4 and 16 shots like the old 22 mp backs.
But it is 48 mp. I am wondering if it is even harder than with the 22 mp to do
100% steady 16-shots? (Bacause the movements must be less than half between
each shot)

It seems that 16x wasn't available to backs with lower than 9μm size, because lower than 4.5μm movement was difficult to control accurately via a piezzo electric crystal, all backs using higher resolution sensors where able of 4x only… If they've achieve accuracy within 3μm …that surely is quite an achievement! I have 100% success with all my 16x shots using my 528c after mastering all aspects that influence MS, I surely want to try the E-xact beast!
My up to now experience is that if 16x is done correctly using an old 22mp back, it beats both a Cruse scanner and a scanning back for large painting reproduction, if accuracy of the E-xact is the same, the result will be extraterrestrial! …a phenomenon of an image!

[EricWHiss]

I'm also interested in these and would to see some sample files and hear from anyone using them.
16 shot with 48mp back has to be amazing!

[Theodoros]

I'm also interested in these and would to see some sample files and hear from anyone using them.
16 shot with 48mp back has to be amazing!

If a lens able to cope with 6μm pixel will be used, like your 90micro or my 120m Apo, Nyquist limit should be increased significantly! If one has total control of vibration, (and I mean total) the linear resolution increase should be of 20 maybe 30%! A real experience… it will make eyes like...

[Theodoros]

It seems that there are no users of the back…  Maybe Steven Hendrix can give us more info on the product? …lets hope that Steven will share his experience or knowledge with it. 

[Atina]

Hm? No one? That is strange.

eXact is not a full-frame-medium-format back?

I believe that the New York City studio Davies and Starr use the Sinar back for their product photography.

[torger]

The Sinar eXact is built around the 6um 48x36mm 48 megapixel Dalsa sensor. I'd love if there were a Leaf Aptus or other non-tethered back with that sensor, but there's not...

I think Sinar is a bit stronger in Europe and in reproduction / product, and those people probable don't use the internet, so we don't see much about the Sinar products in the forums :-)

[Atina]

"6um"?  

Apple photographer Peter Belanger uses a Sinar too, but with a Phase One back:

http://www.theverge.com/2013/5/8/4311868/the-illusion-of-simplicity-photographer-peter-belanger-on-shooting

[Steve Hendrix]

We have several Sinar eXact installations. You would find them primarily in the museum or an institutional archiving environment.

You are correct that the results are more challenging than with lower resolution 16 shot capture solutions (6mp/11mp/16mp/22mp). But it can be done, it simply needs the sum of all elements to be at their optimum in terms of stability and vibration - shutter/camera/digital back/camera support/flooring/environment, etc.

If anyone would like some sample comparisons between 54H and eXact, we can supply those (as well as between other MFD products).


Steve Hendrix
Capture Integration

[Theodoros]

We have several Sinar eXact installations. You would find them primarily in the museum or an institutional archiving environment.

You are correct that the results are more challenging than with lower resolution 16 shot capture solutions (6mp/11mp/16mp/22mp). But it can be done, it simply needs the sum of all elements to be at their optimum in terms of stability and vibration - shutter/camera/digital back/camera support/flooring/environment, etc.

If anyone would like some sample comparisons between 54H and eXact, we can supply those (as well as between other MFD products).


Steve Hendrix
Capture Integration

Why I have a feeling that it must be seriously better than 200MS? ….In my opinion (judging from what I've seen from 4x shot comparisons), Sinar should provide a 16x capable version of the 75H… I believe that the 7.2μm pixel is ideal in size to provide both wide lens compatibility and enough size to make 16x shots as easy as with 9μm pixel size sensors… 132mp combined with 16X quality should be enough for any project of any size or accuracy needed. ….a "dream back" IMO, especially if they would make it "self contained" for single shots (like my 528c is), combined with the superb Dalsa 33mp image quality, it would be the most "complete" back around. But again, why not increase the size of the sensor to 53.8x40.6mm and provide 41.5mp for single shot and 166mp for 16x, also being self contained…. That would be the back for my Contax 645! 

[Theodoros]

"6um"?  

Apple photographer Peter Belanger uses a Sinar too, but with a Phase One back:

http://www.theverge.com/2013/5/8/4311868/the-illusion-of-simplicity-photographer-peter-belanger-on-shooting

P1 doesn't do MS backs… He obviously doesn't shoot still subjects.

[Theodoros]

The Sinar eXact is built around the 6um 48x36mm 48 megapixel Dalsa sensor. I'd love if there were a Leaf Aptus or other non-tethered back with that sensor, but there's not...

I think Sinar is a bit stronger in Europe and in reproduction / product, and those people probable don't use the internet, so we don't see much about the Sinar products in the forums :-)

Actually the sensor is the same as the P65+/IQ160/260, only cropped down to 36x48mm and 48mp.

[henrikfoto]

We have several Sinar eXact installations. You would find them primarily in the museum or an institutional archiving environment.

You are correct that the results are more challenging than with lower resolution 16 shot capture solutions (6mp/11mp/16mp/22mp). But it can be done, it simply needs the sum of all elements to be at their optimum in terms of stability and vibration - shutter/camera/digital back/camera support/flooring/environment, etc.

If anyone would like some sample comparisons between 54H and eXact, we can supply those (as well as between other MFD products).


Steve Hendrix
Capture Integration

Hi Steve!

I would very much like to see some comparisons between 54H, Xact and an 80 mp back.
Is it possible?

Henrik

[Theodoros]

Hi Steve!

I would very much like to see some comparisons between 54H, Xact and an 80 mp back.
Is it possible?

Henrik

What? ….54H shot 16X vs. 80mp back? ….forget about it, the 80mp back doesn't stand a chance… not even comparable!   54H vs. Exact will be very close depending on subject size… for painting reproduction, I would say that Exact will start showing some slight evidence of advantage for painting sizes more than one square meter, which would start growing there after… I expect the E-xact to beat a Cruse scanner for large paintings… Heck, (this maybe hard to believe but its true) if 16X is done correctly and a top quality MF lens is used, even a 22mp back shot in 16x (just) beats the Cruse! …but, there are two key words on that statement...
1."done correctly"... some people think that they are doing 16x correctly because they get a successful result which impresses them… they only realise that their outcome is poor (for 16x) only after they see their first really correctly done 16x shot… 
2."top quality MF lens"... no great LF lens is better than a great MF lens… 

[henrikfoto]

Which mf lenses do you use for 16 shots?

[EricWHiss]

Steve,
Maybe you know - do these Sinar Xact backs come in either the Rollei 6008 or Hy6 mounts? 


I've compared quite carefully my Leaf AFi-ii 12 (80mp) vs the CF 528 (22mp) in 16 shot mode on some art reproduction work of priceless paintings (which I can't share) using the same exact lens the Rollei Schneider 90mm APO Macro and the results are quite close - so close the processing makes the difference - but you have to use detail recovery software on the Leaf to have it match the CF 528.  Interestingly, when you apply the same recovery software on the 528 files you can't pull up the same gains, probably because it was so much better to start with.   The 528 has more DR than the Leaf in multishot mode and probably better color detail, but its possible that more accurate larger color could be coming from the Leaf.  The multishot just picks up subtle details the single shots can not.  Even with the 22mp m/s back, the only contest the 80mp comes out clearly ahead is in workflow and ease of use.

I regularly use my CF 528 as a 'scanner' for negatives and for this work, the 4 shot or 16 shot modes are ideal.  Compared to scanning the 16 shot mode isn't all that bad and I prefer the results to my 80mp back in this application as well. Occasionally the film grain messes up the multishot math in a few spots, so this is way more tedious than a single shot, but I do it because well I think this is an area where you see the difference.

I would expect the 48mp multishot back to produce some stunning files when used in the right application.

 

[henrikfoto]

From what I am told the Sinarback 86, which is the same sensor as xact but just 4 shot,
produces very comparable results to the 54H in 16 shots.

So the Xact in 16 shots should be the xtreme?

[Theodoros]

Which mf lenses do you use for 16 shots?

90% (unless the distance to subject is limited by factors that one cannot overcome, I use the Zeiss 120macro APO at f11 or f8 on Contax 645…