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Author Topic: Ten Years after….  (Read 10000 times)

eronald

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #20 on: February 17, 2014, 03:15:43 PM »

'Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit' - Oscar Wilde

I think the appropriateness of wit is best preached by Pope :)

Edmund
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Chris Livsey

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #21 on: February 17, 2014, 03:30:01 PM »

The full "quote" is also given as :- "Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit, but the highest form of intelligence."
It does not appear in any of his writings that have been published and is attributed to him, without evidence, of having once said it.

I shoot a P20 to show I am on topic  ;D
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Manoli

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #22 on: February 17, 2014, 04:25:42 PM »

I think the appropriateness of wit is best preached by Pope

Alexander or Francis ?
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #23 on: February 17, 2014, 04:40:07 PM »

Bernard, I'm so grateful for the clarification. I now realise the error of my ways. I'm at such a huge disadvantage that I might as well toss my piece of crap of a camera into a hole and be done with it.

As always your D800 images just scream superiority.

It takes a great man to confess his mistakes, congratulations!

But I do apologize in case my comments affected the resell value of your 22mp back even a cent!  ;D

As far as my images go, well they are what they are amidst the constraints that are mine, but the interesting thing is that you got pumped up to the point of having to use the atomic weapon of personal attacks on this forum...  ;)



Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 05:31:33 PM by BernardLanguillier »
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Theodoros

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #24 on: February 17, 2014, 05:02:21 PM »

It takes a great man to confess his mistakes, congratulations!

But I do apologize in case my comments affected the resell value of your 22mp back even a cent!  ;D

As far as my images go, well they are what they are, but the interesting thing is that you got pumped up to the point of having to use the atomic weapon of personal attacks on this forum...  ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

I doubt comments can affect the value of a 22mp back… They've taken more, much more than that through time. I'm not sure on the D800 future value though…. will it worth (and be demanded) more than what a D50 costs (and is wanted) today?  :P  :D
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2014, 05:20:28 PM »

I doubt comments can affect the value of a 22mp back… They've taken more, much more than that through time. I'm not sure on the D800 future value though…. will it worth (and be demanded) more than what a D50 costs (and is wanted) today?  :P  :D

Are you advising to OP to invest in a 22mp back?

Cheers,
Bernard
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Theodoros

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2014, 05:33:15 PM »

Are you advising to OP to invest in a 22mp back?

Cheers,
Bernard

No… I just wonder why ten years after so many people pros still make their living out of them and provide super results… Let me put it to an extend that will be more understandable to you… Back in the 70s one could buy a Ferrari or a Porsche…. but if you was to win in a rally race, …you should get your self a "statos"… Ten years after, it was still the same, with a new model Ferrari or a Porsche, it accelerated better, it had more top speed, even handled better… but would still loose the race from the "stratos"!  …It's only that one needs "balls" to drive the later!
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 05:34:59 PM by T.Dascalos »
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eronald

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2014, 05:40:27 PM »

nice pic - is there a toy museum near you?

Edmund

It takes a great man to confess his mistakes, congratulations!

But I do apologize in case my comments affected the resell value of your 22mp back even a cent!  ;D

As far as my images go, well they are what they are amidst the constraints that are mine, but the interesting thing is that you got pumped up to the point of having to use the atomic weapon of personal attacks on this forum...  ;)



Cheers,
Bernard
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2014, 05:42:50 PM »

No… I just wonder why ten years after so many people pros still make their living out of them and provide super results… Let me put it to an extend that will be more understandable to you… Back in the 70s one could buy a Ferrari or a Porsche…. but if you was to win in a rally race, …you should get your self a "statos"… Ten years after, it was still the same, with a new model Ferrari or a Porsche, it accelerated better, it had more top speed, even handled better… but would still loose the race from the "stratos"!  …It's only that one needs "balls" to drive the later!

The equivalent of that in the photographic world must be the Betterlight back, that takes balls! Backs and DLSRs are children garden territory in comparison.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 05:51:59 PM by BernardLanguillier »
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synn

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2014, 05:47:19 PM »

'Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit' - Oscar Wilde

I never said half the shit people quote in my name.

- famous person
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synn

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #30 on: February 17, 2014, 05:50:20 PM »

...and yes, I would like to get a 22mp back eventually to bring my bronica gear into the digital age.
There's an awesome thread at getdpi full of fat pixel magic...
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #31 on: February 17, 2014, 05:51:01 PM »

nice pic - is there a toy museum near you?

Well spotted!  :D

Cheers,
Bernard
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Theodoros

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #32 on: February 17, 2014, 06:01:09 PM »

The equivalent of that in the photographic world must be the Betterlight back, that takes balls! Backs and DLSRs are children garden territory in comparison.

Cheers,
Bernard
….Which in return works only on an LF camera and is much worst than an MS version of these backs when used for the same purpose! …In fact any back ever is worst when compared to a correctly done 16x image out of the MS version of these backs… But again, the conversation here is on their single shot (not scanning or MS) ability as of today when compared to other single shot solutions…. we are only trying to be specific on the "race" terms…  ;)
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #33 on: February 17, 2014, 06:14:41 PM »

….Which in return works only on an LF camera and is much worst than an MS version of these backs when used for the same purpose! …In fact any back ever is worst when compared to a correctly done 16x image out of the MS version of these backs… But again, the conversation here is on their single shot (not scanning or MS) ability as of today when compared to other single shot solutions…. we are only trying to be specific on the "race" terms…  ;)

OK, if that has become too manly, then I'll propose an alternative contender costing 480 US$ new called a Sigma DP3m (not even speaking about its successor to keep the race somewhat interesting).

Granted, there are some limitations, but we are speaking about 7% of the back second hand cost... and you still get similar image quality at base ISO.

You may want to give it a try it!

Cheers,
Bernard
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Theodoros

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2014, 06:50:42 PM »

...and yes, I would like to get a 22mp back eventually to bring my bronica gear into the digital age.
There's an awesome thread at getdpi full of fat pixel magic...
There is a lot of "conspiracy" going on, on the values of MF… this "conspiracy" is oriented from those that do keep prices high and "vanish" from the market what could expose the conspiracy while at the same time, it shrinks the base of MF, that would be hundreds of thousands of users by now… It is the same conspiracy that has enforced some of the older cameras to be excluded (not supported) for their users to be able to experience "digital MF", the same conspiracy that takes older backs for "part exchange" and then never returns them to the market as S/H, the same conspiracy that is basing prices to resolution increase -when it has nothing to do with it-, the same conspiracy that wants to convince people that when there was nothing else around but what we are talking about right here... photographs were crap! But… look around you people… has photography/i] improved those past ten years? …Lets say that these "war machines" that some are trying to convince us that are now "worthless ancient crap" actually are! …How come and photographs are only worst? …How come and so many artists still use them? …how come and they don't feel the need to upgrade? …how come and they find some magic into them?

Go ahead Synn and give rebirth to your ETRS… (I'm thinking of doing the same actually), maybe you'll decide later to advance it into prime use and make some money back….
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Theodoros

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2014, 06:57:17 PM »

OK, if that has become too manly, then I'll propose an alternative contender costing 480 US$ new called a Sigma DP3m (not even speaking about its successor to keep the race somewhat interesting).

Granted, there are some limitations, but we are speaking about 7% of the back second hand cost... and you still get similar image quality at base ISO.

You may want to give it a try it!

Cheers,
Bernard

I would have… if only it could copy a large painting the way an MS back does in 16x so that I could provide to my family as I do… and if the rest of my photography wasn't B&W "artistic" and some high Iso weddings to add some extra income… It's a matter of choosing the right tool for the race you see… I'm surprised why you don't replace your D800 with one….
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2014, 07:01:25 PM »

There is a lot of "conspiracy" going on, on the values of MF… this "conspiracy" is oriented from those that do keep prices high and "vanish" from the market what could expose the conspiracy while at the same time, it shrinks the base of MF, that would be hundreds of thousands of users by now… It is the same conspiracy that has enforced some of the older cameras to be excluded (not supported) for their users to be able to experience "digital MF", the same conspiracy that takes older backs for "part exchange" and then never returns them to the market as S/H, the same conspiracy that is basing prices to resolution increase -when it has nothing to do with it-, the same conspiracy that wants to convince people that when there was nothing else around but what we are talking about right here... photographs were crap! But… look around you people… has photography/i] improved those past ten years? …Lets say that these "war machines" that some are trying to convince us that are now "worthless ancient crap" actually are! …How come and photographs are only worst? …How come and so many artists still use them? …how come and they don't feel the need to upgrade? …how come and they find some magic into them?

Go ahead Synn and give rebirth to your ETRS… (I'm thinking of doing the same actually), maybe you'll decide later to advance it into prime use and make some money back….

It is much more simple than that.

I don't think anybody doubts the fact that 22mp backs still deliver excellent images today when used in their area of expertise (base ISO, good light, perhaps on a technical camera), nor that there is little need for more for 99% of applications. Heck, my Mamiya ZD did deliver brilliant images, no doubt and very few people print large enough to actually need more.

[

The discussion is more about their price/performance ratio compared to other options.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 07:06:42 PM by BernardLanguillier »
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2014, 07:04:20 PM »

I would have… if only it could copy a large painting the way an MS back does in 16x so that I could provide to my family as I do… and if the rest of my photography wasn't B&W "artistic" and some high Iso weddings to add some extra income… It's a matter of choosing the right tool for the race you see… I'm surprised why you don't replace your D800 with one….

I have both, in fact I use a DP2m. I am sure you own several cameras, so do I. There are some situations where the DP2m is the best tool for the job, some where the Betterlight back is the better option and many where a stitched D800 job blows everything else out of the water.

The Merrill is not quite at D800 level in terms of DR and detail, but it is very close in terms of detail, a bit farther behind in terms of DR. My guess is that the Quattro will be ahead of the D800.



MS backs are clearly the best option today for what you do, no doubt. Was the OP interested in art reproduction? Sorry if I missed that part.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 07:15:24 PM by BernardLanguillier »
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synn

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2014, 07:07:17 PM »

Blah blah DR this,DxO that.

Bruce Percy shot his best work with Velvia. They are also better than any I have seen the science brigade post.
I am sorry if the truth hurts.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Ten Years after….
« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2014, 07:10:38 PM »

Blah blah DR this,DxO that.

Bruce Percy shot his best work with Velvia. They are also better than any I have seen the science brigade post.
I am sorry if the truth hurts.

It is for sure possible to get excellent results with film, 4x5 or other formats. Not sure why this would hurt.



Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 07:12:18 PM by BernardLanguillier »
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