deciding to move from D800E to MF (Mamiya Credo 40)

[photosultan]

Hello,

I currently shoot a d800E with both the 85m 1.4 G and Zeiss 135 f/2 lenses. I shoot mostly full body shots, Dancers in motion and head shots (hence those two focal lengths). i have always dreamed of MF and the D800E seemed to have solved the appetite for a while. Now the Credo 40 is on sale... sounds like a great deal.

I can't at this point afford more than the 40. I know it is a MF 'crop' sensor. I am looking at the 80mm Leaf Shutter f/2.8 as well to start with. First of all, mp difference is not that big of a deal. how about everything else. is it is worth it. better skin tones? faster sync speed to my Broncolor? btw, this is for studio only.

then how does the crop work. is this a good lens first of all. secondly, what will this translate to in 35mm world. will this be my full body lens? should i get a headshot lens, should i dedicate my d800e with zeiss to full head shots and this only to body shots, can i do both head and body shots. sorry so many questions. also, uSB3 work on it?

[Paul2660]

The 80mm is an excellent lens, the LS version newer than the older 80mm D.  The 80mm is considered a "normal" focal length to MF,  equivalent to a 50mm in 35mm format.

You did not mention the 645 body, I assume it's a DF+ (Phase One) I guess Mamiya still has a body out there, I have not kept up with it as much as I used to.    If you use the leaf shutter lens, remember that both the shutter in the camera and lens will fire, there is currently no way to disable the focal plane shutter in the camera body.  At certain focal lengths/shutter speeds, this can induce a bit of vibration, especially with the camera in the vertical. 

Hopefully Synn, will add more info, as he has a similar setup. 

Paul C.

[photosultan]

The 80mm is an excellent lens, the LS version newer than the older 80mm D.  The 80mm is considered a "normal" focal length to MF,  equivalent to a 50mm in 35mm format.

You did not mention the 645 body, I assume it's a DF+ (Phase One) I guess Mamiya still has a body out there, I have not kept up with it as much as I used to.    If you use the leaf shutter lens, remember that both the shutter in the camera and lens will fire, there is currently no way to disable the focal plane shutter in the camera body.  At certain focal lengths/shutter speeds, this can induce a bit of vibration, especially with the camera in the vertical. 

Hopefully Synn, will add more info, as he has a similar setup. 

Paul C.

It's the mamiya 645+.

Because of the crop I'm assuming it's closer to 60mm on my 35mm, right?

[Paul2660]

Yes, I forgot the crop is 1.3 on the 40. 

Make sure on the body that it's fully compatible with the LS lenses.  Phase One's latest firmware for the IQ backs took away communication support for several of the older Mamiya 645 bodies. 

If you are working with a dealer, then you should be fine, however if I would double check on the body.  If the 645+ is the same as the Phase One DF+, you are fine as that's the most current.

You will like the Credo, and it should be a great complimentary system to what you are already shooting. 

Paul C.

[photosultan]

yes with a dealer, brand new with warranty. looks like this kit will be a fine full body camera. now which lens is great for head shots? or will this work with the crop?

[Paul2660]

It should work fine with the crop.

Paul C

[photosultan]

i am really starting to consider this...

[Doug Peterson]

The 80mm is an excellent lens, the LS version newer than the older 80mm D.  The 80mm is considered a "normal" focal length to MF,  equivalent to a 50mm in 35mm format.

Feel free to use our Focal Length Visualizer to compare the final effect of specific focal lengths between difference cameras. Just select Credo 40 and another camera like the D800, and use the vertical/horizontal/diagonal toggle to decide which side of the photo matters most to your comparison (e.g. for a vertical portrait it's probably more relevant to compare the short dimension as you rarely use the full 3:2 length of a dSLR for portraits as many/most consider it too "tall" in aspect ratio).

[Doug Peterson]

You did not mention the 645 body, I assume it's a DF+ (Phase One) I guess Mamiya still has a body out there, I have not kept up with it as much as I used to.

The DF+ is a DF+ regardless of whether it got painted with a Mamiya or Phase One logo at the end of the production line.

Though make sure you're buying from a good dealer who knows/cares that the body is up to date in firmware, as updating the body firmware requires a Phase One V-Grip. Some box movers might have a Credo kit on a shelf for a few months and not know/care to update the firmware prior to shipping to the customer. Latest firmware is important for compatibility with recent lenses like the 75-150LS and for best AF performance and camera stability.

[Doug Peterson]

I currently shoot a d800E with both the 85m 1.4 G and Zeiss 135 f/2 lenses. I shoot mostly full body shots, Dancers in motion and head shots (hence those two focal lengths). i have always dreamed of MF and the D800E seemed to have solved the appetite for a while. Now the Credo 40 is on sale... sounds like a great deal.

I can't at this point afford more than the 40. I know it is a MF 'crop' sensor. I am looking at the 80mm Leaf Shutter f/2.8 as well to start with. First of all, mp difference is not that big of a deal. how about everything else. is it is worth it. better skin tones? faster sync speed to my Broncolor? btw, this is for studio only.

then how does the crop work. is this a good lens first of all. secondly, what will this translate to in 35mm world. will this be my full body lens? should i get a headshot lens, should i dedicate my d800e with zeiss to full head shots and this only to body shots, can i do both head and body shots. sorry so many questions. also, uSB3 work on it?

These are very different cameras in many ways. I'd suggest you read back through this forum and getdpi.com forum for myriad discussions of the pros and cons of each. Then, if/when you're ready to move forward I suggest actually shooting with both cameras. In my opinion when you do this you should not try to compare the cameras in locked-down control-all-the-variables ways, but rather try to do real shooting with both cameras using each camera the best way you can use it (regardless of if its the same way you used the other camera) and take the images through the entire process (pre-production, shoot, post-production, delivery) and see how you feel about the entire system.

There are a lot of things that don't come up often on this forum (being a largely landscape/nature driven forum) that will be relevant in both directions. For instance the Credo 40 allows you to review the last 10 images you've shot tethered, including double-tap-to 100% focus review, custom highlight warning, and customizable grids/guides. And yes, sync up to 1/1600th with strobe, though you'll have to mind which wireless transmitter you use as not all can get to 1/1600th (not that this precludes them from good use).

A good dealer can get you raw files and arrange a demo or a rental (with the cost of rental counting towards purchase) and will be glad to help you learn the system before you purchase and help you with any questions you have after the purchase, including Capture One training, lens recommendations, and troubleshooting.

Specs and numbers only get you so far. Other people's opinions and experience only get you so far.

[synn]

Hi there,

I did this exact same switch a few months ago. My work is mostly portraiture as well and I am loving the Credo 40 tonnes. For my work, it's an upgrade from the D800 in every possible way.

To answer your questions, yes; skintones are amazing out of the box, but process the files only in Capture One. No other converter does justice to the files.

With Leaf shutter lenses, you can get upto 1/1600 sync with strobes. I haven't gone that high, but I get a comfortable 1/500s with my Pocketwizards. In a studio, it's not  a big deal as your flash duration is more critical. Since you're using Bron, that's not a problem at all.

Resolution: It's a lot more than the 4MP difference would suggest. The Credo resolves a ton more details than the D800. You can sharpen the D800 files yes, but it's not the same.

Don't worry about the crop. It's actually a blessing in disguise for portrait work as you get much better pixel density. The viewfinder is still miles better than the nikon's.

Regarding the lens, you can do full body work with the 80mm, but if you want something close to your 135 Zeiss, I would recommend the 150mm LS.

p.s. Of course, all the usual MF caveats apply. Shooting process is slower, AF is basic, etc. etc. Buy boy, are the results worth it!

Enough talk. Here are some pictures:

[synn]

If you use the leaf shutter lens, remember that both the shutter in the camera and lens will fire, there is currently no way to disable the focal plane shutter in the camera body.  At certain focal lengths/shutter speeds, this can induce a bit of vibration, especially with the camera in the vertical. 

This is not a concern for strobe lit work at all.
I did some tripod based landscapes with the kit and did not notice any vibration related issues with the files either.

[photosultan]

Great info. Btw what lens was used for this picture?

[synn]

Great info. Btw what lens was used for this picture?

All those were taken with the 80mm LS. Love that lens.

I also have the 35mm, 150mm and 210mm non LS lenses.

The 35 is great for environmental portraits. Center sharpness is excellent, but the edges are a bit soft. Doesn't bother me much as for portraiture, edge sharpness is not critical and Capture One has a tool to increase only the edge sharpness that works rather well.

the 150, I am not a big fan of. It's a bit soft. Might be the copy I have, but others tell me that the new 150 D and LS lenses are both much better. The images I have seen with them suggest the same.

The 210 is scary sharp and is an amazing lens. It's also very light for a tele. I would highly recommend it if you're doing more close up portrait work.

[calindustries]

I'm also considering the move to a Credo 40. I know rumors are rumors, but is phase/schneider planning on coming out with a LS between the 28 and the 55?  My biggest reason for the move is to take advantage of LS synch speeds

-C

[calindustries]

BTW, I've used both the Credo 60 and 80on the Phamiya+ body (rentals) and could not get them to crash Capture 7 tethering all day. I was very impressed. This has not been the case with the IQ on H bodies (not horrible, but not rock solid all day error free). I feel confident in the system, just wondering about future glass.

-C

[Rob C]

synn, what's the problem with your model's hands, especially in the second shot? At first I thought she was wearing latex gloves.

Rob C

[synn]

synn, what's the problem with your model's hands, especially in the second shot? At first I thought she was wearing latex gloves.

Rob C

She just has unusually pale hands... 😊

As for lenses yes, a 35mm ls would be nice!