Used ipf8300 vs. z3100

[spacegrey]

I'm looking for some advice hoping it'll help me to solve my dilemma.
Shopping for used 44'' printer to start printing on our own vs. ordering from print labs.
My life will not depend on it greatly, if it'll fail we can always order prints from the lab, hence looking for the used model.
My bigger concerns is the cost to run (supplies and repairs)
I already pretty much ruled out all of Epson models (9890/9900/9880) due to print-head clogging/ high ink spend on cleaning/loosing ink on gloss/mate switching.
What have left is 2 potential models ipf8300 or z3100
I have both available somewhat locally for me to get for roughly the same price and similar condition.
I know z3100 would be cheaper to run (print heads and belt inexpensive and easy to replace, genuine but expired ink available for 1/2 cost, compatible ink also available)
ipf8300 can supposedly deliver better colors and can work with wider selection of papers
We are mostly printing gallery wrapped canvas and glossy metallic prints and we do it sporadically (not every day) - once every week or two.
So far I'm leaning towards z3100. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Alex.

[Rob Reiter]

I looked at the Z3100 before buying a iPF 8100, then the 8300 and now my 8400. The Z3100 looked ok except glaringly deficient chroma in dark reds, i.e., dark reds were devoid of color, in comparison to either the iPF 8100 or the Epson 9800 (which I owned), for that matter. It got better with the 3200, I hear, but don't know how it compares with otter brands. While the 8100 was also weak in the dark reds, although better than the HP, that improved significantly with the 8300, to the point where it wasn't a problem for me. The Z3100 is also a lot slower than the Canon printers and has awkward roll loading from the back.

[Mike Sellers]

Hi,
If you are somewhere close to Cincinnati you could take a look at my Canon ipf8100. Just put in a new printhead. It is in nice condition. I could let it go for $1,000.
Mike

[Miles]

I have owned both and am/was satisfied with each one.  The dark reds of the Z3100 never seemed to be an issue for me with landscapes but you need to decide that for yourself based on the types of images you plan to print.  I never had a maintenance call on the Z, but also am not a high volume user.  I do feel that the software was quirky and had to re-install maybe once a year for some unknown reason, but that always worked.  I replaced a few print heads - not hard to do and not too expensive.

The Canon is a more robust printer and the software solid.  No problems with the Canon either, but I have only owned it for 18 months. I do like the Canon print add on for photoshop.

I don't think you can go wrong with either machine.   

[smjphoto]

What do you mean by metallic? Inkjet metallic isn't the same as you might be getting currently.

[spacegrey]

Thank you all for good advice.

smjphoto: I know what I'm getting now from a print labs is not done on Inkjet printers, they use Kodak Endura papers and probably Laser or LED printers.
I tried using Inkjet Metallic papers on my B9180 printer, it wasn't exactly what we are getting from lab, but somewhat similar.

[dseelig]

I own a 24 inch hp they do have the longest lasting inks 200 years even in normal light. I love it but sheet prints with it are not practical Roll is the only way to go. I have no trouble with the software. I have owned it since it came out

[Damir]

I looked at the Z3100 before buying a iPF 8100, then the 8300 and now my 8400. The Z3100 looked ok except glaringly deficient chroma in dark reds, i.e., dark reds were devoid of color, in comparison to either the iPF 8100 or the Epson 9800 (which I owned), for that matter. It got better with the 3200, I hear, but don't know how it compares with otter brands. While the 8100 was also weak in the dark reds, although better than the HP, that improved significantly with the 8300, to the point where it wasn't a problem for me. The Z3100 is also a lot slower than the Canon printers and has awkward roll loading from the back.

Interesting - I have Z3100 and Epson 9800 and red colors on my Z are better than on my Epson??!!
I never have problems with Z regarding colors and gamut, it is far better than anything I got from 9800.
When I print for customers I am ofering to them to chose the prints from which printer they want - HP wins all the time after we do a test prints.
Only problem I have with HP is that it is only 24 inch, Epson is 44 inch printer.
Epson prints on the other hand looks better on plastic photo paper, less gloss diferential, even whan I use GE on Z.

Can not comment on Canon.

[Damir]

I own a 24 inch hp they do have the longest lasting inks 200 years even in normal light. I love it but sheet prints with it are not practical Roll is the only way to go. I have no trouble with the software. I have owned it since it came out

I agree with you, roll changing is not so difficult with 24 inch printer. I am not do it from behing to change the roll, I do it from front side over the printer.

Only proper way to use the sheets is to load them from behind through the same slot as roll, not from front side. This is really awkward. Epson have much better sheet loading.

[Ernst Dinkla]

There must be a secondhand Z3200 around too, the Z3100 is at least 5 years old and possibly 7 years. The Z3200 is richer in color, the gamut in darker colors improved including reds with some loss in the lighter colors. Compared to the Z3100. The B&W of the Z3100 is the one to beat by any printer. The iPF8300 is as good as the iPF8400 and by that a very good printer if you have the print volume to justify head costs in time. A cost factor that will be higher than with the Zs. Way faster than a Z too if that is important for you.

For Zs sheetloading: The idea that a printer should be placed with its back to a wall is something you better forget. There are no rules that printers'backs should be against walls and usually things can be arranged that there is that 2 square meter minimal area for the 44" printer, make it three. Keep the side that has the power plug and network cable to the wall so you can access the printer from all the important sides. Loading sheets on a Z can be done much easier by removing the sheet insert lid. Yes, more or less a contradiction. Keep a loaded spindle on the printer. Hang a smooth sheet of kraft paper or a similar low friction paper over the loaded roll so the surface of the roll will not be damaged. Insert the sheet while it touches the roll on the spindle and its left side against the spindle flange. The printer will accept larger, thicker sheets on 90% of inserts then. With thinner, smaller sheets insert the paper at an angle, the printer will grasp the sheet but tell you fast to align it to the blue lines at the front. It will accept that sheet in 90% of cases then. You can improve register in dual sided printing with tabs at the blue lines and I always load papers that way for dual sided jobs. http://www.pigment-print.com/review/Z3200FirstPage_5.htm

That the sheet edges have to have a true 90 degree angle to one another to get the sheet accepted is normal. So you have to cut roll waste to nice sheets.

--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
January 2014, 600+ inkjet media white spectral plots.

[artobest]

I must have super powers, but I load sheets on my Z3200ps the conventional method using the sheet insert tray and get a 90% success rate, even with Check Skew on. It's a knack, for sure, but not too hard if you think about what you're doing.

[chez]

One thing to consider with the Z3100 is its built in ability to calibrate and make custom profiles. If you want to experiment with different papers, this feature is invaluable.

[Ernst Dinkla]

I must have super powers, but I load sheets on my Z3200ps the conventional method using the sheet insert tray and get a 90% success rate, even with Check Skew on. It's a knack, for sure, but not too hard if you think about what you're doing.

Super powers, a good back and superb manual control if you can do that with Museum Etching 350 grams down to 56 grams Newspaper.
Next skill to develop is loading the roll from the printer's front side :-)

--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
January 2014, 600+ inkjet media white spectral plots.

[spacegrey]

Thank you all for your wisdom - We now are happy owners of ipf8300 beast of the printer.
With that I have yet another question.
It came with 2 sets of Genuine 330ml sets of unused inks. The printer itself was never used as well, but that it not the point here.
I know by reading this forum that those inks are generally good for 2 years on the shelf and 6 month once they installed into printer.
Inks in my 2 sets have been manufactured between Feb and Aug of 2012 - they are getting on 2 years mark.
I don't see us printing a lot and using 2 sets fast, we'll be lucky to use one set this year.

Hence the question: would it make sense to sell second set now and get new inks when we need them or can those inks really last much longer than 2 years on the shelf?

Alternatively there's an option to go with compatible refillable system, not sure how many folks are using compatible inks? I find many refillable options for Epson's, but not so much for Canons.