Why encapsulated ink?

[Some Guy]

Now that it appears Canon is surpassing longevity using their ink over Epson, why not use the Canon ink, or even HP, in the Epson?  Providing one can make a profile, or maybe have a suitable RIP to work with the ink cart changes.

Seems Canon's are less prone to clogging over the Epsons.  I would have thought the heat of Canon's thermal printhead that it uses to squirt out ink would "bake ink" onto it and for them to clog more, but not so.  Even my Epson 3880 running encapsulated dye ink clogs up (Often unused MK Black), and their small portable Charm PM-225 that uses dye ink (I think?) clogs too if not used within two weeks.  That later one is bad enough that it takes 3 power cleans to unclog it and then the cart is often empty, but I ship the unused paper they pack with the ink cart back to them and get a refund for unusable paper.

I've been suspicious of Epson's encapsulation or whatever else is in their ink for a while and whatever is causing their ink to clog with sometime disastrous results (New printer.).  Just doesn't like to flow as easily for some reason.

So why not run a cheaper OCP dye ink, another non-OEM pigment, or Canon's OEM flushed out of their larger carts, into the Epson even if it is not encapsulated, much like I do with the Canon?  I could see the need for encapsulated ink in textiles that need washing, but not so much for a paper print.  I can see Epson-to-Canon being bad as the Epson encapsulation ink might melt and stick to the Canon thermal head clogging it, but the other way might be workable?

Only thing I can see as to "Why not?" would be maybe the non-excapsulated Canon ink would flow too freely and run out of the Epson printhead.  But that also seems to point to the clogging ability of the Epson encapsulated ink too.

SG

[Czornyj]

What made you think that Canon ink is not encapsulated?

Clogging is caused by air bubbles. Epson head nozzles have longer ink lines where the air bubbles can cumulate, and piezo membrane produce less pressure than thermal element in HP/Canon print head.

[Some Guy]

What made you think that Canon ink is not encapsulated?

Clogging is caused by air bubbles. Epson head nozzles have longer ink lines where the air bubbles can cumulate, and piezo membrane produce less pressure than thermal element in HP/Canon print head.

I'm getting info that the HP and Lucia Canon is encapsulated, but they might have a higher thermal temperature encapsulated resin than the Epson ink. Jon Cone said his ink won't work in a Canon due to thermal heads and his formulas encapsulation (He stopped selling non-encapsulated ink, fwiw.).  Maybe it melts and gums up the Canon and HP head, and the Canon and HP inks have a higher encapsulation temp to withstand that since they use thermal heads?

Still, doesn't explain why Canon or HP ink cannot go into an Epson printer, if their inks are less prone to clogging.  Maybe their higher-temp resins is protecting the dyes better than Epson and why the longevity charts are pointing to better results with the Canon and HP?  Epson using a "stickier encapsulation" maybe else it may leak in their non-thermal heads?

Sorry, but I don't buy the air in lines part for clogging the head unless it has been open for a long time and not just a ink void trying to refill it.  The little Epson Charm has probably the shortest length from cart-to-head and it plugs up quicker than anything with Epson's dye ink.  Not much chance of air causing it in its lines.  Maybe sitting on the head and dry air crusting it up, but can't see air getting in the line causing it.  Some other non-OEM refiller tried to make carts for it and they plugged solid.  Has to be faulty ink chemistry coming into play there and not air in the lines.

The humidifier threads seem to point at keeping the heads somewhat moist to prevent drying out and plugging.  If Epson ink is prone to drying out and crusting or gumming up the heads, then their ink must be likely at fault in sundry environments over say a Canon or HP sitting next to it (Ruling out Teflon head coatings or whatever in later Epsons to keep heads from gumming up and sticking.).  Still, it sort of points to bad ink technology/chemistry being used in the Epsons.

SG

[Ernst Dinkla]

Sorry, but I don't buy the air in lines part for clogging the head unless it has been open for a long time and not just a ink void trying to refill it.  The little Epson Charm has probably the shortest length from cart-to-head and it plugs up quicker than anything with Epson's dye ink.  Not much chance of air causing it in its lines.  Maybe sitting on the head and dry air crusting it up, but can't see air getting in the line causing it.  Some other non-OEM refiller tried to make carts for it and they plugged solid.  Has to be faulty ink chemistry coming into play there and not air in the lines.

Air bells in a piëzohead reduce the pumping activity much more than air bells do in a thermal head. The air can get into the nozzles quite easily if the ink level in the head is reduced for one reason or another.

Yes, HP Vivera pigment inks are used in some custom B&W Epson printers, from desktop models to wide formats. For the neutrality/longevity of the grey/black inks. They work. If you like to work with Canon or HP color inks then get Canon or HP printers. There is no need to make it more complex.

If you can talk Epson into using thermal heads for this kind of printers you may see less clog threads in this list.

--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
January 2014, 600+ inkjet media white spectral plots.

[Czornyj]

Sorry, but I don't buy the air in lines part for clogging the head unless it has been open for a long time and not just a ink void trying to refill it.  The little Epson Charm has probably the shortest length from cart-to-head and it plugs up quicker than anything with Epson's dye ink. 

The length from cart to head doesn't matter, what makes difference it's the length of ink chamber in print head that leads ink to a nozzle. In thermal print head it's much smaller than in piezo head, plus the heater creates bigger pressure - that's what make thermal print head design less prone to clogging.

There's a chance you could use Canon/HP ink in Epson, but I don't think it would work better - ink is optimised for nozzle coatings used in specific print head.